Limited Jobs Limit Potential

Short and to the point, i dont see the reason for limited jobs. Why would you waste time and resources on a class that is only half finished?

This isnt a callout to those who like the idea, this is merely an opinion piece. I'm genuanly curious if people like limited jobs or not and if I'm alone in thinking their alittle pointless.

the vast majority hate the system, especially what it represents for future jobs like beast master
you're not alone, that's for sure. I pray that they don't do beast master or other FF11 jobs dirty this way, i would much prefer a job be neutered a bit to fall in line with ff14's model than be a limited job

I suppose people may say the same thing about the new races in that they could be seen as only being half finished, when you consider they are unable to have headgear appearance on release and some may also claim not having male (viera) female (hrothgar) equivalents is incomplete work as well Though when we look at the higher picture it's not going to be wasted time/resources if it brings new content to players, I think that's a similar thing with BLU. The legacy is not great so far but there is room to improve in the future, and either Limited Jobs becomes a worthy addition to the game or BLU ends up becoming a proper job (and limited jobs are dropped altogether).

Beastmaster being limited is a horrifying concept. All they'd have to do is copy paste the BLU setup and just replace learning spells with learning monster summons or something.

I'll just quote myself from the BLU for Duty Finder thread.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by HarryTipper

*me everytime this thread pops up again and im reminded of the sad state that BLU is in*

https://img2.finalfantasyxiv.com/acc...ea3079af6b.png

---

The coming BLU update better be something amazing if they want to win people over for the idea of more limited jobs.

I like the concept of making broken and awkward systems, but I want to see it either used in conjunction of a normal job or not used on anything you'd ever think could be a normal job. Like Blue Mage I believe could use limited systems to its benefit to have an ungodly amount of OP skills and also have some sort of system (many options) that allowed them to DF without breaking everything they glower at.

Meanwhile I could imagine a job like Onion Knight being a create your own job from your other job.. jobs, and it just doesn't really fit in any way but it could be fun for the heck of it (wear anything, use anything). Go fight Bahamut Prime with your Hallowed Ground triple cast holy with a smiggen of penta fell cleave :P.

So I guess I'd say I love the concept when used in conjuction (a smaller level example would be Bard and performance) and I CAN like it when used exclusively limited but there are a lot more caveats on that. So an example of mixing two systems would be say beastmaster can run around taming and gathering things as a sort of Sheperd DoL job, not really attempting to be balanced and its quite great solo job, but then when they DF there is some differences (while keeping the theme of the job) that make them balanced to content. It's a bit too late for it now but you might say Alchemist could be the limited side of Chemist (changing and adding some more potions and effects and giving them some combat abilities). Puppetmaster's limited side could be DoH crafting system, minion customization, and perhaps even being able to make small Lords of Verminion armies in the open world (Pikmin style lol)- but in DF they just get their main puppet.

I like that they can do weird broken things, I don't like when it takes a job off the market that you definitely think could be one.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JunkhogMakison

Beastmaster being limited is a horrifying concept. All they'd have to do is copy paste the BLU setup and just replace learning spells with learning monster summons or something.

---

Nononono

It would take a lot of work!

So much work!

Whew, just think about all that extra work it would take to make a limited job Beastmaster as opposed to a regular job version!

*Cough*

Man, they can't even give SMN more than 3 pets and you think Beastmaster's gonna have that option?


You all should pray it actually comes under limited format, at least you'll get some mini-games out of it.

I like the idea of jobs that wouldn't otherwise fit the system in ffxiv having a place, but BLUs execution left a lot to be desired.

I like the idea of a Beastmaster limited job (far more than SMN 2.0 with 1 to 3 monster pets, one of which is meta) and of an Onion Knight job that can equip all armour and uses a cross class skill system.
But they need to establish content for them if they're going to work, more than just a few isolated challenges to complete for poetics.

I'd certainly prefer a real version of Blue Mage, but I don't out right hate the Limited Job concept.

I think it at least has potential for something interesting, but I doubt SE can implement anything to capitalize on that... Masked Carnival is lackluster and that's about all there is... Just not really anything to do with Blue Mage... The progression of the Job is solely from leveling it, then there is nothing... No progression in gearing it up (really, they could have done some interesting stuff with Blue Mage gear, but instead we only get 3 weapons and they're all identical outside glamour? Delete this please...), only thing there is is the weekly Masked Carnival which isn't even for new rewards... Allied Seals were added in 2.1? Like seriously...

Add a "Limited Roulette", which only Blue Mage (and *sigh* any future Limited Jobs) can queue up for. Just another dungeon roulette really, but at least something to do with the Job. Throw in additional rewards to upgrade your Blue Mage AF gear? Now you have stats like "Enhances 1,000 Needles" on there to make certain spells more powerful. Heck, throw in its own Relic questline to make a stupidly powerful Cane like old FFXI/XIV 1.x style Relics were... Could have a mix of things like "Clear this dungeon as Blue Mage", "Clear this Masked Carnival", even mix in some of the open world content like the Odin/Behemoth FATEs, or Levequests/Treasure Maps. Just add something tangible to work on once you've finished leveling... I did occasionally have fun on Blue Mage, limited though it may be, but I can't have fun on something that has zero purpose... I just see no reason to really touch it again as it currently is... What's the point of limiting a Job because of a few stupidly powerful abilities, when there is nowhere to have fun using those stupidly powerful abilities?

Most use I've had out of my Blue Mage since it's release was doing the Noctis quest with it... That's it... Again, kinda had fun with that... Why isn't there more any stuff like that to do as Blue Mage?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by HarryTipper

I'll just quote myself from the BLU for Duty Finder thread.



The coming BLU update better be something amazing if they want to win people over for the idea of more limited jobs.

---

apparently has the insta death spell that will work on alexander and such

but lets see if they actually keep that idea

The fact that BLU can't do duties/progress doesn't bother me and I can see how it might be OP unless the job was nerfed, what does bother me is the level cap that locks off any relevant content.

Just feel that a job like BLU should be the best at open world content, but it can't even do dailies so like... what's the point.

counting jobs link3d 2 1 weapon creates alot of limited potentional limited or not. Then counting how they limited summoner because Eorzens are 2 weak to pass a test to have full controll. how is it a shock they'd add a system that limits jpbs when weve been limited from.the start

I wasn't looking forward to Blue Mage at all, but I can imagine for the people that were hoping and praying for it to be added how this could be a disappointment.

Quote:

---

Getting down to business, I asked Yoshida to shed some light on this decision out of the gate. Noting that there is potential for "Blue Mage-only PVP content," he explains that using "powerful blue magic" is what makes the class so interesting, and given that it "breaks the balance of the game," it wouldn't be feasible to allow raid participation (he clarifies there are "no plans" for that). He also explains that certain abilities (like Level 5 Death) would have to be removed entirely.

---

So don't include Level 5 death. Take the same liberties with Blue Mage like you did with Summoner.

Did he think that players would demand to be able to insta-kill raid bosses? The excuse of wanting to provide a true Blue Mage experience as to why it would only work as a limited job is a flimsy one.

I was never a great fan of BLU, although I did have fun gathering spells with a friend in XI. I was curious on how the job would play if it ever landed in XIV. Of course it was released as a limited job, and I feel disappointed with the results. I can only imagine how disappointed true blue fans of the job actually were. Not holding my breath, but hopefully the next update to BLU will add some much needed life to it.

The way BLU has been handled does not make me interested in seeing other jobs being given the limited treatment, especially BST and PUP. I know I have answered a few "what jobs do you want to see" threads over the years, and I always list BST since it was my favorite from XI, usually with the caveat as long as it does not play like SMN. I know Charm cannot work as it did in XI, but I would like to see the job made to fit in the world of XIV. Now my biggest concern is them making it a limited job. Even if it was released as a full job, but turned out to be something I did not enjoy, at least others may have fun and enjoy maining it. To release it or any job as limited, at least going by the current state of BLU, seems to be such as wasted opportunity.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Len

Did he think that players would demand to be able to insta-kill raid bosses? The excuse of wanting to provide a true Blue Mage experience as to why it would only work as a limited job is a flimsy one.

---

I think their real reason was balance. Not of the Job itself, but of the roles. They didn't want a 4th Caster, so Blue Mage was either simply never going to happen, or it had to be something entirely different.

I wouldn't be surprised if they're actually just about done adding new Jobs at this point, 6.0 will have a new healer and that's it; 4 tanks, 4 healers, 4 melee, 3 ranged, 3 casters. That's their plan, and Blue Mage doesn't fit into it. Rather than simply never give us Blue Mage however, they opted to instead implemented it the way they have, for better or worse...

I really like the idea of limited jobs, but the way Square went about and continue to go about presenting them as anything other than a minigame is very stupid.

The status panel should have BLU in its own line, broken from both DoL and DoW/M.

It should not have a DPS background. A yellow background, or something else that isn't blue/red/green, should be its role "color."

Heck, if they'd done BLU properly they would've had a "limited job" for Triple Triad release (As in, "I'm a level 50 triadian, let's duel") way way long before BLU so people could have a frame of reference for these minigame "jobs."

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Nalien

I think their real reason was balance. Not of the Job itself, but of the roles. They didn't want a 4th Caster, so Blue Mage was either simply never going to happen, or it had to be something entirely different.

I wouldn't be surprised if they're actually just about done adding new Jobs at this point, 6.0 will have a new healer and that's it; 4 tanks, 4 healers, 4 melee, 3 ranged, 3 casters. That's their plan, and Blue Mage doesn't fit into it. Rather than simply never give us Blue Mage however, they opted to instead implemented it the way they have, for better or worse...

---

Ironically, i felt BLU was extremely underpowered untill you got broken skills. Or at least till 50 imo. And there are so many skills they didnt choose to make learnable, throughout the overworld. I agree the implementation is off, but I am under the impression that like you, we'd only get a healer next BUT I feel like they literally designed a full job that only needed tweaking to function in a party setting, and yeah we will get 4 4 3 3 4 but I think ultimately BLU could be a 4th caster job and that its on trial basis till they need a 2nd job in 6.0 or 7.0

Is there anyone even playing BLU anymore? like, serious question. Even the carnival guy in Ul'dah is rather lonely every time I pass by. If that's the future of what a limited job is I'd rather they make them a full job or don't bother at all, but that's just my opinion.
Also, BLU is nowhere near as broken as they feared it would be, if anything, it's horribly underpowered. With a little tweaks here and there it could be a normal ranged caster by 6.0, who knows.

My soul still hurts from what they did to my beloved BLU. I do not wish that on any other job.

there's always a way to make things work. yoship just chose the hard way

I don't know, the idea of turning jobs that were otherwise not going to be added into the game as side content is pretty clever. The execution needs some work, but for a seedling of a new concept...not bad. I had fun with BLU, even in its current early awkward phase. I even still use it to mess around with FATES and low level WT dungeons and in between working on my zodiac weapons.

All it needs is more fleshing out and more goals to reach. I kind of like the idea of it having to work on making its own relic weapon and gear. I would love it if BLU gets its own playground in the New World. A Eureka-like area that only it (and other limited jobs) can enter. And for people that hate BLU and Eureka, that must be quite a scary thought.

And why wouldn't BST work as a limited job? Give it a Monster Bank like the one in Tactics Advanced to store all of your pets, a monster journal to record all of its beast interactions and a whip (I'm fine with dual-wielding axes too), and viola! A loner adventurer that spends all of their time studying, befriending and raising beasts. And while they're taking inspiration from TA, they can honor the symbiotic relationship it and BLU had in that game. Learning spells and taming beasts together.

I'm not completely averse to Beastmaster being a limited job if the content they made for it was akin to a Pokemon-type/style content (like how many hoped Verminion would be) or even a turn-based strategy like Tactics. Given their poor handling of a pet DPS in SMN, I couldn't imagine them getting a normal Beastmaster job right. That is to say, I'd hope they put actual effort into making a side content limited job like Beastmaster enjoyable, totally unlike that boring auto-attack mess Pankration from FFXI.

While there's always room for improvements on everything, I'm happy with Blue Mage just the way it is.

Thank you, Blue Mage. Thank you for giving me the tools to build an army.

http://i.ibb.co/5K6wKJs/puk3.jpg

An army of Pudgy Puks.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DumdogsWorld

While there's always room for improvements on everything, I'm happy with Blue Mage just the way it is.

Thank you, Blue Mage. Thank you for giving me the tools to build an army.

http://i.ibb.co/5K6wKJs/puk3.jpg

An army of Pudgy Puks.

---

[Angry frog squeaks]

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Nalien

I think their real reason was balance. Not of the Job itself, but of the roles. They didn't want a 4th Caster, so Blue Mage was either simply never going to happen, or it had to be something entirely different.

I wouldn't be surprised if they're actually just about done adding new Jobs at this point, 6.0 will have a new healer and that's it; 4 tanks, 4 healers, 4 melee, 3 ranged, 3 casters. That's their plan, and Blue Mage doesn't fit into it. Rather than simply never give us Blue Mage however, they opted to instead implemented it the way they have, for better or worse...

---

I mean if they didnt want to add another caster they could have made BLU use scouting gear and use dual swords or a magic dagger or something. BLU has the least consistent identity of any FF job other that the fact it uses monster attacks, so a BLU DOW could have been really interesting, melee attacks to build a blu magic meter to then cast or somethin

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ReiMakoto

I mean if they didnt want to add another caster they could have made BLU use scouting gear and use dual swords or a magic dagger or something. BLU has the least consistent identity of any FF job other that the fact it uses monster attacks, so a BLU DOW could have been really interesting, melee attacks to build a blu magic meter to then cast or somethin

---

Personally, I think it could have made a great tank (bonus points, tank icon is even blue). Counter based tank mechanics, can even implement a somewhat true-to-Blue Mage Learn mechanic as a counter spell, so you get hit by Chocobo Kick? You can throw it right back at the enemies. It wouldn't permanently learn spells but temporarily have access to them based on what you're fighting. Don't even need to worry about balance, it can effectively work the same as Astrologians Lord of Crowns, just the name of the spell/animation changes depending on what you're fighting, potency/effect could be fixed.

Still, at this point I think they've settled on all the "real" Jobs they want to add. I think they've had the idea of 4 tanks/healers/melee 3 ranged/caster since 2.0 and fitted Jobs in as they went, and at this point they've decided on all the Jobs (Geomancer seems a solid bet for 6.0s healer). With Stormblood, stuff like Blue Mage and Beastmaster simply didn't fit in with their plan anymore, so they opted to find an alternative.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Cidel

I'm not completely averse to Beastmaster being a limited job if the content they made for it was akin to a Pokemon-type/style content (like how many hoped Verminion would be) or even a turn-based strategy like Tactics.

---

I mean, if Beastmaster was essentially a full FF themed pokemon game inside FFXIV I'd be ok with it being limited.

But it's not going to be that, it'll be a SMN that can't queue with 50 useless pets and 2 or 3 decent ones.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ReiMakoto

BLU has the least consistent identity of any FF job other that the fact it uses monster attacks, so a BLU DOW could have been really interesting, melee attacks to build a blu magic meter to then cast or somethin

---

Reverse RDM with monster attacks, the job we'll never get :(

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jandor

But it's not going to be that, it'll be a SMN that can't queue with 50 useless pets and 2 or 3 decent ones.

---

Still sounds better than SMN 2.0 with only 3 monsters and only 1 that's any good.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Seraphor

Still sounds better than SMN 2.0.

---

Does it really? 50+ pointless monsters with which to fight open world mobs from 2 expansions ago. Wooo.

BLU being limited I was supporting the idea at first. Simply because with this they can stay true to the lore of the job. However seeing it being actually out was quite disappointing.

The point of limited was because the job would be very powerful to the point where it could not be included in other content due to its power.

However that is not the case. BLU is an underpowered job and at this point they should have just made it a stand alone job.

I hope beastmaster, puppetmaster and geomancer dont become future limited jobs.

Any job I can't do my daily roulettes with is useless to me. I do not like the idea of Limited Jobs. It added nothing to the game except a collectathon for about 1 week.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jandor

Does it really? 50+ pointless monsters with which to fight open world mobs from 2 expansions ago. Wooo.

---

Yes, it does.
Side content matters as well as core jobs.
SMN 2.0 would be pointless, and good side content is better than no side content.
Limited BST is better than no BST.

For all BLU's drawbacks, it's better than not being in the game at all.

Best way to see limited jobs is not as neutered jobs, but as player-oriented experiments--mechanical "what if" scenarios--that otherwise wouldn't be able to adequately exist in this game without the job being something that is not true to previous versions like how the players would want. On one hand, it's an interesting approach to playable content, but I do agree with previous posters in this thread that something like a "Limited Job" Roulette should be a thing since it's a lazier way of providing additional content for those jobs.

Also, pro tip: if you don't want a job to be limited, then don't ask for a job from FFXI and whine about how it needs to be exactly like how it was in FFXI. It's just that simple!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Seraphor

SMN 2.0 would be pointless, and good side content is better than no side content.

---

Collecting 50 mobs to do outdated content with is literally just BLU 2.0 with monsters instead of spells.

BLU wasn't good side content either.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Seraphor

For all BLU's drawbacks, it's better than not being in the game at all.

---

I disagree.

Instead of implementing a crappy "Job" with limited use, limited content and a limitation on the games scope (Since, there's a lower potential for getting an actual full BLU job)

It would have been possible to have the time and resources spent on "Designing" BLU on some other, likely better, side content that could have had more permeance or enjoyability.

Like, how much time was spent designing BLU? Writing the story, implementing all of the limitations, animating their skills, coding in 0.0001% chance to work insta-death spells, coding everything to be immune to insta-death spells, balancing their INT scaling so they end up being exactly as powerful as any other job... At level 50... With a full set of ilevel 130 Ironworks gear.... etc.

And how much time would it have taken to say... Create a new side-story line such as the Postmoogle or Hildibrand series? Create a new type of end-game content that is maybe something like a "Boss Rush" where 8 man parties will fight a series of dungeon/raid bosses back to back that are scaled up to level 70? A Prestige system where you can play jobs at max level and progress towards "Prestige" levels that allow you to unlock things such as extra AF gear, unique skill animations (I.e. Golden Bahamut)?

Or any number of other things that would have been more entertaining that the current BLU...

All without the disappointment that is a ruined BLU job...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Seraphor

For all BLU's drawbacks, it's better than not being in the game at all.

---

If I was starving and someone gave me a steak with maggots crawling all over it and said, "Well it's better than not having something to eat isn't it?" I would probably starve.

That's how BLU felt to me. Granted I did level it and collect all the spells... but it still feels like a maggot steak to me.

Blue Mage was fantastic.

For leveling my chocobo every 30 minutes.

As a class, it accomplishes nothing we were told it would be except limited, so i guess that can count as part of a win? (I gave up before getting all the spells because I didnt want to bother people to do primals with me after they finished relics and I hadnt learned the spells yet).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Burningskull

If I was starving and someone gave me a steak with maggots crawling all over it and said, "Well it's better than not having something to eat isn't it?" I would probably starve.

---

But that's just extra protein, and don't write off what you would or wouldn't eat when starving... you'd be surprised what you can stomach.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Burningskull

If I was starving and someone gave me a steak with maggots crawling all over it and said, "Well it's better than not having something to eat isn't it?" I would probably starve.

That's how BLU felt to me. Granted I did level it and collect all the spells... but it still feels like a maggot steak to me.

---

I mean... Based on what you just said, you wouldn't starve, because you did in fact eat the maggot steak...