How much of a bonus to BLU skill acquisition would it take for you to attempt it

With a BLU-only party? (for EX trials)

Given that i have them all, if i feel like it :P but for future ones if it is doable and it is something like a 50% chance to get then i'll be up for it if it only goes up to 10% then it would be faster/easier to try and get people to unsync it with max jobs.

Full Blu teams require mechanics, half 80/half blu teams just require survival so the increase needs to be worth it

I think all they need to do is drastically increase the drop rate for synced parties, then suddenly we have more BLU content, as leeching undersized parties is not content. Clearing EX is.

I've said it before and I'll say it again: 100% learning rate if you are in synced duty with other blus, with a -10% for every non blu and -50% if it's unsynced.

They already have masked carnival as an endgame for blu, no need to aggravate your playerbase with padded out rng for interim activities.

Thordan EX as all Blue Mages sounds scary.

I would never be doing these things synced even if the learn rate was 100%.

I don't have a problem with learn rates in this game. Anyone who thinks it's difficult to learn spells in this game hasn't played FFXI blue mage.

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Originally Posted by Fynlar

I would never be doing these things synced even if the learn rate was 100%.

I don't have a problem with learn rates in this game. Anyone who thinks it's difficult to learn spells in this game hasn't played FFXI blue mage.

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Mmm I still don't have Winds of Promyvion ☹

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Originally Posted by Vnolan

With a BLU-only party? (for EX trials)

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Thats going to be interesting. I mean most BLU died on Extreme when unsynced. Chances of getting spells better be 100%.

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Originally Posted by Saefinn

I think all they need to do is drastically increase the drop rate for synced parties, then suddenly we have more BLU content, as leeching undersized parties is not content. Clearing EX is.

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I think they said something like it will be near 100% for synced in the patch notes

Will they said the learning chance has been increased and that it gets increased further if the undersized party setting is disabled

Unless you can learn when dead or BLU gets a raise spell, I wouldn't ever want to be in an all BLU EX trial learning party.

Increase skill potency by 200% and make learn rate a 100% then I give blu a chance. Blu is to weak how it is now. You can't even survive ARR ex primal attacks.

while i would love an increased chance to get the skills with it being sync'd would i rather spend 20 mins to clear sync'd for a one shot chance, or clear in 2 mins with level 80 friends for a slightly lower chance, its a bit of a no brainer.


also in before morbol mount requires all HW trials and alex prim beaten by BLU team sync'd

They really do need to allow skills to be learned while dead in instances.

Losing out on a learn because someone in your party was slacking on healing or screwed up mechanics is really frustrating.

How about they make it into a full job!?

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Originally Posted by Hierro

How about they make it into a full job!?

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i'm p-sure at this point theres no chance of that, so we might as well enjoy what we got.

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Originally Posted by DracotheDragon

while i would love an increased chance to get the skills with it being sync'd would i rather spend 20 mins to clear sync'd for a one shot chance, or clear in 2 mins with level 80 friends for a slightly lower chance, its a bit of a no brainer.


also in before morbol mount requires all HW trials and alex prim beaten by BLU team sync'd

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If the highest rank spells come 5.1 are anything like the primal skills, you'd be better off clearing with all BLU parties than getting carried. Or you can just do it synced with whatever party composition, really. Near 100% synced while contributing versus low double digit percentage while being bored throughout? Easy pick. Plus, doing it synced gives you a chance to familiarize with doing things with all BLUs for the log. Probably some nice rewards attached to it.

Zero.

I got all the skills within the first 3 days.

For BLU-only, synced and without echo?

100% and not a nanofraction less than that.

At the very least, if it's not practically guaranteed, I'll probably stick to the unsynced farm PFs just like last time.

While I did enjoy doing all-BLU dungeons the last time BLU was alive for a week, and even on one occasion all of the Crystal Tower raids, none of those had EX mechanics. Pug groups have trouble doing HW Extremes even unsynced at 80, I don't have a lot of faith in it being a more time-efficient method for farming spells unless a coordinated static is doing it. An unsynced group can probably get like 20 clears in by the time an all-BLU party is done progging Sephirot so unless learning the spells synced is guaranteed or nearly so, I don't foresee it being viable for skill acquisition.

For fun tho? Absolutely! I love all-BLU parties. I'll definitely try it, I'm just not expecting to get any spells that way.

I think the biggest reason why BLU's lifespan is so short is the fact they insist on throwing it into party content and the party content gets rushed for the first week because nobody wants to be left out by the time the BLU hype dies off and parties become impossible to find... It should always have been a solo job with the option to do Squadrons, Palace of the Dead and use Duty Finder for low-level dungeons and trials. It wouldn't have made it a real job but would at least give BLUs some degree of long-term usability.

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Originally Posted by hynaku

Increase skill potency by 200% and make learn rate a 100% then I give blu a chance. Blu is to weak how it is now. You can't even survive ARR ex primal attacks.

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Look at the preliminary patch notes. They did a pretty good sized buff of all BLU skills.

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Originally Posted by Fynlar

I would never be doing these things synced even if the learn rate was 100%.

I don't have a problem with learn rates in this game. Anyone who thinks it's difficult to learn spells in this game hasn't played FFXI blue mage.

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Why would I care what FFXI's learn rate was? This isn't FFXI.

No one's claiming it's difficult to learn abilities. They just don't see any fun in spamming old Primals upwards of 100+ times.

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Why would I care what FFXI's learn rate was? This isn't FFXI.

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This game is nevertheless influenced and inspired by FFXI. Comparisons are inevitable. And it doesn't change the fact that anyone who thinks it's difficult in this game doesn't know what real difficulty is. The same thing can be said for anyone who thinks we're strapped for inventory space in this game. Compared to many other games (FFXI included, especially old-school FFXI) inventory space is outright generous in this game.

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No one's claiming it's difficult to learn abilities.

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Aside from the fact that I very much have heard people say that it is (even though I disagree personally), the heart of the topic at hand revolves all around the (supposed) difficulty of learning BLU spells.

If nobody thought it was hard to begin with, nobody would give a damn about synced duties giving a 100% learn rate. If the majority felt it WAS hard to begin with, more people might care.

As long as I can get them in an unsync party I will just do that.
If they increase the rate for synced BLUs only parties that's great I'm sure alot of people will try that out. I for myself take a guaranteed unsync win with a chance to get the skill over the stress of doing synced ex fights with BLU only parties.

Could see ones being blu in pvp and use final sting and self destruct on players and nodes. Blue Mages also need a real weapon and not one that has zero stats to it. Can't even put any materia on there weapon.

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Originally Posted by Fynlar

Aside from the fact that I very much have heard people say that it is (even though I disagree personally), the heart of the topic at hand revolves all around the (supposed) difficulty of learning BLU spells.

If nobody thought it was hard to begin with, nobody would give a damn about synced duties giving a 100% learn rate. If the majority felt it WAS hard to begin with, more people might care.

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Difficult in the sense it is time consuming and obnoxious not actually difficult.

People simply don't want to spam synced duties, especially not for content they've likely already beaten into the ground. I suppose some might think so but that's irrelevant when most just don't want to run Shiva EX 100 times.

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Difficult in the sense it is time consuming and obnoxious not actual difficult.

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Isn't that what passes for difficulty nowadays in video games?

Most don't have hours of play time to try for one spell. To learn titans skill to me over 150 runs to finally get it. Percentage is way to low for learning.

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Originally Posted by Nighthawky2010

Thats going to be interesting. I mean most BLU died on Extreme when unsynced. Chances of getting spells better be 100%.

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Well yeah. Unsynced Level 50 Blue Mage in Level 50 content is still a Level 50 Blue Mage in Level 50 content.

If they give us a chance to use DF and not wait around for others, I don't care the chance. I got a BLU with so little skills cause players seem to have gotten tired of it.

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Originally Posted by Bonbori

For BLU-only, synced and without echo?

100% and not a nanofraction less than that.

At the very least, if it's not practically guaranteed, I'll probably stick to the unsynced farm PFs just like last time.

While I did enjoy doing all-BLU dungeons the last time BLU was alive for a week, and even on one occasion all of the Crystal Tower raids, none of those had EX mechanics. Pug groups have trouble doing HW Extremes even unsynced at 80, I don't have a lot of faith in it being a more time-efficient method for farming spells unless a coordinated static is doing it. An unsynced group can probably get like 20 clears in by the time an all-BLU party is done progging Sephirot so unless learning the spells synced is guaranteed or nearly so, I don't foresee it being viable for skill acquisition.

For fun tho? Absolutely! I love all-BLU parties. I'll definitely try it, I'm just not expecting to get any spells that way.

I think the biggest reason why BLU's lifespan is so short is the fact they insist on throwing it into party content and the party content gets rushed for the first week because nobody wants to be left out by the time the BLU hype dies off and parties become impossible to find... It should always have been a solo job with the option to do Squadrons, Palace of the Dead and use Duty Finder for low-level dungeons and trials. It wouldn't have made it a real job but would at least give BLUs some degree of long-term usability.

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I definitely agree with the solo job. Thats what it was meant for at the release of BLU. Squadrons & PotD would have been perfect for Blu. especially with Squadrons. Add more dungeons in the Squadron Mission w/ the monsters you need to learn spells from, same for PotD. But doing extremes or other dungeons to get spells with a party, it was best to just made it a normal job.

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Originally Posted by Hierro

How about they make it into a full job!?

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Sometimes I wonder that myself. Initially, BLU was suppose to be solo content but yet we have to form parties to go into dungeons & extreme trials to obtain skills. For it to be solo content, it wasnt allowed in Squadrons or PotD contents.

It would take BLU being a full job, even if that would require that everyone else gets similarly open-world interactions, unique acquisition mechanics, and player-controlled skill progressions.

Haven't seen the new skills yet and perhaps they've done something else too but... assuming it's more of the same I have to say I think if it's not readily done solo I wont do it. Blue Mage in terms of gameplay composition/mechanics isn't as interesting or as engaging as I'd hope, particular in compared to jobs as one would expect (imo)- to the point where the most fun I had was only when I was blowing stuff up (like 1k needles or grinding out levels with dragon and ram voice). It's here where I had hoped SE would lead to more of a interweaving combos (Diablo 3 / legendary items, that mad mix mash that was quite a bit of fun) like a tightly wound trading card game sort of building experience (high relationships), that and I felt strongest value of having a job that can't DF would be one that does content solo better then (like being able to do dead content one couldn't normally solo, doing some of the more challenging story content, and throwing hilariously wild challenges like "fight all the ARR savage primal in pairs in one dungeon".. because we can). Of course being a normal job would have been fantastic and optimal too lol, or personally most preferred an advanced job which holds both a unique approach to the game and yet still has DF-able side.

In other words I find difficulty placing a job I was excited for, as it just feels like doing old content slower and in a less engaging way. . . I'm trying to sell myself on this idea but I can't seem to do it. I wish I didn't feel that way either.

Perhaps much later down the road, after many level increases, there might be a huge list of skills that'll parse down into a very nice interweaving set of skills, or a few reworks for relationships (like FFXI Blue Mage had combinations of spells to make passives, and passives on spells already).. but at the moment Blue Mage has left me the feeling its less Blue Mage and more 'But Why' Mage.

I had wanted to wait for their first patch of Blue Mage before really placing Blue Mage but each news update makes that placement feel bleaker than brighter. Luckily I have many jobs in this game I already like, but I still feel sad as this was a job I was excited for and had really wanted to play. Not a final forecast of feelings but at the moment I'm strongly leaning to Blue Mage is a means to an end, where I play Blue Mage only if the ends justify the means- if it gives me something I want then I'll do it, perhaps for the short lived novelty of casting a easily fail-able 1hko spell, but just for those ends. I don't want anyone to feel bad about liking Blue Mage if they do, or the designer if they ever read this (unlikely, if translated it's probably truncated lol), but in terms of feedback I guess I'd say I'm hoping for a lot more than what's currently available and news about the job seems to do the opposite of excitement for me, coming from a place of someone who was excited for the job (before announcement).

FFXIV's not dead, not claiming the end is neigh- still got loads of still I like to do, but just wanted to share my current feeling on it lol (feelings may change with time and patches ;)).

For me the way they have done it thus far is opposite of how it should be.

Right now it feels like you have high acquisition rates for enemies in the field, and low rates for high level enemies within a duty. This doesn't make a lot of sense since a BLU can easily round up loads of enemies out in the world and blow them rather quickly, while doing a duty legitimately takes much more time; level synced you can kill many, many, many regular enemies in the time it takes to complete some of these trials or normal raids.

It makes sense for low level enemies to reliably give their spells to give their actions, but beyond that they should be <20%. On the other hand, if in this new system you defeat bosses legitimately with a synced party, it should give you the action 100% of the time.

I'm of the mind that individually, each spell should have a 20% learn rate. When it comes to party content, add another 10% for up to 4 players (50%). For the remaining 4 slots, add 12.5%, eventually translating to a 100% learn rate if you're a Full Party. At this point, it's just a matter of deciding if you want to wait for other BLUs in PF or just having a friend or someone bored blitz you through dungeons/primals. Running unsynced shouldn't be any sort of demerit, nor should syncing be a bonus, either.

Alternatively, primal spells should have buyable totems in exchange for their unique drops (levin orbs, ice tears, hive wings, etc.). Primal farming was pretty much the only sore spot in the process, where the few requiring the final boss of a dungeon being runner up, as that usually meant 6 minutes of running through the stage just to get your attempt.

At this point they would have to make it a full job or make it insanely OP at soloing content. Otherwise I have no reason to touch it again. It's not worth the headache.

I'll take the near 100%. This means that if you want harder content with guaranteed rewards you take the synced option, and a grind if you want the easy option.

My perfect amount would be 1% unsynced, 25% synced, 75% 8 (or 4 in dungeons) BLU synced though, as there is still no incentive to do 8 BLU parties (though we will see how the BLU log remedies this)

With an all-BLU party?

I don't even see the point of collecting them in an unsynced party, even if the learn rate is 100%.