The latter is still harder imo, but the former isn't as easy as people think. You need really good awareness and a good sense of strategy. You need to think ahead about how to use your pomanders/magicites in a way that secures the clear. However I would say PotD/HoH solo on a job like AST or BLM is harder than all three ultimates.
Having completed both types of content the best way to sum it up is that Ultimate requires good tactical skill while PotD/HoH solos require good strategic thinking. With the current content drought I'd encourage more triple legends to try out PotD/HoH solos, it demands a different skill set that is very rewarding when you master it.
Which is harder: PotD/HoH solo vs. Ultimate?
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11-17-2020, 06:07 PMSeanCodyWhich is harder: PotD/HoH solo vs. Ultimate?
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11-17-2020, 07:13 PMMagicAura
You remind me of Karasu for some reason. Just when I consider writing you off for just another (or the same forum troll) you go and post something serious that makes sense and poses a reasonable challenge.
I haven't done either PotD or Ultimates yet. I plan to at some point. Solo PotD is also something I want to try. :D -
11-17-2020, 07:36 PMBokoToloko
Ultimate is harder but failing a PotD/HoH solo run in higher floors can be heartbreaking as several hours of run fly out of the window and you have to start all over again.
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11-17-2020, 07:48 PMMagicAura
I guess the concept of "harder" is highly subjective. As the OP says, they require two very different skill sets. Strategy vs tactical (although I'm not convinced that tactical is the correct word here). I tried Shiva Ultimate once and learning the patterns while maintaining good situational awareness is key (well I guess that's tactical :D ). In PotD it's totally about strategy, situational awareness, and being constantly mindful of what's happening and potential outcomes. In both if one panics, it's the end.
Of course different people will find different things harder. -
11-17-2020, 08:44 PMVyrerus
Well, the difference would be, Ultimates require 8 people to be near masters of their job and reacting to mechanics. Takes a lot of time to learn the fights and execute them properly, but like any other fight in the game, once you learn the script by heart, then you can consistently beat it over and over and over.
Soloing PoTD and HoH is not really that hard, but you cannot guarantee a win without the use of the spin exploit. The spin exploit is making use of a movement based glitch wherein, if you are a precise distance from a monster's frame center, and you run circles around them at the right speed, they will spin incessantly, unable to even auto attack. It works on bosses too. This obviously takes a lot of practice if you want to be able to use it on any monster, as the size and difference between monster frames makes the distant and movement slightly different for every monster.
Without learning the spin exploit, you will be reliant on good RNG, especially the worse your job is for the task at hand. AST is the worst job to take, because its personal DPS is very very bad at the level range and substat limitation that you experience in both Deep Dungeons.
MCH, RDM, or any tank is a pretty solid choice these days, due to the reworks and insane potency increases. MCH's ability to kill fast while moving away from the monster while also engaging from 20y away is insane. That and you can pretty much start every other monster with Reassemble + Drill for an Auto Direct Crit 700 pot attack.
It's not too hard to consistently get down to the 181 floors of PoTD nor the 81+ floors of HoH, but on average, your luck runs out during or after these floorsets, resulting in no useful pomanders or debuff floors not allowing you to use useful ones.
Any player that can get a legitimate clear of an Ultimate could legitimately clear HoH or PoTD solo. They just have to put in however many attempts it takes them to get good RNG or learn the spin exploit. -
11-17-2020, 08:51 PMSeanCodyNah most jobs don't need to do spin exploit. Only melee DPS really need to.Quote:
Originally Posted by Vyrerus
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11-17-2020, 08:55 PMVyrerushttp://64.media.tumblr.com/e0cbf02f2...h2co1_500.gifvQuote:
Originally Posted by SeanCody
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11-17-2020, 09:16 PMSeanCodylol im not trolling on ranged classes... well, you kite. on tanks you're tanky enough to just ignore spinning.Quote:
Originally Posted by Vyrerus
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11-17-2020, 09:18 PMKleeya
Between potd and ultimate, potd is definitely harder.
Each of them needs to know all mechanics and how to play your job very well, but on top of that there is two things that make a big difference :
- the awful RNG of potd. Not matter how good you are, if the RNG is giving you way too much bad debuffs on floors, way too much mimics and items you don't need on treasures chests, way too much dangerous mobs to solo on the only path you can take, way too much rooms to explore to reach the exit for the limited time you have, etc, you are 100% screwed. While ultimates, as hard as they can be, are only scripted fights where you wipe because your team is not good enough, not because the game did launch a dice at the beginning of the fight to decide that no matter what you do, you are gonna fail.
- the fact that for potd you have to redo all the previous floors at each wipe. Last time i did check, after each wipe in ultimate the game don't ask you to redo all the previous savages fights in a row without a single fail before being able to enter ultimate again for a single try.
As for hoh, since it is way easier than potd for various reasons (like having only 100 floors and way more powerful pomanders), i would say it is easier than ultimate. -
11-18-2020, 02:36 AMAbsurdityI would agree with the more powerful pomanders but not with the reduced number of floors. Let's be honest, most of PotD is simply a time sink. Floors 1-170 are an absolute joke so you end up with really only 30 difficult floors and the same is more or less the case for HoH.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kleeya
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11-18-2020, 02:48 AMAyuhra
I have never tried Ultimate but I think Ultimate would give me less of a piercing migraine.
I'm not saying I'd expect it to be easy...
But if I am very suddenly kicked offline it's not the end of the world.
My deaths in PotD:
10% killed after leaving keyboard for an emergency by wandering mobs
20% killed by powerful mobs chain spawning
70% killed by random disconnects
And I SWEAR I DC more in Palace than anywhere else. -
11-18-2020, 02:50 AMMPK
The RNG is what makes PoTD and HoH hard tbh fam
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11-18-2020, 07:39 AMBsrking5
Sastasha normal DF after taking 10+ coffees rapid fire.
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11-18-2020, 08:38 AMAziraSyuren
PoTD is a contest of endurance and patience like nothing else. It requires much more on-the-fly adaptation than literally any other content in the game. The content itself might not be as difficult, but you definitely have to work much harder to clear it and it's not even close. You have to maintain good awareness of your surroundings for literal hours at a time and can never relegate any aspect of it to autopilot or habit, except for the lower floors. Nothing in this game demands more of you.
There's a reason they're the two rarest non-PVP battle titles in the game.
Ultimates do require a lot more skill to beat but that doesn't really make them more inherently difficult, just better designed. "Unfair ridiculous bullshit that wasn't designed to be cleared this way" is the name of the game for DD solo. It's not harder for the best of reasons but it's certainly harder.
This is patently untrue if you're playing a good job. MCH in PoTD and GNB in HoH (although to a lesser degree) can power their way through so much bad RNG.Quote:
Originally Posted by MPK
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11-18-2020, 08:44 PMCeasariaI was thinking, is disconnection a hidden mechanic in PotD ? xDQuote:
Originally Posted by Ayuhra
Yoko Taro, you know what to do for the next raid 24 : "If we have to visit a cyberworld by hacking, during a fight put us a fake disconnection windows. It would be funny and in total consistency with your universe".