My wrists hurt, I haven't been able to *play* for two days, and no house for my FC.

The current purchasing system is:
1.) Physically Damaging to Player health
2.) Insanely, ridiculously discourteous
3.) Doesn't even do what it's supposed to do. People are still selling lots!
4.) Increases server load for no reason.

I have spent two entire days unable to play the game while trying to get *any plot whatsoever* for my FC. I've lost a total of three of them, two after more than 12 hours of attempting to buy it, and the third after a mere, oh, 3 or 4. All to Individuals. My wrists hurt like hell, my left elbow was cramping up for half the day, and I've got literally nothing to show for it but sheer rage.

And it's an easy fricking fix, too!

1.) The timer that allows individual purchases needs to be longer than the one for FCs. If no FC wants to buy it first, then let an individual have it, and only then.

2.) There needs to be a *vague* indication of when the lot becomes available for purchase. This would mean people aren't sitting there for half a day, constantly sending requests to the server to see if the thing's available yet. Even if it only indicated within a freaking hour it would be a dramatic improvement.

That's the worst of the problems. The only way I can think of to stop relocation lot selling (the most common kind now) is to have the timer apply to that as well.

As for selling an entire FC that owns a house... that I don't know.

And no, the new wards aren't a solution as the chances of being able to get in and buy a house when they go live is, based on past reports, almost nonexistent. not to mention the new housing is a drop in the bucket of what needs to be added.

You know video games are now recognized as an addiction right?

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Originally Posted by Big_Bap

You know video games are now recognized as an addiction right?

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While true, the way the housing purchase system works you basically *have* to sit there and click for hours, probably multiple days in a row, to actually get one. It's... beyond dumb.

Or use a macro and get banned.

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Originally Posted by TironStarstryker

And no, the new wards aren't a solution as the chances of being able to get in and buy a house when they go live is, based on past reports, almost nonexistent. not to mention the new housing is a drop in the bucket of what needs to be added.

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You will have no problem getting a FC once the new wards go live as long as your FC is at least rank 6 and has the gil ready to buy one. You evidently have been reading the exaggerated past reports instead of the accurate ones. Every world had large number of vacancies throughout the FC only purchase period when the new wards were added in 4.2. It was only after the personal purchase moratorium was lifted that they quickly disappeared on the very high population worlds. The low and medium population worlds had plots available for several weeks if not months after that.

Your FC might not get it's preferred choice of a plot but it will be able to get one.

Also the current system is not damaging to player health. It's your unhealthy obsession that is damaging your health. That is YOUR responsibility, not Square Enix's.

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Originally Posted by Jojoya

You will have no problem getting a FC once the new wards go live as long as your FC is at least rank 6 and has the gil ready to buy one. You evidently have been reading the exaggerated past reports instead of the accurate ones. Every world had large number of vacancies throughout the FC only purchase period when the new wards were added in 4.2. It was only after the personal purchase moratorium was lifted that they quickly disappeared on the very high population worlds. The low and medium population worlds had plots available for several weeks if not months after that.

Your FC might not get it's preferred choice of a plot but it will be able to get one.

Also the current system is not damaging to player health. It's your unhealthy obsession that is damaging your health. That is YOUR responsibility, not Square Enix's.

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A system that requires constant inputs for a period of hours to have a reasonable chance of success... yeah, that's bad any way you slice it. There is literally *no* way to tell if the plot's actually available other than trying to buy it. If anyone else is there trying to buy it as well... Which there is, well. Unless you're phenomenally lucky, you don't get it. I've worked on three, and not gotten any of them. (I watched a *lot* of Star Trek the last couple days, heh.)

The system *requires* you either basically give up on getting one or... sit there and spam it. Because other people are spamming it, and if you don't you've got effectively zero chance of success yourself. And only a small one even if you *do* spam it. It's a flawed system, and blaming it on the people trying to use that is fallacious at best. The system actively encourages that behavior by effectively locking you out if you don't do that.

More plots is a band-aid, unless they add enough to mostly satisfy demand. Which isn't likely to happen unless they increase the cost of ownership so much that it drives down demand, from what I can see.

And all you have to do is wait about another month so you can avoid all the constant clicking because the new wards will open and there will be plenty for your FC to choose from.

I understand there are issues with the current system but trying to blame SE for stress you have imposed on yourself over something in a game is ridiculous. Nothing is worth risking your health.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TironStarstryker

While true, the way the housing purchase system works you basically *have* to sit there and click for hours, probably multiple days in a row, to actually get one. It's... beyond dumb.

Or use a macro and get banned.

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You ignore the most obvious way to obtain an FC house... purchase one off someone.

Players purposely chose to ignore the easiest and safest option. Hard to have sympathy for someone when they decided to pick the worst option available to them.

There is an easy fix for this.

1. The character needs to finished with the MSQ Line before they can purchase a house.
2. Allow only 1 Free Company house per account
3. Allow only 1 Personal house per account - 1 character - 1 house - no matter the size. The account shares the personal house purchased.
4. Open up 18 More wards in each housing are - basically doubling what is available now.
5. Pack Up needs to be 90 days from the day the sub runs out - refunding 100% of purchase value
6. Remove all timers.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by GoofyBoots

There is an easy fix for this.

1. The character needs to finished with the MSQ Line before they can purchase a house.
2. Allow only 1 Free Company house per account
3. Allow only 1 Personal house per account - 1 character - 1 house - no matter the size. The account shares the personal house purchased.
4. Open up 18 More wards in each housing are - basically doubling what is available now.
5. Pack Up needs to be 90 days from the day the sub runs out - refunding 100% of purchase value
6. Remove all timers.

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Only the first point made any sense.

https://eu.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodes...e225f833b8c3e6

"After the release of Patch 5.1, wards 19 through 21 will be added to all residential districts. Subdivisions will also be available, resulting in a total of 180 new plots of land for each of the four districts. An apartment building will also be added to each ward, with a second apartment building available in each subdivision.

Please note, however, that sales of plots in wards 19 through 21 will be restricted to Free Companies for a limited time."

There you go OP. SE are already doing what you suggest, and have been for some time.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TironStarstryker

chances of being able to get in and buy a house when they go live is, based on past reports, almost nonexistent.

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This is factually untrue, and I'm pretty sure you are mixing up times when they opened up FC housing and individual housing at the same time. I have seen screenshots of empty lots just days before they open it to individuals, with people complaining (ironically) that they have no neighbors. The demand for FC housing just isn't that high.


P.S: Quit crying about physical injuries that you inflicted upon yourself. Its a videogame, get up and take a break. I get that its frustrating having housing be so limiting, but to blame it for physical injury distracts from the real issues and highlights your own issues.

And yet people light their torches and pitchforks when physical health is mentioned.

So far, our "responsible, adult" community sure doesn't seem so responsible. Almost as if people hurting themselves over obsessions is a well-documented issue.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TironStarstryker

More plots is a band-aid, unless they add enough to mostly satisfy demand. Which isn't likely to happen unless they increase the cost of ownership so much that it drives down demand, from what I can see.

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I've seen "more plots" work on Hyperion at least. After they added the new wards along with the limitations in place, I would see Goblet small plots go empty in ward my friend's house is in, and they would sit empty for days, so you should have been able to just walk up and buy them at that point with no timer blocking you. I would also check the wards every once in awhile from the aetherytes, and there was always a some small Goblet plots empty. The only complaints were from the picky people about how they can't get something like a large house in Shirogane.

Around Shadowbringers, more people started playing and plots opened up less often, and when they do open, they get groups sitting at the placard. But these new wards coming may though maybe just enough to go back to at least having it where you can easily get a Goblet small plot at any time.

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Originally Posted by Kenky

And yet people light their torches and pitchforks when physical health is mentioned.

So far, our "responsible, adult" community sure doesn't seem so responsible. Almost as if people hurting themselves over obsessions is a well-documented issue.

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Yeah, and I'm trying not to exacerbate it since the first day, but the simple fact that is that the system design encourages that kind of behavior, or using bannable automation in its place. the fact you don't have to do it is irrelevant.

People didn't have to wear a hole in their palm to win a stupid mario party minigame, but that was the easiest way to win it, so kids ended up with second degree burns on their hands. Nintendo responded by issuing a warning, offering free protective gloves to owners of the game... and also using the mechanic that caused the problem very rarely in subsequent releases. And changing their joystick design to one that didn't cause the problem as quickly. And they haven't released the original on virtual console either.

It encourages unhealthy behavior (both in terms of spending way too much time doing it, and in terms of clicking repeatedly to try to beat other people out). As any competent, responsible UX designer could tell you, that's something you need to fix, urgently.

There are literally dozens of products that have been recalled or banned because of stuff like that (of admittedly varying severity), and I'm not asking for anything like that. I just want them to fix it to be less stupid, because I don't want to sit around for hours trying to buy a fricking house. I don't want to sit there and tap out the same button sequence over and over trying to buy the thing. I don't want to have to risk a ban to automate the bloody thing.

But I have, in fact, already lost one because I tried to back off and not be dumb about it. Someone walked up and bought it before I could react while I wasn't spamming it, and if I had been, I would've gotten one already. That's stupid.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TironStarstryker

Yeah, and I'm trying not to exacerbate it since the first day, but the simple fact that is that the system design encourages that kind of behavior, or using bannable automation in its place. the fact you don't have to do it is irrelevant.

People didn't have to wear a hole in their palm to win a stupid mario party minigame, but that was the easiest way to win it, so kids ended up with second degree burns on their hands. Nintendo responded by issuing a warning, offering free protective gloves to owners of the game... and also using the mechanic that caused the problem very rarely in subsequent releases. And changing their joystick design to one that didn't cause the problem as quickly. And they haven't released the original on virtual console either.

It encourages unhealthy behavior (both in terms of spending way too much time doing it, and in terms of clicking repeatedly to try to beat other people out). As any competent, responsible UX designer could tell you, that's something you need to fix, urgently.

There are literally dozens of products that have been recalled or banned because of stuff like that (of admittedly varying severity), and I'm not asking for anything like that. I just want them to fix it to be less stupid, because I don't want to sit around for hours trying to buy a fricking house. I don't want to sit there and tap out the same button sequence over and over trying to buy the thing. I don't want to have to risk a ban to automate the bloody thing.

But I have, in fact, already lost one because I tried to back off and not be dumb about it. Someone walked up and bought it before I could react while I wasn't spamming it, and if I had been, I would've gotten one already. That's stupid.

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Well, then let me give you this little pearl of wisdom. (Given it in the other posts, but I assume you haven't looked through those)

Join a Housing Community. There are groups out there with the sole intention of helping you get a house. How they do it varies from group to group, but the general consensus is that they ping you when it's time to start camping the plot, due to "Prime time" since RNG timer averages and such.

And, just to be clear. The system doesn't "encourage" unhealthy behavior. That's the players response to it. The system is meant to discourage bots and plot-sellers, but I think we all know how well that turned out. The current system in place (despite needing a fix, for the most part) can't really be blamed if the players using said system prefer physical and mental pain / stress, because they're putting a worrying amount of weight to a virtual thing.

There's how many hundreds of houses coming in 5.1 per server and free companies will get first dibs. You aren't tethered to your computer and nobody is making you click spam. The whole point of joining FCs is also not to have a house. There's extra benefits like airship and sub and gradening but my friends but that's just extra. There's solutions to your problem such as join one of the new EU worlds which still has mansions available for FCs, or JP worlds, or join forces / be absorbed by another FC that already has a house. Or again, be patient and wait for the patch with housing. Did you buy this game so you can have a house? Why blame developers for what happens to your health when you made the choice to click spam? There's plenty of other games for house simulator or even other MMOs with housing like ESO if it's that important to you. I have a private tropical island and 30 other houses, all instanced in that game. Clearly, FF needs instanced housing, but it's your choice to participate in the current system which you knew isn't instanced when you click spammed.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by shaiel

There's how many hundreds of houses coming in 5.1 per server and free companies will get first dibs. You aren't tethered to your computer and nobody is making you click spam. The whole point of joining FCs is also not to have a house. There's extra benefits like airship and sub and gradening but my friends but that's just extra. There's solutions to your problem such as join one of the new EU worlds which still has mansions available for FCs, or JP worlds, or join forces / be absorbed by another FC that already has a house. Or again, be patient and wait for the patch with housing. Did you buy this game so you can have a house? Why blame developers for what happens to your health when you made the choice to click spam? There's plenty of other games for house simulator or even other MMOs with housing like ESO if it's that important to you. I have a private tropical island and 30 other houses, all instanced in that game. Clearly, FF needs instanced housing, but it's your choice to participate in the current system which you knew isn't instanced when you click spammed.

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I joined with a group of friends that mostly just started playing, and they chose the server we're on because a couple of us were already there. Trying to get the house for the entire *group* of us because none of us has one. So yeah, that doesn't really help.

Housing community is an interesting idea that I'll look into.

Just buying one from someone is nonviable, both since we frankly don't have enough cash to get one on the secondary market(the majority of us are new players), and because we would have to purchase an FC to do it since we don't already *have* a plot to relocate from. And I don't think we really want to get stuck with some random FC name that whoever happened to have just to get a house.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TironStarstryker

I joined with a group of friends that mostly just started playing, and they chose the server we're on because a couple of us were already there. Trying to get the house for the entire *group* of us because none of us has one. So yeah, that doesn't really help.

Housing community is an interesting idea that I'll look into.

Just buying one from someone is nonviable, both since we frankly don't have enough cash to get one on the secondary market(the majority of us are new players), and because we would have to purchase an FC to do it since we don't already *have* a plot to relocate from. And I don't think we really want to get stuck with some random FC name that whoever happened to have just to get a house.

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So instead of making money while enjoying the game, you prefer to spend your free time doing something ridiculously boring and "Physically Damaging" to use your own words. Amazing...

When you buy someone's FC, you end up with their house if they have one. You can also change the tag/name. Looking into how things worked might have been a better option compared to targeting a virtual piece of wood all day.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by shaiel

There's how many hundreds of houses coming in 5.1 per server and free companies will get first dibs. You aren't tethered to your computer and nobody is making you click spam. The whole point of joining FCs is also not to have a house. There's extra benefits like airship and sub and gradening but my friends but that's just extra. There's solutions to your problem such as join one of the new EU worlds which still has mansions available for FCs, or JP worlds, or join forces / be absorbed by another FC that already has a house. Or again, be patient and wait for the patch with housing. Did you buy this game so you can have a house? Why blame developers for what happens to your health when you made the choice to click spam? There's plenty of other games for house simulator or even other MMOs with housing like ESO if it's that important to you. I have a private tropical island and 30 other houses, all instanced in that game. Clearly, FF needs instanced housing, but it's your choice to participate in the current system which you knew isn't instanced when you click spammed.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by TironStarstryker

I joined with a group of friends that mostly just started playing, and they chose the server we're on because a couple of us were already there. Trying to get the house for the entire *group* of us because none of us has one. So yeah, that doesn't really help.

Housing community is an interesting idea that I'll look into.

Just buying one from someone is nonviable, both since we frankly don't have enough cash to get one on the secondary market(the majority of us are new players), and because we would have to purchase an FC to do it since we don't already *have* a plot to relocate from. And I don't think we really want to get stuck with some random FC name that whoever happened to have just to get a house.

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Your ignoring the fact that hundreds of houses are coming in 5.1
Instead of destroying your wrist and complaining about it to everyone, you retain the option of waiting a few weeks to get a house with ease.

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Originally Posted by Edax

Your ignoring the fact that hundreds of houses are coming in 5.1
Instead of destroying your wrist and complaining about it to everyone, you retain the option of waiting a few weeks to get a house with ease.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Big_Bap

So instead of making money while enjoying the game, you prefer to spend your free time doing something ridiculously boring and "Physically Damaging" to use your own words. Amazing...

When you buy someone's FC, you end up with their house if they have one. You can also change the tag/name. Looking into how things worked might have been a better option compared to targeting a virtual piece of wood all day.

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1.) I have, in fact, backed *way* off and haven't been bothering to camp or spam in days, dramatically reducing my chances of getting a house for the FC anytime soon.
2.) I'm the person least able to make cash in the FC atm.
3.) Nothing anyone has said changes the fact that it's a badly designed system. Extremely Badly designed.

The simple fact is, the optimal way to get a house quickly under normal circumstances (so *not* including extraordinary, rare, one-time events where more housing becomes available!) is to have as many people as possible constantly trying to buy every open house. Either via wrist-wrecking manual inputs or bannable macros.

No commentary about behavior, about the fact my specific situation will temporarily stop being a problem in a few weeks, or any other alleged 'mitigating factor' thus far presented changes that fact.

I can, in fact, think of only two ways that the current system could cease being totally awful for anyone trying to buy a house.

1.) Increase the cost so much that the number of people seeking houses is reduced to the point where there's openings that last *beyond* the end of the timers. My estimate is this would be somewhere around a factor of 100 times more expensive.
2.) Increase the number of houses by a tremendous factor so that there's actually close to enough to satisfy demand. I estimate this would require at *least* a doubling of current stocks, and probably more like triple or quadruple the present number.

Neither seems likely. Measures to fix the current system so that sitting and spamming for hours on end is no longer the most effective solution would be both easier and more reasonable. Anyone that says otherwise... well, I have to question their motives.

Edit: Just to illustrate... I've been casually monitoring the available plots today, and of the Six I've found, only one had been consistently camped (the worst one too, oddly.), but now, suddenly, *all of them* are camped. So my choices are... give up, or start trying to outcompete one of them via spam. Which is... wrong.

I used to play every day until things happening in game started irritating me and I found I was not enjoying time spent like I used to. I log in 3-4x a week to grab xworld hunts fill my tomes, get a piece of 460 gear and craft a bit, check my ventures, attend a special event etc then outie. If the game is stressing you or making you angry, find another that doesn't, I did. I have a medium house but always wanted a large in a good location. Didn't happen, now I rarely change my house stuff anymore and I used to be an avid deco freak hehe.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Besame

I used to play every day until things happening in game started irritating me and I found I was not enjoying time spent like I used to. I log in 3-4x a week to grab xworld hunts fill my tomes, get a piece of 460 gear and craft a bit, check my ventures, attend a special event etc then outie. If the game is stressing you or making you angry, find another that doesn't, I did. I have a medium house but always wanted a large in a good location. Didn't happen, now I rarely change my house stuff anymore and I used to be an avid deco freak hehe.

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Yeah. I don't care about getting one personally, FC wants one for the extra mechanics it offers.

Give 5-7 ppl like 3-5 mil from the chest and ask if they can be at the house for a bit each (if you have no money just tell them that they should use their own and you pay them)? Anything can potentially hurt you if you do it for hours, you could raise the the argument playing the game causes your eyes to be sore and your fingers to cramp if you do it all day ... saying this system causes you physical harm is a bit far fetched.

If not for the timer you would look at 20m for a small house because of blackmarket.

Split the time with fc member.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TironStarstryker

Yeah, and I'm trying not to exacerbate it since the first day, but the simple fact that is that the system design encourages that kind of behavior, or using bannable automation in its place. the fact you don't have to do it is irrelevant.

People didn't have to wear a hole in their palm to win a stupid mario party minigame, but that was the easiest way to win it, so kids ended up with second degree burns on their hands. Nintendo responded by issuing a warning, offering free protective gloves to owners of the game... and also using the mechanic that caused the problem very rarely in subsequent releases. And changing their joystick design to one that didn't cause the problem as quickly. And they haven't released the original on virtual console either.

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Again, I'll reiterate that the housing coming in 5.1 is FC exclusive, meaning you will have no problem getting one, and the behaviour you talk about won't occur. As of this current moment, your particular issue isn't an issue. There are still problems with the housing system overall, but SE are listening and have been fighting a losing battle (that they simply don't have the resources to fix) since 2.1.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lambdafish

Again, I'll reiterate that the housing coming in 5.1 is FC exclusive, meaning you will have no problem getting one, and the behaviour you talk about won't occur. As of this current moment, your particular issue isn't an issue. There are still problems with the housing system overall, but SE are listening and have been fighting a losing battle (that they simply don't have the resources to fix) since 2.1.

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As I said before, several times... adding more is a bandaid unless they add a *lot* more. It's temporary, and things will go back to being as they are. The *mechanics* need fixing, and it would take a *lot* less resources than adding enough housing.

And we got one finally. none of those six I mentioned earlier went before most of the people camping them gave up, and I managed to snag one on a later pass.

Still doesn't make the mechanics any less garbage. :p

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lambdafish

Again, I'll reiterate that the housing coming in 5.1 is FC exclusive

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Only for a few weeks, maybe a month tops. It's how the FC-exclusive housing surge was last time they added more wards. I'm wagering some will take advantage, then others will just not bother. Leaving some wards on every server dead until the "Personal Housing Peons" flood it up and then go back to bitching about housing not being open to all.

Despite the fact it is. You just need to do what every other player is doing. (excluding those that buy FCs. For obvious reasons.)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Kenky

Only for a few weeks, maybe a month tops. It's how the FC-exclusive housing surge was last time they added more wards. I'm wagering some will take advantage, then others will just not bother. Leaving some wards on every server dead until the "Personal Housing Peons" flood it up and then go back to bitching about housing not being open to all.

Despite the fact it is. You just need to do what every other player is doing. (excluding those that buy FCs. For obvious reasons.)

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People are forgetting that while the new wards will be limited to new purchased by FCs, there will plots opening in the existing wards as people relocate to the new ones to get their preferred plots or upgrade.

There won't be a huge selection but there will be plots available to individuals before the new wards have the personal purchase moratorium lifted. Yes, they are still going to be fighting the purchase timer but they'll be far less likely to be fighting people trying to relocate since those players would be going to the new wards.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jojoya

People are forgetting that while the new wards will be limited to new purchased by FCs, there will plots opening in the existing wards as people relocate to the new ones to get their preferred plots or upgrade.

There won't be a huge selection but there will be plots available to individuals before the new wards have the personal purchase moratorium lifted. Yes, they are still going to be fighting the purchase timer but they'll be far less likely to be fighting people trying to relocate since those players would be going to the new wards.

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Exactly what we're hoping to do, actually. Relocate from the small we just picked up to a larger plot in one of the new wards. That was part of why we wanted to get a plot *before* the surge.

Has anyone bought a personal house on the old wards after someone has relocated to the new ones? I’m trying to figure out what the ranges for the relocation timer. To where it’s able to be bought not relocated too. :(

With all the new housing spaces that would have opened up on most standard servers there will be a ton of small houses available for players to purchase when the timers all lift and for FCs even if they missed the Medium/Large houses there are many small plots available to get started on.

I do think they need a way for new players to get into housing without spamming the placards though.

Perhaps SE could code that a player gives a one time fee of 3 million to a housing NPC and they purchase (any) small house for you when one opens up and this would only be available to new house buyers on a priority list after that individuals can just relocate when they see one available.