How to make this game more impactful and more satisfying in its Combat System

Hello everyone. I cant find any Thread about this so im wondering if i am really in fact the only guy in this game who is a bit unsatisfied with that matter.

My suggestion is to improve the satisfaction in using skills : give every multi hit skill an separate damage number calculation. Every MMORPG even low budget mmorpg can afford to do that so its not an matter of money right?

what i mean are skills like... Sam skills as Kasha Gekko or Yukikaze or DRK skills like Hard Slash or Soul eater or even "Osmose" (i dont know the english name of that skill)

or blood spiller where the damage number shows up before the DRK actually hit the monster in the animation.

so for me this game would be much more fun to play if the damage number had an better timing in showing up. sometimes the damage number show already up before teh character made the skill. isnt that very unsatisfying for you too?

Why are the devs not changing that? there are alot of multi hit skills that only get 1 damage number for the total skill animation and even if its just 1 number it is very bad placed in its timing. royal authority from PLD shows up at the beginning where he didnt do the actual cool looking animation.


the problem with that is, many animations seems useless and non-enjoyable if the damage is already done before the skill animation made its highlight moment. so it feels useless to watch it. it feels like that hit wont do anything anyway and is just for the eyes to feel better. but it would have much more impact if the damage would show up together along with the skill animations hits.

there are alot of multi hit skills like from Ninja. That 3 hit attack where somehow only 2 damage numbers shows up which is pretty weird.

so they gave nin more than 1 damage number but only 2 of his 3 hits? Thats so random.


So can somebody explain me why the devs dont change this? why they dont improve this? would you agree with me it would have more impact and satisfaction in your combat feeling if the damage numbers would have a better timed apperance or give every multi hit also an separate damage number?


Im really curious about your opinions and i hope we get an statement about that because if they dont change that at least i would like to understand why this is not happening considering every game support that so i cant imagine this big game has budget issues to implement that.

If I'm not mistaken, you want numbers to appear after the attack has finished? And attacks that hit multiple times to show more than one number?

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Originally Posted by Kaethra

If I'm not mistaken, you want numbers to appear after the attack has finished? And attacks that hit multiple times to show more than one number?

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I think he wants the numbers to appear when the attack "hits" so it feels more impactful. So basically, yeah though more on the attack "hit" and less on the attack "finishes", if they are different. Also yeah he wants multiple hit attacks to "hit" multiple times, showing numbers each time it hits. Like Lionheart/Omnislash and things.

Piggybacking on this idea: It would be kinda fun, if the damage numbers would also fly in the direction we strike. For example with Dragoon's Chaos Thrust: First swing shoots a number left, second swing shoots a number to the right and the thrust shoots one larger number through the enemy

So I could agree that the timing of the numbers being shown could be different. And if they were Smart, they set up an internal scripting language to show when the effect happens and did NOT tie it directly to when the server processes it. We do have a client/server relationship, so even if we got what we want here. You'd still see the HP bar the target move before the attack 'finishes' This is because they do not wish Animations to self nerf abilities.

As for multihit. The only effects we see do multiple numbers are those that apply their effect multiple times. Like a Barrage'd Straight Shot. For attacks that aren't doubled or tripled like that, they do their potency value in damage. To change it so other attacks that have multiple hits in the animation, they would have to divide the damage dealt (after potency and modifiers and such) by the number of hits. Again if they set up their internal scripting for this sort of thing properly, it shouldn't be that hard.

So this is heavily dependent on how they set up their effect stack script.

I like this idea. Also... Would desperately love if the proc lines could fly in a different direction than the damage. Anything that would make procs more noticeable without having to put a hotbar cluttering the middle of your screen.

I do agree that multi hit skills should have multiple damage numbers
it feels weird to do carve and spit and then see 1 big number rather than 3 smaller numbers

I've always wanted multi hit to be what it was back in 1.x. Back then when we would do multiple hits..we'd see..multiple numbers. Not like..a 6 attack animation and one number.

They would have to rebuild their entire engine and netcode in order to make numbers appear immediately after AOE attack.

Whenever you AOE something, damage appears after the attack and it appears one after another on each mob, its a client<>server relations its not easy to change.

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Originally Posted by Arkfrost

Piggybacking on this idea: It would be kinda fun, if the damage numbers would also fly in the direction we strike. For example with Dragoon's Chaos Thrust: First swing shoots a number left, second swing shoots a number to the right and the thrust shoots one larger number through the enemy

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That...

Would be incredibly distracting.

Also problematic for thrust/piercing attacks. What, would those fly through the boss to where you can't see them?

I feel like this ties a lot into having to dodge the telegraph and not the actual attack. While this won't affect me either way since I never pay attention to numbers, I doubt they would do this personally - especially when Hallowed Ground and Benediction still suffer from going on CD despite not taking effect in time to prevent death.

I'm so much for this idea!

tl;dr: 1.5sec gcd please

I think it could be fun to see the damage individualized but I'm not sure I'd switch just because I like to be able to know the total without having to add it up before the text disappears lol.

If it's not too much trouble it could be a cool option :)

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Originally Posted by Berethos

That...

Would be incredibly distracting.

Also problematic for thrust/piercing attacks. What, would those fly through the boss to where you can't see them?

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Flying Sardine attack causes the text to hit the monster in the face like talismans slapped onto a spirit. Thwack, Thwack, get that Sardine! XD

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Originally Posted by LilySkye

tl;dr: 1.5sec gcd please

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Haha

No. He wants more impact, not less.

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Originally Posted by LilySkye

tl;dr: 1.5sec gcd please

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That doesn't change the impact of combat, just the actions per minute...

And with the amount of weaving between GCDs that we have, we're easily at comparable levels to other games that do have a 1.5 second gcd (and as a result, don't have as much weaving between the gcd).

While it would speed up the feeling of combat at lower levels, where you have less abilities, it wouldn't really change the amount of button presses you're typically engaged in at higher levels.

In order to make the combat feel more fast paced while still being on the current GCD then yeah I agree this would be great.

Don't think it would be terribly difficult to implement but it would make the combat more interesting.

This makes me think of the combo system in Mother 3 with the numbers flying about. Though personally that would work better in a single player game, instead of an MMO.

They would have to change the way the game snapshots in order to do this. While it would be nice tbh there are more important things they should be focusing on

I order to take screenshots I was recording a Verflare. When I was in VLC, mashing "E" which is the frame-by-frame button, I also noticed that I don't even know when the "damage" part of that skill happens. Those bubbles were still appearing when it said 15,000 and it just looked stupid. As if in a shooter game, the guy already explodes into debris before the rocket even impacts..

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Originally Posted by Reimmi

I do agree that multi hit skills should have multiple damage numbers
it feels weird to do carve and spit and then see 1 big number rather than 3 smaller numbers

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It's like anime physics where a guy with the katana does a flurry of 1000 slashes but the gravity causing the other guy to fall into 100 pieces doesn't kick in until 10 seconds later when he realises he's been hit lol

I read all of your replies and im very happy im not the only one who wishes that.

i think some guys mistook i want a more fast paced game but thats not what i want.

as i said what i wish for is, an better appearing of the skill numbers that matches the actual skill animation. So if my Samurai does Hakaze he does 2 slashes. so i want 2 damage numbers to appear right when each strike hits the enemy. so the damage number timing in appearance is equal to the skill animation visually.

because right now the damage numbers randomly appear and the most part of the skill is useless. its boring to see a skill animation where the damage number comes before the animation ends. so it feels like the last hits are like doing 0 damage which is very sad so you cant really enjoy the rest of the skill animation.

but sadly some guys said here that would be hard for the devs to implement that because of an old engine right? is there any source for that like an statement ?

but they always say they want to give us an better game experience and for me i really can promise you this feature will make my game experience higher by 1000x. i would enjoy PVE much much more because it just feels good if the damage numbers are better timed. how many games out there DEPEND on the fact that for example the camera shakes when you cast an cool looking skills.. you know what i mean? placing damage numbers or things like camera shaking or vibrating is what makes pve or pvp in a game so much fun. but here every skill and damage feels like an dead static animation without any impact because the timing is so bad placed. the animation gets useless if the damage number screws up its timing.

imagine non turn based games would be like this. like action games. i know this is turn based but it counts for this game as well. especially BECAUSE its that. and btw its the only game i know that makes it like this. but everyone would love to have this. i cant imagine someone would prefer the current system.

cant we do anything about it ? i just now how strong it would increase my game experience and my enjoyment of the combat system. and by the way thanks for all your comments lol

Well in theory, they wouldn't have to change any of the normal client/server stuff for this.

The full damage of a three hit animation can still be applied at the same time. All that would need to change is how the client displays it to the player.

Most of it would depend on your camera angle, and mob position relative to you.

The rest should just be timing and math.

The one exception I can think of is if an animation connects prior to when its damage is registered for calculations.

then i really wonder why they dont implement that :(