Ya know, I really wasn't going to make a post. I know a lot of these already exist, and it's become a futile topic at this point, but I want to tack on my two cents after this experience.
I understand why there was a need for a timer. Sure, you don't want people flipping houses or whatever, but this is beyond asinine. Over the last four days me and some FC members have spent over 36 hours sitting outside empty plots, clicking placards. These timers are going WELL into the night, like 6am EACH at least. We have jobs and lives. We can't sit here and click a placard until hell freezes over.
3 houses were lost to just sheer inability to stay up all night, coupled with people relocating and reset timers completely. But the straw that broke the camels back is this house just now. This house was up for almost TWENTY FOUR(24) HOURS! Our FC member stayed up literally ALL night for this nice. We wake up, and it's STILL up. So we click click click, and OH WHATS THIS!? SOME ONE WHO SHOWED UP 5 MINUTES AGO GOT THE HOUSE!? AND IT'S FOR PERSONAL USE!? WOOOOW FANTASTIC!
You can call me spoiled or say I'm being unreasonable or anything you want. But that is just NOT right. These RNG timers are absolutely hot garbage and I would really like to see them fixed. Much sooner than later.
#EndRant
Random Timer is a big problem
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01-23-2019, 05:32 AMAndromedyRandom Timer is a big problem
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01-23-2019, 06:38 AMDrWho2010
you need enough money to be able to buy two houses - buy a crap one and then to transfer.
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01-23-2019, 07:11 AMJillianThis is the best advice you are going to get. The RNG timers suck, but I doubt SE is going to change the way it works. Try to buy a small, less desirable plot in Goblet. This seems to be the least popular housing area and it will probably be easier to snag a house here as opposed to the other housing areas. I think some of the plots go for less than 3mil, which is easy enough to get. This way, when a plot opens up that you do want, you will be able to transfer your FC house right away.Quote:
Originally Posted by DrWho2010
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01-23-2019, 08:10 AMMizAraiQuote:
Originally Posted by DrWho2010
He's on Leviathan, so he's probably trying to buy the crap house now (seems like they're trying to buy anything they find available) and running into this problem.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jillian
Telling people to just buy any house that's available on a populated server (where the only available houses are going to be behind the timer) is bad advice. Lots of them (like OP) are already doing that. The timers are ridiculous. I understand why they put them in, though I feel like they weren't needed. It didn't stop flippers like they wanted, it just cut out who can buy flipped houses. All it seems to have done is created plenty of problems for people trying to buy their first house. -
01-23-2019, 08:25 AMJillianThe timer system sucks and the entire housing system is unfair. I also never said the advice was good; I just said it was the best he was going to get. Unfortunately, there is not much else the OP can do unless SE finds a way to fix the crappy housing situation. I don't think the OP is being unreasonable nor do I think he is spoiled. I have friends that are unable to purchase housing so I sympathize with him. It is my hope that SE finds a way to fix the housing situation so that everybody who wants a house is able to purchase one. I do not think housing should be a limited commodity.Quote:
Originally Posted by MizArai
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01-23-2019, 09:25 AMMizAraiI was trying to point out that it's not helpful advice, as he was already doing what he was being told to do. The last housing census for Leviathan shows 2 smalls available in the Goblet. I'm sure he and his FC mates were just seeing anything available and camping the placard, especially since he said they tried this at a few houses. He came here hoping to bring attention to how much the current RNG timer system hurts the player population.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jillian
I'm honestly very glad that I got my personal house before the timer. When I was trying to get an FC house for my alt's FC (formed with some irl friends who play sporadically), the timer was a huge pain. It took a few days before I was able to actually catch a plot that I didn't end up losing to someone else. I would have given up on having a house if I kept losing the placard clicking mini-game back when I was new. And since housing was one of 2 reasons I started playing the game (eternal bonding was the other), I would have quit. While the timers were nice in theory, it hasn't helped with the intended problem, and has only made it harder for players to get their first house.
And I bolded part of the quote, 'cause I totally agree with it!!!! I would LOVE for SE to figure out a way for every FC & character to be able to purchase a house if they want (new instanced housing, expandable apartments, I don't know what other options might be, but I'm totally open to other ideas). Keep the ward system we currently have as a more glamour type housing for people who prefer it, but please give us another option so everyone can have a house! -
01-23-2019, 12:45 PMAndromedy
This is my point in it's entirety. Leviathan is very busy. There is not a lot of housing, and each placard I've been sitting at has at least 5-10 people clicking it until the late hours of the night.
We are trying to get an FC house. The past 4 days, there have been 6 plots available.
The first was relocated to. The plot that left behind was then relocated to as well. The plot THAT let behind didnt pop till 6am. The next was in the goblet, and didnt pop till 2am in which we lost again. The census you are speaking of there were 2 smalls available last night. One was won by a guy with a macro who didn't even know he won the house until 2 hours later. The second plot went from 2pm to 10:30 AM the next day, and was won by a person who showed up 5 minutes prior.
Another plot opened up today in the mist only to be relocated by, get this, the man who was botting the house last night.
These houses are pretty integral to an FC. Not only do you get a personalized space for the whole of your FC to hang out and relax, but you also get the access to personalized rooms, and the company workshop. So much so that we chose to merge our two FC's the other night just to have a better chance at getting a house. Fight together not against.
I don't find one single reason a player should have a personal *House* in this game. They server no functional purpose other than to be a spot for an RP experience or to be a hermit(or like a garden... lmao) Especially a single player owning a mansion. Like what are you doing with all that space lol.
Houses could very easily be made for FC only, as they are again, and integral part of the growth of an FC. They could spruce up apartments ten fold to let players who want a personal experience have this.
Even if that isn't an option, I would very much like to see something done here. It's an increasingly frustrating project to sit and click 15+ hours on a house just to lose to an RNG timer. D:< -
01-23-2019, 03:26 PMBeckett
I wonder why so many people are bothering to relocate to Smalls. I could understand a few choice locations being snatched up, but for every Small plot you camp to be Relocated to by someone seems weird.
Housing originally was FC-only, and in fact we were promised the individual player housing would be completely separate from FC housing. But then they completely went back on that and all of our housing issues have stemmed from that mistake. Unfortunately, this is the way things are now and they're never going to change the current housing system back to FC-only.Quote:
Originally Posted by Andromedy
The best solution I can think of that fits within the current system is to grant every FC a Workshop, regardless of whether they have a house. Put the entrance to it in each city's Grand Company area, or let FC's buy a Workshop in the Apartment buildings. That still leaves out (cross-breed) gardening and chocobo stables, but at least it'd put a major dent in the FC inequality. -
01-23-2019, 06:15 PMLambdafishThis is the system by design, to prevent people from doing exactly what your FC member did. Imagine if your FC member was a house flipper, if the system was the way it used to be, they would be able to camp the spot (like they did) and hold the house hostage for money. Now its a psuedo lottery, in that the house randomly becomes available and the first one to get it gets it, which is what happened and your FC member lost.Quote:
Originally Posted by Andromedy
Limited housing is the big problem, not the random timer. You might as well be saying that primal dogs are a big problem because yours took 85 runs to get, and a random got theirs on the 3rd run. -
01-23-2019, 06:43 PMAndromedy
The random timer is just as big of an issue as the limited housing. Even more so than just base limited housing. The sheer fact that it is random can be looked past for the sake of the games state and how people used to treat property flipping. The major issue is the timer LENGTH. On top of the housing being limited, I have not had one timer yet that has been under 12 hours. In my previous point, not everyone can stay up ungodly hours to camp a housing placard. What about people who are only able to play a few hours a day but want a house or to start an FC? You're limiting the already existing limitations, which causes a problem.
Comparing apples to oranges to to be a devils advocate isn't going to fix a situation. If I spent hours farming and 87 runs of an extreme and didn't get a dog, I didn't waste my time. I still got something in the form of totems, or hell even a potential boss drop and some gear. On the contrary, if I spend 6 hours clicking a sign for someone to walk up and either get PogChamp lucky or relocate, I get absolutely NOTHING and have completely wasted an entire 6 hours.
Limited housing, with limited RNG, made even more limited by people who relocate their house because "this is 2 inches closer to the MB" make the housing in this game an absolute nightmare. And that doesn't even stop people from flipping ANYWAY. Because once you HAVE a house, anyone cause sell their plot and just have you relocate. Hell, people even sell FC's just for because they have a house.
The system needs looked at and adjusted. Black/white, cut and dry. Either making workshops not limited to having house. Instancing FC housing. FC only wards. Something. /shrug -
01-24-2019, 02:38 AMBrynneI've been saying this for ages now. I don't understand why you can't get a FC workshop outside of a house when housing is such a limited commodity. I also think they should add an instanced gardening area for apartment owners. Just those two things might even free up some plots, because I know there are dummy FCs created just to access more airships and submarines. They'd probably release their plots if they could do this from somewhere else. It wouldn't solve the core issue, but it would at least help to ease things up a bit.Quote:
Originally Posted by Beckett
The random timer, its length, and the competition with other campers are all symptoms of the limited housing system. The random timer wouldn't even be a thing if housing were unlimited, but aside from that, if there is enough housing to meet demand, you don't even really notice the timer unless you want a specific popular plot, and then you'd follow the advice in the first response and scoop up an available plot to transfer instantly when the one you want opens up. This is basically how it is on some of the lower population servers.Quote:
Originally Posted by Andromedy
It'd be nice if SE treated some of the more bothersome symptoms (and I think what your FC is experiencing is one of the worst things about the housing situation), but they really need to start addressing the core issue. I'm also hoping against hope that the Ishgard housing will be instanced and unlimited, and pave the way for more of that going forward. -
01-24-2019, 03:46 AMAndromedyI just honestly see no reason a random house timer has to go 15+ hours. For like the 10th time, people have jobs, school, and other activities. The only way to guarantee you'll at least see the house bought is by spending your entire day clicking these signs. Every house I've been too have gone well into the night, even midday the next day.Quote:
Originally Posted by Brynne
The second problem is being on Leviathan, every house that pops, no matter the location or time of day, has at least 4 people at it. People are even botting these signs. For instance, the sign I was just at. I stayed up all night from about 7pm to 10am this morning only to lose the house to a girl botting. It's been an hour past and she's still clicking the sign lol.
It is absolutely maddening the way this system works. :^) -
01-24-2019, 06:12 AMAriesMouse
I'd suggest reading/bumping this tread (Housing-Purchase-Timer-Alternative-Idea ), since it is basically on the same topic, and has a lot of talking points that might be insightful. Also, just seems easier than repeating myself, since what I've said in that thread are what I'd say in this one, i.e., if we're going to be stuck with a random timer, they might as well just make buying a house a literal lottery that people apply for, and then they can resume playing the game.
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01-24-2019, 01:10 PMMikkiTHIS.Quote:
Originally Posted by MizArai
If you go to ...certain sites, you'll find that flipping houses is very much still alive and the only thing that has changed is the fact that now you have to either have a home already to relocate OR you have to be willing to buy it as an FC home. It doesn't stop the flippers at all, just makes it a lot more difficult for people who are trying to get their first house in a legit manner.
And honestly, most flippers I see aren't even that bad anymore. I remember when I saw people trying to sell smalls for 100 million. Now it's more like 10 million. Yeah, that's still a huge markup but it's calmed down a lot and I feel like it will drop even further if they actually release that Ishgard housing they seemed to be teasing. I do wonder if SE is hesitant to add more wards because they want to add more housing areas in general.... hm. In any case, if they add another housing area that will add a lot more supply and the prices should drop once again. THAT BEING SAID, I think that allowing only one house per server per service account has really helped cut down on the people who are buying houses only to flip them, which leaves mostly people who are just trying to get their money back on housing they won't use anymore.
I think the timers are more harmful than helpful. If anything, I think they should retain the timer in the sense that you can't drop ownership and immediately a new buyer can swoop in. However, the time in which it becomes available again should be random but clear. For example, I think when you drop the house ownership it can go on a timer of 12 hours, 24 hours or 36 hours. The fact that you can't just instantly transfer into the new house makes it more risky for people buying from flippers. Secondly, the fact that it's random to some degree means that you can't plan - for example, you can't ditch the house at a certain time and say "Okay well I dropped the house at 3am so it will be up in 24 hours. 3am is a dead time so no one will be on." The huge variance in possible times means that if you drop at 3am, it could be available at 9am, 3pm or 3am. ADDITIONALLY, the placard should tell you exactly when it will be available. This means that there is at minimum 12 hours in which someone else can notice that the house is free and check to see when it's up again. This gives other people a chance, without them having to wait ridiculous hours checking every few seconds.
They could possibly add some randomness to it, as in "the house will be available for purchase some time between 3pm - 5pm" with it being possible to be unlocked in increments of 10 minutes.
I think there's a middle ground here somewhere that could make it more fair and friendly to people trying to get a new house while also discouraging flipping. -
01-26-2019, 12:29 AMAndromedy
I'm just going to bump this by saying, I have lost 5 houses now due to people using macro's to click the sign for them. All 5 have sat there for hours clicking the sign before they realize they've somehow won. This system of "random" timers does nothing but promote botting, and nobody seems to want to do anything about it.
It's increasingly frustrating that I sit up all night clicking a sign just for someone asleep in their bed to win a house. zzz -
01-26-2019, 08:14 AMAriesMouse
I still vote that if they are going to insist on keeping this system, they should just make it a true lottery, with some checks and balances, and let people get back to actually playing the game while the timer ticks.
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01-26-2019, 08:50 AMTalacocheta
They need to remove the random timer and they need to put in more housing. It's surprising that so few people on each world actually get to own a home, which is one of the selling points - and big draws - of FFXIV. Imagine how many more people would be happy if they increased the number of wards.
And they could totally put in FC-only wards on top of that. It's not a bad thing to let more players who want housing to be able to enjoy owning a home. -
01-26-2019, 09:04 AMAriesMouseI've personally always felt that with how the wards are made, the subdivision should have been personal housing while the main area was FC only, or something to that effect.Quote:
Originally Posted by Talacocheta
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01-26-2019, 05:08 PMAndromedyI like that idea, but even then I don't really see a reason why FC's at all should have to fight for something integral. Revelation has entire instanced guild areas that you were able to build and level through efforts of guild members. All while being nearly as big as the Ruby Sea map itself almost. It was a wonderful system and area to hang out. I don't see why they couldn't do something even remotely similar in this game. Or at the very least like someone earlier said, make the FC workshops not linked to housing.Quote:
Originally Posted by AriesMouse
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01-26-2019, 07:01 PMAriesMouseThe problem is, it is far too easy for people to make shell FCs to get housing that is more or less a personal house, just with the added bonus of being able to attach a workshop to it. =\Quote:
Originally Posted by Andromedy