Beastmaster implimentation

I've been seeing a lot of people talking about beast master and it got me thinking on how the best way to implement this classic job to the game.

After brainstorming with what little brain cells I have left I thought of something that I think might be cool.

What if instead of beast master job, we use the concept of beast master to expand a feature already in the game. By feature, I mean the companion system. Currently the companion system is limited to just the chocobo. However with beast master implementation into it this could expand the options to any monster, beast, etc we can tame. After we could advance them by choosing a path for them that we choose like the chocobo has a melee attacker, tank, and healer. Want a pet behemoth tank? melee attacker? what about a spell caster? It would most likely have to go by species and not limited to roles like dps, tank, healer. Maybe expand it to debuffer, buffer, etc as well.

I'll use a cactuar as an example. I can see its three paths being melee attacker, ranged attacker, and buffer. The melee attack would of course focus on tackling and attacking from close range. Ranged attacker could be how it shoots needles at enemies and attack. Then the buffer could provide support buffs to your character while you fight such as haste. Providing more powerful skills as you go further down the path with skill points.

Even after implementation it could still be expanded on, maybe include new quest as more monsters and types are added to the game.

Pros
Don't have to worry about limitations due to balance
New content and expansion on a feature that hasn't been touched upon in any significant way in a long time
allowing you to fight alongside your pet as any job you want such as a healer, tank, etc.
following the companion system, you could grow the pet by choosing which path to develop them which could be different based on species.

Cons
wouldn't be able to use in dungeons/limited to open world
it wouldn't be a job on its own, not even a limited job

I like the idea to use the Companion System, as the jumping point for Beast Master, however I would like to see it implemented as an actual JOB proper.

Edit: what about the use of Mounts, or Minions as "Beast Glamours".
That way the build you choose under the companion system translates to any "Glamour" your choose.
That way a player isnt restricted to using the best, or highest level pet. Rather a choice to have something that suits your character.
Would also make use of all those mounts and minions.

Dragoon summons Midgardsomer ...

I'm gonna be that guy and say fix summoner aesthetics and pet gameplay first. Not because I'm trying to be a jerk but because I want to spare BST the same pain.



Trust me, you really don't want to play with the same 3 pets for years.

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Originally Posted by SenorPatty

I'm gonna be that guy and say fix summoner aesthetics and pet gameplay first. Not because I'm trying to be a jerk but because I want to spare BST the same pain.



Trust me, you really don't want to play with the same 3 pets for years.

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that is my biggest concern and why I suggest using this as an expansion of the companion system instead of a job. If it became a job it would need to be very limited in order to make balance easier. One of those limitations is the available pets. If they were to make it into a pet based job we would most likely get stuck with the same 3 pets much like summoner is resulting in the taming aspect not being there outside of job quests.
As for gameplay, if they go with my suggestion then it would be more or less a lot like the chocobo we have now where it fights with us in the open world and the abilities it has we have some control over adding variety to the pets we have. Could even have pets for different occasions whether you need damage, healings, support, debuffer, etc.

My idea for Beastmaster does not reflect most people. My desire for this class is to be another gatherer that facilitates the acquisition of mob drops. That doesn't mean it cannot tame beasts in the outer world. I think it would be awesome if the beasts they compel do work like companions. You can use them in battle, and even mount them. But the companion aspect to them would just be one of several features that would make it a fun and interesting class to play.

It would basically function as another limited job, but be a step up for a gatherer instead of a step down like with BLU. You can't use it in duties, but instead have it's own game much like how BLU and FSH do.

I think the issue is that people want a Beastmaster Job to play a Beastmaster Job. Not to just run around with a reskinned Chocobo (Since, Chocobo can already be Tank, Healer or DPS. If you're rich enough you can level it to level 20 and max out all 3 trees to boot)

Think something akin to Beastmastery spec'd Hunters in WoW, or White Lions spec'd for either their Lion or their Hybrid tree from Warhammer Online. Where you have skills that make your pet do something with you and have buffs you apply to each other.

As far as taming and the like goes... They could go the WoW route and put pets into different "Families" so that they can be grouped into similar stats/skills and make "Taming" more of a cosmetic change than actually core gameplay (Such as in prior games where you'd control an enemy in a fight for a short while, such as a single turn)

Alternatively, they could make Taming simply a side-activity, much like BLU going around and learning spells for such things as pure cosmetics or to utilize for such things as your Companions suggestion. While actually combat-wise playing more like the Tamer from BDO where the "Pet" is a shadowy/aetherial animal that comes out with your attacks. (This would also be able to bypass the crap AI that plagues SMN)

I like the idea, but feel that it can be expanded on. I would much rather it be a job on its own than a feature that any job can imitate. That can be either limited or standard. Though when I think of BST, I think of actively going out, taming and observing beasts to know their traits and abilities. Like a monster journal where after a time battling against or with a species you learn more about them. Maybe even a psuedo reputation system where you improve your relationship or knowledge with a certain species.

That also means every species should have differences besides on how they look. For example: crabs are a sturdy bunch and would make great tanking pets. You start of with a lowly crab that you can find in La Noscea or Thanalan and as your relationship improves it gets stronger and learns new abilities. Then you have more supportive beasts like the mandragora who excel in debilitating enemies with poisons and giving allies regen effects. I like the idea that as they get stronger they can "evolve" into stronger versions of their species. I would love to see a crab turning into the B rank Helmet Crab or the mandragora into a Royal with their own noticeable differences between the "lower" and "higher" members of their species.

It's beginning to sound a lot like World of Final Fantasy. Which kind of pushes it more into the limited job camp.

Of course this will require some fine-tuning of the AI or maybe organize special abilities as commands that only the master can give. Would suck to have to micromanage the cool actions like you have to with the faeries and primals.

I know it would be impossible to do in FFXIV but my iteration of Beastmaster would stem from FF13-2 when defeating mob & captured them as monster crystals, you was able to use them in battle. Different monsters had different abilities: buff, debuff, sentinel, medic, magic damage, physical damage. Chose what beasts you want in your party & can be switch out often. Most likely it would be a limited job.

Limited, my twist allow beastmaster to collect the essence of monsters they kill in the wild, let them build up a certain number similar to AP from earlier ff games to master each monster form. Then once mastered the beastmaster can temporarily transform into a larger, stronger version of that monster at will. In the field a beastmaster can dominate the will of a wild creature and use it to attack, or defend against other monsters, or transform and fight alongside it's unwitting ally. In Dungeons or trials a beastmaster may use it's mastered forms to wreak havoc, and destruction upon the dungeons denizens. For those who brave the dungeons or can't find a monster they like in the field Craftable jug items may be used to spawn stronger named monsters for a period of time to fight at their side. Why Limited? Because the format of the limited job is perfect for beastmasters preferred style of play. Because it is Limited Beastmaster would not be balanced for all content and as such will be able to better exist as an overpowered solo berserker which would not need to worry about being Nerfed to play nice with others.

Beastmaster will have to be a limited job, even if its not...

In the sense that if its a proper job, it will have between 1 and 3 preset pets to choose from, only one of which will be used.

That ir its a 'Limited Job' and you get to collect dozens of pets to use in just openworld content and a side game.

I actually think that is kind of a nice idea. However the beast companion should have less skills than our chocobo otherwise it would be overpowered in group content. I personally don't mind to use the same 3 pets. If we get to tame a monster it would end up as a limited job and I rather see it as a normal one.

I think beastmaster could work, just the pet management would be different than arcanist. Arcanist pet is wrong and unnecessary pet management. They could get it right with a fresh attempt.

Bst as a barriers tank (pet hp being the barrier) could work and be interesting.

Puppet master being a totem/bubble driven healer/dps focus job I can imagine too

As long as it isn't limited, I'll be fine. Make it DPS, tank or even heals - I just want to be able to enjoy the game regularly on a Beastmaster. It's an archetype that's been notably missing since launch.

I wouldn't even mind if they had to limit the number of beasts in order to make it NOT a limited job. Taming the ones that we do use could be our job quests just as easily.

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Originally Posted by Stormfur

I wouldn't even mind if they had to limit the number of beasts in order to make it NOT a limited job. Taming the ones that we do use could be our job quests just as easily.

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There's a really simple solution to that - simply have your choice of beast be an aesthetic choice or an equivalent choice, instead of having them be hyper-specialized carbon copies of mobs out in the world.

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Originally Posted by Stormfur

I wouldn't even mind if they had to limit the number of beasts in order to make it NOT a limited job. Taming the ones that we do use could be our job quests just as easily.

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In WoW you had a massive list of beasts you could tame, but they used archetypes in order to control balance (like a tank pet or a damage pet, etc). They used to be far more personalized but it was difficult to balance / expect players to have / do certain things.

While I'm not suggesting FFXIV copies everything from WoW I would really hope whoever makes Beastmaster in FFXIV plays WoW's Hunter Beastmaster spec in order to broaden their ideas and what players might expect (rather than accidentally underdeliver as they had a limited pool of ideas, meanwhile players go pointing off to games that did it better and wonder why they couldn't have done it at least 'that good' if not ideally better of course). It's had some ups and downs but it has had quite a few really good moments. Also when trying out WoW's beastmaster also check out WoW's warlock again, and the pet ai, and try to make a better ai / interaction gameplay wise lol. FFXIV's pets are not known to be the easiest to work with sometimes :p.

I honestly want Beastmaster to be more like Lyon, where you get to use a copy of Beast skills in your natural attack rotation. Then in the open world, you also get to use your Beast summon and command your pet to attack, something like Castrum's final boss. So basically a mix of something like the FFXVI skills trailer (instead of primals, we have a demi ability of the beasts we capture) and a more fleshed out system than what SMN currently have. The limited portion of the job is the beasts themselves due to collection and having different beasts means different stats. The normal part of the job are the skills - and the flavor will be assigning a beast action to the initial rotation changes the animation slightly. Though I can't see this ever happening due to the amount of work involved to make it work, it would be really cool to have.

At the same time, the normal jobs are missing a glaring factor to having an actual pet job. SCH's faerie doesn't feel like an actual pet but more like a very unresponsive AI. SMN is also a mix between egis and demi summons, so it doesn't really feel like a pet class itself. If it really does go into the direction of a fully fleshed out pet class that would be nice too.

In terms of pets a Beastmaster can have, they should take inspiration (Not follow) WoW's example where whatever you tame goes into a menagerie and you can pick and choose. Charm can be used here where you can go into the wild and charm a monster, however to make it part of your menagerie you need to register it at the main cities. In previous iterations of Beastmaster the pet that you charm is temporary, however with FFXIV's system your pets can still be active even when you change zones or go into a ward or city which is a good part on the pet system.

As for Charm, it can be a fun overworld or dungeon thing and it'll be like a miscellaneous ability or it can be related to the menagerie idea. It'll rarely ever be used in raids and FFXI had the same thing going, when you do ambudasce or any high end content (Which is rare and most of the time you solo) you only use pots which summons the beasts because charm doesn't work.

Beastmaster is not about collecting beasts, it is more like taming beasts to your side to help you in battle. In no point in the FF series Beastmaster was never about collecting monsters. However FFXIV can allow it to be about collecting and maybe gives us something like a fishing log for a Beastmaster.

As for Job Gauges it would be like Scholar's where certain pet moves take up certain amount of resources. Beastmaster is bound to have weapon skills so it can generate the amount necessary for pet actions and different pet actions will have different costs.

I mean the same can be applied to Normal Jobs where they are conformed to be balanced and have a job gauge.
But a Normal job is better than a Limited Job. Mainly because it teaches you to manage your resources instead of just spamming a skill.
All of the casters can spam their own magical skills, and still they have a rotation. Blue Mage, Summoner and Red Mage are all considered Burst Caster DPS while Black Mage is a Constant Caster DPS.

It doesn't need to be a limited job because Beastmaster has a different type of weapons, which are whips (FFV), Brushes (FFVI), One-handed Axes (FFXI), Scythe (FFXI), Instruments (FF:TA/A2) .
So we already have an idea of what kind of weapon skills can be brought in and the type of roles it can fill. Not just that but abilities for a Beastmaster are learned through levelling.

Already with this sort of idea the need for implementing as a Limited Job becomes obsolete.
I can see some people using limited job as a way to implement it and I have to say, you are really "creative" especially when you are relying on a crutch for your ideas.

However I think it is more important before we can try implement it as a Normal Job is to ADDRESS THE FACT THAT THE PET SYSTEM NEEDS TO BE IMPROVED FIRST before anything else.

What I'm realistically expecting is that it'll put in the monster affinity chart from XI, sort of like BLU elements in Carnivale. Beyond that, something kind of like the personal islands in Adoulin where you raise monsters, you can stable only so many at max, and you aim for final forms that either focus on single-target or AoE.