How will future advanced jobs work?

Curious what people think about this. Currently as we all know jobs are sort of extensions of preexisting classes. You don't level them separately, they don't have a huge amount of extra abilities and aren't drastically different than their root class.

This makes me wonder where jobs like Puppet Master, Blue Mage, Summoner, Beastmaster or Ninja fit in. Previous iterations don't resemble anything close to what classes we have now and couldn't be implemented in the same way as current advanced classes. Are we going to have a third archetype: the advanced base class, with no soul crystal? Or would SE somehow manage to shoehorn this into the soul crystal system? Or maybe these kinds of jobs will never see the light of day in FFXIV.

If there's any official word on this stuff, I'd love a link, even if it's just vague ideas of what the devs are planning for the distant future. Feel free to share your own thoughts on how this might work, 'cause it's been baking my noodle for the last couple of days.

Well, for one, in the recent poll they mentioned jobs like Ninja, Summoner and Puppetmaster, so at least I guess they already have an idea on how to shove them in...
All it's left to understand is the 'How' they're going to do it.

They're going to add new classes, each of which comes with an advanced job to come with it.

I think one of the new classes will clearly be the Arcanist, there is just so much evidence to support it, Musketeer I think will eventually become a Job maybe.

They could do it like skill trees, where each class advances onto another, like Eden Eternal.

My idea of it could be such that, right now we have Job Tier 1, 30-50, If they ever increase level cap they could add new jobs onto that, 50-60 include the Tier 2 of Jobs, Summoner part of White Mage, Ninja part of Gladiator, Puppet part of Monk, and so on.

So Jobs become a sort of skill tree you can unlock, as in the end, that is all it is, you equip it, you can wear specific gear and use its unique skills. But to be more FF could be like "Skill Crystal" XD

Musketeer will probably be a class since it has its own guild.

Musketeer would be a class, not a job. Was planned as class since beginning and there is already a class guild for musketeer.

And yes, Yoshi already said there would come new classes and that the new classes would come with jobs.

basically im hoping they add more weapon classes as the future comes and eventually give at least every class 1-2 jobs, (then they can add w/e advanced jobs they want that are mix and match or function differently)

Like if they add Musketeer, a DD with a gun as a base job class, you will get its abilities, traits, and weaponskills, then add jobs on top of it. Perhaps one job could be Pistolero, which has strong enfeeblements and focuses on staying DD, and another could be puppetmaster, and it could be a versatile pet job ontop of the gun class. Not saying this are things that should happen, but there is a lot of room for them to wiggle with.

I voted for musketeer ^^
http://www.ffxivcore.com/gallery/129..._614_26987.jpg

I would like to see them branch out so that it works like FFT.

Something like Base Class > Job > advanced job.

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Originally Posted by Felis

Musketeer would be a class, not a job. Was planned as class since beginning and there is already a class guild for musketeer.

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Bard was suppose to be a class, but it's a job now. And they can easily get rid of the musketeer (and arcanist) guilds in the map revamp

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Originally Posted by Isaveron

Bard was suppose to be a class, but it's a job now. And they can easily get rid of the musketeer (and arcanist) guilds in the map revamp

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When did they ever mention BRD as a class? Arcanist and Musketeer have been confirmed to be classes, and they were next in line to be implemented under Tanaka's plan, however Yoshi P came in and felt there needs to be more balance between physical and mage class choices and thus he wants to prioritize magic-based classes a bit before getting to musketeer.

That being said, we already know that each class will have at least 1 job, and that they were at some point exploring the concept of jobs that branch from a combination of multiple classes.

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Originally Posted by Volsung

basically im hoping they add more weapon classes as the future comes and eventually give at least every class 1-2 jobs, (then they can add w/e advanced jobs they want that are mix and match or function differently)

Like if they add Musketeer, a DD with a gun as a base job class, you will get its abilities, traits, and weaponskills, then add jobs on top of it. Perhaps one job could be Pistolero, which has strong enfeeblements and focuses on staying DD, and another could be puppetmaster, and it could be a versatile pet job ontop of the gun class. Not saying this are things that should happen, but there is a lot of room for them to wiggle with.

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Hmm, I thought the only way puppetmaster would be my favorite again is if it still was hand2hand based. But I might actually enjoy puppetmaster if it had guns too. I like that idea.

I wouldn't say a mage class is the next in line, even if Yoshi-p said he would like more magic classes.

Isn't the whole point of the latest poll to determine what class is most wanted.

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Originally Posted by Jinko

I wouldn't say a mage class is the next in line, even if Yoshi-p said he would like more magic classes.

Isn't the whole point of the latest poll to determine what class is most wanted.

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This is true. He did say at one point he wanted to prioritize mage classes, but then he effectively decided to ask the playerbase.

The job system can easily be expanded in the future. if the cap is raised to 60 that's 2 more abilities per job and whatever number of passive abilities as well (I think jobs need this bad right now).

It's the mix of classes that can really shine here to create new jobs. That plus the introduction of new classes to mix things up. Something like a katana can then branch to Ninja and samurai. A dagger can bring in THF and assassin. Yes, that means that a NIN will have 7 abilities different from a SAM (plus sub abilities from different jobs), but those could mean a lot if tested and used right.

Just think of the possibilities. FF Tactics come to mind :)

If you guys were paying attention but alot of people sadly weren't ...

You'd have already noticed that jobs are already prepped for multiple different combinations.
After you take a base class and its 2 supporting class's skills, its not hard to see what kind of job best fullfills that role.

Ill use an exist job, bard as an example then go on to something else.

Bard is a support/DD. You run between party groups to give buffs while keeping your main target on the enemy. Normally, an archer is free to just wail away, but a bard adds the ability to keep party members fresh on MP, TP and Accuracy, not to mention if you've leveled THM, you get Resonance which makes it easyer to get songs to far members. And if you leveled CNJ Sacred Prism and Stoneskin further your support status.

Now take something like Dark Knight.
The best fit here is Lancer. Yes, lancer at first glance is just Dragoon, but think about it, Dragoon optimized Lancer for High Damage and quick disappearance via jump. Dark Knight is a job that eats its own HP to deal damage while having High draining potency, capitalizing on Lancer's life surge and power surge. In FFXIV, building a DRK would actually have tank Potential. I've ran into Lancers tanking before so I wouldn't rule it out. While your defense isn't great, you have the ability to drain massive amounts of HP and sustain your life. The two supporting jobs that best fit for Dark Knight are Marauder, and Thaumaturge. Marauder give access to provoke, blood bath and foresight, making it increase its tank potential. Thaumaturge gives way to Dark Seal, Necrogenesis Fire and Thunder. If I developed DK I would give it Drain, so you use Dark Seal with Drain to Increase Accuracy of Drain, Fire, or Thunder. Also use necrogenesis for increased self heal sustaining. Fire and Thunder also will give an edge when fighting mobs weak to those elements.
And so yeah... That ladies and gentlemen is the essence of a Dark Knight.

If you want to know how a new job would function all you essentially have to do I make one up and think of the mechanics.

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Originally Posted by AceofRains

If you guys were paying attention but alot of people sadly weren't ...

You'd have already noticed that jobs are already prepped for multiple different combinations.
After you take a base class and its 2 supporting class's skills, its not hard to see what kind of job best fullfills that role.

If you want to know how a new job would function all you essentially have to do I make one up and think of the mechanics.

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I'm talking about jobs which require entirely new skill sets that don't currently exist. No matter how hard you try, you cannot make a Blue Mage or Ninja with what we have, they both have their own completely unique and vast branches of magic. Same can be said for Summoner primal abilities and Beastmaster pet controls - there's no simple version currently in game to grab a hold of and extend upon. Lore-wise and mechanics-wise, these jobs simply don't belong to any other class, or any combination thereof. I don't feel that they would mesh with the soul crystal system at all. Dark Knight was kind of an easy one, which is why I didn't mention it.

Anyway, I'm glad to hear from others that there will be new base classes, 'cause as far as I can see, this is the only way to do it well. Starting off entirely new classes at level 50 with the soul crystal system would be pretty disappointing to me - it makes sense with the current jobs, just not the ones I mentioned. That was my biggest concern.

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Originally Posted by Tigercub

I'm talking about jobs which require entirely new skill sets that don't currently exist. No matter how hard you try, you cannot make a Blue Mage or Ninja with what we have, they both have their own completely unique and vast branches of magic. Same can be said for Summoner primal abilities and Beastmaster pet controls - there's no simple version currently in game to grab a hold of and extend upon. Lore-wise and mechanics-wise, these jobs simply don't belong to any other class, or any combination thereof. I don't feel that they would mesh with the soul crystal system at all. Dark Knight was kind of an easy one, which is why I didn't mention it.

Anyway, I'm glad to hear from others that there will be new base classes, 'cause as far as I can see, this is the only way to do it well. Starting off entirely new classes at level 50 with the soul crystal system would be pretty disappointing to me - it makes sense with the current jobs, just not the ones I mentioned. That was my biggest concern.

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They can (and most probably will) introduce new classes in the future. I don't see the problems in this. Arcanist and Musketeer are already classes with guilds in the game (they can change it still). But for the jobs you mentioned, new classes can be introduced. Like I said, a katana wielding class can handle SAM and NIN. A basic mix of mage can handle SMN. while a pet class can handle beast master and puppet master.

I think it'll all differs in the traits. those need to be utilized to the fullest to differentiate those jobs. In the SAM and NIN example a NIN will get expertise in ninjetsu while a SAM will have a TP gain or something of the like (maybe 4 WS combos).

The real issue I can see is with something like the DRK. to put it as a job from say MRD (which I think it fits better than LNC) will mean you can ONLY use scythes as the job DRK and not as the class MRD. Could work, honestly better than making a whole new class using a scythe. A great sword + scythes class? perhaps.

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Originally Posted by Tigercub

I'm talking about jobs which require entirely new skill sets that don't currently exist. No matter how hard you try, you cannot make a Blue Mage or Ninja with what we have, they both have their own completely unique and vast branches of magic. Same can be said for Summoner primal abilities and Beastmaster pet controls - there's no simple version currently in game to grab a hold of and extend upon. Lore-wise and mechanics-wise, these jobs simply don't belong to any other class, or any combination thereof. I don't feel that they would mesh with the soul crystal system at all. Dark Knight was kind of an easy one, which is why I didn't mention it.

Anyway, I'm glad to hear from others that there will be new base classes, 'cause as far as I can see, this is the only way to do it well. Starting off entirely new classes at level 50 with the soul crystal system would be pretty disappointing to me - it makes sense with the current jobs, just not the ones I mentioned. That was my biggest concern.

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I have my own speculations on new classes that lead to the more quirky jobs like blue mage and summoner but thats all in the devs hands, I guess.

Although if you want, we can speculate all night, I love making job and class concepts especially posting them even if no one reads. Now that we know how the entire system works, you could come up with your own ideas, I mean whats the point of questioning whats next if we don't talk about our own ideas of whats next.

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Originally Posted by AceofRains

Now that we know how the entire system works, you could come up with your own ideas, I mean whats the point of questioning whats next if we don't talk about our own ideas of whats next.

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That's what we're doing. We're offering our different perspectives on what would work, what wouldn't, and why. You offered an example of Dark Knight that worked quite well, I was just pointing out why it wouldn't be as easy for the other advanced jobs; that I think they would need to be their own classes. Any speculation is good. Just because we don't all agree on how it would work doesn't mean others' opinions aren't valuable.

On another note, a lot of people have said that there will be new classes. Has anyone got an official link on hand that I could read over? It would be much appreciated :) I'll look for it myself as well, but it'll probably take me a while.

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Originally Posted by Tigercub

That's what we're doing. We're offering our different perspectives on what would work, what wouldn't, and why. You offered an example of Dark Knight that worked quite well, I was just pointing out why it wouldn't be as easy for the other advanced jobs; that I think they would need to be their own classes. Any speculation is good. Just because we don't all agree on how it would work doesn't mean others' opinions aren't valuable.

On another note, a lot of people have said that there will be new classes. Has anyone got an official link on hand that I could read over? It would be much appreciated :) I'll look for it myself as well, but it'll probably take me a while.

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I think new classes has been stated in alot of interviews

what were essentially looking at is:

Scout - Assassin type.
Tamer - Pet Class
Arcanist - Access to Water and Enfeebles/Dots and Enhancements
Musketeer - Ranged attacker number 2... Wonder how it would be diversified.

I'm thinking that they should probably give RNG to Archer and make Musketeer get jobs such as gunner, machinist, and corsair.

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Originally Posted by Tigercub

Curious what people think about this. Currently as we all know jobs are sort of extensions of preexisting classes. You don't level them separately, they don't have a huge amount of extra abilities and aren't drastically different than their root class.

This makes me wonder where jobs like Puppet Master, Blue Mage, Summoner, Beastmaster or Ninja fit in. Previous iterations don't resemble anything close to what classes we have now and couldn't be implemented in the same way as current advanced classes. Are we going to have a third archetype: the advanced base class, with no soul crystal? Or would SE somehow manage to shoehorn this into the soul crystal system? Or maybe these kinds of jobs will never see the light of day in FFXIV.

If there's any official word on this stuff, I'd love a link, even if it's just vague ideas of what the devs are planning for the distant future. Feel free to share your own thoughts on how this might work, 'cause it's been baking my noodle for the last couple of days.

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I think you're overthinking this. New base classes (like Musketeer and Arcanist) will work like the old base classes--the appropriate primary weapon/tool will become available in shops and by crafting recipes, and you'll become one by equipping them. New jobs will work like the jobs we just got--you'll complete a quest that gets you the job stone which you then equip to the job stone slot.

Yeah ^^ I just didn't know we would be getting new base classes, so I was thinking they were only going to be adding in new advanced jobs. I'm glad I was wrong about that.

I voted for Arithmetician! I just like the concept of very particular classes, I'd like the Dev team to implement something original too =)

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Originally Posted by AceofRains

Bard is a support/DD. You run between party groups to give buffs while keeping your main target on the enemy. Normally, an archer is free to just wail away, but a bard adds the ability to keep party members fresh on MP, TP and Accuracy, not to mention if you've leveled THM, you get Resonance which makes it easyer to get songs to far members. And if you leveled CNJ Sacred Prism and Stoneskin further your support status.

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Pretty sure Resonance increases the casting range of spells, not the AoE radius, and considering all songs are Self AoE's, it has no effect.

That being said, considering the BRD will usually find it's place to be among the ranged DDs Resonance can be very useful for throwing Stoneskins or backup Cures on the tank without having to get too close.

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Originally Posted by Tigercub

I'm talking about jobs which require entirely new skill sets that don't currently exist. No matter how hard you try, you cannot make a Blue Mage or Ninja with what we have...

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Oh yea, I'd totally agree we can't make ninja or blue mage with what we have, and I'd hope they don't try to or else we'll have another watered down bard (not that I dont like bard, but it could have been more).

For blue mage I'm hoping they make a whip class and the abilities all need to be learned from enemies. Call the class Flayer, and let blue mage and dancer or beastmasater (though I would want dancer a beastmaster to be their own classes, I could see this attempt to please multiple people at once) jobs that spring from it.

For ninja I'm hoping the add a small katana class (they mentioned scout) that could have those scout evasive/stealthy like skills on it, then have a job ninja that focuses on w/e they want ninja to be this time around - more evasive, enfeeb, elemental, shurikens/throwing. The alternative job could be thief later on (steal/mug, direction attack, advanced stealth)

again, none of this should happen, just shows IF they put the effort into new classes, they could do a lot. But if they try to make too many jobs off of only what we already have, it would not be as purdy

I don't think there's going to be "advanced jobs" per se, however there will be more jobs added in the future. When new classes are added, they'll also need at least on job. Also they can have multiple jobs branch off of the same class.

Currently GLA/CNJ is the requirement for Paladin. Something like Thief could be PGL/GLA. Even within the current classes there are a good amount of combinations. When they add new classes the combinations only further expand.

Ninja Job.. Hmm I hope they bring back the large shurikens as weapons that could be used to stab, slash or they could be thrown like Yuffie Kisaragi large shuriken. Using hand signs while casting ninjutsu magic as well would look cool and badass. Hmm that sounds perfect for close and mid range combat.

I could totally see Summoner being a job for Puppetmaster, lol. As far as weapons go, I'm sure they'll use different forms of existing weapons including some new. For instance, both mages use staves and wands; they look different, but they are the same kind of weapon nonetheless. For Ninjas, they can implement a different kind of dagger unless they plan to remove daggers in the game and only have GLA, THM, BLM and PLD use just swords....Actually, I think it would be best to revamp and armory system and remove katanas and daggers for future use. It would lead to less confusion.

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Originally Posted by Volsung

Oh yea, I'd totally agree we can't make ninja or blue mage with what we have, and I'd hope they don't try to or else we'll have another watered down bard (not that I dont like bard, but it could have been more).

For blue mage I'm hoping they make a whip class and the abilities all need to be learned from enemies. Call the class Flayer, and let blue mage and dancer or beastmasater (though I would want dancer a beastmaster to be their own classes, I could see this attempt to please multiple people at once) jobs that spring from it.

For ninja I'm hoping the add a small katana class (they mentioned scout) that could have those scout evasive/stealthy like skills on it, then have a job ninja that focuses on w/e they want ninja to be this time around - more evasive, enfeeb, elemental, shurikens/throwing. The alternative job could be thief later on (steal/mug, direction attack, advanced stealth)

again, none of this should happen, just shows IF they put the effort into new classes, they could do a lot. But if they try to make too many jobs off of only what we already have, it would not be as purdy

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I"m kind of confused as to why they wouldn't be able to make NIN with what we currently have compared to something like a pet class. With 15 abilities I can imagine that there would be a mix of melee and jutsu. If based on the original FF4 spell wise they could get Fire, Water and Lightning based attacks. Shadowbind, a spell to keep a target stuck in place unable to turn around (useful for solo play to perform back attacks or party play so a tank can take advantage of their back attack combos if they have any.) Mirage, 2 image copies that increase evasion but are required to perform certain actions, using said action takes a charge away. Smoke Greatly increases evasion for party for a short duration 5-10 seconds.

1=Backstab (When performed in front of target it does back attack damage, improved dmg if initiated from behind)
2=Mirage (Create 2 images to increase evasion)
4=Side Swipe (When performed in front or back of target it does side dmg, improved if initiated from the side)
6=Quick Step (Ability wears off upon evading an attack, evading an att causes acc down for target)
10=Flame (Fire based dmg, Combo:Backstab Does AOE dmg)
14=Smoke (AOE greatly improves Evasion)
18=Revenge Slash (Can only be performed after evading a strike deals dmg and chance to reduce evasion, Mirage: Increases Crit rate)
22=Assassin's Edge (Stance that improves evasion, decreases dmg taken, improves TP gains)
26=Flood (Water based dmg, Combo:Side Swipe, Chance to slow target)
30=Exploit (Can only be performed after an evasion, grants a dmg boost to elemental ninjutsu and increases dmg even greater if target is weak to element Mirage: Decreases re/cast time)
34=Assassin's Strike (Stance that improves crit hit rate, ele dmg, lowers evasion and increases dmg taken)
38=Aerial Slice (Wind based dmg when performed from behind Mirage:Improves DMG)
42=Shadow Bind (Binds target making it unable for them to turn around for duration)
46=Blitz (Lightning based dmg, Combo: Aerial Slice, chance to paralyze target)
50=Whirlwind Fury (Strikes from all side Combo:Flame, Increase chance at incapacitation on all sides)

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Was pretty much conceptualizing this idea as I saw based on FF4's Edge as well as the concept on being more like an assassin, I dare not touch the job or traits part though but I just wanted to show that it would be possible to implement a Ninja like class into the game. You just cant think of it like FF11's NIN since not even BLM in this game is the same as 11's lol. Granted I know throwing shuriken are left out but i figured a bigger focus on back attacks and jutsu would be better then trying to add in back attacks, range attacks and magic attacks.

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Originally Posted by NoctisUmbra

Pretty sure Resonance increases the casting range of spells, not the AoE radius, and considering all songs are Self AoE's, it has no effect.

That being said, considering the BRD will usually find it's place to be among the ranged DDs Resonance can be very useful for throwing Stoneskins or backup Cures on the tank without having to get too close.

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Oh thats too bad :/ I'm still working on getting it so I'm kinda misinformed.
But yeah the far stoneskins, thats also the kind of thing im talkin about.

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Originally Posted by Urthdigger

They're going to add new classes, each of which comes with an advanced job to come with it.

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new classes will eventuasly come yes

also, new jobs wont be 1:1 with new classes(sure they will each probly get their own job)

but jobs will also have the ability to mix and match with other classes too, there may still end up being a primary sure, but youll be able to expand on it too(such as higher level requirements, more class/different class requirements) and so on

Thief for instance, can easily be a gladiator/archer type mix
red mage is conj/thm


just think of combos not used yet, or if the combo is already used, think of how it may be expanded further(such as a 50/30 requirement instead of a 30/15 on some of the higher tier jobs its possible for them to add later after a cap raise)

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Originally Posted by Airget

I"m kind of confused as to why they wouldn't be able to make NIN with what we currently have compared to something like a pet class. With 15 abilities I can imagine that there would be a mix of melee and jutsu...

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jobs only get 5 abilities, so thats exactly what I'm saying, they need to make a new base class entirely.

I would be interested in a FFT system where combining 2 base classes equals a new job, maybe something like CNJ and THM = RDM. However, I would be curious how the exp would be distributed to the job since, as is it now, playing on the class also rewards xp to your job and vice virsa.

Personally I think if they're going to expand and give several jobs to each class they would need to have some skills be unique to classes to make some more variety between classes but certain jobs getting access to certain skills.
Like gladiator for example. For paladin it could keep skills like sentinel and rampart, but if you want to play thief (if GLA gets this) then it won't have access to those 2 skills.
Just a brief example but I think it would give more variety between jobs based on a single class.

TL;DR: Classes can use all of their skills but jobs only get access to certain class skills which benefit their role.

Pretty sure we're gonna get a scout type class, very likely Thief, and Ninja is going to be the first unlockable job for it.

Question is, when we will get said scout class.

Maybe in 2.0? I can honestly see Arcanist being a class and summoner being it's job maybe. Since Arcanist has a lot of enfeebles and DoTs. And if they did add a scout type maybe ninja would be it's job? Just a thought.

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Originally Posted by NoctisUmbra

Pretty sure Resonance increases the casting range of spells, not the AoE radius, and considering all songs are Self AoE's, it has no effect.

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Just catching up on this thread and this caught my eye, resonance does expand the range of blizzara, idk about other spells as i haven't check with flare or anything.

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Originally Posted by Peptaru

Just catching up on this thread and this caught my eye, resonance does expand the range of blizzara, idk about other spells as i haven't check with flare or anything.

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In my testing I didn't notice such a thing, but perhaps it is worth looking into. If I can use it to expand Battle Voice I would be more than happy to place it on my BRD bar.