Making healers more interesting via buffs

This is just a brainstorm, not a statement of what could or should happen. Also, focused on concepts as opposed to numbers.

Many complaints about healers stem from not having consistent need for critical thinking, and complex actions or rotations to go along with this. Most threads I see are asking for more complex DPS rotations to fill this need, followed by bickering between people about whether healers should be doing so much direct DPS or not. What most people seem to want is some added complexity to the job that is good for min/max and raids/dungeons, but not implemented in a way that is too scary or confusing to new or less skilled players that results in deaths and harassment.

As opposed to making healers do more complex DPS (rotations, positionals, conditionals), which brings about more "Green DPS" arguments, why not add DPS-related buffs to better fit within the healing/helping role? This still meets many DPS healers' goals of making fights end faster without being the direct contributor of that DPS. What quickly comes to mind is Brave and Faith. These have FF history with Brave being physical DPS boost and Faith being a magic DPS boost.

I believe that making such buffs AoE or party-wide is too simplistic. To me, this would just be boring. Also, making it single target can add complexity when determining who gets the buff when. Maybe you give Faith to the PLD for the Holy Spirit window instead of the RDM who is doing their melee combo at that time. You could really optimize based on fight and timing for best overall DPS assistance. Less skilled or comfortable healers could simple do a more basic rotation. Making duration and cooldown such that you can only have buffs on 1 or 2 people at any given time (including self) also adds something for consideration.

The buffs should not be so short that they interfere with healing, but not so long that you don't really need to think about them. The goal is to add complexity, so applying buffs should be moderate frequency. There should also be an appropriate cooldown so this isn't something that is spammed instead of <healer DPS skill>.

The buffs should not stack (neither Brave and Faith together nor buffs from another healer). This encourages healers to work out who they are responsible for, and not just a super-pad of the top parser.


Potential ways to increase complexity even further:
- Give an extra (double?) potency effect when applying to self and adjust spell/ability potencies down accordingly? This would further the gap between healers and DPS where it should be more optimal to buff the DPS as opposed to the healer, but still allow the healer to solo/duo as they do now. Maybe make a penalty take effect when Brave/Faith are learned so it doesn't punish new players that don't understand how this works. I will admit that I was one of the healers that nuked without cleric stance for 30 levels in 2.0 before I figured it out...
- Brave and Faith could share a cooldown. That way you have to think about which one to do when, in what order, and which one to apply to jobs that have multiple damage types. This does reduce the busywork of buff management slightly since it is a single cooldown to consider instead of two. It could also make mixed magic/physical DPS jobs more interesting in the future.
- The cooldown(s) and duration could be such that they do not evenly map. Perhaps it should not be possible for 1 healer to have 100% uptime on 2 members. Otherwise, it becomes a matter of which 2 DPS are covered by which healer. Having a gap means that either one person gets 100% uptime at the loss of a portion of DPS boost to another person, or the healer needs to be much more calculating in their buff application.
- I don't personally like this, but they could have diminishing potency like Embolden. This would make timing even more important, and maybe you let a buff fall off in order to have the highest potency throughout a burst window.

My biggest concern with this is that it could make AST too busy. Dealing a DPS buff in addition to card management could be a bit overwhelming. Something would likely need to be done to ease this.

I've tried to think of a good way to do this without making these healer role actions, but I can't think of anything that wouldn't result in the healer given a specific buff from becoming the required healer. I also know this sounds like it's just giving the AST card effects to the other healers (because it effectively is), but I also can't think of any other buffs other than flat DPS that wouldn't be ridiculed by the playerbase. Giving one healer DPS while giving another something like skill/spell speed or recast reduction wouldn't go over well because timing messes with people's buff lineups and rotations or the effective DPS from those buffs doesn't equal the raw DPS buff. This gets even harder if you want to plan for a 4th or 5th healer down the line. Maybe job-specific traits like additional potency, duration, a damage spikes effect, or noticeable auto-attack speed (not GCD reduction) could add some job uniqueness to it. Maybe they are on the GCD for some jobs, and oGCD for others based on their kit mapping and weave requirements. SCH and AST have a lot of oGCD stuff to do, and instant GCD application would be nifty, but maybe WHM has a trait that makes it oGCD for them.

This approach of job traits to augment role actions could also break up some of the homogeneity of healers without taking necessary things away from any of them. But that is a separate topic.

I remember AST having several buffs at one point and SE decided too many people liked they so they took it away.

Anyhow, skimming through this, it doesn't spark anything exciting imo. Not to say I don't appreciate the thought or effort, but I don't see it fixing the problem. The biggest problem is that healers have so much down time and not enough to do in it. Giving them one buff they can use, which I imagine would be a lengthy cool down, wouldn't fix anything. That would be like saying SCH has plenty to do because chain strategem, and having the buffs at the point where they could be constantly used would basically be the other 2 healers stepping on ASTs toes, and if all 3 got them then that goes into another complaint people have of "healers feeling too similar with nothing to differentiate them". What every healer needs is something to call their own with that something taking up their down time, and making the class work around it instead of being an after thought. The old AST cards were great for that,hence why ASTs almost never complained about their simple DPS rotation, because they had cards to focus on instead. SCH had its DPS rotation as well as actual fairy management to keep it occupied so things were good there, it was WHM struggling in that department, so clearly the only solution was to drag the other 2 healers down to that level.

I would definitely love more of a support element added to the healers, but that kind of thing is hard to balance and the FFXIV dev team is all about DPS numbers. I could see WHM getting more of the buff kinds of skills and SCH getting more a the debuff kinds of skills that effected mobs, but I really don't know what else to add to AST aside from the cards they already have.

I'm fine with adding more complexity to each healer's toolkits but it has to be something more than a simple buff they throw out during Raid buff windows.

For WHM, I want to see a return of Cleric Stance Dancing, Fluid Aura changed into a Frontal Cone AoE Slow, Protect returning but as a Single Target Mitigation tool, Shell being added as an AoE mitigation tool, and Afflatus Solace/Rapture reducing the CD on Presence of Mind each use.

For SCH, I want Selene to be the Noct version of Eos, changing Whispering Dawn into an AoE Shield with Fey Illumination being a 10% mitigation and 5% healing increase vs EoS being a 10% heal increase and 5% mitigation; Have Seraph include Selene's old Haste buff to Consolation as well. I also want Emergency Tactics to be changed into a stance that SCH can switch in and out of to remove their shield entirely for just straight heals with Addlo/Succor but with slightly lower heal potencies (I.E. Without E-Tactics, Addlo is a 300 cure potency with a 375 shield, with E-tactics, its just a 600 potency heal straight), I also miss the trait that Sacred Soil would proc an occasional free Succor so I want that back but it to be guaranteed instead of a X% proc.

For AST, just return the old card system with Spire being changed into a Direct Hit buff, Spread Royal Road being reduced to only affect 2 party members and Divination being buffed to a 20 second duration. Return Time Dilation and the Stun to COpp (not the time extension though).

WHM remains largely unchanged but has more DPS options available to it, and having some mitigation tools to it as well.
SCH gains more mitigation tools but can swap to a more full frontal healer approach without issue and can provide more utility with Seraph as well.
AST just returned to its former self for the most part.

Potency adjustments might be needs here and there but it would at least allow each healer to be different from one another but still be potent as healers will still contributing to the group in their own ways with some mild complexity thrown in to appease everyone.

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Originally Posted by SieyaM

I would definitely love more of a support element added to the healers, but that kind of thing is hard to balance and the FFXIV dev team is all about DPS numbers. I could see WHM getting more of the buff kinds of skills and SCH getting more a the debuff kinds of skills that effected mobs, but I really don't know what else to add to AST aside from the cards they already have.

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The problem is... this is more true than you know. Or rather, the OP knows.

We've been having this discussion for literally years.

This is what got us lillies 1.0.

The dev team is stone-wall adamant that white mage should not have party buffs. It is only years later that we got them to give WHM good DPS to make up for the lack of buffs.

I don't mean to discourage this discussion. Yes, it would be nice if there was more 'support' things to do, or if we simply had reason to use even a slightly larger fraction of our healing kit in regular content. But from a pragmatic standpoint, it is extremely difficult to get the dev team on board with these kinds of suggestions.

I think that we can all agree on one thing: SE needs to think outside the box. Healer kits are almost 1:1 identical, and something needs to be done against that.

AST is just weaker WHM with cards, and SCH is WHM with slightly different heals.

Every class in the game has gimmicks: burst phases, mana jauges, dances, ninjustu, stances, modular combos, buffs to maintain, priority systems, action stacks...

What do we have? Press this button to kill, press that button to heal. And perhaps one or two interesting buttons. Fantastic.

I keep getting into healer threads and essentially repeating the same thing.

Build on each healer secondary identity.

Their healing is homogenized? Have their contribution to dps be distinct.

AST has its own way to contribute to rDps: Buffs. Give them more tools to manipulate said buffs. Let them cast cards more often, and have divination be more impactful. Card management is what makes the class unique. Double down on that.

SCH is the debuffer. Make Chain Stratagem an equivalent of divination, in the sense that it becomes an ability that requires tactical build up. Give them debuff management, skills to reveal weaknesses, exploit gaps in enemy defenses. Have them apply strong enfeebling debuffs while the fairy sustains the party during those times.

WHM is fine with having no utility as long as it contributes with enormous personal dps. Make lilly abilities into oGCDs, let them weave damage and healing together. Have fluid aura deal moderate damage and increase the speed of lilly growth when woven with other spells.

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Originally Posted by GrimGale

I keep getting into healer threads and essentially repeating the same thing.

Build on each healer secondary identity.

Their healing is homogenized? Have their contribution to dps be distinct.

AST has its own way to contribute to rDps: Buffs. Give them more tools to manipulate said buffs. Let them cast cards more often, and have divination be more impactful. Card management is what makes the class unique. Double down on that.

SCH is the debuffer. Make Chain Stratagem an equivalent of divination, in the sense that it becomes an ability that requires tactical build up. Give them debuff management, skills to reveal weaknesses, exploit gaps in enemy defenses. Have them apply strong enfeebling debuffs while the fairy sustains the party during those times.

WHM is fine with having no utility as long as it contributes with enormous personal dps. Make lilly abilities into oGCDs, let them weave damage and healing together. Have fluid aura deal moderate damage and increase the speed of lilly growth when woven with other spells.

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I'm gonna be that guy and say I do like the ideas here, however I will be doomed to nitpick it.

For AST: I think what they have now is sufficient, what we need for them is stuff to make the management and button bloat more streamlined, such as Minor Arcana instantly converting and using the cards at the same time, rearranging the levels at which card mechanics are learned, )literally the only reason I dont play ast pre-70 is because how incomplete their buff mechanics feel without Sleeve Draw) and slight number tweaks to make the buffs OR personal dps feel more impactful.

For SCH: While I adore the concept of sch being the debuffer/dot specialist. I have a difficult time visualizing how this would work without them being even more overwhelming dominant in the game then then they are. What I personally wanted to see was maintaining dots granting you fae guage and more abilities consuming fae guage to emulate the feeling of debuff management without as much balancing issues. I do think Chain, and reimplementing Virus, would be sufficient as well.

Er, a minor nitpick but in your original post you mentioned giving Faith to a PLD who's currently in their Requiescat phase while the party's RDM is doing their melee combo. RDM's Enchanted weaponskills are still pure magic damage, so they'd still benefit an absolute ton from Faith at that stage (let alone Holy/Flare and Scorch being magic). The way you can tell is whether the ability says "Delivers an attack" or "Deals unaspected/wind/fire/etc damage". If it's the former, it's physical, and magic attacks are always the latter. The only exception is Dragonfire Dive, which is both physical Piercing and Fire damage.

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Originally Posted by Brandedblade

For SCH: While I adore the concept of sch being the debuffer/dot specialist. I have a difficult time visualizing how this would work without them being even more overwhelming dominant in the game then then they are. What I personally wanted to see was maintaining dots granting you fae guage and more abilities consuming fae guage to emulate the feeling of debuff management without as much balancing issues. I do think Chain, and reimplementing Virus, would be sufficient as well.

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Well "dominance" or meta can be paliated with numbers.

With this design the healers would essentially be doing the same thing in different ways. With better weaving tools WHM would see an increase in its own personal dps while maintaining an edge on healing potency. Plus, paired with SCH or AST she would benefit from buffs debuffs aswell.

SCH and AST would bring essentially the same potency increase. One is simply granted to party and the other is applied to single enemy (Which is the same as granting a buff to every player currently attacking said enemy.) Ofc their personal damage numbers would be adjusted as to be balanced with WHM's personal dps. I could see AST and SCH getting and edge over WHM in the case of very coordinated statics still. WHM would be a safer alternative to AST and SCH pairings.

I'd agree that healers should be the buffers / debuffers.

Take all of them away from the dps, let them worry about dps.

Give healers a short CD short duration Protect for physical (like in pvp) and Shell for magic via role actions

i wish healers had virus and disable back. why the hell does dps out of anything have to be the ones mitigating damage? most dps dont know or care about what damage kills or when to use what. why should healers depend on random unreliable people for something that is literally their job? if you dont have temperance/soil/CU and want to mitigate something you have to beg other dps to use theirs and many times they dont cuz theyre too busy doing their rotation