Linkshells...

Are you in a linkshell that has over 100+ members but when you log on and say (Hello) in it you get 1~3 replies?

Are you ina linkshell that has 100+ members but when you try getting a party to do anything at all you cant get more than.... 1~3 people?

Are youn a linkshell that has 20+ high crafters but when you ask in LS chat for a repair
a synth or a meld you get 0~1 replies?

Are you in a linkshell that has 100+ members but can only recognize 10 of the names you see in the LS members list while scratching your head thinking
"hmm who are all these people? and where are they"

Are you in a linkshell that works hard towards gearing up it's leaders but when it comes to you the leaders are nowhere to be found?

Are you in a linkshell that has no planning, no future, no schedule whatsoever?

Are you in a linkshell that consists of mostly linkshell hoppers that only hop on your linkshell whenever they want to get a party to get something for themselves and as soon as they got it they immidiatelly fade away into the shades again wearing another crest overheads untill the next time they need you again?

Do you own a linkshell like that?

My question is... what is a linkshell for you?
Post below guys.

Just asking questions guys don't turn this thread into a hate thing please..

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Originally Posted by YuriSan

. . .

My question is... what is a linkshell for you?
Post below guys.

Just asking questions guys don't turn this thread into a hate thing please..

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Personally, I'm in two linkshells with 30~60 members and I can pretty much say that I know at least 3/4 the people in both of them, and talk to both just about every hour I'm on; my biggest problem is having to switch back and forth every few seconds to carry conversations sometimes. If they adedd a system where we can use /l1, /l2, /l3, etc. to talk to our multiple linkshells without having to switch our "active" linkshell, I think many of the problems you mentioned--LS hoppers, for example--would be less common; certainly, my life would be a lot easier.

If you have 100+ member LSs with active members that don't ever talk, chances are someone just handed it out to everyone they met. If you have a 100+ LS with mostly inactive people, it probably consisted largely of people who didn't subscribe at the end of the non-sub period.

There seem to be a lot of people who think that linkshells are synonymous with guilds/legions/supergroups from other games, when in reality they're essentially just invite-only chatrooms.

To me, a linkshell is just that - a way for people who enjoy playing together to chat and organize freely, without the overhead and structure that comes with more involved collections like guilds.

Well.. laugh - I'm on Palamecia.. that translates into dead boringness.. but yeah I'm in a decent Linkshell although I'm new in it. As far as your questions go, most of them end in negative answers. There's no reason why I should had leveled to the max level on my own, and now doing the same on my second class. The "community" on my server.. sucks.. so the Linkshells fall into that category. Just waiting on those transfers / mergers.

I made a character just to check server population.. Fabul and Kashuan are suppose to be the lowest - they had 280 and 300 players respectively.. Palamecia sits on 160ish.

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Originally Posted by Dreamer

When in reality they're essentially just invite-only chatrooms.

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Hmm. What makes you say they are just chattrooms?
Can't they be a well organized community of people who work together for something?
Also i have another question for you. Have you mostly been doing stuff in everchanging pickup parties?

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Originally Posted by Dreamer

There seem to be a lot of people who think that linkshells are synonymous with guilds/legions/supergroups from other games, when in reality they're essentially just invite-only chatrooms.

To me, a linkshell is just that - a way for people who enjoy playing together to chat and organize freely, without the overhead and structure that comes with more involved collections like guilds.

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The difficulty is in distinguishing between the groups that consider themselves a major guild and those that are just social hangouts.

I'm currently in one of each. Fortunately, these two shells don't get the problems listed above (one has stayed strong for yonks), but I've been in a few that have had those problems. Usually, when a key member or two decide to stop playing, the glue in the shell dissipates. Eg: Doblyn Riders and Ether, just to name a few.

I make a point of actually breaking my pearl when I consider the shell dead.

Surprisingly I don't have this issue. My linkshell only has about 25 members, but there is almost always people on. However, I have heard of other Linkshells having these issues, especially after subscriptions started. It's also a void silence I would imagine happens between content bursts, lol. On our server there are lots of pick up groups happening though, so maybe your population is just particularly low? Nonetheless, I think some people just make linkshells to get things going somewhere (whether it be into the ground is up to them), then there are some linkshells that have more dedicated players and purpose.

Edit: There are a group of players on our server that have maxed out linkshells though. So, I guess I understand when someone might say they are a glorified chat room.

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Originally Posted by YuriSan

Hmm. What makes you say they are just chattrooms?

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Exactly what she said. Productivity as an 'entity of players' in non-existent.

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Originally Posted by Bulwarkz

Exactly what she said. Productivity as an 'entity of players' in non-existent.

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And that's ok in your opinion or you just stating the facts?

Also there are linkshells that grow strong due to the fact that their members are united, dedicated and proud wearing their linkshell's crest.. which is the reason why they achieve things that make them famous among other servers.

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Originally Posted by YuriSan

And that's ok in your opinion or you just stating the facts?

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May just be my server environment and my own personal experience.

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Originally Posted by Bulwarkz

May just be my server environment and my own personal experience.

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This is likely the case for everyone regardless of what that experience is. It will define their views.

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Originally Posted by Catapult

This is likely the case for everyone regardless of what that experience is. It will define their views.

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Yeah I.. kinda figured that bro

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Originally Posted by Bulwarkz

May just be my server environment and my own personal experience.

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Naah aint only yor server man..
Our shells in Fabul go like this:

October = Born
November = Thrive (lolthrive that is)
December = Go inactive
January = Die out due to inactivity, elitism or drama.

Nope - I am in a LS that is pretty much the exact opposite of that.

My linkshells are decently active, but two of them stay alive so well because they originated from a group of real life friends. They are always chatting in the shell @_@
I know it is easy to find dead and dying shells though :[

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Originally Posted by Vackashken

Nope - I am in a LS that is pretty much the exact opposite of that.

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Ya yours isn't like the majority of linkshells in Fabul though. it's the minority.
Also your ls has the exclussive rule correct?
That alone is a huge contributor towards keeping a linkshell alive..

We have about 4 shells that aint dead, dying or on their way to become social only
like many others did before them.

I'm in an LS of 20 people. We tend to beat content as it comes out quickly and then farm it and go semi-inactive until the next content patch. Right now we are kind of slow because we are tired of Moogle and waiting for 1.21. I have never really had an issue with members not helping me, or not answering me etc. It's my opinion that if your in an LS as big as 100 members and you can't get them to answer you.....F*ck 'em

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Originally Posted by SirOleas

I'm in an LS of 20 people. We tend to beat content as it comes out quickly and then farm it and go semi-inactive until the next content patch. Right now we are kind of slow because we are tired of Moogle and waiting for 1.21. I have never really had an issue with members not helping me, or not answering me etc. It's my opinion that if your in an LS as big as 100 members and you can't get them to answer you.....F*ck 'em

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My opinion was always a linkshell can't ever be good with 100+ people. it's bound to get in the wrong way at some point.

Also i dont have an ls atm. i kinda have a place where i have gathered some random people i done a few things every now and then, just to keep in touche. however i am working hard on shell of about 10 people, and then close recruitment indefinetly lol... aint an easy task tho lemme tell ya that.

BTW your shell sounds great.

Maybe ppl just doesnt like to talk to you.

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Originally Posted by YuriSan

Ya yours isn't like the majority of linkshells in Fabul though. it's the minority.
Also your ls has the exclussive rule correct?
That alone is a huge contributor towards keeping a linkshell alive..

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Yes we do have a 1 LS rule more or less for that reason. Don't like elitism or people with bad attitudes or who are greedy. We adopted a 1 LS rule to keep shell hoppers and such away from us. We try really hard to help each other so its an all for one and one for all kind of thing. It's kept our continuity to be honest seeing as we're the only surviving LS from beta... and its worked.

Like everyone we've had our ups and downs for sure but have always managed to survive and thrive by just having a solid core of good and honest people. With how the game is right now its extra rough on people.

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Originally Posted by Vackashken

Yes we do have a 1 LS rule more or less for that reason. Don't like elitism or people with bad attitudes or who are greedy. We adopted a 1 LS rule to keep shell hoppers and such away from us. We try really hard to help each other so its an all for one and one for all kind of thing. It's kept our continuity to be honest seeing as we're the only surviving LS from beta... and its worked.

Like everyone we've had our ups and downs for sure but have always managed to survive and thrive by just having a solid core of good and honest people. With how the game is right now its extra rough on people.

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Thats the way to go imo...

Many think 1 ls rule is dictatorship though... they cant see that the rule exists for their well being aswell.

From what i've seen (personal expirience) a shell hopper will beat your shell's active state to the ground.

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Originally Posted by Chardrizard

Maybe ppl just doesnt like to talk to you.

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Yes that may also be the case.
I'm greedy, never help anyone, i'm always rude, and i have terrible foot odor...

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Originally Posted by YuriSan

Thats the way to go imo...

Many think 1 ls rule is dictatorship though... they cant see that the rule exists for their well being aswell.

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Well, I won't speak for anyone in particular but many agree with it and understand why. It all boils down to (for us any way) that we just don't want hoppers here. Its that simple and as aforementioned it's worked for us well. Everyone is helpful, we're all pretty tight (because it fosters unity) and so on so forth. It's not for everyone though, thats for sure.

There are two types of linkshells for me

1. Social
2. Endgame

Social linkshell is just a place I go to socialize. Whether if people are asking for quest/mission help, making EXP parties, or willing to help their fellow linkshell member is not a qualifier when I look at social linkshells. It's just a place where I want to be able to have a conversation with someone.

Endgame linkshell is what I tag for any shell whose sole purpose is to organize the linkshell as a whole to accomplish a common goal in a timely manner. Usually no socializing in the shell to reduce chatter.

I don't like most endgame linkshells because they force people to stick to one shell. It is almost as if people are asking if you want to be their friends, exclude all your other friends. I equip whatever social shell I feel like participating at the moment, and try to respond whenever there is a conversation to be had when I am not preoccupied.

OP, I know exactly what you are talking about. I've been a loyal member to my linkshell since 1.18. At this time, I could log on to the game at anytime and see a lot of people in the linkshell and in vent. We were an exclusive shell then, but still recruitment was open and we always would do stuff with other linkshells...

Now, fast forwarding a bit to now... We have about 100 members, and I'll frequently log in and see about 17-20 online. I'll say hello and maybe get one response. This is do to the fact that we sort of "merged" with other linkshells, who still retain loyalty to their original linkshell and don't really use ours unless they want to ask for help. I'm not sure about ya'll, but I am not inclined to help anyone who will just switch over to the linkshell and say "come help me do this, plzkthx" versus someone who you talk to regularly asks you for help (I'll help them anytime).

I'm accounting the problems we have now to the abysmal server count. Everyone has formed tight-nit group of friends that they only want to socialize with. Istory will have about 180 people online at 4pm EST, and a little over 280-300 at 10-11pm EST. It's pitiful

Social Linkshell = chat rooms these are the shells you see with 100+ and take in anybody. Basically all they are and generally people form little groups and only talk/do things with said group. with no recruitment rules. Most people will use it only as a help shell (only talk when the need help ect.) and have another shell on the side and switches between the 2.

Endgame/Event shell = guilds that get together and get things done. These are usually groups with around 25-50ish players. They have recruitment rules and only take in players they think are worthy. They don't bring in any more then they need. These groups are usually made up of friends and friends of friends so everyone usually knows each other making them a much more effective group when needing help to get things done.

There are a bunch of problems and a handful of solutions.

Problems:

1: There are too many people in the linkshell, and most of them are NEVER on (leading to an LS with 100+ members but only maybe 15 active ones).
2: There ARE plenty of people in the linkshell, but a lot of them are lower level characters so when you ask for help, they literally cannot help you (even if they wanted to).
3: There are plenty of people in your linkshell, but most have another shell currently equipped, and are simply too busy or lazy to switch shells JUST to answer you.

Solutions:

1: Make it so Linkshell leaders can kick people who aren't on, when they aren't near you. (Make sure inactive people get the boot so LS leaders don't have to remake every few months.)
2: Allow different 'levels' of linkshell members... not just member/leader/admin. That way, you can set someone to 'social' or someone to 'endgame', etc, as an easy way to understand the capabilities of each member.
3: Change the way you talk in linkshell. I fully support the /ls1 /ls2 /ls3 idea. Having to switch between shells sucks, and to be honest, I hate doing it.

It would also be helpful if the linkshell member list didn't display the names of members who have the shell completely unequipped (i.e. people who aren't even listening to the current conversation). Alternately, it could list those people in a completely separate category at the bottom of the list. That might be the best option, actually.

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Originally Posted by YuriSan

My question is... what is a linkshell for you?
Post below guys.

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Personally i dont like big Linkshells for certain Reasons. The one im in is pretty small, but since they were carefully selected i can count on them. When we do things, you get used to them pretty fast and will know pretty fast how everyone is acting and how you can cover up certain Things, which is pretty hard/almost impossible in a 100+ Linkshell.

Beside that, you will gear out smaller Linkshells way faster than a bigger Linkshell. While you can do that in a small LS in a couple Weeks, it will prolly take Month in a bigger Linkshell. It also appears, as soon as it comes to HNM's and "called Drops", that you will cause a lot of Trouble in a Big LS, since it is possible that some People have to wait a long Time to get something.

In a small Shell you will learn to respect each other pretty fast, you will learn their personal actings pretty fast and also can make some close Friends with everyone, which wont happen in a very Big Linkshell. It can happen that you prolly dont ever talk to everyone in a 100+ Linkshell.

And so on.. and so on.. there are way more Reasons why i would go into a small LS over a big LS.

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Originally Posted by Nero

Personally i dont like big Linkshells for certain Reasons. The one im in is pretty small, but since they were carefully selected i can count on them. When we do things, you get used to them pretty fast and will know pretty fast how everyone is acting and how you can cover up certain Things, which is pretty hard/almost impossible in a 100+ Linkshell.

Beside that, you will gear out smaller Linkshells way faster than a bigger Linkshell. While you can do that in a small LS in a couple Weeks, it will prolly take Month in a bigger Linkshell. It also appears, as soon as it comes to HNM's and "called Drops", that you will cause a lot of Trouble in a Big LS, since it is possible that some People have to wait a long Time to get something.

In a small Shell you will learn to respect each other pretty fast, you will learn their personal actings pretty fast and also can make some close Friends with everyone, which wont happen in a very Big Linkshell. It can happen that you prolly dont ever talk to everyone in a 100+ Linkshell.

And so on.. and so on.. there are way more Reasons why i would go into a small LS over a big LS.

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That reply is like right on the money..
Thats the shell i aim for atm.

i hate when you do events people get geared up, use up crafting resources then leave to another shell and your still left high and dry.

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Originally Posted by YuriSan

Hmm. What makes you say they are just chattrooms?
Can't they be a well organized community of people who work together for something?
Also i have another question for you. Have you mostly been doing stuff in everchanging pickup parties?

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It really depends what kind of linkshell it is. I have a multiple linkshells, but my main is a tightly knit group of friends, whereas my social linkshells are kinda just "there" if I'm bored.

The game is so bad it doesn't matter if you have 20 solid members running Moogle all day everyday. You're still going to hate yourself for playing this game and not spending your 2012 better until 2.0. Even if 2.0 bombs, theres going to be a massive sky rocket in server populations for the first month. You'll probably meet a ton of new cool people and actually have fun. Maybe even recruit some newbies n show them the ropes if that's your kind of thing. It's going to be a completely new game, not like your gear now will be optimal after the overhaul (an excuse to not stress over finding a linkshell to call home/run content with... during the games lowest population time).

The thought of running Ifrit or Moogle 100 times for your LS mates after you've already obtained all the weapons may sound like fun, but it really isn't.

Hmm,

Okay so I'm the leader of Kisses LS on my server. The LS currently has 31 members online "11:25pm EST". Peak times, it's up to 45 members, and slow times perhaps 25 members online. There is ALWAYS events going on at least one a day, and they are pre-organized. Also, our members always help eachother, and a Hello will usually get you 4-10 responses.

There is a couple mindsets I've seen for people who lead their shells. One mindset is that they recruit only the best. Very exclusive, and very elitist. Usually these shells live quite long, and are quite small. They do an event a night "I think", and are respected within the server. I've seen these shells die, and I've seen them do well. Most that do well are groups of friends from FFXI servers who moved together.

Another kind of Shell I've seen is the Anyone can join shell. This is likely the most common shell. The biggest problem with this shell is that usually some stupid person creates the shell, and just wants to collect people. They usually have a lot of drama, or aren't active, or simple don't care. As a result, they don't put much time into growing the shell, improving it, organizing events ETC. In order to do well leading this kind of shell, you must have a leader or leaders who have the mindset that their shell is ALWAYS dieing. Everyday I look at my shell, I check the numbers of people logging in, how many events go on a day, how active the chat is. If I even see the slightest drop, I do my best to recruit. This was EXTREMELY important earlier when the shell was new. Also, when the shell hits 120+ members, we restart moving the active members to the new shell, and recruiting new member with the extra space. This next shell will be our 4th shell. We're currently at 98 members.

Problems I've seen that leaders make:

1. They make their friends leaders -- Titles give people big egos. Giving someone a title over someone else creates resentment, and if they are a bad leader, drama. Best to make everyone the same rank. Leaders will create themselves. They will organize events, and gain respect of their members. There is no need to make it so one person can feel they are more valuable than another. It's Drama.

2. They only allow you to have one shell -- This is a social game. If you only allow your members to have one shell, you BETTER have the best shell out there because if players don't have the capability to join events or make friends with other players outside your shell "other than shout", they are not going to stay for long. Instead, of a member picking up another shell, and keeping yours, they will leave your shell and likely bring some of their friends with them.

3. They don't engage their members -- People come online, they don't want to do a lot of thinking. They don't want to get everyone together, set up member lists, and set times for events. As a leader, you are the organizer. I've created a system for my shell where members can create an "event" on our website, and members can simply sign up. It's great, and people can easily schedule and execute events from it. If you're a leader, and you don't engage your shell, you can only hope you're lucky enough to have a couple members who will do it for you, or people will quickly join a shell that's more engaging.

4. Creating a bad rep for your shell -- We have this one shell on the server, where if you even mention their name, people say "ew". Honestly, their not bad, and their leader has all jobs maxed at 50. The problem is that he botted most of them, and he shouts for members for events, and then yells at them when they fail. The only people I see join his shell these days are noobs who don't know better.

5. Websites are not user friendly -- I hate sites where I have to sign up, get approval, and then remember stupid credentials that must have capital this, a digit, minimum of 8 characters, and than we can't forget email verification. It's a online game. Not a bank account. Make it so your users can get in, get out. Non-members aren't going to care about your super secret moogle strat.


If you're going to look for a LS, you need to find a LS with a leader who doesn't play favorites. Who engages his or her members into doing events. Who unites the LS to complete challenges and goals for the LS, and who recruits like no other. This is an extremely hard shell to find, but when you do, you will have a family that will stand the test of drama, time, and bad updates!


Closing note: This is just my experience. I'm sure I'm wrong. I'm 15 years old, but this advice that I've used has made my LS one of the top linkshells in the server in activity, ranking, and size. I'm realy proud of it, and I'd love to see more Linkshells like it because I firmly believe that it's the families people make in FFXIV that will keep them, not the updates. Though the updates are certainly nice hehe.

Astin Prey

If you would like to see how many Events are planned: http://kissesls.net/
-- The top part shows how long until the event, the event, and how many members are signed up. As you see, it's quite active! This is what I think is the key to success for Kisses. That and recruiting! Well, and no playing favorites I.E. No IN-LS- drama


Update: I basicly just wrote a guide here. I'm going to make my own Post for this as well. I want more peeps to see it in hopes they will make a good shell, and unite people in their server. Forgive me!!

I am a member of 2 main active Linkshells.
I know all the members on both of my main shells and I can party with any of them at any given time.
Finding someone to party with, or finding a crafter to fix my stuff was never a problem for me.

I support the having more than one LS mentality as long as you have nothing to gain for being 100% loyal with one guild.

So a LS for me is an easy way to find ppl to help you with ingame stuff, or chat and socialize.

To me?

It's a roleplay organisation medium >.>