Community chest theft?

Hello!

So my free company just had an instance where one member cleaned out the company chest of ALL OUR ITEMS, then immediately left the free company and jumped servers.

I reported it to the GMs, and while they responded quickly and were super friendly, they said there was nothing they could do in regards to company chest theft or to the player that did this. Which is really disheartening, as this player clearly had malicious intent and this negatively impacts our whole company.

Is there is some other way I can report this and have something done about it? Please let me know if there is! I did go ahead and submit a post in the Feedback forum per the GMs suggestion so that something may be added in the future to fix this, but...my company is really bummed that we've hit a dead end on this.

Thanks!

Nope, if they had permissions to access and use the chest, then there is nothing the GM's or anyone else can do.

Be tighter on your permissions and only give access to those who really need it.

Nope, if they had permission to access the chests, then there is nothing they can do about it. Need to not give that permission out to just anyone.

GMs don't consider it theft they consider it poor management and personal drama.

It's because of the risk of theft that my fc's chest has access attached to ranks.

Those who are in the trial rank can only access tab 1 which has nothing we cannot easily replace. Members can access tab 1 and 2, which also has nothing that cannot be easily replaced. Tab 3 has all the valuable items and only officers can access it. Members can request an officer to withdraw something on their behalf. Officers are also the only ones with access to the gil.

This does mean we have very little space to store valuable items but it also means they cannot be stolen.

Not saying it's OP's fault. Their fc is obviously too nice to consider someone would steal something. They learned the hard way bad eggs exist and it's very sad that it happened.

SE should really make an exception for players like OP spoke about. It is obvious their intention is theft and SE have access to logs to clearly show a player took as much as they could get before leaving.

Thank you so much Penthea!

My free company is small, we have less than 20 people. And everyone in was a first time player who joined the game/FC because they knew us in real life. The person in question was ironically the only person in the FC who was established and had played for many years. They had created an alt to join our FC, and had been a member for over a year before they did what they did.

While we did give all members access to the items in the chest, we only allowed officers access to the gil. That was the only thing they didnt steal, and its only because they couldnt. At least we still have that, though.

Your companys policies are actually a really good idea! Im gonna forward this on to the other officers to see if we can start the 1-2-3 page idea!

Again, thank you for your feedback! And your understanding! Its really appreciated. I suppose we were all too green to know, but now we know better and can take future actions to prevent this from happening again!

Yeah, no. There shouldn't be any interpretation of intent. Because there's always going to be an instance when the interpretation turns out wrong.

While we're on the subject, you should check the permissions of each rank you have established.
Rememeber this, the game at a base level, only recognizes two ranks. You're either the FC leader, or you are not the FC leader.
So having Rank 1 being the master, rank 2 being your officers, and rank 3 people players with rank 4 people potato lalafells, doesn't actually inherently protect your officers from management from your potatoes.

Just make sure you know who is set to allowed to promote and kick and demote and invite, and all those options. Make sure it's set appropriately for every rank you have set up in your FC. A new rank will get default options, not something 'lower' than the latest rank.

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Originally Posted by Penthea

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But it's literally the fault of the FC for putting trust into someone, the moral of the story is don't trust just anybody with access, I tend to jump a lot of FC's and I can't tell you how much stuff they leave in there for the taking if I desired to, they just trust random people who've been in the FC less than a months time and bam. I don't blame the FC for being upset but I do think that people need to be a little more cautious with what they put in there if they have an open chest to most of the members or don't allow an open chest and only trust players that have been with the FC for a long time.

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Originally Posted by Canadane

While we're on the subject, you should check the permissions of each rank you have established.
Rememeber this, the game at a base level, only recognizes two ranks. You're either the FC leader, or you are not the FC leader.
So having Rank 1 being the master, rank 2 being your officers, and rank 3 people players with rank 4 people potato lalafells, doesn't actually inherently protect your officers from management from your potatoes.

Just make sure you know who is set to allowed to promote and kick and demote and invite, and all those options. Make sure it's set appropriately for every rank you have set up in your FC. A new rank will get default options, not something 'lower' than the latest rank.

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I thought that was fixed. Was it really never changed?

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Originally Posted by Ilenya

I thought that was fixed. Was it really never changed?

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Well... there was nothing to fix.
It's working as intended. It gives full administrative control to the FC master.

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Originally Posted by Canadane

Well... there was nothing to fix.
It's working as intended. It gives full administrative control to the FC master.

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We must be thinking a different thing. I remember a while back there was an issue where people could promote to ranks higher than they were, which was letting people gain access to the FC chest they shouldn't be allowed. That was what I thought was fixed. Was I wrong?

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Originally Posted by Ilenya

We must be thinking a different thing. I remember a while back there was an issue where people could promote to ranks higher than they were, which was letting people gain access to the FC chest they shouldn't be allowed. That was what I thought was fixed. Was I wrong?

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It is not fixed, i think because, technically, it is working as intended. It is the ability to promote or demote, and it lets you do exactly that. Not saying it shouldn't be limited to promoting only to your rank, but yeah.

This is the FC equivalent to putting someone's name on a bank account and handing them the PIN.

You don't do it unless the contents are easily replaced, or unless the person is someone you can explicitly trust.

everything expensive always goes on retainer, if I had many people in fc and a community chest, I wouldn't even use it for expensive items or gil.

Due to the fact SE always does nothing even on FFXI.

heard about this happening on FFXI few times and GM's do nothing but funny thing is if you lot on a item and another person wanted it and they gm you then you have to drop it and even here in ffxiv drop items..

but they cant make that person give stuff back? that is funny.

Some lessons are just learned the hard way, sadly.

It really is better to just err on the side of caution and keep the community chest rules strict for everyone but the most trustworthy, as I've heard stories of even long-term FC members suddenly going bad and cleaning out the chest because they got offended by the FC leader or some such.

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

It is not fixed, i think because, technically, it is working as intended. It is the ability to promote or demote, and it lets you do exactly that. Not saying it shouldn't be limited to promoting only to your rank, but yeah.

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You cannot promote to a rank higher than your own if you have the permission to do so. Something I heard through past convos about being able to promote higher and FC's being stolen in their entirety. SE Fixed it to where only the Master of the FC can assign a new master, and doing so will immediately drop said master to the lowest rank, and all ranks under the FC master can only promote to their current rank to prevent that very thing from happening. Assigning permissions to the FC chest based on the ranks is the easiest way to control access and prevent mishaps from happening.

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Originally Posted by Ilenya

We must be thinking a different thing. I remember a while back there was an issue where people could promote to ranks higher than they were, which was letting people gain access to the FC chest they shouldn't be allowed. That was what I thought was fixed. Was I wrong?

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Again there are only two ranks. Master, and not master.
If you give permissions to promote ranks (better to be called 'change ranks'), ranks 2-8 are all equal. Your officer tier is no different than your Lalafell tier.

This is working as intended as others mentioned, as full administrative control still rests with the master.

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Originally Posted by Canadane

This is working as intended as others mentioned

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Working as intended does not mean it is working good.

Being able to promote people above yourself is just plain wrong.

Years ago there was a 17 page long debate whether or not it would be considered stealing from an FC chest even though you were granted permissions to access the chest etc.

Topic: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...can-do-nothing.


GM responded on Page 15:

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Originally Posted by Enkrateia

Greetings, DarkDedede!

This thread was brought to my attention, and I am currently looking into the situation. There may have been a miscommunication on the part of the GMs about our ability to investigate, and I am making sure that this was looked into. Sufficient evidence to treat this type of behaviour as fraud can certainly be difficult to obtain; however, these types of situations are ones that GMs can look into to try to find such evidence and rectify the damage that was done.

Thank you for your patience while we look into this.

LGM Enkrateia

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Originally Posted by LalaRu

Working as intended does not mean it is working good.

Being able to promote people above yourself is just plain wrong.

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There is no "above" you when you're not the Master.
All non-master ranks are equal. This is a bit strange yes, but it does maximize the amount of control a master has over their FC.

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Originally Posted by KerriganV

You cannot promote to a rank higher than your own if you have the permission to do so. Something I heard through past convos about being able to promote higher and FC's being stolen in their entirety. SE Fixed it to where only the Master of the FC can assign a new master, and doing so will immediately drop said master to the lowest rank, and all ranks under the FC master can only promote to their current rank to prevent that very thing from happening. Assigning permissions to the FC chest based on the ranks is the easiest way to control access and prevent mishaps from happening.

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There is no true hierarchy other than the top rank and everything else. If you have it set to show:
Master
Rank 1 - promote/demote
Rank 2
Rank 3
Rank 4 - promote/demote
Rank 5
Rank 6

Rank 4 in this example can promote anyone at all (including themselves, but not the Master rank) up to Rank 1, they can also demote anyone up to Rank 1 to any other rank.

My chest is full of food buffs and dyestuffs... gil can be added but not removed... all gil added is considered a donation to improving the fc house... if you have access to it in the chest help yourself...

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Originally Posted by Zeonx

everything expensive always goes on retainer, if I had many people in fc and a community chest, I wouldn't even use it for expensive items or gil.

Due to the fact SE always does nothing even on FFXI.

heard about this happening on FFXI few times and GM's do nothing but funny thing is if you lot on a item and another person wanted it and they gm you then you have to drop it and even here in ffxiv drop items..

but they cant make that person give stuff back? that is funny.

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You're mistaken, GMs very much do have the power to give and take away items. If you join a Party Finder party with a condition, like called or reserved drops, and there's proof that everyone agreed to it, you can be reported for not adhering to it and the GMs will remove the items you gained by breaking the agreement and give it to the proper person.

For example, I obtained one of my primal horses like this back in 2.0 after the guy rolled on it and won even though there had been a previous in-party-chat agreement that I had dibs. One GM report later and I logged in to find the horn in my inventory, and gone from his Lodestone character page.

The issue with company chests is about them not wanting to get involved in potentially unclear player disputes, not about GM powers.