Yet another MCH topic + suggestions how to solve some problems

We all know how bad MCH now is and it needs next rework, so i will go straight to the main point of my topic.
I have problem with heated animations. They feel extremely out of place. They are indeed cool and i wouldn't mind having them as abilities, but not main combo. It's like playing BRD but after using every heavy shot your character makes some acrobatic jump. It becames annoying very quickly.
Since i know there are people who enjoy it, i have 2 possible solutions how to satisfy both groups.
1. Let us toggle it in character options (choose betwen classy old animations and new crazy jumps), but make it visible for everyone, since i would feel odd knowing people see me doing these weird things. It's not big problem, i bet it can be done in one day without even any additional budget.
(second option in comments due to low characters limit)

2. Second option, that will satisfy people who wants two handed guns. Just add two handed guns. It can have the same mechanic or different, but most important thing, it should have more static (like these old) animations. So you can choose between jumpy boi and classy rifleman.

Edit

3rd option - change heated animations to two handed animations, with a small twists (but not too crazy). It will probably not work with makai revolver, but i haven't seen anyone using it (probably because i'm seeing 3-4 machinists per week).

I'm not saying "please fix it because i want that", i saw topics where people were complaining about the same thing, so i'm just suggesting possible solution which will not harm anyone.

About toolbox - i have never been thinking about it before, because imho standard toolbox looks perfect, and there's no reason to change it. As long as it can be changed independently from weapon i can't complain.

I'm really confused by that post

For you the MCH is bad and needs to be rework because ... it jumps too much?


And your solution are
1- Add a toggle option that makes your character do A instead of B animation (i'm not even sure the game can currently do that)
2- Add an entirely new type of weapon, in other words, double the design budget for the MCH because some people like big guns. Also possibly add an entire new set of mechanic while we're at it.

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I'm not saying "please fix it because i want that", i saw topics where people were complaining about the same thing, so i'm just suggesting possible solution which will not harm anyone.

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I lurk these forum everyday and the vast majority complains about wildfire and actual game balance, not how jumpy the job is.

If you don't like your animation just toggle them off, you'll still jump but you won't have the laser coming out.

Btw, as far as I'm concerned, the MCH is a "MACHINE-ist", not the Sniper or the Gunner.
If there's one thing the MCH lacks is actually more "device themed" mechanic. So while I agree they can be a bit too flashy sometime, the new combo heated animation feels more in line with what the job is (or should?) be about, the use of device and machine.

Obviously it's a matter of preference and they're both valid
but what I think isn't valid is that click bait title and how you pretend this is the #1 problem people are talking about when it's clearly not

Animation are currently NOT an issue, especially not a #1 issue when the job suffers from a very cluncky gameplay.

For instance, BLM not doing enough DPS WAS (still is a bit?) an issue. To the point some PF would prevent BLM from joining.
BLM having to dps with Fire instead of Ice because you want to be an Umbral BLM ISN'T an issue. It's unfortunate for you, but it is definitely not an issue.

RDM having to pay so much dps for that raise utility is an issue
RDM not doing enough melee combo because you wish it was more hybrid is not an issue

It's an annoyance or a disapointement at best.



P.S you can edit your post to put both text in one comment.

MCH is a very unpopular job, and I think it's a fair point to consider the visuals as a part of the equation. There's a few things that feel a little disconnected with the design.

1. Most of the gun models are quite large but we're using them one-handed while this is almost never the case in real life even with the smallest firearms. Because of the fantasy setting the flimsy handling can be easily justified, we have giant swords and axes after all, but I have a feeling that people who gravitate towards gun classes despite the setting would appreciate a more realistic take on the aiming and shooting. Personally, I feel like the majority of the gun models would fit much more naturally with 2-handed animations due their sheer length, like seen with Sprint or Flamethrower.

2. While the particle and sound effects of the heated shot are satisfying, the flips feel very arbitrary. The design would be a lot more coherent with recoil effects and animations instead of the flips. Combined with the large gun models it would also seem more realistic and feel more powerful.

3. The Gauss Barrel is awful. I interact with a lot of MCHs in the community and I've not heard a single person like it. Most opt out with /gbarrel off and mine has been hidden since the command was implemented, I would almost argue that the only reason people have it visible is because they don't know about the text command. The barrel doesn't adjust to gun length and rarely matches the color or design theme of a gun model. This most definitely warrants a redesign.

4. The toolbox doesn't change with gun models. Bards get their customized quivers, why can't we? There might be lore reason for this, but I can't think of anything that wouldn't justify some customization. At least make the colors match the gun models, please! The thing only dyes if the gun is dyable so the lunchbox easily ruins otherwise nice glamour sets. There's even a mod out nowadays that specifically hides the toolbox because of this.

I don't know how the numbers look at SE's end but I'm very surprised the DRK redesign, tank balance and healers have been talked about so much when there's a much more extreme disparity with the usage of BRD and MCH. It feels like MCH has been put aside and forgotten since the early SB changes. I would urge them to take a look at all the feedback they've got about the class, since most of the threads about MCH nowadays don't even pick up any wind, people just don't care anymore since almost nobody plays the class seriously.

I'm not saying this is #1 issue, this is one of the two issues. Firstly, whole mechanic is bad, secondly, these animations are ridiculous. But imho if they would let us disable these animations i would play this job because it was my main, but some major rework is still necessary.

They just feel very weird as a main combo, they might fit gunner, but not machinist, which is supposed to be something like engineer.

When they announced this job before Heavensward, I had in mind a concept that was totally different.
I wanted to have a mobile range dps and fun to play. The problem is maybe that I conveyed the gameplay I could imagine from a gunner to a machinist (with riffle).
But even with a riffle, I know we can have something near a gunner, or something more enjoyable.
They should maybe get some inspiration from King or Cater from FF Type-0 (even it's not the same type of gun).

I don't know, right know MCH feel too stoic, too restricted, not very fun.
This is not the expectations I could have to control a character with a gun.

If they want, on the contrary, be conformed to the idea of Machinist, then, they should do something else on the side.
The turret(s) should deserved more carefulness, and should be extended (with the adding of several skills related to it).
I would like to see, for example, the flying laser turrets from Alexander be a part of the kit of MCH.
I would like to see the using of other machines, like calling a Magiteck Armor as reinforcement, etc.

So either, MCH stay as now (little presence of machines) but with a good refund of riffle gameplay, either they rework the job to give him half skills related to riffle, the other half related to machines.

Ive always loved mch, but yeah I would love it even more if it didn't use the silly heated animations, or used them less (ie in overheat) and if they held the gun in two hands. I can think of maybe 2 guns off of the top of my head which wouldnt suit a 2 handed animation set.

I don't have a problem with the animations. And for reference I do still enjoy playing it, but I do think it was better in 3.X.

I just don't like how they dragged it kicking and screaming down the no-cast-bar route along with Bard, when it was only complained about on Bard. The cast animations raised a few eyebrows, but it gave the Gauss Barrel purpose, and wasn't like you were as immobile as Bard thanks to procs. I understand the desire to simplify some jobs, but the shorter wf window in conjunction with overheating just feels a bit cruel. I'd rather have more turret interaction / meaningful attachments than what we have.

Some MCH did complain about the caster bar. I liked the cast bar, because it was fun trying to find ways to cut down on it, while keeping the barrel on. MCH is certainly doable without the cast bar, but it needs to either A) Focus on making the wildfire windows easier for those with ping issues and making flamethrower more useful than simply adding heat (perhaps a dot like pvp) or B) Focus on making MCH a nastier debuffer through the use of their machines.

Edit: As for the aesthetics, people complained about the lack of animation in HW. I really don't mind either way.

Get outta here.. MCH heated shot animations are basically the best animations in game.

I thought the issues mch had was more about brd being a stronger range option and not the gameplay/how they looked?

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Originally Posted by whiskeybravo

Get outta here.. MCH heated shot animations are basically the best animations in game.

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Wouldn't mind some weight to Gauss Round and Heartbreaker animations.

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Originally Posted by whiskeybravo

Get outta here.. MCH heated shot animations are basically the best animations in game.

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And that's the problem, some people enjoy it, so i'm trying to think about option that won't take anything away from anyone. But for now people who preferred "classy" machinist and not jumpy boi are victims of 4.0 rework.

I would focus on reworking MCH into being fun to play before looking into the animations. Overheat was a completely unnecessary addition, it played fine before in HW when they adjusted it.

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Originally Posted by Cetek14

And that's the problem, some people enjoy it, so i'm trying to think about option that won't take anything away from anyone. But for now people who preferred "classy" machinist and not jumpy boi are victims of 4.0 rework.

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I was exaggerating slightly to make the point, but yea when I first started seeing the heated shots I thought they were amazing. A lot cooler than the other animations I've seen so far. As I've played it for a while now I don't really pay too much attention to the animations anymore, they are what they are and I'm here to press an obscene amount of buttons in relatively little time. I ain't got time to check out the scenery :p

Nothing about this game is realistic so I find it a little perplexing how anyone would knock on various animations (it happens on all jobs) about not being realistic enough. You should probably just be paying attn to mechanics lol

I'm not kidding when I say I'd play Machinist again if they allowed an option to turn off heated shot animations. An insane far cry from the aim: (body part) type of gunner Mustadio and fusiliers were. Cleaner shot was the most ridiculous thing, and even that looked like they at least tried to line up the shot.

And then when I actually did play it again, I'd be concerned about the flamethrower clunkiness and other gameplay stuff. If people are wondering if the ridiculous animations have to do with Machinist's unpopularity and act as a barrier to main, I can use myself as an example of people that repelled by that kind of thing.

http://www.finalfantasykingdom.net/6/chainsaw.png

Just saying... Chainsaws solve everything

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Originally Posted by Lambdafish

http://www.finalfantasykingdom.net/6/chainsaw.png

Just saying... Chainsaws solve everything

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Please please please, this was the direction to go in, not the Overheat system! Even the flamethrower skill is perfect, just not in the implementation. Was I the only one who got really jealous at the boss of Doma Castle using Chainsaw? Also, who else thought Wildfire kind of reminds them of Air Anchor?

R.I.P. Grenado Shot. You were one of the coolest skills in the game as well as feeling very Laguna-like. Shooting grenades was cool, not magic curving laser spam and bending bullet acrobatics.

GCD animations are the least of MCHs worries from what I can tell... but maybe a compromise could be to limit the 'Heated' shots to only when you overheat, so they feel more impactful?

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Originally Posted by Lambdafish

http://www.finalfantasykingdom.net/6/chainsaw.png

Just saying... Chainsaws solve everything

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We are a ranged primary class good sir! Need to find a way to make that chainsaw a projectile.


Also I don't see SE addressing the animations especially since you can toggle the amount of animation you see unless the animation is proven to to be too distracting to other players around you similar to DRK's animations at the time. MCH is flashy, but not distracting to others.

I personally like the animations. A lot of HW's shots looked the same so pretty cool we get different looking abilities now.

While I can agree about a dislike of the "Heated" shot animations, I can also agree that MCH has... bigger problems (Overheat clunky-ness). Personally I "would" have had a near obsesive respect/love for HW MCH if it wern't for that damn casting animation (its a gun not a damn wand u idiot).

So 1st a fix to 4.0 PvE MCH clunky overheat system then maybe an "option" to disable the heated shots animations, in every way... still think they should just change "Attach Gauss Barrel" into its PvP version when above at lest 60 heat (even if that ment re-learning my opener as I've ajusted to this thing we call "use Flamethrower to enter Overheat to start opener")

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Originally Posted by Velhart

We are a ranged primary class good sir! Need to find a way to make that chainsaw a projectile.

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Make it like dragoons jump, jump in, chainsaw, jump out. I know animation lock is a thing, but it could be a cooldown skill with high potency, and its chainsaw, everyone can forgive animation lock for chainsaw

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Originally Posted by Velhart

We are a ranged primary class good sir! Need to find a way to make that chainsaw a projectile.

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Machinists found a way to fit Blank into their rotation in Heavensward just fine.

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Originally Posted by Valdegarde

Machinists found a way to fit Blank into their rotation in Heavensward just fine.

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I was thinking more like this:

http://www.roboticgizmos.com/wp-cont...d-Chainsaw.gif

Alot of people see machinist as the gun job instead of the machine job

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Originally Posted by Valdegarde

Machinists found a way to fit Blank into their rotation in Heavensward just fine.

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I remember people confused why I was near the boss at certain points.