DNC feels weak/stops progress

So heres my situation.

At the start of early access is switched from a 360 Ninja to a dancer, i fully geared her out with 390 gear and materia then went on with the story playing catchup. dancer felt fun and i enjoyed it more than Ninja, however i hit a roadblock or two.

I reached solo instances where as a dancer i couldn't push out the DPS (With using all tools at my disposal) to finish the quests. Zenos swords being the primary moment.
Each time i got stuck i switched back to Ninja. Sill at 360 and not using Materia, doing so made the fight trivial.

So it leaves me with a bit of a dilemma.
Play the class i enjoy but cant progress with, Or play the class i enjoy much less but can progress with.

It is kind of an odd situation with Dancer and some have stated it is the weakest out of physical ranged especially on single target.
Yet i out dps other jobs without issue so am not sure.
Granted i have not tested in solo trials per say and such.

I think go with what you enjoy playing, it will help in the end.
For example Sigmascape Savage i was needed to go as Ninja at the time when i have always been a caster. I did not enjoy it at all, it was rough times

dnc seems to be the new pre 5.0 mch now, everything is luck with 50% chance proc for pretty much your combo extension.

Hard to say at this point, it's not like it's lagging behind dramatically if at all, but without something like current savage content to gauge its ability all we can do is speculate. Interesting to see how things go.

Much like the old Machinist, Dancer's damage is very dependent on CDs and luck. Popping everything feels awesome and dances are great, but once you exhaust your procs after Devilment and Flourish, you are pretty much just hoping for procs. I'd guess it gets a bit better with Saber Dance, and I don't know what the overall dps looks like, but you should be good in a group thanks to sharing your damage cooldowns with the group.

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Originally Posted by Sililos

So heres my situation.

At the start of early access is switched from a 360 Ninja to a dancer, i fully geared her out with 390 gear and materia then went on with the story playing catchup. dancer felt fun and i enjoyed it more than Ninja, however i hit a roadblock or two.

I reached solo instances where as a dancer i couldn't push out the DPS (With using all tools at my disposal) to finish the quests. Zenos swords being the primary moment.
Each time i got stuck i switched back to Ninja. Sill at 360 and not using Materia, doing so made the fight trivial.

So it leaves me with a bit of a dilemma.
Play the class i enjoy but cant progress with, Or play the class i enjoy much less but can progress with.

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I haven't had any trouble with Shadowbringers solo duties yet (and already had all the stormblood ones done before early access), but DNC is generally going to have a little more trouble solo than in a group just because we have a decent amount of stuff built around grouping (buffing our dance partner's damage and getting esprit from them being the main things, but also our heal being twice as strong if we stack with our dance partner).

I agree. They feel really weak when it comes to single target. It needs to be buffed slightly. Also, the RNG mechanic needs to be tweaked or changed... especially with Espirit. As of right now.. my single target and AoE attacks are only a 50 potency difference, which means at 2+ targets, you have to AoE or you're losing out on a lot of damage. This should be tweaked to 3+ targets... That would feel a lot better I think. I know that DNC buffs other party members, but there is such a thing as ending up doing content by yourself, which really hurts.

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Originally Posted by Vallerie

Much like the old Machinist, Dancer's damage is very dependent on CDs and luck. Popping everything feels awesome and dances are great, but once you exhaust your procs after Devilment and Flourish, you are pretty much just hoping for procs. I'd guess it gets a bit better with Saber Dance, and I don't know what the overall dps looks like, but you should be good in a group thanks to sharing your damage cooldowns with the group.

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Saber Dance doesn't proc enough to fix the proc drought, it's a fine ability and I don't think it needs touched, it does what it says and is definitely not the problem with the class.

The damage *is* concerning but we're going to need some time in raids to find out the true story.

Solo they indeed dont seem to shine much. In group they seem to be able to outdps alot of classes and be an amazing help with their buffs so guess they got that going for them :D

I haven't had any issues with solos as DNC. Make sure to keep up your standard step and get in close for the finish step, because standard step sequence causes damage + buffs your DPS, as I'm sure you know about the latter. Do all the steps, don't miss any. That's the only thing I can think of, honestly, because I've seen some DNCs do their standard steps away from mobs and such.

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Originally Posted by MOZZYSTAR

I haven't had any issues with solos as DNC. Make sure to keep up your standard step and get in close for the finish step, because standard step sequence causes damage + buffs your DPS, as I'm sure you know about the latter. Do all the steps, don't miss any. That's the only thing I can think of, honestly, because I've seen some DNCs do their standard steps away from mobs and such.

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Yeah this really bugs be a ton. They see "ranged dps" and activate steps all the way in the back. It's my new pet peeve XD

It would be nice if after not getting a proc your next time using that ability gave a guaranteed proc
Would still have the RNG but also have protection to keep the dps consistent

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Originally Posted by xXAzurePrimeXx

Yeah this really bugs be a ton. They see "ranged dps" and activate steps all the way in the back. It's my new pet peeve XD

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I understand fully but it annoys the heck out of me were a tank stands still and in the middle of steps or any cd really they decide to take off. Grr that is my pet peeve

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Originally Posted by Maero

I understand fully but it annoys the heck out of me were a tank stands still and in the middle of steps or any cd really they decide to take off. Grr that is my pet peeve

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thats what en avant is for (thank god they let you use that skill during steps)

I haven't had any issues in solo duties as a dancer.

For single target if I'm with typical xiv pugs, I outdps all of them. Pair me with someone that can press buttons and I'm on average 2k dps behind.

I out dps everyone on aoe pulls.

Overall I'm ok with dancer's dps. We have a lot of buffs and an aoe heal, can't have it all.

You'll be far behind once you hit 80.
You can't say it is fine, as you are 75, every others class didn't get their power yet.
On Titania, i'm far behind all the DPS.
I don't mind, but it is worth having a low dps and giving some damage buff ? will it be enough ?

I love Dancer I enjoy the buffs I give to the party and to myself. I have had no issues at all I have kept everyone buffed and put out decent amount of damage.

I feel people are forgetting that dancer is a buffer/support job it is a lot of fun. If you want to put out bigger numbers then that's fine maybe dancer isn't for everyone.

I'd say in a group setting dancer is fine as it is if your partner never dies and standard step buffs never drop (which they shouldn't) freely take 5% of your partner's dps and add it to your own. This ofc doesn't account for other party buffs you or anyone else applies but with the above scenerio there is no way they have had that dps without you, so own it :D

The only real problem in solo instances is espirit you lose a good way to generate it so you cannot Saber dance as often but this is hardly a deal breaker since instances feel tuned around bad rng and low espirit gain. The Eulmore instance for example i had 0 procs outside flourish and got enough for Saber Dance twice(i really mean it, it was horrible), against final enemy in it yet i still won.

While you can target npcs with closed position they ofc don't do things as much as a adequate player would so resource generation is still a bit slow.

I feel a good change to Espirit generation would be double the chance you can earn espirit for yourself but keep it how it is for party members under standard/techncal buffs.

Also make Saber dance ogcd with 1s recast pls just pls it being a gcd skill feels wonky >_<

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Originally Posted by Crushnight

I'd say in a group setting dancer is fine as it is if your partner never dies and standard step buffs never drop (which they shouldn't) freely take 5% of your partner's dps and add it to your own. This ofc doesn't account for other party buffs you or anyone else applies but with the above scenerio there is no way they have had that dps without you, so own it :D

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This is something people tend to forget. Dancers will always be bottom line in terms of personal DPS, because this is how it functions. If Dancers were on par with other DPS jobs in addition to all of their support, they would be way overpowered.
Also feel free to add 5% of every second raid burst DPS phase to your own too, because Technical Finish does exactly that.

Players who like being right on front in terms of personal DPS should consider switching to another job, because this is not what Dancers are there for =/.
There are so many jobs catering to people who like pushing their own numbers and only two jobs for those who perfer pushing numbers of others: Astrologian and Dancer.

I understand how liking a theme(e.g. dancing) can drive someone towards a job, even if they'd rather play the personal DPS kind of job.
Keep in mind though that the opposite is also true: players like me, who prefer a supportive approach, might find e.g. black magic an appealing theme and would prefer black mages to be LESS about personal DPS and more about support, but this is not what the job is supposed to represent.

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Originally Posted by Xelanar

This is something people tend to forget. Dancers will always be bottom line in terms of personal DPS, because this is how it functions. If Dancers were on par with other DPS jobs in addition to all of their support, they would be way overpowered.
Also feel free to add 5% of every second raid burst DPS phase to your own too, because Technical Finish does exactly that.

Players who like being right on front in terms of personal DPS should consider switching to another job, because this is not what Dancers are there for =/.
There are so many jobs catering to people who like pushing their own numbers and only two jobs for those who perfer pushing numbers of others: Astrologian and Dancer.

I understand how liking a theme(e.g. dancing) can drive someone towards a job, even if they'd rather play the personal DPS kind of job.
Keep in mind though that the opposite is also true: players like me, who prefer a supportive approach, might find e.g. black magic an appealing theme and would prefer black mages to be LESS about personal DPS and more about support, but this is not what the job is supposed to represent.

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you forgot ninja.

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Originally Posted by dragoelete

you forgot ninja.

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My bad, for attempting to keep my post on the shorter side, to an extend where it was unclear why I highlightet only two out of all available jobs. I'll elaborate a bit more on that matter then!
I'm aware of other classes having support oriented actions like Trick Attack. When refering to support jobs I mean jobs that actively have to do things for giving benefits to party members - like executing a dance combination, or drawing/playing cards. In short: Mechanics that are more complex than just pressing a single button. This is why personally I do not consider other jobs as support. I am aware how they can be legitimately seen as such from different perspectives though, and I won't disagree since not everybody sees 'support' as the same thing.

It is less powerful overall, which makes sense given its buffs. I like that they have given us Standard and Technical finish to stop it from feeling weak because you can deliver huge hits with them. It becomes about how you weave your fan dances between your normal DPS moves as an oGCD and making sure to take advantage of the damage your finishes give you and not just using it as a buff as MOZZY says (and I see a lot of people who do this). I think Closed Position also works on NPC's, I've been throwing it their way anyway.