2480 Crafting?

Are you serious, Squeenix? What the hell is wrong with you!?

I've got 2115 crafting right now and I can't use any of this stuff I brought back from diadem for expert crafts.

How the hell do you expect anyone to get 2480? That's absurd!!!

Do you play test this nonsense at all?

Funny thing about crafters, we have this thing called Overmelding. It's costly, yes, and you will go though a lot, and i mean A LOT, of materias of all grades, but it makes a huge difference in what you can and cant craft. I had to overmeld back in 5.2 when they revealed the 480 crafted gear, and it was an investment well spent.

Expert crafts are intended for expert crafters, ie, those who go the extra mile with overmelding, calculating their stats, specializing, and learning the best action to the situation (as well as the combination of said actions to keep them from failing). I'm not fully overmelded but with what overmelds I do have and with food, I can attempt the expert crafts (sadly, although I can finish, my control isn't quite high enough to get the rating up). You have to be willing to get yourself to that level to do the action and reap the benefits.

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Originally Posted by Kidria

Expert crafts are intended for expert crafters, ie, those who go the extra mile with overmelding, calculating their stats, specializing, and learning the best action to the situation (as well as the combination of said actions to keep them from failing). I'm not fully overmelded but with what overmelds I do have and with food, I can attempt the expert crafts (sadly, although I can finish, my control isn't quite high enough to get the rating up). You have to be willing to get yourself to that level to do the action and reap the benefits.

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You know it would be easier for people like me if this kind of info was upfront. Even still 2480 seems a little ridiculous.

I mean, the recipes are more difficult. They require higher stats, and also with the new buffs, it makes optimizing the craft almost macro-less. You have to think your moves through, but there has to be a 'gate' somewhere. It's not very expert if you can try it with base gear, I'd think.

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Originally Posted by Kidria

I mean, the recipes are more difficult. They require higher stats, and also with the new buffs, it makes optimizing the craft almost macro-less. You have to think your moves through, but there has to be a 'gate' somewhere. It's not very expert if you can try it with base gear, I'd think.

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I always think my moves through. I just find caps like these to be silly.

It's just the design of the gear available, too. If the gear at max stats (overmelded) and HQ food/syrup can reach a particular number, it has to be pretty high so these 'end game' recipes are just that, end game.

It sucks but honestly, once you get a fully overmelded set of gear you're set for a good while. With the new materia system, getting materia needed is even easier. Throw on a FC and pot spiritbond buff and go to town on a spammable/quick synth recipe. You'll have plenty of materia.

So after spending about 250k and grinding tons of white scrips to beat the cap. I get into the craft and find out that the target numbers are not only skewed to hell (9000+ progress with 4500 collectabilty minimum.) but also they've changed the bonuses around, most of them are useless and excellent doesn't seem to come up anymore.

Ugh... What the hell squeenix!?

There is no excellent-prog in expert-crafting but other progs instead. It's a complete different system then normal crafting and it is designed to be difficult. That's the whole point: It shouldn't be easy, it shouldn't be for everyone (it was announced as endgame crafting-content) and it shouldn't suceed with every craft. There is a learning curve to master: We will fail a lot in the beginning until you get the hang of it.
On the plus side: the materials are very cheap on the market board. So you can learn and practice to your heart's content without spending much gil or time for gathering.


TL;DR: Gid Gud.

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Originally Posted by JamieRose

I always think my moves through. I just find caps like these to be silly.

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To be fair, you find everything that requires some effort to be silly. One only has to read your post history to see that

And my ignore list continues to expand...

If you choose to, you can get a buff of over 200 craftsmanship or control from food medicine and company action. So getting the stats to attempt these recipes doesnt require a full set of over-melded BiS gear. And i mean, its not like you couldnt have looked at the recipes from your book to see the stats required before you went gathering. Thats what i did. I had a partially melded set of dwarven cotton/swallowskin gear. On tuesday i looked and saw i was a bit short of the stat reqs for expert recipes, so i spent a little bit gathering some mats and whipped up enough of a set of facet gear(with guaranteed melds only) to hit the stat requirements. Then i spent some time in diadem. Took a few shots at the recipes(think i gathered enough for 6 attempts in my first short visit). I tried a few things, and by the end was very consistently getting to about 3500, but hitting the minimum for turn in required luck. Tried the non-expert level 80 recipe just to make sure i hadnt forgotten how to craft(maxed in 13 or so steps, so good enough). Took a break to clear my head. Then i did some research, talked to a few crafting friends and looked at some of the advice online. Went back a night later, and with some new ideas i was hitting about 4800 consistently, with good luck pushing it into max range(still a couple fails, but i was succeeding around 80% of the time).

And the new conditions are far from useless. One of them is the return of steady hands. One of them is a free step of waste not. One of them cuts any CP costs in half. Any crafter who thinks theyre up to the challenge of an "Expert" recipe should be able to find some uses for those.

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Originally Posted by Frizze

If you choose to, you can get a buff of over 200 craftsmanship or control from food medicine and company action. So getting the stats to attempt these recipes doesnt require a full set of over-melded BiS gear. And i mean, its not like you couldnt have looked at the recipes from your book to see the stats required before you went gathering. Thats what i did. I had a partially melded set of dwarven cotton/swallowskin gear. On tuesday i looked and saw i was a bit short of the stat reqs for expert recipes, so i spent a little bit gathering some mats and whipped up enough of a set of facet gear(with guaranteed melds only) to hit the stat requirements. Then i spent some time in diadem. Took a few shots at the recipes(think i gathered enough for 6 attempts in my first short visit). I tried a few things, and by the end was very consistently getting to about 3500, but hitting the minimum for turn in required luck. Tried the non-expert level 80 recipe just to make sure i hadnt forgotten how to craft(maxed in 13 or so steps, so good enough). Took a break to clear my head. Then i did some research, talked to a few crafting friends and looked at some of the advice online. Went back a night later, and with some new ideas i was hitting about 4800 consistently, with good luck pushing it into max range(still a couple fails, but i was succeeding around 80% of the time).

And the new conditions are far from useless. One of them is the return of steady hands. One of them is a free step of waste not. One of them cuts any CP costs in half. Any crafter who thinks theyre up to the challenge of an "Expert" recipe should be able to find some uses for those.

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I only call them useless because not a single one of them could get me over the 4500 target. I tried several approaches and 4300 was the best I could do. Feels like I wasted my time and my money.

Sounds like maybe you're not an expert crafter after all. It's good to know your limits.

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Originally Posted by Hasrat

Sounds like maybe you're not an expert crafter after all. It's good to know your limits.

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Pretty much this.

Think of it like Savage or Ultimate crafting. You're just not at that level (which is fine). It doesn't make the content bad, though.

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Originally Posted by JamieRose

You know it would be easier for people like me if this kind of info was upfront. Even still 2480 seems a little ridiculous.

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Just go overmeld and stop crying, newbie.
You just need last craft's gear and meld.

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Originally Posted by JamieRose

And my ignore list continues to expand...

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Yes expand your blacklist, and don't improve yourself and complain SE for your incompetence.

You just need stuff and meld, and you can train for a good rotation.

you guys are all silly... cmon Lodestone....
<.<
>.>

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Originally Posted by JamieRose

I get into the craft and find out that the target numbers are not only skewed to hell (9000+ progress with 4500 collectabilty minimum.) but also they've changed the bonuses around, most of them are useless and excellent doesn't seem to come up anymore.

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This has been available since the patch was deployed on Tuesday. The bit about excellent not appearing and the new statuses and their effects was in the patch notes. You can easily verify the required progress and quality numbers from the crafting window and the NPC you deliver the items to without actually having the required stats to craft the item.

Also the stat requirement for expert recipes are exactly the same as Lv80 tri-star items, which have been available for more than three weeks. I really fail to see the surprising aspect here.

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Originally Posted by JamieRose

Are you serious, Squeenix? What the hell is wrong with you!?

I've got 2115 crafting right now and I can't use any of this stuff I brought back from diadem for expert crafts.

How the hell do you expect anyone to get 2480? That's absurd!!!

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I am at Craft 2554, Cont 2434, 541 CPs. Armor and accessories are max melded, tools have but two melds, non specialist.

Its really easy if a bit expensive.

I have 2398 craftsmanship, 2331 control and 541 CP on my non-specialist crafters with cheap melds (three overmelds per item, meld chance at least 17% for each and no wasted stats). I need Mejillones al Ajillo to reach the craftsmanship rating required for the Lv80*** recipes, but the mussels are not too difficult to acquire. I could avoid the food dependency by melding differently, but when I found out just how much stats the recipes need I had already melded most of my items and couldn't be bothered with doing it again. With the food I can easily craft HQ gear from NQ mats, and I'm sure I'll be able to tackle the expert recipes as well once I have some time to sort through the different possible sub-rotations and figure out which ones to use in which situation.

Overmelding gear as a crafter is the worst thing ever , the materia is super expensive they really need to make it easier to get Crafting Materia.

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Originally Posted by snipski

Overmelding gear as a crafter is the worst thing ever , the materia is super expensive they really need to make it easier to get Crafting Materia.

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Seriously?
I get tired of this complaint when I've spelled it out many times on the forums, only to be ignored, while people continue complaining because they just don't want to put effort in. Materia is also over 10 times cheaper than in Stormblood. But here we go anyway.

-The best method by far. Keep a Battle and Botany retainer on constant duty getting the mats for Craftmans Cunning Syrup while you play the game normally. Keep an eye on Rowena's Collectible turn is. When Syrup (Alc) is starred, get a 1 button macro (plenty out there, I'm happy to make one too for any stats) and spam as many of these as you feel up to. You get a whopping 324 scrips a pop. That's like 35-40k scrips an hour. Turn in for a few grade 6, lots of grade 7's and grade 5 CP materia.
For white scrips, you do the same except either for Tinctures or Lignum Vitae Spinning wheels. Keep in mind you don't need to overmeld the first overmeld slot with Grade 8 materia, it's a luxury (even for expert craft), Grade 8 in the main slots, one grade 6, rest 7's is plenty and Cunning Syrup handles that fine. If you aren't doing Expert Recipes, you hardly need to overmeld at all. 8's in the main slots, one 6 overmelded and even 4's in the rest will get you there.

-Extract materia is next best. Make a Spiritbond Potion and use it. Buy a stack of Apprentice's Practice Materials and deliberately fail the Grade 2 Expert Skybuilder Practice Materials craft. Repeat until your gear spiritbonds, take out the materia as you go.

-Custom deliveries are easy weekly scrips. Stockpile materia for the next major patch.

-Ishgard Scrips can be turned in for Materia, although not at a very generous rate.

-Run maps for an hour or two. Buy materia from the MB with the profits.

But seriously, Cunning Syrup is a goldmine for Scrips.

overmelding VII to everything is also a overkill, my melds for clothing are normally 2xVIII/1xVI/1xVII/1xV and for accessories I use IV and III for the last 2 slots and for tools I overmeld 2 low level CP materia to cap it and nothing else.

That is more than enough for the current expert recipes, in fact I feel like I am overgeared for them.

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Originally Posted by snipski

Overmelding gear as a crafter is the worst thing ever , the materia is super expensive they really need to make it easier to get Crafting Materia.

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I started with the 80 normal Grade 2 crafts until I had the materia form Ishgard script to re-meld properly to do the artisanal Took me 3 days. It took me another 2 days to learn how to do the Expert rafts. I slept 3.5 hours a day for other reasons, and I still put in 24 hours over overtime at work last week. Don't give up you are closer than you think. This is brand new and some people need 2-3 iterations to get used to it.

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Originally Posted by RyuSaarva

overmelding VII to everything is also a overkill, my melds for clothing are normally 2xVIII/1xVI/1xVII/1xV and for accessories I use IV and III for the last 2 slots and for tools I overmeld 2 low level CP materia to cap it and nothing else.

That is more than enough for the current expert recipes, in fact I feel like I am overgeared for them.

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It's actually easier to get VII, since now you even get it from your own gear, than older ones, and older ones are just as expensive or more.

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Originally Posted by Tlamila

It's actually easier to get VII, since now you even get it from your own gear, than older ones, and older ones are just as expensive or more.

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I just checked the prices and they are not normal currently, seems like crafting pvp made people buy all the V materia and they are really expensive now while VII and VIII are cheaper than ever but all other materias are still way more cheap, I have been buying dirt cheap V and VI materia for a long time so I have lots of them and thousands of lower tier materia too from previous expansions.

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Originally Posted by RyuSaarva

overmelding VII to everything is also a overkill, my melds for clothing are normally 2xVIII/1xVI/1xVII/1xV and for accessories I use IV and III for the last 2 slots and for tools I overmeld 2 low level CP materia to cap it and nothing else.

That is more than enough for the current expert recipes, in fact I feel like I am overgeared for them.

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What you call overkill I call future proofing.

Sure you are overgeared, I am worse overgeared, but I can go longer without upgrading.

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Originally Posted by Shadygrove

What you call overkill I call future proofing.

Sure you are overgeared, I am worse overgeared, but I can go longer without upgrading.

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it's cheaper to just buy a new set than overmelding the previous one.

You can certainly do expert recipes in dwarven equipment but it requires some luck and isn't too efficient.

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Originally Posted by RyuSaarva

it's cheaper to just buy a new set than overmelding the previous one.

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But I LIKE blowing materia up. Its my only even slightly expensive hobby.