[4.5 Discussion] The Flames of war in 4.5

So last live letter showed us the upcoming story dungeon in 4.5 and some 4.5 scenario story screenshots which revealed several things...


1) Looks like Alphninaud and Maxima (along with the other Garlean survivors) made it back to meet Alisaie so they will most likely be staying with WoL group for 5.0 since now they need a new plan to reach the captial city of Garlean Empire.

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/a...360195&thumb=1

2) That battlefield will be our 4.5 Story Dungeon and thus we will see the events from the 5.0 Teaser trailer (which was only half the Full trailer just like the 4.0 trailer with the other half once the full trailer released to show the newer content area for 5.X era)

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/a...360284&thumb=1

So how do you think the events of 4.5 may play out now we know events from the 5.0 Teaser trailer is happening next month?

I speculate that there will be another two-pronged attack, with the Eorzean Alliance probably occupying Amh Araeng which I think will be in western Ilsabard (and possibly the sight of Bozja Citadel), and the new Othardian Alliance going through Nagxia, Dalmasca, and in to the Rak'Tika Greatwood.

We'll be forming ties with local resistance cells and the Populares. We'll probably be taking castrums one by one leading up to a final attack on Garlemald itself, ousting the Ascians and establishing the Populares as a new anti-imperialist government.

I think that ultimately Varis might give in to pressures by the Ascians and end up transforming in to a primal or something. Despite hating Ascians and Primals he's definitely not one of the Populares so I don't think he'll be an ally in the end.

I bet it's going to start out as us trying to meet up with Alphinaud in Southern Isabard... and then Elidibus shows up in Zenos' body and everything goes to hell.

Its so bizarre the way everyone has been reading this trailer and the new slides. Its clear to me that the Garleans aren't going to lose horribly but instead are going to preform a massive counter attack that rolls up the Eorezean alliance all the way back to the shroud. That Varis will be removed from power and eldibus will deploy the black rose on the domans and ala mhigans, retaking all the ground they lost.

The garleans will, in one patch, undo everything we have accomplished over the course of the entirety of Stormblood and that will set the stakes.

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Originally Posted by ObsidianFire

and then Elidibus shows up in Zenos' body and everything goes to hell.

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So what im picturing is Elidinos showing up and trashing... something. I dont have the whole picture sketched out in my head yet. But Elidinos is wrecking the joint. Then Elezenos shows up so he can fight his former body with its new host - the ultimate hunt! Que Shinryu-Omega style fight sequence. The ensuing destruction creates an opening in "Solus's Wall" or whatever is supposed to keep us out of the empire.

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Originally Posted by Xie_Belvoule

Its so bizarre the way everyone has been reading this trailer and the new slides. ...

The garleans will, in one patch, undo everything we have accomplished over the course of the entirety of Stormblood and that will set the stakes.

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Based on the quests and gathering / crafting materials that would become inaccessible if the Eorzeans and Othardians were pushed out of Gyr Abania and Yanxia, I don't think that's going to happen. It might, but so many important things being locked away after having access to them is pretty unprecedented for the game, never mind the genre. It's possible for sure, but the only area to be locked from player access was the Rising Stones during the first half of Heavensward... which, while sentimentally significant, has nothing of objective value.

I still think it's too early to make any sort of sound prediction on what's going to happen. I need more than a couple screenshots and knowledge the Ghimlyt Dark (a war zone) is going to be the 4.50 MSQ dungeon to make anything resembling an accurate prediction. (I actually prefer it that way; everything being predictable gets really boring.)

One think that I find weird is that, the way the trailer presents it, the fight against Zenos seems like this epic duel between rivals. If this was the real Zenos, I think it would fit. But Elidibus? IIRC the Warrior of Light only met him once in Thanalan. And even we, the players, barely know anything about him. I'm kinda hoping that Elezenos shows up and takes his body back before the climatic battle.

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Originally Posted by Xie_Belvoule

Its so bizarre the way everyone has been reading this trailer and the new slides. Its clear to me that the Garleans aren't going to lose horribly but instead are going to preform a massive counter attack that rolls up the Eorezean alliance all the way back to the shroud. That Varis will be removed from power and eldibus will deploy the black rose on the domans and ala mhigans, retaking all the ground they lost.

The garleans will, in one patch, undo everything we have accomplished over the course of the entirety of Stormblood and that will set the stakes.

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Damn I'd love that. Not actually conquer back regained territories, but most likely unleash something like Black Rose in a sulky dick-move like "eh you fought for this, then have it but we'll kill you anyway".
I think we need something big and hard coming from Garlemald to strengthen the oppositions from within Garlemald.

First of all, I wouldn't be so sure that Alphinaud and Shadowhunter will be coming back to Eorzea just yet. Remember, Maxima was not present with them in the scenes at the end of 4.4. It's entirely possible Alphinaud requested Maxima to relay their discoveries to the Scions while he continues his work, whatever that may be at this point. As far as the fight against Garlemald goes, I have suspected that they've been waiting to try to spring something. I did believe that they had simply allowed Ala Mhigo to be liberated so they could lull the Alliance and Resistance into a false sense of victory before crushing them. That may still be Zenobus's plan perhaps, though how it leads to Ghimlyt Dark (and where precisely that is) I'm not yet sure. And what of the Eighth Calamity, and the oncoming Flood of Light? If Garlemald succeeds in bringing about a Calamity, how then does this trigger the coming of the Flood? So many variables to account for, despite the information we have to work with. EleZenos is also still a wild card that could derail things for either side.

Also, outlandish and improbable "theory" time: EleZenos obtains a katana embedded with a sacred Othardian jewel, imbued with tremendous aether, which becomes the focus to allow him to use his resonant powers to summon and inhabit the form of kami primal Amaterasu. Being a god of sun, this could tie into the whole light being the enemy thing. Unlikely, I know, but then we did get Susano and Tsukuyomi already... Why leave out the third of that trio of deities?

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Originally Posted by Xie_Belvoule

Its so bizarre the way everyone has been reading this trailer and the new slides. Its clear to me that the Garleans aren't going to lose horribly but instead are going to preform a massive counter attack that rolls up the Eorezean alliance all the way back to the shroud. That Varis will be removed from power and eldibus will deploy the black rose on the domans and ala mhigans, retaking all the ground they lost.

The garleans will, in one patch, undo everything we have accomplished over the course of the entirety of Stormblood and that will set the stakes.

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But isn't us having "no fight left to fight" (as the gremlin put it) one of the problems we are supposedly going to have? If Garleans pushed back hard on us, then that would not be the case.

I'm expecting Garleans to try and launch a large scale counter attack on us, Ghimlyt Dark being the stage of that conflict, resulting in countless deaths on both sides (possibly because of the Black Rose).

The artwork for Ghimlyt Dark has a single character on it who I assume to be our character, arriving at the scene of utter devastation. Throughout the dungeon I could see us fighting stragglers. magitec, and then Zenos 2.0 as the final boss.

If you watch the trailer, the scene leading up to WoL and Zenos about to fight shows battlefield with a bunch of burning flags, amongst which is Garlemald's imperial flag. This to me means at some point in 5.0 we ally with Garlemald and all nations fight together against some other external force or faction and all are decimated, or the Eorzen/Othardian Alliances fight against Garlemald and all are mutually destroyed.

https://youtu.be/i4QPcqPhu1k?t=40
Go to 40s, you see the flags of the Immortal Flames, Twin Adders, The Maelstrom, as well as Ishgard's Temple Knight flag, and Ala Mhigo's purple flag (I don't see Doma's but perhaps they're fighting with Ala Mhigans) then the white Gearlean imperial flag, amongst the burning piles.

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Originally Posted by Jonnycbad

If you watch the trailer, the scene leading up to WoL and Zenos about to fight shows battlefield with a bunch of burning flags, amongst which is Garlemald's imperial flag. This to me means at some point in 5.0 we ally with Garlemald and all nations fight together against some other external force or faction and all are decimated, or the Eorzen/Othardian Alliances fight against Garlemald and all are mutually destroyed.

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On the other hand, the primary shot of the banners shows all the (standing) Eorzean and Doman banners together - and then pans to Garlemald's alone. I don't think it's an alliance.

I hope Maxima can be my 5.0 husbando once we split with Hien.

A new evil force to fight seems too out of the blue for me. Although we gather than Garlemald itself is not that unified under the "bad people" label, the fact that we learnt the empire is built out of Ascian trickery is enough of a problem.
For me the Ghimlyt Dark will be a battlefield against Garlemald. Now the trailer seems keen to make us believ that this fight leads into the "big thing" that is 5.0. But we still have two parts for 4.5 right? What could possibly be the scenario for 4.55 if we already have fucked it all up before? I'm curious.

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Originally Posted by Mansion

What could possibly be the scenario for 4.55 if we already have fucked it all up before? I'm curious.

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It could be the 4.50 ends with possibly-triumphant possibly-forced "defeating Elidibus" and then 4.55 will be when we see just what a bad idea that was....

Taking the Shadowbringers teaser as literally as I can, I'm thinking we get a big fight with Eorzea vs Garlemald, they pull something that wipes the whole world or we go too far and bring on the flood of light, and somehow we go back in time to fix it. For becoming a "Warrior of Darkness", I'm guessing we drop the Blessing of Light again (maybe permanently), purposely weaken Hydaelyn, and/or maybe even summon our own primal (more dragon please).

So for 4.5, I guess we'd get the big battle with Garlemald, then 4.55 would give us the light nuke and us going back in time, leading into 5.0 where we have to weaken the light while finding another way to deal with the Ascians and the Empire. Maybe we'll get the final goal being to destroy both Hydaelyn and Zodiark, since the light and dark balance is such an integral part of the world that one triumphing over the other causes disaster either way.

Or that guess is horrendously off. :P

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Originally Posted by Iscah

It could be the 4.50 ends with possibly-triumphant possibly-forced "defeating Elidibus" and then 4.55 will be when we see just what a bad idea that was....

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Hmmm. Or the big thing is the 4.5 cliffhanger (then we ignore it and go play Blue Mage for a few months), and 4.55 identifies "how and where to solve this", foreshadowing the next expansion area/big goal (more precise than become Warrior of Darkness and take down the Empire, as presented in the Fanfest)

This new "Calamity" could arrive not immediatly after we defeat the Empire or Elidibus, or whatever battle serves as a catalyst. It could be like the Meteor, where the players defeat Nael, and are just told that it didn't work and Dalamud is still falling. Maybe we think we won in 4.5, but something wrong starts happening that WoL doesn't notice, and in 4.55 we see the full consequences of that, culminating in some end of the world scenario.

Then, maybe, we get told that we have to go back to the past, and the patch ends with us going back to fix stuff, but then are told to wait a bit more in the past before we start changing stuff. I mean, they can't just erase the world and leave us with no world to play in while we wait for Shadowbringers. It could be just as before Heavensward, when we are told to just wait with Haurchefant a little until we get permission to enter Ishgard.

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Originally Posted by TheHeavenAbyss

Then, maybe, we get told that we have to go back to the past, and the patch ends with us going back to fix stuff, but then are told to wait a bit more in the past before we start changing stuff.

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I REALLY don't want any time travel thing. That's 90% of the time an awkward make up for ways to resolve plot-holes. I'm more on the side of fucking things up big, but yeah the "Calamity" is not instant, see the world collapse further and further, but we would still be able to sort things out, and that would be the point of 5.0.

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Originally Posted by Mansion

I REALLY don't want any time travel thing. That's 90% of the time an awkward make up for ways to resolve plot-holes. I'm more on the side of fucking things up big, but yeah the "Calamity" is not instant, see the world collapse further and further, but we would still be able to sort things out, and that would be the point of 5.0.

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Actually, I agree. Time travel is a plot that I really tend to dislike, not only because it is a way to resolve plot-holes but because, most of the time, it actually ends up creating a lot more plot-holes than it resolves. That being said, I believe we might be getting some time travel stuff, considering the whole "if history must be unwritten, let it be unwritten".

They could do a plot whereby the world was doomed when Lousioux saved us from Bahamut by sending us forward in time. Had he not done that, the Ascians would have succeeded but the world would be balanced. By us surviving and doing our WoL crap, we actually doomed the world to an even worse calamity (good job breaking it, hero)

https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.p...BreakingItHero

The one big problem I see with having a Time-Travel plot as part of the MSQ in 5.0 is that we already got a classic Time-Travel plot in 3.0 with Alexander. It feels way too soon to have another one.

The implications are also a bit weird... what would be so bad that Alexander decided that writing time again would be a good idea? Or you know... the plot hole of not going to see if Dyne and Myde have any advice on how not to break a timeline... Yeah, I'd feel very weird if we ever had a Time-Travel plot in FFXIV going forwards and everyone pretended Alexander wasn't a thing.

Yeah but Alex was a side-story so it doesn't really count.

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Originally Posted by Jollyy5

and then Zenos 2.0 as the final boss.

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Noooo...

NOOOOOOOO...

They already trolled us once by making the invincible Zenos into a squishie dungeon boss. Don't do this to us again!!!

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Originally Posted by TheHeavenAbyss

Actually, I agree. Time travel is a plot that I really tend to dislike, not only because it is a way to resolve plot-holes but because, most of the time, it actually ends up creating a lot more plot-holes than it resolves. That being said, I believe we might be getting some time travel stuff, considering the whole "if history must be unwritten, let it be unwritten".

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I think the Alexander storyline showed the devs can handle a time travel plotline without leaving a bunch of plot holes. That story resulted in a nice, tidy time loop; nothing happened that was later undone, the timeline wasn't "changed", etc, etc.

To be fair, though, I agree that if the warning we're receiving is from a "bad future" which we now need to change, that is NOT pointing at a nice, tidy time-loop. It WOULD indicate time travel being used to change fate, not being used to fulfill it. Also thanks to the Alexander storyline, we know that alternate timelines DO exist (the Primal observed many before settling on the one that made up the storyline), so this is possible. Still, I'm cautiously optimistic that they can pull it off.

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Originally Posted by ObsidianFire

Yeah, I'd feel very weird if we ever had a Time-Travel plot in FFXIV going forwards and everyone pretended Alexander wasn't a thing.

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Well, effectively, Alexander ISN'T a thing. He's permanently sealed away, now, and even if we had the means to unseal him, I doubt anyone would be keen on the idea since everyone is in perfect agreement with the Primal that he's just too dangerous a being to allow to be active, even if he's not malevolent. Any further time travel shenanigans will take part without Alexander's influence. He was probably aware that further time travel antics were in the works, since he observed multiple possible futures before being sealed away, but still decided that the current timeline was the best he could arrange. That doesn't mean that it's a PERFECT timeline, just the best he could manage. (And its primary metric of "goodness" is that it doesn't have Alexander stomping around and sucking all the aether out of everything.)

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Originally Posted by LineageRazor

I think the Alexander storyline showed the devs can handle a time travel plotline without leaving a bunch of plot holes. That story resulted in a nice, tidy time loop; nothing happened that was later undone, the timeline wasn't "changed", etc, etc.

To be fair, though, I agree that if the warning we're receiving is from a "bad future" which we now need to change, that is NOT pointing at a nice, tidy time-loop. It WOULD indicate time travel being used to change fate, not being used to fulfill it. Also thanks to the Alexander storyline, we know that alternate timelines DO exist (the Primal observed many before settling on the one that made up the storyline), so this is possible. Still, I'm cautiously optimistic that they can pull it off.

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Well, I'm not entirely pessimistic, because I know that FFXIV in general tends to explain stuff in a satisfactory manner, at least to me, and a lot of care goes into how the world works, I was just saying that I don't like time travel in general and would prefer if they didn't do it.

The thing is the Alexander storyline was something relatively small and self-contained, so I think it was easier to pull off. But, if Shadowbringers manages to make the time travel simple and to the point and out of our control (as in we don't choose when we are sent to, because that would raise a lot of questions of "well, we should just go to this time to avoid this and warn about this"), in a consistent way (and not going full time patrol like in FFXIII-2), I'm okay with it. Still not a fan of time travel in general, but I can dig it if it's used in a contained way.

Called it...

“War looms once again. Scarcely has Ala Mhigo taken its first breath of freedom when the Empire reaches out with ironclad fingers to reclaim the bloodied nation. “

I was right, massive Garlean counter attack. I also predict they will deploy the black rose.

The closer we get to 4.5, the more I'm getting the impression that, in order to pull off a time-skip sort of scenario (as the Shadowbringer's trailer would imply), we'll complete Ghimlyt Dark and whatever else happens in 4.55, followed by "resetting" the timeline to just before the climax of 4.55 until Shadowbringers eventually drops. I'm not saying that this will be due to any sort of time traveling shenanigans, just your standard New-Game+ or postgame system from other games that let you continue exploring the world or playing the game after you've finished. The Witcher 3 comes to mind, as after the end of that game you're essentially dropped back in to the world just before all of the craziness of the final chapter happens. Same goes for the first two inFamous games, or really most open-world games with a NG+ or postgame feature.

This way, no matter what happens at the conclusion of Stormblood, we won't be locked out of certain areas or be prevented from doing certain quests or tasks based on the events of the story.

Isn't it kinda hinted time is already chaning, 'The Caller' has already interfered with the present day by calling the Scions and warning us of the twin dooms, in the original timeline that we were never part of, this wouldnt have happened.

I have a few thoughts here, separated by section!

The Dungeon:
I agree with the premise that the Ghimlyt Dark is going to be the site of a critical battle between the Eorzean Alliance and Garlemald. That's more or less confirmed by the dungeon description, and by the fact that most of the enemies seen appear to be Garlean soldiers and machina. Using dungeons to simulate big battles is more popular in Stormblood than it had been in the past. It would make sense for a climactic final dungeon of the patch cycle, and be a good setup for the next expansion. It's also going to be the Empire's counterattack. I personally predict that both sides will be devastated, more than likely by the Black Rose since it was brought up again last patch. This could leave the Alliance in an extremely precarious position, their army gone/exhausted, and The Empire having plenty of legions to replace the ones they'll lose.

The Caller
I get the temptation to think that the caller is from the future given how he mentioned the word 'future' but at the same time there's a bit more of a logical explanation. The fact that he speaks of twin fates and not making the same mistakes he did relates very closely to Arbert, the 'Warrior of Darkness' who doomed his plane to a Flood of Light thanks to recklessly fighting primals. If it's him, there are most certainly twin fates to avert, the end of the prime plane world and his, and it avoids all of the very difficult to deal with time travel shenanigans. And given that a flood of light appears to be the existential danger of Shadowbringers, and the Warrior of Light having to become the Warrior of Darkness...well, it just lines up nicely now doesn't it?

New Game + and Conquering:
I don't see us losing all of Ala Migho or timeskipping to something crazy different. If the counterattack takes anything it would maybe be Ala Migho city, but otherwise those areas are still needed for crafting and gathering quests, class storylines, and a bevy of other things. And if they did a timeskip, what would they do, dump players post story into a totally different server? Just ignore the massive changes? I think it's best for people to temper their expectations a little.

But what do I know? These are my just my own personal thoughts and predictions. I could be right, or totally wrong. Either way I'm definitely looking forward to seeing where things go!

(And in the 4.5 cliffhanger we discover that it is all Time Compression stuff orchestrated by Ultimecia. That's why we are getting a gunblade!)

I would actually not mind if 5.0 brought devastation on lands we have known, and that this NG+ feature would allow us to "jump back in time" to complete quests that would not be available anymore... It could bring strong immersion. But that would be colossal work.

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Originally Posted by Mansion

I would actually not mind if 5.0 brought devastation on lands we have known, and that this NG+ feature would allow us to "jump back in time" to complete quests that would not be available anymore... It could bring strong immersion. But that would be colossal work.

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I agree that would be cool! But that's also kind of an entire expansion worth of content. I would not be opposed to another expansion set in the City-States that we have come to know and love, or even based around their devastation. I would actually love a City-State expansion where each of them have their own struggles to deal with. World of Warcraft did a similar idea with the Cataclysm expansion after all, and Yoshida himself is a big fan of that game and takes clear inspiration from it. That being said, that does not appear to be this expansion. Shadowbringers has already announced multiple new areas in foreign regions, so it's not like they're just adding new Shrouds or La Nosceas (I suppose that could be a twist but it's unlikely). While Square Enix has clearly been quite ambitious about these sorts of things in the past (Stormblood perhaps a little too so) the idea of trying to manage both crises at home and exploring/expanding new areas seems a little difficult to handle. Maybe if they had several more years and a truly titanic staff, but there comes a point to what they can realistically pull off. I still think it will be a dark moment for the Alliance, just not complete and total devastation of the areas we currently play and craft in.

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Originally Posted by Mysteltain

The closer we get to 4.5, the more I'm getting the impression that, in order to pull off a time-skip sort of scenario (as the Shadowbringer's trailer would imply), we'll complete Ghimlyt Dark and whatever else happens in 4.55, followed by "resetting" the timeline to just before the climax of 4.55 until Shadowbringers eventually drops. I'm not saying that this will be due to any sort of time traveling shenanigans, just your standard New-Game+ or postgame system from other games that let you continue exploring the world or playing the game after you've finished. The Witcher 3 comes to mind, as after the end of that game you're essentially dropped back in to the world just before all of the craziness of the final chapter happens. Same goes for the first two inFamous games, or really most open-world games with a NG+ or postgame feature.

This way, no matter what happens at the conclusion of Stormblood, we won't be locked out of certain areas or be prevented from doing certain quests or tasks based on the events of the story.

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Doubt so, as SE did made up a reason for us to freely walking around with a messed called 2.55 this one should not be too hard to get a reason without doing time skip. Just limit the damaged zones to the next expac and it's our job to stop it from engulf the entire world is good enough.

We know from Fanfest that 5.0 be set against a backdrop of the six nations we have allied moving against Garlemald proper. For one reason or another it seems probably pretty safe to say that the Garlean invasion fails for some reason, though it is anyone's guess what forces the Garleans back.

This knowledge suggests a few things.

Firstly, we probably won't see much impact on the existing zones from the Garlean attack. One way or another their attack probably fails.

Secondly, It seems unlikely we will be seeing a time skip as it is unlikely that the Allied nations take years before they move against Garlemald and we know from 4.4 they are of the mind that until the Ascians are removed peace with Garlemald is impossible. This is why I expect time travel. If we can spend ages wondering around lost in a past era and it will have no impact on how things progress back in Eorzea. If we have to have a time skip, that would ironically give us the time for one without impacting the flow of the war.

Thirdly, I expect that the time between 4.55 and the expansion will represent the time it takes to fully mobilise and organise and invasion into Garlemald's territories. As for Time Travel, if it does happen, I have a feeling that our Echo will allow us to transition between where the souls of our allies have been called to and our own bodies. After all our echo is tied to our souls and its the soul which is getting called.

If the Scion's souls are being called, they are being called somewhere. Maybe it is another shard. Maybe it is another time. Regardless that were is going to be important. I don't expect for the voice to be Calling them into the future even if that is where the voice comes from. Very little would be gained from calling Thancred and co to a point where it is already too late to stop things going wrong.

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Originally Posted by Belhi

If the Scion's souls are being called, they are being called somewhere. Maybe it is another shard. Maybe it is another time. Regardless that were is going to be important. I don't expect for the voice to be Calling them into the future even if that is where the voice comes from. Very little would be gained from calling Thancred and co to a point where it is already too late to stop things going wrong.

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Personally I think that they are being called to another shard, more specifically Arbert's shard. We already know that souls can travel between the shards, even if physical bodies are unable to. That particular shard is already implied to be plot important, since it is about to be destroyed by a flood of light and is only barely being kept alive by the efforts of Hydelyn herself. The fact that we have to become Warriors of Darkness (something Arbert personally tried to do) and that light themed enemies were shown in the trailer further reinforces this idea. Not to mention it means no time travel shenanigans, which can get very complicated very quickly. And that since that shard is a clear vision of a possible 'future' for Eorzea, we could 'change the past' by not making the same mistakes he did, and instead averting the coming doom. That's my guess anyway.

Either way I really don't foresee Eorzea getting devastated or losing access to the current game world. Side Activities are still structured around being able to do them whenever and wherever you want, and the new crafter storylines being about rebuilding Ishgard kind of derails the concept that the whole world is going to blow up.

I'm frankly disappointed in that the Scions that are out of commission will be able to recover so quickly. I was suspecting it to be an early 5.0 plot point of their recovery

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Originally Posted by Dreggit

I'm frankly disappointed in that the Scions that are out of commission will be able to recover so quickly. I was suspecting it to be an early 5.0 plot point of their recovery

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Who said that won't be the case? I honestly don't think that they're coming back to normal this patch. In fact, the trailer seemed to imply that Lyse is going to get pulled away too.

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Originally Posted by CaesarCV

Who said that won't be the case? I honestly don't think that they're coming back to normal this patch. In fact, the trailer seemed to imply that Lyse is going to get pulled away too.

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I could have sworn one or two of them are features in the trailer. Hmm /shrug. I'm just hopeful that it doesn't resolve easily with the build up that it has

Yoshida had an interview a few days ago where he said the Scions being called will be gone into more in Part 2 of 4.5. Thancred was certainly in the trailer and acting very much like himself (as opposed to being possessed), so we know he at least gets better. Given that the Scions as a whole were put up as the faces of the Trust system, they probably will be back by the end of 4.5.