Possible to skip Eureka/Pagos?

And get the required ilvl equipment through other means? Can I for example just buy equip on the market so that I never have to set foot in there or is that not recommended?

Someone can correct me if I'm wrong but if you're trying to raid I think pentameld crafted gear is good enough for the first few floors?

If you aren't trying to raid then again, crafted gear is fine until you get the tome gear. I don't really get why people are so upset/annoyed with Eureka when the relic will be outdated like what 2 months after you get it? Just don't do it something better will replace it soon.

Is that the ilvl 380 crafted gear?

I'm sorry I'm actually new to the endgame content and I try to carefully plan how to get up with those ilvls because I know that too much grinding will burn me out quickly.

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Originally Posted by Belgianbeer

Is that the ilvl 380 crafted gear?

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Yeah that's the gear. I would double check though, just to make sure it's still ok to start raiding in the crafted set.

I know I've never done a relic weapon, ever, don't get the point and no one's turned me down from any statics or anything.

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Originally Posted by OurMom

Someone can correct me if I'm wrong but if you're trying to raid I think pentameld crafted gear is good enough for the first few floors?

If not then again, crafted gear is fine until you get the tome gear. I don't really get why people are so upset/annoyed with Eureka when the relic will be outdated like what 2 months after you get it? Just don't do it something better will replace it soon.

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That's been my approach. I've never once touched anything related to Eureka. And so far, it's cost me absolutely nothing. New patch drops, I craft some new gear, and that tides me over until I start getting tome gear & Savage drops. Eureka gear now is about as useful as previous relics currently are- as glamour and little else.

Eureka was a system that had a lot of potential, but sadly SE let it go and cannot seem to find the happy middle ground with their player base. There are lots of other way to get entry level gear for raiding, and need to do what works for you.

With the removal of the Mendacity cap if you run the MSQ, dungeons and raids up into lvl 70 you should get enough tomes and coins to upgrade your gear to 360/370 reasonably fast. 360/370 ilvl is just fine for the normal level Alphascape raids that will let you upgrade to 380 stuff. One thing I've found with this game is getting geared up to the next level content isn't really a problem and higher level gear shows up about the time you need to start using it.

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Originally Posted by eisman22500

Eureka was a system that had a lot of potential, but sadly SE let it go and cannot seem to find the happy middle ground with their player base. There are lots of other way to get entry level gear for raiding, and need to do what works for you.

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There is no middle ground. Mob grinding is unwelcome.

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Originally Posted by van_arn

There is no middle ground. Mob grinding is unwelcome.

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Literally everything in the game is mob grinding.

As much as I hope it is for the relic, I doubt it. I'd also be fine with Pyros taking a bit longer than the other 2 areas as well for the relic grind so long as it's tolerable if people choose to skip the first 2 areas entirely. Having to level should stay as is though, imo. Otherwise yeah, there's a few avenues you can take OP. Tome gear, crafted gear and Alphascape will do just fine. Tome gear and Alphascape gear are free though.

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Originally Posted by Floortank

Literally everything in the game is mob grinding.

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- The majority of crafting, which doesn't require leather or 2/5 of the cloth in this game.
- Gathering, even fishing
- Boss FATEs (on account of boss =/= countless trash mobs)
- Gold Saucer and related activities
- Trials and Raids, even counting stretches with trash pulls
- The vast majority of exp from dungeons come from beating bosses, completing instances, or doing roulettes, not from grinding the trash (compare to pre-HW with Dzemael Darkhold first room farms, which is a "was" rather than an "is")
- On that note, even non-boss FATEs give far more exp for completion than simply killing those monsters over and over.
- Glamour endgame (save for those leathers and 2/5 of cloth mats)

hmm...

As I see it, the Devs have to seriously consider giving us an alternative method of acquiring our relics. Either that or improve the playability mechanics of Pagos in a manner that its not a massive time sink for minuscule rewards.

Also, to answer the OP, yes, you can skip Eureka altogether, and pretend is doesn't even exist. It comes out too late and requires too much effort that is, often, anti-fun, and all for a weapon that will be outdated as soon as the following patch comes out.

Crafted gear, tome gear, 24man gear when the relevant raid comes out? These are your best bet for staying on top of your gear. Then just learn and farm the newest primal for a decent weapon that will last so much longer than the SB relic stages, and actively require more of your mind than Eureka does (where it instead sucks your brain through your wallet, a la., sub fees and time).

You don’t need Eureka for anything else than the relic. And to be honest the relic is just for pure cosmetic. If you want to be updated with gear, then do dungeons, the roulettes, raids, get the drops, get tomes gear, do the latest ex primal/trial for weapon, go to savage..., or like others said if you have the “coin”, just buy the crafted gear from market board. again you don’t need Eureka to have Good/BiS gear.

Learning to do Suzaku Ex is much kinder to your brain and overall health and well being than doing Pagos. It's also done in 10 minutes or less.

And I'm actually being very serious about the negative health aspects of Pagos.

The only reason to do Pagos would be if you actually enjoyed the grind. The weapon is not worth the effort in my opinion. As other people have pointed out, you have a lot of options for getting better weapons and with far less effort. It is perfectly safe to skip this content.

Unlike many games I was used to( EQ, EQ2, Wow) The Relic here isn't something needed for end game/raiding which feels sorta odd to me. Wish I knew the story of why it is like that but there ya go.

I use a penta-melded (5 pieces of materia) I380 crafted weapon which is already superior to the pagos weapon by leaps and bounds. OK maybe a hop or two, but still. However those can be costly on the MB unless like me you are able to craft it yourself. In which case you could Run sigmascape V4.0 4 times and then Rabanastre and Lighthouse for the tokens to get a I370 weapon which will be serviceable.

That all assumes you like me don't do EX trials because "2spooky"

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Originally Posted by OurMom

I don't really get why people are so upset/annoyed with Eureka when the relic will be outdated like what 2 months after you get it? Just don't do it something better will replace it soon.

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I think it's because they put 11 months of development time, lots of resources and skipped a dungeon for something that is extremely niche content. It left a lack of content in 4.3 for those who didn't enjoy it. The upset is strongly worded feedback, which is important.

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Originally Posted by Liam_Harper

It left a lack of content in 4.3 for those who didn't enjoy it.

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Considering dungeons are done once, and then it's "run the EX roulette as fast as possible", it doesn't change much. Besides, what were lost are Hard Mode dungeons, so mostly reuse of existing design. Also, Ultimate in odd patches are a big part of why there is only one dungeon.

The problem with 4.3 was not to have one less content but to have content spread throughout 4.3, 4.35 and 4.36.

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Originally Posted by Nyvara

Unlike many games I was used to( EQ, EQ2, Wow) The Relic here isn't something needed for end game/raiding which feels sorta odd to me. Wish I knew the story of why it is like that but there ya go.

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The story is a design oversight with the implemention of the story mode raids.

Back in 2.x, the relic was indeed the best weapon for (early) progression. For example when patch 2.4 introduced a new raid tier the max item level was 110 before, with item level 115 weapons. The relic WAS item level 115 at that time. The new tomestone gear of that patch was item level 120, and the raid gear 130, with a 135 weapon. The Extreme Primal of that patch dropped an item level 110 weapon.

With the intorduction of the story mode raids in 3.0, they implemented an item level step between the former highest item level and new tomestone gear. Wich means you don't use the gear of the last tier for (early) progression anymore. This item level step, with normal mode raid gear, crafted gear and extreme primal weapon, makes all the gear of the last tier obsolete, including the relic weapon.

Another point is that the relic was the only option to get a strong weapon without (savage) raids at all. The tokens for the tomestone weapon were locked behind the raid. The introduction of the story mode raid also made these tokens available for everyone, wich further reduced the relevance of the relic weapon.

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Originally Posted by Liam_Harper

I think it's because they put 11 months of development time, lots of resources and skipped a dungeon for something that is extremely niche content. It left a lack of content in 4.3 for those who didn't enjoy it. The upset is strongly worded feedback, which is important.

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But that still doesn’t mean you have to do it. I see a lot of people forcing themselves and it was the same with the HW relic. People complained then as well as if you’re forced to do relic weapons.

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Originally Posted by Tint

Another point is that the relic was the only option to get a strong weapon without (savage) raids at all. The tokens for the tomestone weapon were locked behind the raid. The introduction of the story mode raid also made these tokens available for everyone, wich further reduced the relevance of the relic weapon.

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Technically, you always had access to tokens from the following 24-man raid tier or hunts, even if not right away.

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Originally Posted by Floortank

Literally everything in the game is mob grinding.

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False. This is a content grinder. It is what replaced the archaic mob grinding systems from the year 2000.

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Originally Posted by OurMom

But that still doesn’t mean you have to do it. I see a lot of people forcing themselves and it was the same with the HW relic. People complained then as well as if you’re forced to do relic weapons.

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I don't think most people do. Pagos is a wasteland right now. Only one person in my entire FC has the weapon so far. I don't step foot in there.

Which is a waste of development resources. I think most of us wanted a relic to grind, but not like this.

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Originally Posted by OurMom

But that still doesn’t mean you have to do it. I see a lot of people forcing themselves and it was the same with the HW relic. People complained then as well as if you’re forced to do relic weapons.

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People are forcing themselves for the most part because they either really want the Relic or because there was little to no new content to them given a good chunk of the Endgame playerbase was already at i370 thanks to Savage and 24-Man tokens. Were you to ignore it you would be left again to spam whatever it was that you were doing post-HoH release.

Lets not forget that even though people complained about Zodiac/Anima at the very least it allowed content to stay relevant longer than initially intended meaning that just by running what you were already doing contributed to your weapon in some form. The isolated growth that the Elemental weapons have within Eureka itself has only helped to shorten the lifespan of content, it doesn’t help that the reward structure essentially kills off content fast with little to no incentive to run it again. Pairing that with almost a whole patch of spamming the same content over and over again only to find that the new iteration of the Relic content is worse than its first only ends up giving you a recipe for failure. That in of itself is not a good thing for a genre that generally thrived off constant updates, even worse when you consider its a game that has a subscription based model.

Given the resource allocation, time and the fact that it was touted as a big feature of Stormblood you need to wonder what the Dev team is doing with the Diadem Feedback, the Anemos Feedback and their overall design philosophy. As it stands the content is for the most part panned by the community with some calling it worse than Diadem given it doesn’t even bother giving you starting objectives nor does it give a reason for gatherers/crafters to visit. 5.0 will not do well if they try and tout another “Diadem/Eureka” style content that further eats up resources in an already stale patch formula.

As others have said, the main reason to do Eureka is the Relic weapon. Historically, the Relic weapon throughout the patch cycle was competitive with the Raid weapon in terms of power and effectiveness, and in the very end of an expansion occasionally surpassed it. It was a way to get Raid weapon power, without raiding. (It could also be used to provide a powerful weapon to use while progressing through a Raid - but to do so early enough in the Raid cycle to be worthwhile required some pretty insane grinding.)

Whether you raid or not, there are plenty of alternative ways to get powerful weaponry - and if you don't raid, you don't need powerful weapons anyway, so you can skip even them. Non-raiders only gear to the nines for personal satisfaction; there's nothing non-raid that requires good gear. If you do raid, starting with the crafted weapon and proceeding on to the Tomestone weapon will be fine. A crafted weapon is already ten ilvls higher than a Pagos weapon anyway (though the upcoming Ignos weapons may be Raid-relevant, and will require the Pagos weapon as a base).

As a fairly new player, I really enjoy threads like these.

It is good reading, while waiting for "the howling eye" (now time elapsed 25 minutes, average 25 minutes, where the average keeps raising as my wait time does...)

As I expected, I'll likely be buying gear from the Market Board for much of the game. That is, until I level up the trades myself; It seems required in this game? Most "Player Cards", or whatever those things are people post as sigs, show level 70 in everything? So far I'm just 54 lancer/54 fisher, I guess I'll go miner/armor jobs next?

Good stuff!

There was never a reason to run Eureka...it doesn't contain the highest gear available. It's only there as a form of entertainment while they scurry around creating the next patch lol.

It is my fervent hope that I can get to skip Pagos for my relic

Pretty much only doing Amenos to cap tomes after I finished my glowing relic weapon for glamour. Skipping Pagos as the weapon isn't even that good when I can just buy an alternative on MB easily.

Can't believe SE will release a 3rd installment of Eureka. I suffered the horrible grind in early FF11 but it was worth it and rewarding as gear was useful for years back then. Unlike the temp gear that is in FF14.

you can if you don't want relic, but the way they built it your gonna have to do all 4 eureka maps a ton if you ever do

the problem with eureka as i see it is it basically is just grinding for the sake of grinding with only the very occasional boss zerg to break the monoton. They even put in that wheel thing to punish you for changing what your fighting

I feel like...
ditch the wheel, make the dealies into just def or atk buffs
make the zone be constant FATE-like events... like northern thanalan but way more. Escorts, Guard duty, extermination, notorious monster, outpost invasions, item gathering, etc etc Can even make the main base have a hamlet-like event. Would make sense
normal mobs drop materials for crafting "Eureka gear"
add gathering nodes also for "Eureka Gear"
Still have NM's but maybe be creative like FFXI was instead of every single one being grind this crap until your eyes bleed

just make the place... seem alive
commit genocide on the indiginous life for ...reasons just feels kind of lame for an entire zones reason for being