1000+ ATT Power Club :D

What a pain in the ass, but I got it finally XD

http://i1178.photobucket.com/albums/..._27_54_572.jpg

All thanks to these, just made to replace my old 74 ATT pair (which are for sale sold btw ^^)

http://i1178.photobucket.com/albums/..._29_41_432.jpg

Anyone else break 1k ATT yet?

Grats, MW. That's impressive. Really.

List your gear

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Originally Posted by Relic

List your gear

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it seem like the website doing something for 1 of the month you have yoshi-p in pink lol

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Originally Posted by Relic

List your gear

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For the pieces that are relevant:

Symon's Honeyclaws: ATT +40
Darklight Eyepatch: ATT +15
Temple Cyclas: ATT +7
Fingerless Raptorskin Gloves of Slaying: ATT +83
Serpent Sergeant's Sarouel: ATT +9
Explorer's Moccasins: ATT +5
Explorer's Earrings :ATT +5
Electrum Gorget +1: ATT +30
Explorer's Ring: ATT +15
Eft Steak: ATT +49
Mega-Potion of Strength: ATT +125
Fists of Fire: ATT +131

I could get even more with Darklight Corselet and Mercenary's Slops. To get 1000 ATT you need a minimum of +70 on hands with all other slots filled with the best ATT gear. It's not the actual setup I play with, was just a personal goal of mine.

So basically no accuracy gear with -20 Acc on Honey Claws... I wonder if the huge amount of atk power would make up for the large accuracy loss.

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Eft Steak: ATT +49

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If youre gonna use Eft Stake, open fists of fire IMO.

How much do your auto-attacks do on Mistress?

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Originally Posted by Relic

So basically no accuracy gear with -20 Acc on Honey Claws... I wonder if the huge amount of atk power would make up for the large accuracy loss.

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There's more reasons than even that for this setup to not be used. Though MW admitted this isn't his/her regular setup and that it was done just as a personal goal to pass that value on the gear page.

You'd actually want some more accuracy, Ifrit's Claws instead of the Honeyclaws, and more focus on STR/INT until they are capped before moving onto Attack Power.

Nice job though MW!

Mega-Potion of Strength too =P

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Originally Posted by Estellios

Mega-Potion of Strength too =P

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Yea, forgot to put that in there. Fixed.

To answer Shin's question, as stated before this isn't the actual setup I use when I play MNK.

Still having 800+ without the potion/food is quite nice, I think my MNK only has 600ish without food. Darklight gear is a big step up.

Never even tested it?

There's nothing impressive about +1000 ATK.

But god damn those gloves what were you thinking using two grade II materia instead of a single III or IV do you snort four-leaf clovers or something what the hell! :mad:

To reiterate, being able to see the huge number in your gear screen next to Attack Power is attractive, however increasing STR and INT until they reach their caps at ~330 and 300 respectively give greater damage output per point than Attack Power. Sure, you don't see such an attractively large number in 1 place in your gear window but it is what it is.

Like MW said, this is more of a personal goal to see if you can hit a number like that. Far from being an effective set.

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Originally Posted by Almalexia

There's nothing impressive about +1000 ATK.

But god damn those gloves what were you thinking using two grade II materia instead of a single III or IV do you snort four-leaf clovers or something what the hell! :mad:

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I blew up about 8 double meld T4 and a few 3+4 making these (trying for 3rd meld on them) and even blew up 2 M3 T3's (ATT+20 x3). Overall cost me around 35M for this pair. The pair I got lucky on just happened to be a triple meld with T2's in it.

Ill ask again, why no firefist? :P

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Originally Posted by NoctisUmbra

To reiterate, being able to see the huge number in your gear screen next to Attack Power is attractive, however increasing STR and INT until they reach their caps at ~330 and 300 respectively give greater damage output per point than Attack Power. Sure, you don't see such an attractively large number in 1 place in your gear window but it is what it is.

Like MW said, this is more of a personal goal to see if you can hit a number like that. Far from being an effective set.

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I thought it was 350 str and 300 int?

I agree with everything Noctis has said, you need to hit the caps on str/int first then jack atk.

I have a pair of 70 atk gloves and a pair of 50 str gloves. I wear the str ones over the atk ones.

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Originally Posted by Meatdawg

I have a pair of 70 atk gloves and a pair of 50 str gloves. I wear the str ones over the atk ones.

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Because you parsed the difference or because someone told you one was better than the other?
I'm not calling you wrong... I just want to be sure

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Originally Posted by Rydin

Because you parsed the difference or because someone told you one was better than the other?
I'm not calling you wrong... I just want to be sure

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Testing has been done and posted. Kaeko and Seiken are doing wonders when it comes to demystifying the attributes and their effects.

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Originally Posted by NoctisUmbra

Testing has been done and posted. Kaeko and Seiken are doing wonders when it comes to demystifying the attributes and their effects.

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I saw Seiken's Lancer and Archer stuff and have read Kaeko's blog and haven't really seen anything that says Str>ATK
And nothing about pugilist

In the Archer testing... 2 STR = 3 ATK, suggesting Attack is more important (granted STR is not a direct modifier on Archer)

On Lancer (Which still isn't pugilist but probably more applicable to this discussion than Archer)... I saw nothing that suggested that 50STR > 70 ATK
STR was slightly better than ATK under 290.... and dwarfed by ATK after the cap

IMO... test long enough to find the MIN/MAX only changing out those 2 gloves....
Do this on a lvl 45, lvl 50, lvl 52 and lvl 55 MOB
It wouldn't even take that long using Kaeoko and Seiken's Min/max rule
Maybe the STR is better.... But you just can't know for sure

MNK using Ifrit's Claws: get roughly 350 STR / 310 INT then full on ATK (excluding an ACC argument, which complicates things). If not using Ifrit's Claws, the caps will be lower.

Even with Darklight Corselet, you will need a lot of help getting to 350 STR on MNK so triple socket STR hands will be the best for most players. If you are truly decked and do not care about +ACC, I suppose you could go for some STR+ATK hybrid triple socket+ hands. I'd try to buy some STR now b/c the price of it on Aegis server has gone up about 1000% since Seiken posted a week ago. I'm not sure how quickly Seiken and I's testing gets translated to the JP side but I'm sure the JP will eventually figure it out, if not by their own testers.

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Originally Posted by Kaeko

MNK get roughly 350 STR / 310 INT then full on ATK (excluding an ACC argument, which complicates things).

Even with Darklight Corselet, you will need a lot of help getting to 350 STR on MNK so triple socket STR hands will be the best for most players. If you are truly decked and do not care about +ACC, I suppose you could go for some STR+ATK hybrid triple socket+ hands. I'd try to buy some STR now b/c the price of it on Aegis server has gone up about 1000% since Seiken posted a week ago.

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246 Base
20 Darklight Corselet
24 Double MAX STR/DEX pants
36 hq rings
4 HQ bracelet
6 Smoked Raptor
40 Mega-potion of STR
____________________
376 STR... no gloves

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Originally Posted by Rydin

246 Base
20 Darklight Corselet
24 Double MAX STR/DEX pants
36 hq rings
4 HQ bracelet
6 Smoked Raptor
40 Mega-potion of STR
____________________
376 STR... no gloves

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That's nice. There can be a number of way to achieve it. Point is it's better to get STR and INT to cap before focusing on Attack Power, when given the choice.

You can't seriously be advocating building a DD set built around having +40STR off a potion that lasts 40 seconds?

Beyond this, not going to get into a "best DD set" argument here just because I think people can make their own choices given the simplicity of the system.

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Originally Posted by NoctisUmbra

That's nice. There can be a number of way to achieve it. Point is it's better to get STR and INT to cap before focusing on Attack Power, when given the choice.

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Its all about the numbers.. getting STR to cap may be more important... but if you were choosing between 10 STR and 100 ATK then the choice is ATK all the way
I know thats an extreme but where is the cutoff?

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Originally Posted by Kaeko

You can't seriously be advocating building a DD set built around having +40STR off a potion that lasts 40 seconds?

Beyond this, not going to get into a "best DD set" argument here just because I think people can make their own choices given the simplicity of the system.

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Im interested to do the math:
on one hand you do a set amount of damage the entire time
or
You do slightly less damage... but 15% of the time you do quite a bit more damage
A case can be made for either depending on what "Slightly less damage" amounts to

I wasn't going into best DD set... just posing a hypothetical and showing that "STR is better than ATK" is a blanket statement that doesn't always hold true and advocating players to do some tests on their own to see what they come up with

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Originally Posted by Rydin

I wasn't going into best DD set... just posing a hypothetical and showing that "STR is better than ATK" is a blanket statement that doesn't always hold true and advocating players to do some tests on their own to see what they come up with

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1 point of STR is better than 1 point of attack until STR caps at 350, is a fact and not a blanket statement.

Your example of 100 ATK vs 10 STR is hyperbole and not a decision one would come across regularly, if at all. However, if faced with such a choice I'm sure it is quite obvious that 100 ATK is the way to go.

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Originally Posted by NoctisUmbra

1 point of STR is better than 1 point of attack until STR caps at 350, is a fact and not a blanket statement.

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This is a good start.... But people don't say that... people say Cap STR first... which implies that any amount of STR is better than any amount of ATK until you get to 350 STR... which is just not true
Now let's be more specific...
After STR cap... STR to ATK equal 2:3
So after the cap... I'd opt for 30 STR over 19 ATK, but not over 21 ATK
These are the things that are important

Pre-cap... Seiken, Kaeko or Noctis... did you see any type of increase that would give us a ratio?
Also... It's rare that you would hit 350 on the dot... so if you're piece goes over 350.. then you'd have to create a baseline value and treat STR>350 as a completely different stat than STR<351
So say (This isn't true but for the sake of argument that)
STR1:ATK is 2:3
STR2:Atk is 3:2
That would mean every 2 STR above the cap would equal 3 ATK, and 3 ATK would equal 4.5 STR below the cap
So you could say each point of STR at 350 or below = 9, each STR point above 350 = 4 and each ATK point = 6
and then you'd be able to score each piece accordingly
All just an example... but you get my point

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Originally Posted by Kaeko

You can't seriously be advocating building a DD set built around having +40STR off a potion that lasts 40 seconds?

Beyond this, not going to get into a "best DD set" argument here just because I think people can make their own choices given the simplicity of the system.

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Exactly. I would try to push stats with gear first always and never relay on food/potions to hit a target value.

Having 50 str gloves for example also lets you swap in some very valuable acc rings. (don't underestimate acc)

This is all about WS damage, which is much > then AA damage.

There are still occasion when factoring in lower DLEVEL that atk is just > str as well i believe.

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Originally Posted by Meatdawg

Exactly. I would try to push stats with gear first always and never relay on food/potions to hit a target value.

Having 50 str gloves for example also lets you swap in some very valuable acc rings. (don't underestimate acc)

This is all about WS damage, which is much > then AA damage.

There are still occasion when factoring in lower DLEVEL that atk is just > str as well i believe.

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true... some good ACC does go a long way

I do want to parse 4 minutes on a MOB with STR at 350

and then 4 minutes with STR at 310 and a potion for 30-40 seconds of it

That 30-40 seconds would be the most possible damage a MNK can do.... would be interesting

And you're right... I wouldn't factor in potions... but why not factor in food?
It is very possible to keep it up indefinitely

Seiken can provide you the ratios for a couple of the jobs. I do not know if MNK is one of them. Melee stats is much more so his side of the testing we do.

Also, regarding the question about low dLVL target situations possibly making ATK>STR point for point, I would have to disagree. Whatever factor dLVL plays in the damage formula, it will likely be applied globally at the end of the calculation. This is though, again, something you will probably want a direct answer from Seiken over myself.

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Originally Posted by Kaeko

Seiken can provide you the ratios for a couple of the jobs. I do not know if MNK is one of them. Melee stats is much more so his side of the testing we do.

Also, regarding the question about low dLVL target situations possibly making ATK>STR point for point, I would have to disagree. Whatever factor dLVL plays in the damage formula, it will likely be applied globally at the end of the calculation. This is though, again, something you will probably want a direct answer from Seiken over myself.

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admit it Kaeko... for the big number WOW factor... get STR to 310... INT to 310... throw everything else you've got into ATK and CRIT... pop a mega potion of STR, Fists of Fire and go hit a MOB weak to Fire and watch the sparks fly

Valk and I were talking about a Blindside Savage Might Crit build to attempt a 2000 Howling Fist on Miser for Collusion. So there are ways to optimize for "wow factor". With the way stats work currently, there are certainly a number of methods to get ahead of normal players. This is especially true if you're rich and can triple meld materia. But I think BLM is better suited for your 1 time high damage shots.

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Originally Posted by Kaeko

Valk and I were talking about a Blindside Savage Might Crit build to attempt a 2000 Howling Fist on Miser for Collusion. So there are ways to optimize for "wow factor". With the way stats work currently, there are certainly a number of methods to get ahead of normal players. This is especially true if you're rich and can triple meld materia. But I think BLM is better suited for your 1 time high damage shots.

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what is the highest ATK you can get to on MNK with 350 STR and 310 INT?

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Originally Posted by Rydin

what is the highest ATK you can get to on MNK with 350 STR and 310 INT?

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The best build I came up with personally (using Galka base stats and triple gear)

Ifrit's Claws
Felt Cav hat +1 with +43 INT (triple)
Darklight Corselet
F. Rap. Gloves of Slaying +1 with +16 STR and +60 ATK (16STR+25ATK+30ATK triple)
Felt Trousers +1 with STR/DEX legs
Explorer's Moccasins
Veteran's Field Belt
Explorer's Earrings
Electrum Gorget +1
Rubelite Bracelet +1
Rubelite Ring +1
Rubelite Ring +1
Eft Steak

Comes to roughly 350 STR, 310 INT, 802 ATK with fists of fire. No +ACC considerations. No potion used. If using potion, replace the STR rings with ATK rings.

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Originally Posted by Kaeko

The best build I came up with personally (using Galka base stats and triple gear)

Ifrit's Claws
Felt Cav hat +1 with +43 INT (triple)
Darklight Corselet
F. Rap. Gloves of Slaying +1 with +16 STR and +60 ATK (16STR+25ATK+30ATK triple)
Felt Trousers +1 with STR/DEX legs
Explorer's Moccasins
Veteran's Field Belt
Explorer's Earrings
Electrum Gorget +1
Rubelite Bracelet +1
Rubelite Ring +1
Rubelite Ring +1
Eft Steak

Comes to roughly 350 STR, 310 INT, 802 ATK with fists of fire. No +ACC considerations. No potion used. If using potion, replace the STR rings with ATK rings.

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You used that on Morbol?

We don't use MNK on morbol. It's just a theoretical best build.

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Originally Posted by Kaeko

We don't use MNK on morbol. It's just a theoretical best build.

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/sadface

/10

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Originally Posted by Kaeko

Seiken can provide you the ratios for a couple of the jobs. I do not know if MNK is one of them. Melee stats is much more so his side of the testing we do.

Also, regarding the question about low dLVL target situations possibly making ATK>STR point for point, I would have to disagree. Whatever factor dLVL plays in the damage formula, it will likely be applied globally at the end of the calculation. This is though, again, something you will probably want a direct answer from Seiken over myself.

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Hmm I would figure that lower dLVL would have a lower def/vit to push through with lower str thus causing more atk to weigh heavier in the equation.

However if damage caps then it doesn't really matter what you boosted.

Kaeko we noticed this from eyeballing some Mistress before about Auto-Attack.

We try different builds and people notice thier AA to hit 90-100, 100-110, (or when really pushing ATK while holding 290 STR) 115-125.

When using a Mega-Pot of STR it seems AA reaches 130-140 per hit for all these builds, making it seem like ATK caps off. From guessing what these builds have on them and the rate of increase (without accounting for STR's bonus attack past AA cap) it seems that number is in the 850-875 range.

Parsers are terrible to use for this so all we have are observations but I will try to parse every fight now and document gear swaps, and how STR pot is affecting it. Parsers are bad because you'll never know the low end, just the high end (and also on that note, Spinning Heel sort of messes up using the parser on this fight to just document normal AA w/o the pot)

If this is the case, either way you build your MNK gear the Mega-STR pot is going to yield excessive stats that are not required if this is right. (note, I am not sure how the affects WS, since their variance is much larger than AA, and again runs into the same problem on the parser for this fight as AA does).


I'll try to get some solid data on the subject, but so far this observation might be something to go on and could show ATK also caps like other stats based on weapon DMG (but MNK w/FoF might be only DD that can actually achieve the cap even with a Mega pot).

Anyways something to think about!