WHM Actions Start Here [8:56]
[8:56] Video transitions into the WHM portion of the job actions.
[9:06] WHM casts a squiggly light beam attack spell
[9:08] WHM uses what I assume is a healing ability on the Gunbreaker, surrounding the target in three white flower-like orbs. A dark blue lily is consumed at this point. The bottom right part of the job gauge changes, showing the growth of a red bud. The white stem of the job gauge begins to shine and travel up the stalk of the job gauge.
[9:10] WHM casts an instant cast spell. It has Aero-like SFXs, implying another Aero tier. Given the fact the training dummy has a visible damage animation at 9:16, this further substantiates the Aero tier.
[9:13] WHM uses what looks to be a shiney AoE heal that effects themselves and the nearby Black Mage and Gunbreaker. Another dark blue lily is consumed and the bud growing on the bottom right of the job gauge grows again.
[9:14] WHM uses a Divine Benison like ability that seems that surrounds the WHM and nearby Gunbreaker and Black Mage in an orb of light. Based on the animation I assume this an AoE shield. It was also cast instantly, implying it is an ability - but no lilies were consumed by this ability usage.
[9:19] WHM casts what looks to be an upgrade Medica. The glow above the WHM looks like Medica but the bubble effect that surrounds the White and their party members is different than the normal Medica. Medica III, perhaps?
[9:22] WHM uses an ability, surrounding them in a glow as they sprout wings. No lilies are consumed using this ability.
[9:24] Some buffs wear off the from the party. This is ten seconds after the shield like ability is used at 9:14, implying that the shield only lasts for 10s?
[9:28] WHM casts Medica II. I assume it's to signify the wings are magnifying it's power.
[9:29] The WHM uses the same ability that is used at 9:13 of the job action video. The animation remains the same though it seems to be implied that either this ability is now augmented by the wings or is a new "Charged" action, hence why it can be used twice in such short succession. This consumes the final dark blue lily and causing the bud in the bottom right of the job gauge to bloom.
[9:31] WHM uses Tetragrammaton on the Black Mage
[9:34] WHM uses an ability on the target dummy, causing a massive flower to explode on it. This consumes the now blooming flower located on the bottom right of the job gauge.
[9:36] The screen transitions to the SCH job actions, but the shine climbing up the job gauge nearly reaches the tip of the stalk, implying a dak blue lily will bloom once it is full (also based on the comments made during the LL).
Observations and random food for thought
- The video as a whole shows off a whole suite of WHM abilities that affect the party, leading us to believe WHM continues to make direct impacts to the party health and well being.
- The dark blue lily is different from the standard red lily - meaning either they've entirely changed how the system works or there's a trait that modifies it to become the new system. It still seems to be consumed when an ability is used, but not all lilies are consumed upon ability use.
- No Assize was shown. It's possible Assize was removed for something else, perhaps the ability used at 9:13 and 9:29.
- It the ability 9:13 and 9:29 is not a Charged heal, that implies an extremely short recast on the ability.
- Does Divine Benison still exist? Or is the AoE shield an upgrade to that?
Random OCD mode off (for now). Just wanted to put this down in case anyone wanted to see a breakdown of the WHM job actions and provide any further fun for speculation comments~
Randomly Making OCD Observation about WHM Job Actions
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05-25-2019, 09:03 AMGhishlainRandomly Making OCD Observation about WHM Job Actions
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05-25-2019, 09:53 AMDotsNnots
Hi!
Did a similar analysis already over on the balance discord, had some similar thoughts to yours, figured I'd past it here with some edits!
1) Start with a standard cast single target damage skill - presumably new "stone" button, except holy-esque instead of earthy, standard nuke
2) ST skill on the gnb - consumes a black lily, generates the red flower bud. Gauge starts filling here. Whatever this skill does is important? Very lily related, even the animation is lilies. PURE SPECULATION -- looks like the gauge filling up doesn't start until you're down a black lily, so potentially gauge fills roughly every 30s to generate either a new lily or 3 new lilies for you (clip ends right before gauge fills). Doesn't *look* like the GNB gets a buff (no buff aura?) so it's hard to tell what this does.
3) Instant cast skill on the dummy, very likely a holy-themed dot to replace A3 or A2 or both
4) Instant AOE heal - consumed black lily - doesn't have any confession animation (important considering the following is:) - red lily bud grows bigger
5) Plenary cast - doesn't use lilies -- unsure if confession stacks are still involved, since there was an aoe heal right before -- looks instead like this is adding the buff that falls off later?? (this is definitely not benison fwiw!)
6) Medica cast. But, party members have some extra animation going out? Looks similar but different to current plenary stack application, maybe delayed affect from plenary or plenary changes how your GCD heals work? (after heal?)
7) Bubbly wing buff
7a) (buff falls off of the two party members here-- friend of mine is super positive this was applied with plenary)
8) Medica II cast
9) Same Instant AOE we saw earlier, still consumes a black lily, red lily "blooms"
10) Tetra
11) Big Red lily damage skill, consumes red lily
So some thoughts: wings is likely a healing up buff? maybe? i think maybe it'll affect oGCD heals too??? very much speculation, very much likely to be false! But it's interesting that they use tetra shortly after the wings, and the aoe heal that i'm super hoping is an oGCD and not an instant GCD. But, med2 was first.
You have to use the three black lilies to grow the red lily damage skill and get one use of that -- hopefully the black lily skill isn't a GCD and that these are all oGCD skills.
Friend's thought: plenary applies a healing up/after affect healing buff so heals while it's up have an extra effect, extra heal? I.e. plenary is used, applies a buff, medica is used, party gets medica heal and an extra heal -
05-25-2019, 10:33 PMGhishlain
@DotsNnots
For #1, definitely agreed on that.
For #2 - I would err more towards gaining a single Lily once the shine reaches the top of the gauge, but the idea of the gauge generating three feels more appealing given how many things seem to interact with these Lilies. I think three might be a bit much given the fact that an ability seems tied behind the ussage of three lilies but hey, who knows. This ability can mean a whole whack of things too - I'm tempted to lean towards a HoT if it is a buff. If it is a buff, it also means it has a longer duration than the job action video since buffs wearing out have a small visual indicator, unless that visual indicator was drowned out by other effects which is entirely possible given how shiny the WHM job action video is.
For #3 - Agreed, with me leaning more towards replacing A2 since it seems to be single target based on the size of the animation, and instant cast.
For #4 - Agreed~
For #5 - I actually never noticed this was Plenary being cast until you brought this up. The only time I've ever used Plenary is in the heat of combat so I never took the time to absorb the animation for it, lol. Thanks for that tid bit/ It's entirely possible that the WHM started with some for of confession stacks on everyone if Plenary still acts as it did before - though it does look like the effect changed due to point 7a below, which I'm also in agreement with. Take into account that for 7a, the buffs only seem to fall off the two other party members, and not the WHM. More on this at point 7. Also note that Plenary is split into two - the first half is the WHM using Plenary and the second is the "effect" animation hits the entire party.
For #6 - In the current expansion, when a party member gains a Confession stack via AoE heal, they get that orb animation showing they've gained an confession stacks (I just observed this playing around with Plenary animation, thanks for that!). Note that the animation in the job action video after Medica is cast is the same animation of the "effect" portion of Plenary that I pointed out in point #5.
For #7 - Because of my observations into Plenary, before the wings sprout the WHM has the animation of "gaining a confession" used on them. Not sure if related to #5 and #6 in any shape or form. This seems to also imply it "rebuffs" whatever plenary applies? Since the buffs only fall off the other two party members.
For #8 - Given the information above, I think it's important to note that Medica II doesn't have a Plenary effect animation like Medica does. This dDoes match what your friend is thinking at the end of your post, though it should still give an extra heal to WHM since the WHM plenary doesn't drop after use of wings? /think
#9, #10, and #11 - yep, agreed as well.
More thoughts:
Wings I'm going to assume is a super charged Largesse as well until told otherwise. Also I do hope it'll affect ability heals too if that's the case. Time will tell~
The new AoE heal is what I believe to be a new charged ability, hence why they show it twice. I guess time will tell. I also believe it's Charged because it seems absolutely crazy for WHM to have a AoE heal ability that basically only has a 15s recast on it. Alternatively, it's entirely possible the new AoE heal can be only be used when the WHM has a lily.
I too hope the lily DPS ability is an oGCD but an instant GCD doesn't necessarily hurt since you can still use that to both prevent clipping and move from mechanics with proper planning.
WHM is looking like a giant CD management nightmare though @_@ If it is I look forward to it~ -
05-26-2019, 10:05 AMDotsNnotsThis is the part I'm most concerned about.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghishlain
Right now WHM is clipmage - it's next to impossible to play optimally without clipping, and your optimization choices are centered around avoiding clipping.
Even if that aoe is an instant GCD heal (which would be gross) we're not going to intentionally spam an instant heal just to make a weave window, that's still a net loss, you're only going to use it if healing is needed - and even then if it's tied to the GCD you'll still rely on oGCDs first. Like, for the sake of math let's say the all of the lily consuming/generating skills were GCDs. Using stone VI's potency for the math, unless the red lily does more than 750p damage, you're not going to want to GCD heal needlessly just to get the red lily. And if you or your co-healer has oGCD heals that can cover the damage, the math will likely point to the oGCDs being more value since most oGCDs have zero or limited costs, and a GCD (instant or otherwise) still costs you a GCD that could've been damage...
Would be interesting if the red lily is somehow so potent that it makes it worth the value of losing the "stone" (aka new damage spell) casts, though. -
05-26-2019, 10:13 AMmanamoppet
Not really sure, but I think the blood lilly attack look a bit like Penelo's (FFXII) Intercession quickening?
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05-26-2019, 11:14 AMGhishlainI'm of opposite mindset since I find the challenge of "selecting the right tool" to be pretty fun. Just because you have all these lovely oGCDs at your disposal doesn't mean you shouldn't be pushing them all either. Thus finding the optimal skill usage on the fly will be a nightmare yet rewarding experience in my mind. I find the hardest part of playing WHM is not wanting to hit everything unless you need to.Quote:
Originally Posted by DotsNnots
With that being said I am in agreement that the optimal choice will generally be shared healing responsibilities via oGCDs, but having an GCD AoE instant heal wouldn't be bad either. IE you can use it after Final Omega's Electric Slide to get people topped off prior to Delta Attack and still allow the WHM to move into position properly. Also allows for free non-clip use of Swiftcast to allow the WHM to stack back in while using a GCD afterwards.
I had a random shower thought of lilies can be grown both over time and with the use of a Cure. Meaning there may be some optimized scenarios that using a Cure may result in a net gain instead of waiting the 30s if the potency is high enough on the lily. IE, if it's 750p like you mentioned before, using a Cure II followed into the lily attack would reduce the need to clip a GCD later for Tetra, resulting in a net DPS gain.Quote:
Originally Posted by DotsNnots
I guess time will tell though, I might be too tired to offer good theorycraft ATM, lol. I'm looking forward to seeing the tooltips come the 29th but it's also fun to theorize what everything means in that 35s some odd long video too.
I feel we are getting a huge confession / plenary rework given the amount of times those animations pop up.
I never played FFXII so I wish I could comment on this xDQuote:
Originally Posted by manamoppet
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05-26-2019, 12:08 PMDeceptus
Personal Thoughts:
The Dark lily is some type of Rot we have to get rid of via damaging spells to increase healing or something. -
05-26-2019, 07:03 PMmanamoppetMe neither (but I want to play it at some point), though I did watch some youtube videos of different Final Fantasy magic some time ago. Did some googling and found a gif from FF Brave Exvius of Intercession that's a bit more easier to compare with than the one in FFXII:Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghishlain
https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/...20171012021530
and from the job action video
http://i.freegifmaker.me/1/5/5/8/8/6...2847977157.gif
There's not much difference I think (color tint and lack of rising orb)... though some part of Intercession might have been a visual inspiration, or it may be just a coincidence :confused: -
05-26-2019, 07:35 PMDuskTS
WHM Wings is Largesse/Divine seal with the 10% DR from Collective Unconsciousness slapped on to it.
WHM playing catch up to the other Healers again smh tbh fam -
05-26-2019, 09:11 PMgriffinborn
Yea, the more I watch it the more I realize Stone and Aero probably is gone from their kit. Not upset by any stretch of the imagination, as I would prefer a laser show over rocks and passed gas.
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05-26-2019, 09:31 PMSeraphorOnly Aero III is gone, the other Aeros are still there, and Stone is as well but its upgraded to a holy spell after 70.Quote:
Originally Posted by griffinborn
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05-26-2019, 09:45 PMgriffinbornDo we know this for sure? :confused:Quote:
Originally Posted by Seraphor
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05-26-2019, 10:42 PMGhishlainI can definitely see the similarity, just a red aftereffect versus white. I also found this video from the original FFXII for reference too.Quote:
Originally Posted by manamoppet
Quote:
Originally Posted by DuskTS
I assume you're referring to this leak. Given the fact it's implied that Largesse is removed based on a different set of leaks, the healing buff may be more impactful then we think. Admittedly, I am also one to not use Largesse much in the first place on WHM given how many abilities the job has access to. Time will tell how this will pan out, and also assuming the leaks are true.
I imagine you're stating the first bit about Aero III due to the job action ID leak.Quote:
Originally Posted by Seraphor
I don't think anything has been posted yet indicating that Stone was upgraded to a holy spell, though it is heavily implied through the job action video and other leaks in the past. Still would be nice to have a direct source. That will most likely come when the embargo is lifted on the 29th. -
05-27-2019, 04:02 AMYuyuka3
I still don't see anything that looks like some utility unique to WHM, sadly...
If those really are new healing spells, it just bloats what we already have without adding anything new, which then will just lead to the circle repeating itself.
Thank you two for analyzing the video, though. -
05-27-2019, 07:08 PMgriffinbornAh, seems you were right. According to image leak, Stone and Aero upgrade to Glare and Dia at level 72. Costs the same MP and everythingQuote:
Originally Posted by Seraphor
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05-28-2019, 01:51 AMYuyuka3Also, looks like Aero III is, sadly, really gone... That's a disappointment, it's a really good damage ability and this reduces WHM's damage potential unless the other two healers also lost DoT(s). I find the other skills quite interesting, though. Apparently, the new Lily skills have 'Afflatus' in their names and are instant-GCD skills (bummer... would have prefered oGCD, personally, but this might help with weaving at least), and the new damage ability that consumes the Blood Lily is a 900 potency AoE with decaying damage ala Holy. Afflatus Solace (level 52) would then be a 700 potency ST heal, instant. There is a third Afflatus skill with yet unknown effect, but I really hope it's a party buff. Afflatus Rapture sounds promising at least, due to meaning euphoria, excitement etc (or alternatively alluding to the apocalypse, when the worthy are sent to heaven, as I'm told... which could hint towards buff maybe).Quote:
Originally Posted by griffinborn
Last, I have to say, that the level 80 skill (the wings) from the leak looks really juicy. 20% healing up and 10% damage reduction for everyone within 30y radius for 20 seconds, on a 2 minute CD? Sign me up. Also, Assize and Benison stay, which is great.
I so hope those leaks is real... -
05-28-2019, 02:03 AMgriffinbornThe pastebin leak that had lots of accurate information mentioned a "Rapture" being a "better Cure II", whatever that might mean.Quote:
Originally Posted by Yuyuka3
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05-28-2019, 02:24 AMYuyuka3Hmmm. That would suck, but from this image leaks, it sounds more like Solace is that better Cure II (700 potency, instant, eats a Lily instead of MP and makes the Blood Lily grow)? Like, that does sound like a better Cure II to me... I at least hope that's the case, since we really don't need another heal spell, but some more party utility... Temperance might not be enough still compared to the other two.Quote:
Originally Posted by griffinborn
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05-28-2019, 02:38 AMgriffinbornYea perhaps they were mistaken about the rapture bit since multiple abilities had "Afflatus" in it. Didn't seem sure since it was listed with a question mark.Quote:
Originally Posted by Yuyuka3
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05-29-2019, 09:48 AMKyeria
I really hope that if "Banish" & "Dia" replace Stone & Aero that they aren't learned after Lv.70 and that they just simply went back and reworked the job for these abilities to remove Stone & Aero from a visual standpoint after switching to WHM at Lv.30.
I would hate to see two of our new abilities to be wasted on an animation swap... -
05-29-2019, 07:27 PMYuyuka3Glare and Dia are both 72 and Dia is apparently the potency of Aero III and II rolled into one if the leak is true, so I expect the new damage ability to at least be a potency upgrade to Stone VI (or rather, hope...). But Afflatus Solace was inserted at 52 together with Assylum (which is still there). The other two Afflatus skills are 74 (Misery, the AoE damage skill) and 76 (the mystery skill Rapture). That's from a leaked picture of the new WHM skill page. Thin Air now seems to be level 58, wasn't it somewhere in the 60's before?Quote:
Originally Posted by Kyeria