Higher Requirements

Before I go into my ramble, i'd just like to say that i'm really enjoying the content that 1.21 has to offer, and am not rushing through any of it so as to "enjoy the view".

A lot of people complain about the "Lack of Challenge" or "I did it all too fast".

I think what could be a decent idea is a higher requirement to do some of the future content.

Dungeons for example - At the moment it's just do the single prequest and you're in.

I think it would be nice if the requirements were a bit steeper. For example, you must have "X" amount of achievement points to do "Y". Perhaps not achievement points system, as this was only intended as an easter egg implementation, but I personally believe something more is needed.

I understand that this game is to cater to all types of people, and that casual players don't nessecarily have the time/desire to do the "side elements" of this game (Sidequests, Doh/Dol ect), but every feature/content shouldn't be so easily accessible.

One of the reason's why MMORPG's like WoW's content last so long is that they require not only prequests, but also the prior dungeons to be completed (hard mode + standard mode), aswell as maintaining a certain level of gear to even enter.

I'd like to see something like this implemented aswell. With a future cross server dungeon feature being implemented, I don't see any reason why not to make the requirements a little higher to weed out people who are unprepared/inexperienced and didn't take the time to "Earn" their position.

I think this game works well as a casual one, but should give us something to cater toward the other playing style sprectrum. I remember half of the required prequests in FFXI were extremely difficult, and felt a strong sense of accomplishment/immersion and pride after completing even just a few.

At the moment this game feels like almost anyone can just walk into anything as long as they have read a strategy for the dungeon. I think balance is really important in an mmorpg, but the scales feel well and trully tipped towards the casual side. Whilst this has be dubbed a "casual game", that doesn't mean that there should be no hardcore elements at all.

I can't recall ever running into anything remotely challenging in this game outside a primal fight / dungeon. Can you?

The same people would continue to complain. The people who got all their AF in a day were the same people who already beat Dzemael Darkhold previously, which happens to be a requirement to get into The Aurum Vale.

The fun part about developing an MMORPG is that it is impossible to please all of your customers. Square-Enix has it even harder because they're rebuilding the game because of how bad it did initially. So, while having to rebuild the entire world, they also have to provide content for players.

I think that you should have to complete your guild quest in order to keep leveling your class. Leveling without some questing is horrid.

there is already requirements for completing these quest. the thing is the complainers already have multiple lv50s with the requirements already done to enter dungeons. frankly my fart sounds more intelligent than they do.

I don't think DD alone is enough personally.

An instance where you literally just skip the whole thing?

I agree that pleasing everyone is impossible and at best they can only try and do what works for the majority. But please, in future, add prequests and requirements.

Not for AF quests, these need to be accessible to everyone. I don't even think Aurum Vale should have had a requirement since it's an extra step for any newer players that only have PLD, BLM, or DRG that other jobs don't have to take.

I think it would be cool if in the future older dungeons had special drops or what-have-you added to them that would activate side areas/harder versions in newer content, while leaving the dungeon itself accessible without too much prerequisites, so you could cater to all types of players, although forthcoming difficulty modes will probably accomplish that anyway.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Estellios

Not for AF quests, these need to be accessible to everyone. I don't even think Aurum Vale should have had a requirement since it's an extra step for any newer players that only have PLD, BLM, or DRG that other jobs don't have to take.

I think it would be cool if in the future older dungeons had special drops or what-have-you added to them that would activate side areas/harder versions in newer content, while leaving the dungeon itself accessible without too much prerequisites, so you could cater to all types of players, although forthcoming difficulty modes will probably accomplish that anyway.

---

Holy shit. Multiple branching paths?!

Good ideas?! From this forum!?

WHAT IS HAPPENING?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Estellios

Not for AF quests, these need to be accessible to everyone. I don't even think Aurum Vale should have had a requirement since it's an extra step for any newer players that only have PLD, BLM, or DRG that other jobs don't have to take.

I think it would be cool if in the future older dungeons had special drops or what-have-you added to them that would activate side areas/harder versions in newer content, while leaving the dungeon itself accessible without too much prerequisites, so you could cater to all types of players, although forthcoming difficulty modes will probably accomplish that anyway.

---

I agree.

I'm just concerned that the current playing style is how its always going to be and look forward/hope to a new challenge.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Avraym

I think what could be a decent idea is a higher requirement to do some of the future content.

Dungeons for example - At the moment it's just do the single prequest and you're in.

---

I'll come back to this.

Quote:

---

I think it would be nice if the requirements were a bit steeper. For example, you must have "X" amount of achievement points to do "Y". Perhaps not achievement points system, as this was only intended as an easter egg implementation, but I personally believe something more is needed.

---

I understand this was just an example -- but no to this idea.

Quote:

---

I understand that this game is to cater to all types of people, and that casual players don't nessecarily have the time/desire to do the "side elements" of this game (Sidequests, Doh/Dol ect), but every feature/content shouldn't be so easily accessible.

---

It is difficult to determine who should be able to do what instance, what craft, etc. The best SE can do is leave all options relatively open.

Quote:

---

One of the reason's why MMORPG's like WoW's content last so long is that they require not only prequests, but also the prior dungeons to be completed (hard mode + standard mode), aswell as maintaining a certain level of gear to even enter.

---

Here is where things unravel for me. WoW has zero prereqs these days. Everything is the same trifling pile of monotony piled on more monotny. Burning Crusade had a great story progression that had a lot of prereqs involved quests via instance running to get into the raids. Unfortunately, Blizzard saw this as a huge issue because guilds were losing available guild recruits to continually refresh guild populations. Blizzard quickly removed the attunement process (hardcore people complained vehemently) but ultimately it was a better deal for everyone involved. Life moved on. Since then, the only prereq that you have is running a dungeon on normal mode, thus enabling heroic. Same applies to raids. Very little is "restricted" in WoW, in fact if anything, WoW has been made easier -- even reputation grinds (which are bad in general) have been made 10000% easier via tabards. Put simply, if you WANT to do it -- you generally can. Very little stops you.

Quote:

---

I'd like to see something like this implemented aswell. With a future cross server dungeon feature being implemented, I don't see any reason why not to make the requirements a little higher to weed out people who are unprepared/inexperienced and didn't take the time to "Earn" their position.

---

In a game, you shouldn't necessarily "EARN" in the context you're using. Is it nice to achieve for something prestigious and rare? Of course. The entire existence of MMOs really plays off of that. But lets be real -- its better and more enjoyable when the content itself is challenging enough so everyone can ATTEMPT it. If WoW has taught us ANYTHING it is that accessible yet challenging content is the best form of content yet.

There are things plaguing XIV that can't give us challenging content yet. They are slated to be remedied in 2.0. Lets also remember, that challenging content is on its way. Remember Odin? Yes the PDF Odin. The one that roams through various zones and has loot and difficulty that grows after every killing? This is the type of creative content we need to see and URGE to see more of. This is completely accessible content for anyone who wants to attempt Odin, but it is also incredibly challenging -- and maybe eventually unrealistically killable.

Quote:

---

I think this game works well as a casual one, but should give us something to cater toward the other playing style sprectrum. I remember half of the required prequests in FFXI were extremely difficult, and felt a strong sense of accomplishment/immersion and pride after completing even just a few.

---

And now your posts comes into full spectrum. The "I want more XI in my XIV." No thank you. You might have felt accomplished, but there were about 5 more people that simply felt helpless because of it. Do you have the right job capped? +1 gear? Right sub job? Subjob capped? Lets not even go into the issue of having PEOPLE do do OLD content. Put simply, XI's prerequisites are the reason many hate XI. XIV has done a reasonable attempt at keeping such garbage to a minimum.

Sadly, I can only feel pain and longing for the new players who will vehemently struggle with finding a group to tackle the new job quests further on in the lifespan of the game.

Quote:

---

At the moment this game feels like almost anyone can just walk into anything as long as they have read a strategy for the dungeon. I think balance is really important in an mmorpg, but the scales feel well and trully tipped towards the casual side. Whilst this has be dubbed a "casual game", that doesn't mean that there should be no hardcore elements at all.

---

I agree with you on this. I do feel that sometimes walking into an instance on WoW is TOO easy. In fact, as a veteran WoW player I can say that I simply brute forced my way past almost every new heroic instance added in Cataclysm. I was overgeared and I've been playing with the same players for several years. At times I wish the heroics could be more challenging, but then I remember that heroics are only one aspect of the game. Some people log in to do their daily heroic and they find that fun and engaging. The issue is -- they can. They aren't limited by what capped jobs they have, or if their gear is all +1 gear, or if they have NINJA as a stupid subjob. Running heroics is really all these casual players have though. They don't have time to sit for six hours and camp an open NM, or do a five hour raid where only one boss is even attempted. While the "hardcore" quickly clean up of 'easy' content, they also move onto other activities.

Quote:

---

I can't recall ever running into anything remotely challenging in this game outside a primal fight / dungeon. Can you?

---

Finding a party for literally anything. That is a pre-req in itself.

Yes to more challenging and "optional" content. No to stifling prerequisites.

Also, as a slight tangent. No to heroic modes either. I'd rather have SE develop a completely brand new instance than just re-hash an existing one with "hard mode" mechanics. No thanks. I am all for rewarding creative and efficient play though. If beating a boss under x minutes gives you an extra chest with the same loot table that everyone else gets, then yes I'd love to see 'bonuses' like that.

Fatigue can tell us a great many things, one of which is to reward your players for playing, don't punish them for trying.

Making content even more inaccessible is a terrible idea.

I love challenging stuff, I want the game to get harder, but this is not the right time.

Square Enix is trying to get as many players as possible before 2.0 and that is exactly what they should do. Making or adding some hard content that just 5% of the few thousand players can actually do is not a good thing at this stage of the game. There is hardly enough content as it is, making it hard to access is a terrible idea, right now.

When 2.0 hits, FFXIV gets more players, PS3 version is released and the game has enough content might be the right time to add truely challenging/hard content.

I am looking forward to it, but not going to cry, whing or ask for it right now, since it would be a stupid business move.

Hooray for sanity in the thread. Attunements will just cause more of a divide in the player base. Keep the challenges in the dungeons themselves, don't make it harder to find a solid group for things. Even with the small pre requisites we have now there's still that one or two people that join the group that didn't have their moogle or ifrit NMs taken care of, or didn't do darkhold when we needed to run aurum vale.

More requirements will only make that issue even worse.

Having to do old and possibly obsolete content to gain access to the new is a bad design that most MMOs have steared away from recently.

If anything there should be intressting questlines leading up to dungeones and unlocking similar content, and once quests are finished you will be able to enter.
Could be used to help build up context and lore for the location your going, redoing old content just makes it feel more of a chore and makes it harder for newer plaeyrs to catch up.

I don't think any dungeon should require you to complete a quest to access. There should be quests for every dungeon with greater rewards but they should be accesable at any time. It is getting a litle old that every single thing you do in this game requires the completion of a quest even just renting a room at the Inn.

I have ranted about hating the auto-acquire everything on a silver platter way of gaming in my blog...

Like an above poster said, now is not the time to implement 'higher requirements' but I do want them!

I like having requirements to unlock things, some easy, some hard. I especially like really long chains of quests to complete with difficult objectives to unlock exciting things!

I thought the inn quest was good, it wasn't taxing so everyone could do it and it was a nice little story that introduced a FABULOUS new NPC. And the quest difficulty was about equal to the reward.

Answer this are the quests for gaining access to dungeons really that enjoyable or rewarding? They are just time sinks. It is better to remove the barrier to entry to content and just create high quality challenging content that anyone can access. What exactly is being handed on a platter? You still have to actually complete the dungeon to earn any rewards.

I'm not saying some content shouldn't have some requirements but it just seems the way FF XIV is going, quests will be required to access any form of content and there simply to waste our time.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Akira_Tenshi

Answer this are the quests for gaining access to dungeons really that enjoyable or rewarding? They are just time sinks. It is better to remove the barrier to entry to content and just create high quality challenging content that anyone can access. What exactly is being handed on a platter? You still have to actually complete the dungeon to earn any rewards.

---

If the quests are engaging, fun and tells a intressting story about why you must brave the dungeon, would you still call it a time sink then?
A one time deal that takes like one hour to complete, much like how the job unlock quests work.
Or are you of that modern mindset of "get to the loot faster!" and skipping every cs and story?

What I'm asking for isn't pointless attunements just for the sake of it(like having to clear DH before Vale etc), what I want is reason for my character to go slay the monsters inside, instead of just doing it just "for the epics!".

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Akira_Tenshi

I'm not saying some content shouldn't have some requirements but it just seems the way FF XIV is going, quests will be required to access any form of content and there simply to waste our time.

---

Quest to unlock jobs, quest to join GC etc, is a waste of time to you?
Just because its a requirement doesn't mean it cant be intressting content.