Can we have user combos?!?!

You know what I really wish I could use in this game? Combos! User built combos!

Let me pick up to 3 spells that I can chain together by repeatably hitting the same button.
This way, I don't need so many hotkeys and macros. I will have to still interact with the game.

I remember having that ability in the PS4 version only of TERA and it was helpful so I didn't have to worry about needing 25+ hotkeys. If anyone was looking for a reference.

As a controller player, this is super beneficial. I wouldn't have minded the HW skill bloat if this were the case because DRK hotbar was an absolute mess. PVP has the right idea, despite people's complains because you're suppose to be looking at what's around you and the map, not your hotbar.

I could see this getting messy for DNC and their DDR mini game.

SO many different buttons to push is a giant pain with a controller. Would not mind if they did make it so there where fewer.

I'm still sitting here wondering what the hell do you guys have on your hotbars to create such bloat. I use a controller and a kb/m and i never had an issue

Same, never really any issues on controller. Some jobs have a little bloat from time to time but it's completely manageable.

Damn, with the actual rework of jobs I have holes in my hotbars to the point its stressing me out to have nothing even useless to put in them.

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Originally Posted by zcrash970

I'm still sitting here wondering what the hell do you guys have on your hotbars to create such bloat. I use a controller and a kb/m and i never had an issue

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Did you play HW DRK? That was a bloat. Even at level 30. New DRK has a lot less skills and I even have room for role actions, however, it also feels gutted. Combos would have cleaned everything right up.

Teleport to Wolves den. You can see an actual combo system in the game. They have dummies up top to poke.

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Originally Posted by Moonlite

Teleport to Wolves den. You can see an actual combo system in the game. They have dummies up top to poke.

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They are talking about the whole game though. And pvp doesn't let us customize combos. You have combo 1 and 2. And, no open ends for how you want them to flow. Your skill set is limited for the sake of focusing on the match, not an EX trial or raid.

If they added combos in PvE you think it would be actually customizable? This isn't really a game with that type of play. Every patch and every expansion since 1.0 is less and less and closer and closer to being all the same. Not to mention any time they say we could get something its limited by something(time,money,code), not sure why people ask anymore.

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Originally Posted by Moonlite

If they added combos in PvE you think it would be actually customizable? This isn't really a game with that type of play. Every patch and every expansion since 1.0 is less and less and closer and closer to being all the same. Not to mention any time they say we could get something its limited by something(time,money,code), not sure why people ask anymore.

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If it's limited, let it be limited and a test grounds. Or would you rather a Eureka situation where who knows how much money and resources went into something the player base world wide vehemently spat at. If a mass of people hated BLU and didn't do masked carnival at all, then that's just 1 element of the game they know to not touch on or learn to improve. If it was a limited job, I'd welcome it to see how it feels. Heck, they could do it with BLU.

You say it's not the game for it, but it was added in PVP. Meaning there was an attempt, there is feedback. It's not impossible.

I meant more that we get a customized combo system. I could completely see them adding combos down the road to keep more skill animations used and lowering button bloat. Instead of the delete some skills and add some new skills.

I thought you meant a player customized combo system. Where we chose the skills and create our own combos. Basically a better interfaced macro. Where it is more a UI customization for skill. When people ask for tools that seem reasonable, the response is less then positive not a no but not a yes.



Or crazy you meant customize like build our own skill rotations and get combo bonuses like circle of scorn then the skill button lights up for total eclipse(completely random example). And where I am coming from is they removed the customize skill option like paladins use to be able to cast cure and stoneskin. Plus the job they gave customization to they don't let play with others.

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Originally Posted by ArcanoJones

SO many different buttons to push is a giant pain with a controller. Would not mind if they did make it so there where fewer.

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I have 2 full crossbars empty on MCH, what are you guys putting on your crossbars?

Due to the slowness of me switching crosshotbar, I would prefer to be able to see everything combat-related all the time and have easy access to them, which means only 2 out of the 8 crosshotbars available are practical to use (at least in combat) for me, for a total of 32 slots.

Of the jobs I play most often currently, SAM has 32 in actions and role actions alone, while DRK has 30. That's not counting limit break, duty action 1 (and 2 if it ever gains any use outside of Eureka), and sprint, or noncombat actions like teleport, return, mount, dig, or party finder.

Ideally for me, combat-related actions should fit those 32 slots for easy access. Other actions (like teleport) can use the other 6 crosshotbars.

L-like in suikoden?! I'm not sure how possible that is with an MMO, but if they could add a feature like dance partner where you can choose your combo partner, and then execute a combo move (either one of you, you'd get an animation from both avatars like an LB) that would be cooool.~ But then I guess DNC loses one of its gimmicks. >>;

I really don't see why they couldn't do something like this for at least the actions that already combo off each other. I don't care what excuses anyone else can come up with, because face it...hitting 1-2-3 isn't harder than hitting 1-1-1.

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Originally Posted by Mistyregions

I have 2 full crossbars empty on MCH, what are you guys putting on your crossbars?

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True -> Vorpal -> Full -> FaC -> WT -> RT
True -> Disembowel -> CT -> WT -> FaC -> RT
Doom Spike -> Sonic Thrust -> Coerthan Torment

10 separate hotkeys to achieve 3 combos.
Hotbar space has never been the issue. I tried to explain that in the last thread on this topic, but just got attacked for wanting to "Dumb down the game".

I can fit all my skills as a DRG into my bars without issue. Finding 30 odd comfortable keybinds is another matter entirely. I already use 1234, QE, Shift modifiers, alt modifiers, tilde and 8 buttons on my mouse.
We can easily reduce this keybind bloat by folding combos into singular buttons. I never, ever use Full Thrust out of sequence. So save me the damn keybinds and let me choose to set up a button that shifts from True Thrust all the way, in the proper order, up to Raiden Thrust.

And to make it absolutely, 110% clear: This would NOT be a 'one button press' situation (Like crafter macros for example).
This would also be entirely optional. Make a page for 'Consolidated Combos' in the spellbook, let me choose whether to have 10 keybinds for 3 combos, or 3 keybinds for 3 combos.
The simplest description of what i'd like to see is True Thrust executing, button flips from True to Vorpal during the GCD and I press the button again to use Vorpal which shifts it into Full etc etc. All the while pressing my oGCDs between each button press.

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Originally Posted by Moonlite

If they added combos in PvE you think it would be actually customizable? This isn't really a game with that type of play. Every patch and every expansion since 1.0 is less and less and closer and closer to being all the same. Not to mention any time they say we could get something its limited by something(time,money,code), not sure why people ask anymore.

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Yeah, Moonlite, I guess there was never game that had customizable combos/chain skills, EVER! Oh wait... If you read the entire post I made, you would see that I mentioned a game that does. And if you are still not willing to look up said example, but are curious, here is a video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0x-V5KzjDL4

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Originally Posted by Mistyregions

I have 2 full crossbars empty on MCH, what are you guys putting on your crossbars?

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Honestly, it is the tanks and healers with a lot of skills on their hotbars.

For example, lets count what I have for my PLD:
Fast Blade -> Riot Blade -> Royal Authority (3)
Fast Blade -> Riot Blade -> Goring Blade (4)
Total Eclipse -> Prominence (6)
Shield Bash (7)
Shield Lob (8)
Fight or Flight (9)
Spirits Within (10)
Sheltron (11)
Sentinel (12)
Cover (13)
Circle of Scorn (14)
Hallowed Ground (15)
Divine Veil (16)
Intervention (17)
Holy Spirit (18)
Requiescat (19)
Passage of Arms (20)
Holy Circle (21)
Intervene (22)
Atonement (23)
Confiteor (24)
Rampart (25)
Provoke (26)
Interject (27)
Reprisal (28)
Arm's Length (29)

/whew

Oh, crap, I forgot the odd abilities...
Limit Break (30)
Sprint (31)
Shirk (32) I never used this, so it is not hotkey, just on my bar
Iron Will (33) not hotkey, just on my bar

Because I ran out of space on the non-job shared hotbars
Healing Pot (34) Though, this one is there from the shared hotbar
Mana Pot (35) Though, this one is from the shared hotbar

Did I forget anything as a PLD?

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Originally Posted by Aladire

Yeah, Moonlite, I guess there was never game that had customizable combos/chain skills, EVER! Oh wait... If you read the entire post I made, you would see that I mentioned a game that does. And if you are still not willing to look up said example, but are curious, here is a video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0x-V5KzjDL4

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They never disputed that they don't exist in other games lol, they're just saying that if we get combo buttons, they'll most likely just be static with zero customisation like the PvP counterparts. No need to be so hostile.

As a controller player, no thanks.

Being able to keep track of where you are in a combo is super important.
Need to be able to tell if my next hit will be Souleater and give me HP and Blood, or if it will be Armour Crush and refresh Huton, etc.
With all the skills in a combo on the same button, you’d need to be constantly watching your hot bars, very closely.

Id like it for the aoe combos at least, can't quite make things fit comfortable yet, but I still need to play around with my layout a bit.

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Originally Posted by Seraphor

As a controller player, no thanks.

Being able to keep track of where you are in a combo is super important.
Need to be able to tell if my next hit will be Souleater and give me HP and Blood, or if it will be Armour Crush and refresh Huton, etc.
With all the skills in a combo on the same button, you’d need to be constantly watching your hot bars, very closely.

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Well, just like they did with the PvP, the shown skill would change to the current one that next. I personally do not watch my hot bars, but I am aware others do.

Also, if a skill is the start of more than 1 combo, the other combos will advance as well. But, say for example you use skill A to trigger skill B or D. Then skill B triggers C, while skill D triggers skill E. If you hit the combo to do B, then the other combo that is A -> D -> E would change back to showing A because that is what would be used if you hit that while the first combo button is now showing skill C ready to be used.

The only disadvantage with this is that you cannot just use skill C on its own. Now, I am not sure why anyone would want to...

But the BIGGEST advantage outside of condensing the hot bars is that if say I had blind on me and I used skill B and missed. The combo button would go back to skill A since I no longer have the chain going. At least in that sense, I don't accidentally use skill C when I don't have the chain up.

What kind of controller are you guys playing on. I play on a PS4 controller and after SHB I have more space on my hotbars to add silly stuff like emotes. If they bring the PvP combo system to PVE I will have enough free space to add more mounts on my hotbar rather than mount roulette.

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Originally Posted by Aladire

Well, just like they did with the PvP, the shown skill would change to the current one that next. I personally do not watch my hot bars, but I am aware others do.

Also, if a skill is the start of more than 1 combo, the other combos will advance as well. But, say for example you use skill A to trigger skill B or D. Then skill B triggers C, while skill D triggers skill E. If you hit the combo to do B, then the other combo that is A -> D -> E would change back to showing A because that is what would be used if you hit that while the first combo button is now showing skill C ready to be used.

The only disadvantage with this is that you cannot just use skill C on its own. Now, I am not sure why anyone would want to...

But the BIGGEST advantage outside of condensing the hot bars is that if say I had blind on me and I used skill B and missed. The combo button would go back to skill A since I no longer have the chain going. At least in that sense, I don't accidentally use skill C when I don't have the chain up.

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Yes I get how it would work, the point is you'd need to look at your hotbars to know which part of the combo you're on, instead of knowing which skill you're using by the button you're pressing.

"Just like they did in PvP" isn't a good argument. PvP jobs were greatly simplified, and as such the auxiliary effects of weaponskills aren't that important, so you don't need to keep track of them.

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Originally Posted by Seraphor

Yes I get how it would work, the point is you'd need to look at your hotbars to know which part of the combo you're on, instead of knowing which skill you're using by the button you're pressing.

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Like I said before, I do not look at my hotbars, even with the current way things are. I play on a keyboard/mouse. So, if I go to hit my first two abilities for a combo and then I start to do other skills say Circle of Scorn and a defensive cd and Fight or Flight, I know that I am still able to hit the last ability without having to look at the hotbar as long as I do so before about 5 secs is up.

So, to me, having it as 1 button does not mean I have to look at the hotbar.

Also, just because something is there does not mean you have to use it. If you still want to put all your skills on the hotbar as individual skills, you would still be able to.

I for one am not talking about hotbars being the problem. It has to do with hotkeys. I have a keyboard with 18 keys on the side and then 1 through =. I try to put the 18 abilities that I need to react quickly together so I rarely have to move my hand. I am just finding that with SB, for the first time, I am now at around 24 that I want to hit quickly and the other 8 I mentioned in an earlier post can be for slower responses.

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Originally Posted by Sylve

True -> Vorpal -> Full -> FaC -> WT -> RT
True -> Disembowel -> CT -> WT -> FaC -> RT
Doom Spike -> Sonic Thrust -> Coerthan Torment

10 separate hotkeys to achieve 3 combos.
Hotbar space has never been the issue. I tried to explain that in the last thread on this topic, but just got attacked for wanting to "Dumb down the game".

I can fit all my skills as a DRG into my bars without issue. Finding 30 odd comfortable keybinds is another matter entirely. I already use 1234, QE, Shift modifiers, alt modifiers, tilde and 8 buttons on my mouse.
We can easily reduce this keybind bloat by folding combos into singular buttons. I never, ever use Full Thrust out of sequence. So save me the damn keybinds and let me choose to set up a button that shifts from True Thrust all the way, in the proper order, up to Raiden Thrust.

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As a DRG main I'm trying to understand this.

do you have tiny hands? your base rotation can all fit fine 1234QE, but the rest of our moves should be easily reachable in 56 or RT. I know im an odd case example but I go as far as suing 7/shift+7 for second wind/elusive jump, but no further than that. and GH/shift+GH i utilize as well. My entire setup is based on trying to reduce space from the center of kb (wasd) while only using 1 modifier because I hate pressing ctrl and alt.

everyone has different needs, im just throwing out what I do to another DRG.

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Originally Posted by Nora_of_Mira

As a DRG main I'm trying to understand this.

do you have tiny hands? your base rotation can all fit fine 1234QE, but the rest of our moves should be easily reachable in 56 or RT. I know im an odd case example but I go as far as suing 7/shift+7 for second wind/elusive jump, but no further than that. and GH/shift+GH i utilize as well. My entire setup is based on trying to reduce space from the center of kb (wasd) while only using 1 modifier because I hate pressing ctrl and alt.

everyone has different needs, im just throwing out what I do to another DRG.

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My hands are quite normal sized. Freedom of movement due to conditions suffered? Less normal.
As such, I endeavour to keep as few separate buttons as I can, preferring the easily reached shift and alt to modify.
https://gyazo.com/80c63408d5338f25182ee17dbcdfe1af
I've rebound the thumbpad on my Naga, so 8,9,0,PD,7,PU are the first 6 keys that lie directly under my thumb.

My main point as I tried to stress heavily but was also missed … Is that this would be entirely optional. People like me who prefer less unique binds for whatever reason can utilize consolidated combos. Those like yourself who prefer everything laid out separate can also do that.
So for me, It would free up 7 hotkeys by consolidating True Thrust -> Raiden Thrust into 1, Chaos combo into 2 and AoE on 3.

The goal is less keybinds, not less keypresses.

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Originally Posted by Sylve

The goal is less keybinds, not less keypresses.

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Ah, I understand it better now. I cant think of a gameplay reason how it would imbalance things between players, but Idk if I can imagine SE implementing something like this while also keeping it strictly optional. Perhaps it's in their design philosophy as to why certain skills "upgrade" to other skills (like the fact Geir and Nastrond are the same) and others dont. I have to assume it is heavily considered in their battle combat balancing as to what upgrades and what stays separate.

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Originally Posted by linay

Due to the slowness of me switching crosshotbar, I would prefer to be able to see everything combat-related all the time and have easy access to them, which means only 2 out of the 8 crosshotbars available are practical to use (at least in combat) for me, for a total of 32 slots.

Of the jobs I play most often currently, SAM has 32 in actions and role actions alone, while DRK has 30. That's not counting limit break, duty action 1 (and 2 if it ever gains any use outside of Eureka), and sprint, or noncombat actions like teleport, return, mount, dig, or party finder.

Ideally for me, combat-related actions should fit those 32 slots for easy access. Other actions (like teleport) can use the other 6 crosshotbars.

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Do you use the extended cross bar too? You could be able to access 3 cross bars without moving your right trigger finger, ever.

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Originally Posted by Mistyregions

Do you use the extended cross bar too? You could be able to access 3 cross bars without moving your right trigger finger, ever.

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I do, but that third crosshotbar still can't be displayed all the time unless you duplicate it on regular hotbar, which clutters up the screen. So I use the third crosshotbar for noncombat abilities.

I never had a problem on a controller, i fit all my skills in 4 hotbars with just slight flavour of macro used on self-def CDs.

Here is my setup for all 4 tank classes.

https://i.imgur.com/NIP7H6E.png

On war i didnt even know what to do anymore so i just put onslaugth on 2 hotkeys, since its my muscle memory to put dash on L2 > Circle key

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Originally Posted by Nariel

Damn, with the actual rework of jobs I have holes in my hotbars to the point its stressing me out to have nothing even useless to put in them.

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Same here.

With the battle system changes, they actually REDUCED the number of skills you need to slot for almost all jobs, so now I've got blank spots on my hotbars.

I think it's good for people who simply struggle playing the game or struggle due to certain health problems. Not everyone is the same so people shouldn't expect others to have the same level of dexterity, so let them ask for what they want.

That would be nice for my summoner.
atm I threw "Dreadwyrm Trance", "Deathflare", "Summon Bahamut" and "Wyrmwave" all into one macro. They don't overlap.

Well it's as simple as this, for example, playing as a main Dark knight, I want button 1 to have the single target combo, and button 2 to have the Aoe combo simply, and then I will save 3 other buttons for something else like cooldowns or whatever I use often, but for now I have 1 2 and 3 as single taget combo, and 4 and 5 as aoe one.

Which is obnoxious, whenever this idea is being suggested people just get butthurted and whine about it as it will make combat less interesting or whatever, most likely I would love it to be an optional, so people who likes to fill every skill bar to have fun with that still.