GMs need to start moderating the Novice Network

Square Enix needs to hire more GMs to moderate Novice Network chat. They don't have to be in the chat 24/7, but they need to be able to ban bad mentors quickly before they get out of control. I suggest a three-part approach:

• Give sprouts the ability to specifically report bad mentors
  
• Remove the ability for mentors to kick mentors
  
• Bad mentors get removed from Novice Network for a day, then permanently on the second infringement.

The Novice Network on my server is full of negativity. Sometimes it even descends into full-on transphobia, homophobia, and bigotry but there is nothing the good mentors can do because kicking bad mentors will start a kick war. Just yesterday I saw a mentor trolling in the Novice Network by calling a sprout an "attack helicopter" when the sprout introduced themselves and said they were non-binary. Then the trolling mentor got kicked but his friend kicked the mentor who kicked the trolling mentor and a kick war started. I didn't think we would still have homophobia and transphobia in 2020 but here we are. Hopefully, by removing the ability to kick mentors from mentors and having GMs moderate the chat, NN will become a welcoming space for sprouts of all backgrounds.

a 2 strike system is a bit too excessive. I would say you lose mentor status for a week at number 2 and at 3 it's a 6 month ban from NN.

But any form of report system will get abused. What's to stop a bad mentor from making an alt and getting into NN and reporting in retaliation?

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Originally Posted by Alestorm

a 2 strike system is a bit too excessive. I would say you lose mentor status for a week at number 2 and at 3 it's a 6 month ban from NN.

But any form of report system will get abused. What's to stop a bad mentor from making an alt and getting into NN and reporting in retaliation?

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That's why we need GMs to moderate the Novice Network. They get to decide which reports to take seriously and which to ignore.

fully agreed

Why do we even have that crap!?

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Originally Posted by MPK

Why do we even have that crap!?

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The idea of a Novice Network is pretty nice. It helps players become better and serves as a hub to welcome new players and make them feel at home. However, sexism, racism (both real life and in-game, especially against Hrothgars), and homophobia have become rampant in certain communities.

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Originally Posted by MilitaryVet123

That's why we need GMs to moderate the Novice Network. They get to decide which reports to take seriously and which to ignore.

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Well I don't know. They can be a little trigger happy in order to protect the person doing the report. We do have a rules made out for snowflakes which means people would report someone just for having a different opinion .
I would agree with the person who you were quoting

This is why when I see people with crowns in my party I immediately thought, "Shit."

It's unfair generalizations I know, but honestly speaking I think around 80-90% mentors I met always act like an arse, including to sprout players.

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Originally Posted by MilitaryVet123

Square Enix needs to hire more GMs to moderate Novice Network chat. They don't have to be in the chat 24/7, but they need to be able to ban bad mentors quickly before they get out of control. I suggest a three-part approach:

• Give sprouts the ability to specifically report bad mentors
  
• Remove the ability for mentors to kick mentors
  
• Bad mentors get removed from Novice Network for a day, then permanently on the second infringement.

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Sprouts have the ability to report bad mentors. System menu - Support Desk - Contact Us - Report Harassment.

Yes, SE will do things. When I first started playing, I had recurring issues with a specific mentor. I finally got fed up and reported it since they wouldn't leave me alone as I asked. The harassment stopped.

Mentors who abuse the power to kick other mentors can likewise be reported for harassment.

Mentors with a history of repeated bad behavior don't just get removed from the NN. They have their mentor status removed and are unable to get it back.

But if players don't report the problems, the GMs have no way of knowing action needs to be taken. SE isn't going to hire people to do nothing but monitor chats 24 hours a day just in case they might catch someone saying something they shouldn't. The community does have some responsibility for self-policing.

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Originally Posted by Alestorm

a 2 strike system is a bit too excessive. I would say you lose mentor status for a week at number 2 and at 3 it's a 6 month ban from NN.

But any form of report system will get abused. What's to stop a bad mentor from making an alt and getting into NN and reporting in retaliation?

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It's not the report that gets someone in trouble. It's the GMs agreeing that the person reported did something wrong.

Any false reporting, especially if done as retaliation, is going to get the player who made the report into trouble and not the player who they were trying to report.

Ever report a RMT spam bot? Notice that warning that gets displayed? That warning applies to any type of reporting, not just RMT. It's only displayed for the RMT because the RMT reporting is very simple compared to reporting through the Support Desk where more detail is required.

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Originally Posted by LaughingBanana

This is why when I see people with crowns in my party I immediately thought, "Shit."

It's unfair generalizations I know, but honestly speaking I think around 80-90% mentors I met always act like an arse, including to sprout players.

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90% of the mentors I meet never say a thing at all. They just quietly do what's needed. I would say that about half the ones who like to talk a lot turn out to be jerks.

That's just as true of Novice Network as randomly meeting mentors elsewhere. If you ever look at the online list for NN, there are far more mentors hanging out there than are actively talking. Most of them are decent players who have probably mentally tuned out NN chat and aren't paying attention to what's going on there.

When I was part of NN on an alt in a different data center, I was always sad to see sprouts being the ones to help sprouts while the mentors who were talking were mostly ignoring the requests for help and information. Most of the time it was basic game play info that any veteran player should have been able to answer.

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Originally Posted by MilitaryVet123

Square Enix needs to hire more GMs to moderate Novice Network chat. They don't have to be in the chat 24/7, but they need to be able to ban bad mentors quickly before they get out of control. I suggest a three-part approach:

• Give sprouts the ability to specifically report bad mentors
  
• Remove the ability for mentors to kick mentors
  
• Bad mentors get removed from Novice Network for a day, then permanently on the second infringement.

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I agree with all of this except for the ban. I think a perma ban on a second infringement is excessive. I think a system more like this would work better:

First offence - banned from novice network for two days
Second offence - banned from novice network for a week
Third offence - banned from novice network for two weeks
Fourth offence - banned from novice network for a month
Fifth offence - permanent ban from novice network

And to add to the above the ban should be account wide so that the offender cannot make an alt or use a second mentor character to continue their poor behaviour to get around the ban.

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I don't think we'll see GMs moderate the chat channel actively, but providing players with an easy way to report players (similar to how we can quickly report players for RMT directly from the chatbox) would be very helpful. And this would be beneficial for any kind of abuse, not just novice network issues.

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Originally Posted by MilitaryVet123

The Novice Network on my server is full of negativity. Sometimes it even descends into full-on transphobia, homophobia, and bigotry but there is nothing the good mentors can do because kicking bad mentors will start a kick war. Just yesterday I saw a mentor trolling in the Novice Network by calling a sprout an "attack helicopter" when the sprout introduced themselves and said they were non-binary. Then the trolling mentor got kicked but his friend kicked the mentor who kicked the trolling mentor and a kick war started. I didn't think we would still have homophobia and transphobia in 2020 but here we are. Hopefully, by removing the ability to kick mentors from mentors and having GMs moderate the chat, NN will become a welcoming space for sprouts of all backgrounds.

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I am so sad to read this. Many novice network channels I have seen have been quite bad but nothing on this scale. This is truly awful. What I mostly have seen is mentors using the chat as a platform to have idle chatter about whatever and often ignore the sprouts who are seeking help. However I have seen some things being said that are downright abusive.

Speaking of, how do you access Novice Network again? You are required to have a mentor inviting you in, yes?

Seems such a roundabout way for a new player to enter a place that's supposed to be helpful for them for various gameplay tips, questions, etc etc. You actually need to hunt a Mentor first and ask them to invite you in? huh.

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Originally Posted by LaughingBanana

Speaking of, how do you access Novice Network again? You are required to have a mentor inviting you in, yes?

Seems such a roundabout way for a new player to enter a place that's supposed to be helpful for them for various gameplay tips, questions, etc etc. You actually need to hunt a Mentor first and ask them to invite you in? huh.

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I have not made a new character in quite a while but I know on a returner (if you accept the "returner's bounty") you are automatically granted access to the novice network. I would be surprised if it's not the same for a sprout. At least now you can leave, and the game tells you how to do it as well. There was a time in which you could not leave and SE changed this due to complaints from players.

I honestly turned off the NN and ask people directly if they would like tips, as the NN is almost just as bad as a 4chan board some days, everything from homophobia to politics to talking about stuff that isn't even game related.

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Originally Posted by Penthea

I agree with all of this except for the ban. I think a perma ban on a second infringement is excessive. I think a system more like this would work better:

First offence - banned from novice network for two days
Second offence - banned from novice network for a week
Third offence - banned from novice network for two weeks
Fourth offence - banned from novice network for a month
Fifth offence - permanent ban from novice network

And to add to the above the ban should be account wide so that the offender cannot make an alt or use a second mentor character to continue their poor behaviour to get around the ban.

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I don't think we'll see GMs moderate the chat channel actively, but providing players with an easy way to report players (similar to how we can quickly report players for RMT directly from the chatbox) would be very helpful. And this would be beneficial for any kind of abuse, not just novice network issues.



I am so sad to read this. Many novice network channels I have seen have been quite bad but nothing on this scale. This is truly awful. What I mostly have seen is mentors using the chat as a platform to have idle chatter about whatever and often ignore the sprouts who are seeking help. However I have seen some things being said that are downright abusive.

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Yeah, people use Novice Network as a chat network and not many even bother to invite sprouts (which the channel tells you to do when you first enter the channel), much less help them. An overhaul is sorely needed, and it would be ideal if GMs take the role of an "archmentor" and help sprouts on their journey, though I know this is going to be a strain on SE's budget.

you people fall for it every single time

Excuse me , but there is very specific reason novice network exists. Its not a social date chat. Its a chat where players can ask questions or help about THE GAME. This thread is non sense. For me the person that srarted this by stating he is non binary should get kicked. The use of novice network isnt for anyone to discuss their sexuality

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Originally Posted by Kazukiyashuo

Excuse me , but there is very specific reason novice network exists. Its not a social date chat. Its a chat where players can ask questions or help about THE GAME. This thread is non sense. For me the person that srarted this by stating he is non binary shouliomd get kicked. The use of novice network isnt for anyone to discuss their sexuality

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Except the Novice Network invite tells sprouts to share their experiences, and that presumably includes an introduction...

Also, seriously? Kicking someone for being non-binary is both transphobic and homophobic. If you don't think sexuality should be mentioned as part of someone's self introduction, just tell them not to bring it up to prevent drama (which you are doing right now). But why would you kick them or call them an "attack helicopter"? That's what I'm getting at here. It's not about sexuality it's about the rudeness displayed by some mentors.

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Originally Posted by MilitaryVet123

Except the Novice Network invite tells sprouts to share their experiences, and that presumably includes an introduction...

Also, seriously? Kicking someone for being non-binary is both transphobic and homophobic. If you don't think sexuality should be mentioned as part of someone's self introduction, just tell them not to bring it up to prevent drama (which you are doing right now). But why would you kick them or call them an "attack helicopter"? That's what I'm getting at here. It's not about sexuality it's about the rudeness displayed by some mentors.

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It tells you to share your experiences in THE GAME not in life. Ive never saw someone joining novice network and say hi im a girl or hi im a man or hi im a dog. They just say hi. As i already stated this chat isnt to socialise or ask for attention. It is to ask in game questions. Noone cares what you are in that chat in your real life and he/she/it shouldnt adress it , at the first place. And because that person said without noone asking that he/she/it non binary, that means that he/she/it stated that he/she/it doesnt have gender. So its a thing i assume. Attack helicoper sounds funny and valid. I dont why someone to be offended when they say they are a it

Game is already moderated by GMs and everything you are asking is already inside current ToS. There is nothing else SE can do, unless you want them to remove the ability to chat from the game.

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Originally Posted by Kazukiyashuo

It tells you to share your experiences in THE GAME not in life. Ive never saw someone joining novice network and say hi im a girl or hi im a man or hi im a dog. They just say hi. As i already stated this chat isnt to socialise or ask for attention. It is to ask in game questions. Noone cares what you are in that chat in your real life and he/she/it shouldnt adress it , at the first place. And because that person said without noone asking that he/she/it non binary, that means that he/she/it stated that he/she/it doesnt have gender. So its a thing i assume. Attack helicoper sounds funny and valid. I dont why someone to be offended when they say they are a it

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That is totally not what "non binary" means but go off I guess.

Companies hiring people to make things work to gain more money that way instead of just leaving it and hopeing it will generate money without investment?
Wait long for that buddy, Yoshi and his team would i say, i want to be believe he and his team are geneorus but Square pulls the strings and is one of the worst companies in my eyes, same level as EA, Ubisoft and all the others by now.
Milking most out a game without wnating to invest so it could invovle because no one wants ot make a risk anymore in exeprimenting, why change a running system basically. For god sake i not want ot sound salty but you think they can organize the Novice netowrk if they not even can take care of Goldselles in the citys? Put a GM there, mark gold seller message and ban those chars but we not see such also.

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Originally Posted by Kazukiyashuo

It tells you to share your experiences in THE GAME not in life. Ive never saw someone joining novice network and say hi im a girl or hi im a man or hi im a dog. They just say hi. As i already stated this chat isnt to socialise or ask for attention. It is to ask in game questions. Noone cares what you are in that chat in your real life and he/she/it shouldnt adress it , at the first place. And because that person said without noone asking that he/she/it non binary, that means that he/she/it stated that he/she/it doesnt have gender. So its a thing i assume. Attack helicoper sounds funny and valid. I dont why someone to be offended when they say they are a it

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So you think it's okay for someone to experience abuse due to their gender or sexual orientation simply because it's off topic? Good god...

You can politely tell someone something is off-topic without being horrible about it. Sigh.

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Originally Posted by Kazukiyashuo

Noone cares what you are in that chat in your real life and he/she/it shouldnt adress it , at the first place. And because that person said without noone asking that he/she/it non binary, that means that he/she/it stated that he/she/it doesnt have gender. So its a thing i assume. Attack helicoper sounds funny and valid. I dont why someone to be offended when they say they are a it

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"Why are people offended when I say intentionally offensive things?"

lol

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Originally Posted by Jojoya

90% of the mentors I meet never say a thing at all. They just quietly do what's needed. I would say that about half the ones who like to talk a lot turn out to be jerks.

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To my and certainly some others defence, my way is always to first give it a try and look, unless theres a certain death that'll waste time ill let ppl explore first, even if we need more time for a 2nd or 3rd try then just me explaining everything....

I prefer that over some of the extremely pushy mentors who istandly command everyone around and start shouting like they own the place lol


For the NN.... yes its a pity but hell no im making my bow around that just like i try to never EVER enter limsa xD

Toxicity aside, the main problem of NN is there are a lot of "mentors" who are horrible players and give horrible advice to new players. The requirement to become a mentor doesn't do a good enough job of filtering good players. If you are new, you are much better off going to the balance or other unofficial guides/forums for information.

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Originally Posted by Seddrinth

Toxicity aside, the main problem of NN is there are a lot of "mentors" who are horrible players and give horrible advice to new players. The requirement to become a mentor doesn't do a good enough job of filtering good players. If you are new, you are much better off going to the balance or other unofficial guides/forums for information.

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Yeah that is a big issue too and there probably needs to be more requirements for becoming a mentor. I do think that most advice in this game doesn't require Savage raiding or having all 80 crafters though, like "how do I hide party chat" which most veteran players should know. But people don't answer the sprouts because they treat Novice Network as their personal FC

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Originally Posted by MilitaryVet123

Yeah that is a big issue too and there probably needs to be more requirements for becoming a mentor. I do think that most advice in this game doesn't require Savage raiding or having all 80 crafters though, like "how do I hide party chat" which most veteran players should know. But people don't answer the sprouts because they treat Novice Network as their personal FC

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There is no way to fix NN problems. All the problems you have talked about in this topic go against TOS and you can report

No
/10 characters

I don't even join the NN and any new friends I know starting the game, I tell them not to join the NN because it's just a garbage chat channel.

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Originally Posted by Nayout

There is no way to fix NN problems. All the problems you have talked about in this topic go against TOS and you can report

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There is a way to fix NN problems. Being so pessimistic won't solve anything in life either but people still try.