Been running Ridorana Lighthouse the whole week and...

Hello, i've been running this the whole week expecting to get an armor or boots so im going to make this short and ask how is this fair?

https://k62.kn3.net/9/A/9/E/9/4/BCD.jpg

its not fair thats why i only run it once a week for completion and the token if i get a drop cool if not i move on

Yeah, honestly you can't run it for gear anymore :<
Your best bet is to get the coin and upgrade tome gear.

I know thats not the solution anyone wants but it's better than getting your hopes up for a drop from 24man.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Akira

its not fair thats why i only run it once a week for completion and the token if i get a drop cool if not i move on

---

This is how I feel now about the Lighthouse. Get my coin and hope for a drop. If not, oh well. Maybe next week.



I won't even bother running it more than once a week now unless a FC member/friends need it.

Good work censoring the name.

my question is how is it not fair?

the logic is you play the job you get the gear, but until the roll is won the gear is no ones.

you say its unfair because you are the job specifically it's yours before it even drops.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Musashidon

my question is how is it not fair?

the logic is you play the job you get the gear, but until the roll is won the gear is no ones.

you say its unfair because you are the job specifically it's yours before it even drops.

---

My question is, What?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Musashidon

my question is how is it not fair?

the logic is you play the job you get the gear, but until the roll is won the gear is no ones.

you say its unfair because you are the job specifically it's yours before it even drops.

---

I can't take this comment seriously.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Akira

its not fair thats why i only run it once a week for completion and the token if i get a drop cool if not i move on

---

i do it this way too but this week i went in trying to get caster piece
and i did but i felt extremely bad grabbing it since the one SMN in my group rolled for it too and clearly needed it more then me
but im happy they got something in the end

Personally I'd suggest getting a group of friends and plan on running it at X time every week as a full pre-made group, or starting a linkshell that's dedicated to helping people get something they wanted for weekly. The 'Greed Only' option they added into the game has royally pissed off many people in game. There are people that will be willing to pass something at times if you actively need it and can use it, but other times you'll get people saying 'no lol'.

It's why I'm happy I can run with my raid group and fc to help one another get the item we may want/need.

I'd still like to know why they thought this was something that needed to be done.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DJMau

I'd still like to know why they thought this was something that needed to be done.

---

The way I see it, the "Greed Only" rule was put in place so that players can still gear up alt jobs while playing on their main job, or something they feel more comfortable with. Maybe the intention was to try and make alliance raids more smooth since people can still get gear on their other jobs without feeling gimped by being forced to play a job just to get some gear.

I kind of like the change personally, can make runs a little faster and cleaner, but I can see why people don't like it at all.

The question then becomes what if you're actually using your main and you're trying to gear that job up? Cause you know that thanks to RNGeesus that the person that doesn't need the gear or spends the entire fight on the floor is gonna get it whether they have that alt role or not

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DJMau

The question then becomes what if you're actually using your main and you're trying to gear that job up? Cause you know that thanks to RNGeesus that the person that doesn't need the gear or spends the entire fight on the floor is gonna get it whether they have that alt role or not

---

Then its just whether you get lucky or not. Sure its annoying when you don't get that piece of gear you want, especially to an underperformer, but end of the day thats just how rolling for loot works. It's no different from seeing a piece of gear you may need in a dungeon and not winning the greed roll.

That being said, it's not like Ridorana is the only way for people to gear up their jobs, especially if they're relatively new to endgame and this is their main job. There's the new dungeons, sigmascape, tomes, and crafting or marketboard people can use to get gear.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Akira

its not fair thats why i only run it once a week for completion and the token if i get a drop cool if not i move on

---

I still haven't done it this week because frankly I don't want to. It's going to be depressing to watch things like what happened to OP and this sort of thing can create drama...I just don't want to be a part of it even as a bystander.

But I need the coin so I should do it. Sigh.

That's why you went in on the job you wanted gear on. Either way you slice it it's a pretty stupid idea

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ryuseigoes

The way I see it, the "Greed Only" rule was put in place so that players can still gear up alt jobs while playing on their main job, or something they feel more comfortable with. Maybe the intention was to try and make alliance raids more smooth since people can still get gear on their other jobs without feeling gimped by being forced to play a job just to get some gear.

I kind of like the change personally, can make runs a little faster and cleaner, but I can see why people don't like it at all.

---

Agreeing with this. ^ I hadn't seen healer gear drop, so I rolled for a bard gear (my other level 70). I like having that option.


Side note: I know some players won't be receptive to this... but have you tried asking people to pass on X gear so you can gear up? I just had a run (in Rab, not Rid, admittedly) where the Dragoon asked if people would let him have the dragoon gear. Everyone passed on all of the DRG gear so it worked out for him/her.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ryuseigoes

That being said, it's not like Ridorana is the only way for people to gear up their jobs, especially if they're relatively new to endgame and this is their main job. There's the new dungeons, sigmascape, tomes, and crafting or marketboard people can use to get gear.

---

I mean both sides can use this argument though.

In my experience, I feel like it hurt queues. Today I had to give up on a dps Rido queue since it hit 20 minutes and we were missing tanks the entire time and still missing two by the time it hit 20min. Why play a tank when you can just queue dps and just roll on tank gear anyway.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MOZZYSTAR

Side note: I know some players won't be receptive to this... but have you tried asking people to pass on X gear so you can gear up?

---

The truth is people can be awful, especially when they can hide behind an avatar online. Furthermore especially when they know they can't get in trouble for it. Trolls are going to pretend to be gracious enough to pass if certain loot drops that someone else nicely asked for...and then roll on it because they'll think it's funny to make someone else panic or become angry.

Saying you won't roll on something in an alliance raid and doing the opposite is not likely to be a reportable offense. If SE cared about that the loot system wouldn't have been changed.

I don't know if you were suggesting that as a valid solution to the greed only system. I'm just stating that it's not.

The only sure way to get specific alliance loot within the weekly lockout is to have your entire alliance filled with people you know and trust.

And please no one give me that "who would waste their weekly loot to troll someone?", because people like me could with no downsides. I still need the coins but I don't need any gear. If I was a selfish person I could use my weekly win to make someone else miserable.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DJMau

That's why you went in on the job you wanted gear on. Either way you slice it it's a pretty stupid idea

---

Everytime i go for this kind of stuff i use the job that can use that specific gear, i dont roll on items that my job cant use because i always think that other people whos actually playing the job might need that gear, it was an unspoken thing, now it seems that you have to beg to get gear for your main job.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Vaer

I mean both sides can use this argument though.

In my experience, I feel like it hurt queues. Today I had to give up on a dps Rido queue since it hit 20 minutes and we were missing tanks the entire time and still missing two by the time it hit 20min. Why play a tank when you can just queue dps and just roll on tank gear anyway.

---

That's kind of the point I'm trying to make though. You can go on a job thats needed, or one you feel comfortable on and still roll for stuff you might need.

the ironic thing about this is greed only in a literal sense is the most fair it possibly can be and what people are mad about and calling unfair is the inability to use classes to shift the odds in their own favor

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DJMau

The question then becomes what if you're actually using your main and you're trying to gear that job up? Cause you know that thanks to RNGeesus that the person that doesn't need the gear or spends the entire fight on the floor is gonna get it whether they have that alt role or not

---

You’re not at a disadvantage compared to the other person though. You don’t have *less* chance of getting it. (Sure, the scholar beat three bards to the gear in this instance, but there was only a 25% chance of that happening if all four people rolled on it.)

And right now if people are rolling on stuff they actually can’t use... the joke’s on them because they only get one thing per week.

Personally I might be in the same boat as the non-bard winning the aiming gear at the start of the topic. Right now I can only get into the new content as a caster or healer, and I feel like I’m not doing well with those classes so I want to see how I go as bard. To get in as bard, I need better equipment first, so I’d roll on the archer gear as something else so I can get into the raid with it in the first place...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Nihility

the ironic thing about this is greed only in a literal sense is the most fair it possibly can be and what people are mad about and calling unfair is the inability to use classes to shift the odds in their own favor

---

A system like this can only be fair if no one abuses it. As I already said in my previous post I'm in a position to abuse it without losing anything. I'm nice enough not to but not everyone is.

So it's not really a fair system if it can be easily abused without repercussions.

We need the ability to shift the odds in our favour because ***holes exist. Simple as that.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Penthea

The truth is people can be awful, especially when they can hide behind an avatar online. I don't know if you were suggesting that as a valid solution to the greed only system. I'm just stating that it's not.

---

Right, I'm aware of this issue which is why I said "I know some players won't be receptive to this..." (you quoted that). And no, it wasn't meant as a solution, people are neither entirely predictable nor are they controllable as insinuated. However, it doesn't hurt to ask (your ego might hurt a little, but hey). Sometimes you might luck out with people who actually comply (whether they say they will or not). Other times you won't luck out. It's worth a shot, right? You've got nothing to lose with a slim possibility to gain.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ryuseigoes

That's kind of the point I'm trying to make though. You can go on a job thats needed, or one you feel comfortable on and still roll for stuff you might need.

---

And if you DON'T have the job that's needed at the level and item level to play in or haven't unlocked or want to play as... it kind defeats the point don'tcha think?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by VirusChris

And if you DON'T have the job that's needed at the level and item level to play in or haven't unlocked or want to play as... it kind defeats the point don'tcha think?

---

I don't really get what you're trying to say.

What I'm saying is I could go Ridorana on my Paladin, a job I feel comfortable on to try and gear my Monk, a job I don't quite meet the ilvl for and trying to get gear for and have an equal chance like everybody else at getting any striking pieces I need.

1. Buy crafted 350 armor, make it, or trade what you have in to the exchange vendor in ala mihgo.
2. Get upgraded 360 gear for your alts.
3. Don't worry about ridorina gear ever again.

seriously, i literally have full left side at 360 just from that in a week, and one piece away from full right on my healer. Its great, and on lamia each piece is 1 mil gil or so, not unaffordable at all. I can even craft NQ and turn it in, just need a lot more.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RiyahArp

1. Buy crafted 350 armor, make it, or trade what you have in to the exchange vendor in ala mihgo.
2. Get upgraded 360 gear for your alts.
3. Don't worry about ridorina gear ever again.

seriously, i literally have full left side at 360 just from that in a week, and one piece away from full right on my healer. Its great, and on lamia each piece is 1 mil gil or so, not unaffordable at all. I can even craft NQ and turn it in, just need a lot more.

---

Keep in mind, this 'all greed' loot role also applies to any alliance raid we got - From the Labyrinth of the Ages up to Ridorana Lighthouse.
So even when you go to a older raid where you just like to get a piece of gear for glamour, chances are very slim you'd get lucky enough. Because the western gaming world are full of greedy people who'd roll for gear to just turn that in for seals if they could.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Vaer

I mean both sides can use this argument though.

In my experience, I feel like it hurt queues. Today I had to give up on a dps Rido queue since it hit 20 minutes and we were missing tanks the entire time and still missing two by the time it hit 20min. Why play a tank when you can just queue dps and just roll on tank gear anyway.

---

Now there is an interesting notion I have witnessed - The tanks these days seem to have gotten more lazy in doing their role in alliance raids? I have seen situations in more than one case that the tank peeps don't really want to be the MT, or deal with the adds themselves. Can the lack of motivation of taking the tanking seriously be attributed to not be guaranteed their tank gear anymore when it drops?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Arrius

Keep in mind, this 'all greed' loot role also applies to any alliance raid we got - From the Labyrinth of the Ages up to Ridorana Lighthouse.

---

lol or you could just buy the gear, because post 60 leveling gear uses void ark pieces as well as crystal tower stuff. What they don't use generally is too ugly or too impractical; its not like i see Scylla gear wandering around much. Give it time, they will reuse the gear in crafted form and then no worries.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MOZZYSTAR

I hadn't seen healer gear drop, so I rolled for a bard gear (my other level 70). I like having that option.

---

You had that option before as well. It's a fact a lot of people who support this change seem to forget, and because of weekly lockout and people who do care about what gear piece they get, the odds of you getting it were actually high. All the more so if it was, for example, a DRG piece and you had no DRG in the party. This "option" was there, now people who actually need the gear for their main aren't protected against it. I wonder who else rolled on the bard gear you won, you neglected to mention that.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BillyKaplan

You had that option before as well. It's a fact a lot of people who support this change seem to forget, and because of weekly lockout and people who do care about what gear piece they get, the odds of you getting it were actually high. All the more so if it was, for example, a DRG piece and you had no DRG in the party. This "option" was there, now people who actually need the gear for their main aren't protected against it. I wonder who else rolled on the bard gear you won, you neglected to mention that.

---

There's enough people supporting this change for them to be implicitly described as a group of sorts? Colour me surprised; it's one of the worst ideas I've seen SE implement, and I haven't really seen anyone actively supporting it who isn't trolling.

I understand the principle but it is implemented poorly. This is not fair, since even if someone has not even unlocked the class can roll on it and then sell it.

Thing that could be done to make it better: Only need if you can equip the gear
Get inspired by raid group and a simple interface pop-up at the start asking for which class you want the drop. Make it private so people won't leave if there is to much competition. So if i come as a healer, i can say i need dragoon loot since it is my main. But i won't be able to also roll on the other unrelated piece to stock them and trade them for seal later.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RiyahArp

lol or you could just buy the gear, because post 60 leveling gear uses void ark pieces as well as crystal tower stuff. What they don't use generally is too ugly or too impractical; its not like i see Scylla gear wandering around much. Give it time, they will reuse the gear in crafted form and then no worries.

---

Void Ark gear is crazy expensive and easily going in the millions for certain jobs because its still content relevant with i350. And even if not, its the greed that keeps the price up - Even old replica gear, which is still highly sought, goes often in the upper six-digit area.

Okay, maybe I was just lucky.. I've had two Ridorana runs so far, one in each week. I just roll for stuff relevant for gearing up my played classes at that time (in this case, Healer and Caster). I got a piece of useful gear for my classes in each run, without having to run it more than once a week. And there wasn't even anyone else rolling for it.

My thought is the following: There's a 1 piece of loot limit per week. Everyone has that limit. So I'd assume anyone aware of that wouldn't waste it to roll on just any loot that shows up regardless of what they find useful. Thus most people that haven't gotten loot yet and roll for something, would be waiting to roll for a specific piece or at least for a specific class. Which reduces the chance of them wanting the exact same piece as you are trying to roll for.

Sure, the same applies with the former 'Need' rules if a bit differently. Though personally I'm glad I was able to get caster pieces for my lv70 Summoner while playing Whitemage, cause I didn't have the gear level yet to go in as caster. With the 'Need' rules that would be less likely to happen, at least in the early weeks after release.

But in the end, either system comes down to luck. Nobody can predict who they'd end up in a party with (unless you make one beforehand), and who of those in the party rolls for what - what loot will actually drop - and which rolls will win. It's a big roll of random factors in the end anyways. If you're lucky, you get your desired loot in either system. If you're unlucky, you can miss out on th eloot in either system.

Best way to control that luck would be making a party beforehand. Can even be a PF party with strangers, putting something like 'Ridorana with Loot calls. Only roll for the loot you call out for yourself at the start'. You'd do some communication at the start, seeing who needs what and deciding whether its okay if two people want to roll for the same thing cause they need it both. Would raise the chances for everyone to get what they want.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ryuseigoes

I don't really get what you're trying to say.

---

Essentially what I think he's saying (and others have said before in various discussions) is that if you are not "comfortable enough" bringing any job of yours into these 24-man raid alliance, then the whole purpose of "gearing it up" from drops in this raid is rather questionable. These raids are very "casual-friendly" end game DF activities and I would daresay being able to function comfortably on a level 70 job in a 24-man raid is almost like a rite of passage to more "demanding" level 70 content. If you don't want to play as something in 24-man alliance raids, what content do you need the ilvl gear upgrade for outside of faceroll dungeons?

Runs going "smoother" because people are playing their mains isn't the main issue. Runs go "smoother" if people do the boss mechanics correctly.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Nihility

the ironic thing about this is greed only in a literal sense is the most fair it possibly can be and what people are mad about and calling unfair is the inability to use classes to shift the odds in their own favor

---

Okay, so? Do tell why its wrong that people running content are permitted to have lotting precedence on something they are actively participating in said content as?

I can flip that argument and point out people in favor of this change were just mad and calling the inability to gear up their jobs they couldn't be bothered to bring into the content "unfair" (despite, you know, all other DF content having those loot rules).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Penthea

Saying you won't roll on something in an alliance raid and doing the opposite is not likely to be a reportable offense. If SE cared about that the loot system wouldn't have been changed.

---

It is a reportable offense. If someone, in chat, agreed to not roll on something but then does and wins, they will lose the item and be locked in jail for a short while if reported.

It is a "contract". You have to adhere to contracts you make in-game. That's how Square Enix treats this. If you promise to do something but then do not do that, it's a scam. It is most certainly a reportable offense. A player even posted a while ago screenshots of being jailed and told to discard the item they won like that. They had a short ban only because the GM came to the conclusion that they did roll by accident.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Cidel

snip

---

Maybe some people like a sense of progression in their jobs, even if they don't intend to play them at a high level. Maybe someone wants to have a sense of variety with what they play in dungeons, or raids and want to gear up jobs for that. There's plenty of reasons why someone might want gear, doesn't make them wrong because they don't align with your ideal way of playing the game.

And as for runs going smoother, you're right that its when people do mechanics, but wouldn't you say that mechanics are easier to handle in a job you're more comfortable in? :thinking:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ryuseigoes

wouldn't you say that mechanics are easier to handle in a job you're more comfortable in? :thinking:

---

Mechanics in and of themselves? No. You need to dodge in slightly different ways if you're melee or ranged but within that category it matters less if you're a healer or a caster, you stop casting and you move. Now, if you'd have said "easier to handle mechanics and perform your role", I'd have been down with that, but this is level 70 content. People should have at least that level of familiarity with their jobs at this point. If the only reason that BRD has a DRG is to run dungeons on, they can certainly settle for dungeon drops if not tomestones gear.

Eh. It's true that mechanics are easier on a class you're used to play on.
I haven't played on my summoner in some time, and mainly levled it in stormblood by levling scholar cause shorter queues.
At first when getting used to it again, I have to pay a lot more attention to what I'm casting and which cooldowns are up.
More attention on what skills to use -> less attention on the mechanics and movement. It's harder to keep track of two things at once.
On Whitemage on the other hand, I'm so familiar with it that I can cast the skills blindly without ever looking at my hotkey bar and can fully focus on the mechanics.
So yeah, I do agree with Ryusei that mechanics are easier when comfortable with your class.

@Cidel: Off-topic, but what game is the picture in your Signature from? Looks fun ^^