Just had a guy report me because of 2 questions

Ok, i found this pretty funny.

Here i am, doing Alphascape v2.0 (normal) for the first time. Everyone is in, people say hi and whatnot, then i notice the other tank is in their dps stance so i ask them if they want me to MT, they say yes and i MT.

A few seconds later i tell them "If i get 2 vulnerability stacks, swap with me" to which he says he doesn't know how to do that. I didn't mind that, i just payed extra attention as to not get hit by anything. After a minute, before the phases in which Midgar uses Tail's End, i ask the OT if he knows how to cover a tankbuster, to which they respond "no". Again, i'm fine with this, so i ask him another question: "Do you have any defense ability you can use on someone?" so i wouldn't take too much damage from the tankbuster. This is when things start getting even funnier and they say "Dude, i'm a sprout" to which i answer "So am i" then, someone on our team said "I mean, you're level 70" and after him saying "i don't care about the game i only want the story", our teammate says "still..." to which they respond with "stop this harassment, i am getting annoyed", we keep talking and i ask them "how is that harassment?" and our teammate tells him that we just wanted to know if he knew his abilities.

Fast-forwarding, he ended up reporting us for "harassment", after saying "so much for the "nice community"".

It baffles me how someone is in Alphascape v2.0 without knowing any of the basic stuff, basically holding us, teammembers, hostage, carrying deadweight, and then have the audacity to say we're harassing them when we are ACTUALLY trying to HELP them.

I know what me and the teammember did isn't ban worthy, but knowing how funky SE's ban system is, i wouldn't be surprised if we did get banned for 2 questions.

I do have all the screenshots ready, just in case the ban hammer is swung at us.


EDIT: When i first heard on how some people were super sensitive in this game, i thought it was just a meme, a joke, or just a myth. It turns out these people do exist. It saddens me deeply that i was trying to help this person actually be better, only to get hit by their passive-aggressiveness and claims that i'm harassing them!

You need to do something extremely egregious or get a warranted warning a couple times before any sort of punishment is inflicted. I'm sure most of the GMs in this game do their best, but it's hard to actually figure out what's going on with just a chat log (nuance is almost non-existent in chat). My experience though is that they usually side with whoever complains first though.

You can be reported all he wants. If this is the whole story, nothing will happen.
I’m encourage good gameplay as well, it wouldn’t surprise me if I’ve ruffled some feathers. But I’ve never actually harassed anyone or broken rules. I’ve never seen any action on me in my entire adventuring career.

By the by, telling someone you’re reporting them is ACTUALLY considered harassment. So uh, good going on that guys part.

How do you know he reported you?

Whether we have the whole story or not, if nothing else really happened then there's no reason to worry. It's tanks like that though that make me feel better about myself since I'll be going Gunbreaker next month. I'm not a pro at tanking (yet) but I'm not an idiot either. I plan to do my absolute best.

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Originally Posted by Greven

How do you know he reported you?

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It's been a while, but iirc you get a notification in the upper right of the screen that a complaint was filed against you. Or maybe thats only if the GMs deemed it accurate. I can't remember.

To be fair, the amount of times someone says they are going to report you and nothing happens, it's just all hot air. Doesn't seem like OP did anything wrong, sure the tone of the words could be interpreted differently but the GMs would see the bigger picture, there are much worse things that deserve more attention when it comes to reports.

Yeah I definitely wouldn't worry about this. No insults were being hurled and the questions were relevant to the game.

What’s the point of this post?

You won’t get in trouble. You did nothing wrong. That is sad though. I’m guessing they jump potioned

I've had people threaten to report me for daring to try to explain basic job functions before. Nothing's ever come of it. Don't worry about it.

Most folks let folks like that just slide. Carrying them through because they're tired of sensitive players blowing up in their face. Thankfully most non-savage stuff only needs half the party to be competent

I would have just left after the first reply, without saying anything more.

It is not even remotely true, what Reinfeld said. I received a three day ban from an instance in Rabanastre of telling a cocky black mage that his corpse was doing 0 damage. He kept intentionally standing in circles, dying, then saying "Lol, worth it". I responded "Your corpse is doing 0 damage, so it wasn't worth it."

Three day ban. No warnings, no nothing.

The policy in this game is hurt feelings are banworthy, despite the fact that individual was effectively harassing the healers.

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Originally Posted by Gaealiege

It is not even remotely true, what Reinfeld said. I received a three day ban from an instance in Rabanastre of telling a cocky black mage that his corpse was doing 0 damage. He kept intentionally standing in circles, dying, then saying "Lol, worth it". I responded "Your corpse is doing 0 damage, so it wasn't worth it."

Three day ban. No warnings, no nothing.

The policy in this game is hurt feelings are banworthy, despite the fact that individual was effectively harassing the healers.

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Or the report ended up in the hands of GM who used irrational judgement. This is, of course, assuming that was all that was being said verbatim without anything else being left out (because that usually happens) and your hands wasn't caught in cookie jar while you were being investigated (which also tends to happen).

I've said more or less the same thing many times, told I was going to be reported. Nothing happened. Maybe they didn't do it. Maybe they did and if it did, then clearly the GM at the time rolled his eyes and thrashed the report.

If he was a true sprout he Probably spent 15 minutes trying to figure out how to report someone then gave up frustrated.

That's the entirety of the exchange. And yes, I received a 3 day ban for it for "violating the policy on harassment." Whether or not the GM used irrational judgement is of no consequence to the person being punished for hurting a troll's feelings.

I have no clue why there's such a charade on these forums pretending like the policy is otherwise. After I returned to the game, I mentioned it in my hunt linkshell and was greeted with people all giving their similar stories.

It's clear that the policy is to embolden and empower the troll and punish those aggravated by their behavior.

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Originally Posted by Vahlnir

Whether we have the whole story or not, if nothing else really happened then there's no reason to worry. It's tanks like that though that make me feel better about myself since I'll be going Gunbreaker next month. I'm not a pro at tanking (yet) but I'm not an idiot either. I plan to do my absolute best.

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good attitude I like that awesome

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Originally Posted by Gaealiege

That's the entirety of the exchange. And yes, I received a 3 day ban for it for "violating the policy on harassment." Whether or not the GM used irrational judgement is of no consequence to the person being punished for hurting a troll's feelings.

I have no clue why there's such a charade on these forums pretending like the policy is otherwise. After I returned to the game, I mentioned it in my hunt linkshell and was greeted with people all giving their similar stories.

It's clear that the policy is to embolden and empower the troll and punish those aggravated by their behavior.

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And yet, it fell exactly on a GMs judgement. That GM decided that you violated the rules even though there's clearly nothing else to suggest you did. It's an irrational judgement because the opposite of that would've been using clear judgement and thrash that person's report.

The rules may have changed but the people enforcing are the same as before. If it wasn't, like robots they would just auto-ban people solely based on reports without investigation and there'd be no one left playing the game.

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Originally Posted by Gaealiege

It is not even remotely true, what Reinfeld said. I received a three day ban from an instance in Rabanastre of telling a cocky black mage that his corpse was doing 0 damage. He kept intentionally standing in circles, dying, then saying "Lol, worth it". I responded "Your corpse is doing 0 damage, so it wasn't worth it."

Three day ban. No warnings, no nothing.

The policy in this game is hurt feelings are banworthy, despite the fact that individual was effectively harassing the healers.

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Well a big part of what I said was that my experience with GMs is that they side with whoever gets offended enough to file a report. I'd say my experience aligns pretty closely with yours.

I got a warning for talking back to 4 or 5 people in a WoD run who spent 40+ minutes haranguing me after causing a single wipe, then blaming me for every subsequent wipe that wasn't my fault. Then I don't remember if I got a warning or 24 hour suspension for calling someone a dumb n-word in the heat of the moment. The latter one I more or less deserved, but I didn't say anything particularly aggregious in that WoD run. It's just that the squeaky wheel gets the GM grease.

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Originally Posted by SenorPatty

Or the report ended up in the hands of GM who used irrational judgement. This is, of course, assuming that was all that was being said verbatim without anything else being left out (because that usually happens) and your hands wasn't caught in cookie jar while you were being investigated (which also tends to happen).

I've said more or less the same thing many times, told I was going to be reported. Nothing happened. Maybe they didn't do it. Maybe they did and if it did, then clearly the GM at the time rolled his eyes and thrashed the report.

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I wonder what's the GM hiring process. What quality check, if any, to find people who wont side with someone else because of race/class/play style. Because I've seen some ban worthy content and the players are still just as active as ever.

This has always been a worry of mine when dealing with people in game who treat the chat like a private discord. Especially in NN when I try to express that the NN is not the place to talk about your fetishes and said people claw back with "No fun allowed." If it's a vote kick against me for telling them they should please stop, then that strike is against me.

If someone tells you to leave them alone then you should leave them alone. If you don't like them in the group either kick them or leave yourself. As a sprout doing a raid for the first time you usually don't have time to worry about others and there is no need to enforce your playstyle on them.

Is it nice if they can tank swap if you made too many mistakes? Yes, but there is no need to.
Is it nice if they can cover you for a TB? Again yes but also you can clear the content without it.

You said that you are a sprout and he is also a sprout, but he isn't the one that is asking you to do all these things. You might be a better sprout than he is but that doesn't mean he has to be at your level.

You should've just backed off after he said he doesn't want to engage to talk with you, especially since you are ganging up on him with numbers.

Not saying you needed to carry him though, just kick or leave instead of harassing him. Yes it is harassment even though you said you were "asking" him if he knew his abilities, it can be interpreted as "Do you even know how to play?"

Welcome to 2019!

People threaten to report me but nothing has ever happened, before or after the ToS change.

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Originally Posted by SleepyNeko

If someone tells you to leave them alone then you should leave them alone. If you don't like them in the group either kick them or leave yourself. As a sprout doing a raid for the first time you usually don't have time to worry about others and there is no need to enforce your playstyle on them.

Is it nice if they can tank swap if you made too many mistakes? Yes, but there is no need to.
Is it nice if they can cover you for a TB? Again yes but also you can clear the content without it.

You said that you are a sprout and he is also a sprout, but he isn't the one that is asking you to do all these things. You might be a better sprout than he is but that doesn't mean he has to be at your level.

You should've just backed off after he said he doesn't want to engage to talk with you, especially since you are ganging up on him with numbers.

Not saying you needed to carry him though, just kick or leave instead of harassing him. Yes it is harassment even though you said you were "asking" him if he knew his abilities, it can be interpreted as "Do you even know how to play?"

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I couldn't disagree more if you can't do simple mechanics by lvl 70 you have no right to be mad if you get called out. If people just want the story and don't care about playing right they should go to YouTube and not expect others to put up with their bull

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Originally Posted by SleepyNeko

If someone tells you to leave them alone then you should leave them alone. If you don't like them in the group either kick them or leave yourself. As a sprout doing a raid for the first time you usually don't have time to worry about others and there is no need to enforce your playstyle on them.

Is it nice if they can tank swap if you made too many mistakes? Yes, but there is no need to.
Is it nice if they can cover you for a TB? Again yes but also you can clear the content without it.

You said that you are a sprout and he is also a sprout, but he isn't the one that is asking you to do all these things. You might be a better sprout than he is but that doesn't mean he has to be at your level.

You should've just backed off after he said he doesn't want to engage to talk with you, especially since you are ganging up on him with numbers.

Not saying you needed to carry him though, just kick or leave instead of harassing him. Yes it is harassment even though you said you were "asking" him if he knew his abilities, it can be interpreted as "Do you even know how to play?"

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As a healer, you need to ask questions and be able to adjust, so communicating with the tank is very valuable.
If the tank is new, you need to adjust to them and ensure that they live through, because you're the groups Mender,
what do you mean? If the tank don't even know how to play the dungeon, how is this something bad to do at all? This is ridiculous.

anybody in the world can report anybody else for anything...

that doesn't mean it's gonna take.

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Originally Posted by spf1200

I couldn't disagree more if you can't do simple mechanics by lvl 70 you have no right to be mad if you get called out. If people just want the story and don't care about playing right they should go to YouTube and not expect others to put up with their bull

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I'm not saying you have to put up with their Bull, you can just leave or kick them instead of verbally harassing them.

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Originally Posted by NebulaStarsong

As a healer, you need to ask questions and be able to adjust, so communicating with the tank is very valuable.
If the tank is new, you need to adjust to them and ensure that they live through, because you're the groups Mender,
what do you mean? If the tank don't even know how to play the dungeon, how is this something bad to do at all? This is ridiculous.

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Nothing wrong with asking questions and having a dialogue, however the tank doesn't want a dialogue so you either leave or kick or put up with it. Harassing the dude doesn't help anything.

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Originally Posted by whodis

"If i get 2 vulnerability stacks, swap with me"

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Don't worry about this. All content in the game can be tanked without tank stance; most of it comfortably, thus you can just slap on tank stance to make up for the vuln stacks, and slap on rampart if you're still hurting. You can double up on that by using self-heals if the healers are having trouble. Apply cooldowns and mitigations proportionate to the stack size, especially during a tankbuster.

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Originally Posted by whodis

i ask the OT if he knows how to cover a tankbuster, to which they respond "no".

Again, i'm fine with this, so i ask him another question: "Do you have any defense ability you can use on someone?"

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A lot of paladins I've encountered in dungeons, even low level ones, have used Cover effectively and creatively in appropriate situations. But it is nevertheless something you have to train yourself to do instinctively so that your first thought in that split second moment is Cover and not something else. It's not worth expecting a PUG paladin to have done that and pressuring them about it in casual content that is not high-end. If they cover you they do, otherwise they don't and you find your own solution until they do.

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Originally Posted by whodis

This is when things start getting even funnier and they say "Dude, i'm a sprout" to which i answer "So am i" then, someone on our team said "I mean, you're level 70" and after him saying "i don't care about the game i only want the story", our teammate says "still..." to which they respond with "stop this harassment, i am getting annoyed", we keep talking and i ask them "how is that harassment?" and our teammate tells him that we just wanted to know if he knew his abilities.

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They told everyone clearly they were just in it for the story and don't care for being a top-tier player. That was an excellent moment to accept that, drop it and leave them be. For people to persist with "still..." and "how is that harassment?" is just perpetuating the situation and unnecessarily adding fuel to a fire.

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Originally Posted by whodis

It baffles me how someone is in Alphascape v2.0 without knowing any of the basic stuff, basically holding us, teammembers, hostage, carrying deadweight, and then have the audacity to say we're harassing them when we are ACTUALLY trying to HELP them.

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You hardly need to know how to use Cover or Intervention to clear Alphascape v2.0 as the OT. The MT can handle the whole thing on their own, including the dragon.

In Stormblood every tank has a mitigation that uses their gauge which they can apply on a far more regular basis than other cooldowns: Sheltron, The Blackest Night and Inner Beast.

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Originally Posted by SleepyNeko

Not saying you needed to carry him though, just kick or leave instead of harassing him. Yes it is harassment even though you said you were "asking" him if he knew his abilities, it can be interpreted as "Do you even know how to play?"

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And that right there is the problem; that people with a mindset like yours get to be GMs. If someone wants to interpret even the most harmless question and/or statement as harassment, they obviously have every right to do so - what shouldn't happen though, is for said someone to be put in a position of power where they have to objectively assess the behaviour of other, random people.

If things really happened like OP said they did, then it's pretty clear to most of us who was actually harassing someone. Maybe, just maybe, if someone doesn't want to communicate and doesn't care about their performance and how it affects others because "muh story", they should stick to watching cutscenes on YouTube.

Also, what exactly does kicking them accomplish? They'll just be a burden to the next group a few minutes later, especially if they're a tank.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

They told everyone clearly they were just in it for the story and don't care for being a top-tier player. That was an excellent moment to accept that, drop it and leave them be.

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That's not the point. It was new content for OP as well and they simply wanted to make life as easy as possible for the healers/the group as a whole and decided to communicate accordingly. That's the kind of behaviour you want to see from a sprout, it doesn't have anything to do with enforcing optimal play or wanting someone else to be a top-tier player.

Welcome to FF14, where the playerbase is so coddled that you can't even breathe without offending someone and being reported for it.

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Originally Posted by whodis

EDIT: When i first heard on how some people were super sensitive in this game, i thought it was just a meme, a joke, or just a myth. It turns out these people do exist. It saddens me deeply that i was trying to help this person actually be better, only to get hit by their passive-aggressiveness and claims that i'm harassing them!

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https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/...F6CD16790.jpeg
I got a report for pointing out that Omega probably wasn't trans but clearly changed between sexes, and well, the fact that it was an android.
Luckily didn't get a ban, but it goes to say that people ARE sensitive nowadays and the new ToS doesn't help the ones that actually get reported due to petty reasons.

Luckily neither of us got banned, so I still have faith in the GMs, but yeah.

Im a sprout tank and make sprout mistakes. Some people are helpful with advice while others will do the "OmG OmG!! I dont mean to be a dick but its not rocket science." I apologize for my noobery and I blacklist that guy, problem solved.

It sounds like a little more happened than just '2 questions', but you unfortunately did end up in a dungeon with someone who was really just here for the story. Unless it was savage level content, I can't say that I really blame him all that much for getting irritated. When you go into the duty finder you roll the dice and can get all kinds of different people. From his point of view, he probably thought you were singling him out. It doesn't help that we don't get to have private conversations in dungeons (a massively, MASSIVELY bad design decision on the part of the devs). If we could have private conversations, things like this would be an issue less often because we wouldn't have to put everything in party or alliance chat.

It's hard to know whether or not you really were as polite as you're portraying here, since you did feel the need to come here and complain to begin with, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt. Sometimes when you offer unsolicited advice you run afoul of the ToS. Stick to helping people who ask for it.

The rest?

Well, you have an option to eject folks from a duty and SE has upheld time and again that 'differing playstyles' is a valid reason.

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Originally Posted by Derio

You won’t get in trouble. You did nothing wrong. That is sad though. I’m guessing they jump potioned

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OOOR OOOOOOOOOOOR He was just a bad player to begin with. Seriously, it's like everyone forgot that we had bad players before jump pots. Jump pots ARE NOT the reason for this. - headdesk-

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Originally Posted by aeoncs

And that right there is the problem; that people with a mindset like yours get to be GMs. If someone wants to interpret even the most harmless question and/or statement as harassment, they obviously have every right to do so - what shouldn\\'t happen though, is for said someone to be put in a position of power where they have to objectively assess the behaviour of other, random people.

If things really happened like OP said they did, then it\\'s pretty clear to most of us who was actually harassing someone. Maybe, just maybe, if someone doesn\\'t want to communicate and doesn\\'t care about their performance and how it affects others because "muh story", they should stick to watching cutscenes on YouTube.

Also, what exactly does kicking them accomplish? They\\'ll just be a burden to the next group a few minutes later, especially if they\\'re a tank.





That\\'s not the point. It was new content for OP as well and they simply wanted to make life as easy as possible for the healers/the group as a whole and decided to communicate accordingly. That\\'s the kind of behaviour you want to see from a sprout, it doesn\\'t have anything to do with enforcing optimal play or wanting someone else to be a top-tier player.

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Thanks for saying my mindset is a problem, I think that is already reportable in these forums but I will keep to the point of this thread.

The OT has the right to report someone for harassment when they are publicly shamed in the party when they have asked not to be harassed, my main point is that we are all free to do any of the actions stated in this thread.

The OT can report, but its not guaranteed that the gm will take his side.
The MT can give advice when asked not to, but there is no guarantee that he wont be reported.
The MT and his friend is the active contributor here, they are the one trying to initiate.

Noone has full context of the conversation other than the OPs one sided story, so my points are just a neutral stance regardless if what he said is true or false, even if what he is saying is 100% true, the OT can still report him for harassment because he told them to stop it.

I am not saying the gm should agree with the report but the OT has the right to report and the OP has no right to prevent the report.

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Originally Posted by SleepyNeko

Thanks for saying my mindset is a problem, I think that is already reportable in these forums but I will keep to the point of this thread.

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It's not a long as it stays civil.

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Originally Posted by SleepyNeko

The OT has the right to report someone for harassment when they are publicly shamed in the party when they have asked not to be harassed, my main point is that we are all free to do any of the actions stated in this thread.

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They have the right to use a system, but that doesn't mean they are using it correctly. From the dialogue given, there was no public shaming. No games were given on the forums to warrant "naming and shaming." There is no ToS infraction for asking someone to make use of their toolkit. It's actually a violation to create false reports.

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Originally Posted by SleepyNeko

The OT can report, but its not guaranteed that the gm will take his side.

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If there is no infraction, the report gets ignored.

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Originally Posted by SleepyNeko

The MT can give advice when asked not to, but there is no guarantee that he wont be reported.
The MT and his friend is the active contributor here, they are the one trying to initiate.

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Giving advise is not a reportable offense as long as it's civil.

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Originally Posted by SleepyNeko

Noone has full context of the conversation other than the OPs one sided story, so my points are just a neutral stance regardless if what he said is true or false, even if what he is saying is 100% true, the OT can still report him for harassment because he told them to stop it.

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Correct, as no one can physically stop OT from falsely reporting other players because they said something they didn't like, even if it was advise on how to use their class.

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Originally Posted by SleepyNeko

I am not saying the gm should agree with the report but the OT has the right to report and the OP has no right to prevent the report.

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Again, no one can stop the OT from reporting, but abuse of the report function is an actual infraction and violation of the ToS. This is a team game that requires co-operation; some people prefer to actually talk to and help their follow players instead of simply kicking them for 'difference of playstyle,' but given the response, it seems they should have just kicked and moved on.

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Originally Posted by Reinfeld

Well a big part of what I said was that my experience with GMs is that they side with whoever gets offended enough to file a report. I'd say my experience aligns pretty closely with yours.

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I can just agree with you as well. To add a little bit is that the first one who reports is usually the one that gets the upper hand. Just look at two siblings fighting while the mother is in another room.

Billy randomly says: "Moooom! Tom did (something!)" and the Tom immediately says: "No, I did not!". Mom will most likely yell back "Stop it Tom! Leave Billy alone!".

On the Guild Wars 2 forums, this was a common thing. My first infraction was unjustified, but since it has been removed, everyone was like "oooh! He posted something so bad that it got removed!". No, he just reported me for his feelings hurt. (This user's name is Fluffball by the way, married with children. Go figure getting whiny about a cynical comment of mine). I reported him back and got my post re-instated, but the thread locked. The psychologal reasoning behind such behaviour is strange to me but it happens literally everywhere where there is a tight corsett of "We are all niceeeee!" rules are enforced instead of having more room for freedom.

Two or three days ago I was in a very funny Castrum-Ultra-Long-Cutscene run and there was a naked, green-skinned Roe. Me and him joked and smalltalked and there was great banter until I figured out the others might report us - it was absolutely harmless or very abstract. But still I was a bit terrified about snowflakes might get hurt...

My best record so far: I've been banned for 3 days from the Guild Wars 2 forum because I told their former community representant that stories about her musical taste, about her cats and all that lofftopic nonsense do not belong in the game's devtracker (as everything Gaile Gray posted ended up there). Not because I flamed, not because I broke the rules. No, I offended the feelings of a so-called mature person and her derailing smalltalk. I offended her by not caring about her cats or that she likes "violine music". That's when I quitted GW2 and came here.

And this attitude spreads all over the internet. It's a feelgood-place, a help hotline for all the mentally ill instead of a healthy place where things are getting done!

The reports I filed apparently went nowhere here. I think reporting is not worth anything and I should move on after incidents like this. It was worth nothing in LoL either.

In short: GMs should infract far less for words and more for actual actions and read the full context instead of going "You should have kept quiet and report instead of raising your voice.

Sincerely,


https://imgur.com/kXOfaq9.png