Sch Fairy Revision Ideas

Does anyone feel like Scholar Eos and Selene are little confused on their powers?
If Eos is a healer assistant why two types of buffs. Only Illumination has benefits. Covenant makes no sense because 1. boost to magic defense. Really? Physical defense makes for sense on Selene, not advocating for her just saying. 2. Eos would be better with an party group healing even if its lower power then Succcor.

Selene needs better powers too. Remove Silent Dusk, nice power but at one shot at 40 seconds and not all enemies use magic make it a wasted power spot so why not make her a full buff fairy. Keep Caress but drop recast to 20 sec, Fey Wind and All around Physical defense buff power with a shared recast time of 40 with One power cast resets the other at 30 secs so you could micro manage power swaps at 30 sec intervals.

Now if Square really wanted to be nice to scholars introduce a third fairy(vote for moogle) for solo play. This Fairy would be debuff style and horrible for bosses so when we solo we could actually have fun. 1st power would be embrace at 200 potency because when we solo healing isn't really the problem. 2nd power would be and intelligent blind/silence power, if the enemy has 90% physical and 10% magical attacks blind is used. Reverse if Magic is dominant. 3rd power would be defense down so we could have fun with our single target attack power (*cough* White Mage Holy, Astrologian Gravity *cough*). The final power would be a stun because again micro manage.

So again:
Eos: 1. Embrace
2. Whispering Dawn
3. Group Hug ( party wide heal)
4. Fey Illumination

Selene:1. Embrace
2. Fey Caress(shortened recast)
3. Fey Wind (recast time shared and short switched with 4)
4. Fey Ward (defense up[recast time shared and short switched with 3])

Moogle(please): Powers not available for boss battles
1. Embrace (150 to 200 potency)
2. Moogle Shot(Intelligent blind/silence debuff)
3. Moogle Storm(Defense down)
4. Moogle Spike(Stun)

The problem with giving buff actual dps buff to Selene or even a new fairy, mooglr, it would make eos useless. This game is all about dps, more often than not dps is a problem and not heal. As long as your party doesn't take useless dmg, heal isn't really an issue. Just look at OS4 neo, some healer spend 90% of their cast doing dps. All they need to do is an aoe heal for the occasional burst.
You can not have too much dps, but you can have too much healing. If they'd give better buff debuff to Selene (dps buff), eos would just be used for early practice until your party has a rough idea on how to dodge all the dodgable stuff then you'd switch for Selene. Making eos useless / pug only.
Someone actually made a very nice proposition for Selene making her an on par healer with eos but healing in a very different manner.

And considering a potential third fairy, it won't happen. At best you'll get mooglr as a skin

Understand what you are saying. Scholars are shield healers but we come from Arcanist. We are pets class geared towards healing. We provide barrier while our pets pick up the slack to increase potency in our pets mean we are not needed as much and will make us lazy thinking our pets can heal and we dps. Also if we are just barriers why not just pick astro they can use shields and have buffs as well

Slyvain picking eos would be safety in Duty Roulette where you can safely do healing while assisting in dps with people you don't know, and if you say then don't do duty roulette isn't that just sad because there are some people like to help help strangers do dungeons and selene would be used in advanced group to clear faster and boss battles. Like I said third fairy is just a wish for fun solo.

I also like to recall People we come from Arcanist, but to justify giving Selene a dps skill. I still Feel like we should be able to dps more. ( Via selene which results into less healing, and indirectly fairy switch with dissipation)

Simple:

Make EOS the single target healing fairy and make SELENE be the AOE heal fairy. Give Eos a light single target regen, Send Whispering Dawn to Selene, remove the silence. It's not useful anyway.

When aetherpact / Fey Union is used, Eos does massive single heal while Selene does an AOE pulse style heal.

Similar to MCH turrets.

There's 2 types of changes I'd make to scholar's fairy. First one is the fairy skills.

Eos. I'd make convenent a physical and magic shield..

Selene I'd buff wind to about 5% or so. and slash the recast on caress. maybe as low 10 seconds might sound op but will tie in with the other change i'm about to mention
I'd also scrap silent dusk and make it something else entirely. perhaps something similar to contagion from smn or maybe a small tp boost to a designated party member.

The other change i'd make to the fairys is the whole aether system and the fairy guage. change it so all aetherflow stacks build the fairy guage like they already do maybe in bigger steps. 15-20 per charge used instead of 10. but also make it so fairy actions also build the guage maybe 5-10 points for every embrace the fairy cast.

I'd then tie this guage to all fairy actions. some would have a static cost for example fey caress or fey illumination might cost 20 points per use (in line wth the lower cooldown mentioned earlier)

Then with other skills like whispering dawn or fey wind they might have a different cost. maybe 20 points to trigger the effect followed by 10 points per tick as long as the effect is active. (make them stoppable like fey union so you can conserve guage when you don't need it.)

Something like this would make the whole fairy system a lot more interactive and make the fairy guage system a lot more interesting and functional at all levels. you'd build a lot more fairy guage at 70 with these changes but it wouldn't be to bad as you'd be using the guage for all the skills. a full fairy guage would be consumed in 9 ticks of fey wind so would be 9 ticks (27-30 seconds) which isn't to it's current effects. you might be able to extend it a bit with a couple of embraces and lustrates so you could for example pop fey wind during a boss add phase or you could stop the effect early if the adds are dead and conserve some guage for the incoming raid wide damage from the bosses ultimate.

I think something like this would make the fairy system a lot more fun and interactive.

I'd rather the shield aspect move to Selene and keep Eos as the Regen fairy. This lets SCH be overall flexible, but their stances are locked behind a cast and fairy cooldowns.

"The sunlight of Eos doth soothe and shield."
"The moonlight of Selene doth silence and strengthen."

We kind of have this right now, except the latter is a little underwhelming. Eos soothes with Whispering Dawn, shields with Fey Covenant and brings utility via Fey Illumination. Meanwhile Selene can Silence, strengthens with Fey Wind and has utility in the form of an AoE Esuna.

I actually think they could keep Selene relevant as she is by doing the following. Buff Fey Wind to 5% and maybe give Silent Dusk a stun effect as well. If they change Embrace to an instant cast (as many people have already mentioned), it would actually make using this ability relatively easy and effective. Fey Caress is usually not needed, but there have been times in casual content where it can prove useful. This move could potentially be changed, but it's not terrible.

The main change would need to be to Dissipation. If it actually allows a penalty-free instant Faerie swap, it makes both Faeries viable while also marginally increasing the skill ceiling of the job. As with everything in this game, if there is one slot available people will figure out what the best is and stick with it. The Faeries are no exception to this rule. Incorporating a swap mechanic that allows you to utilise what both Faeries have to offer in different parts of a fight will not only make the job more engaging, but actually mitigate the irrelevance that Selene currently has. And the best part is that she doesn't need to be buffed to God tier to shine. There simply would be no reason not to use them both in a fight.

Here is what I'd change:

Eos
- changing Fey Covenant from "increases magic defense by 20%" to "increase defense by 10%" ( not all mobs deal magic damage )

Selene
- change Silent Dusk to a +5% slow aoe skill ( stacking with shadowflare )
- reduce caress cooldown to 40-35 seconds
- empower Fey Wind to 5%

Both
- empower embrace from a 250 heal potency skill to a 300-350 one ( physick has a 400 heal potency and we know how "not so useful" it is endgame wise , fairies now heal for about 3 k hp , physick for 8 k....tanks have about 45+ k hp , healers have about 35...a 3 k heal , even though it can be added to your main spell, is not useful and the addition feels unpractical ).

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Originally Posted by Elyann

Here is what I'd change:

Eos
- changing Fey Covenant from "increases magic defense by 20%" to "increase defense by 10%" ( not all mobs deal magic damage )

Selene
- change Silent Dusk to a +5% slow aoe skill ( stacking with shadowflare )
- reduce caress cooldown to 40-35 seconds
- empower Fey Wind to 5%

Both
- empower embrace from a 250 heal potency skill to a 300-350 one ( physick has a 400 heal potency and we know how "not so useful" it is endgame wise , fairies now heal for about 3 k hp , physick for 8 k....tanks have about 45+ k hp , healers have about 35...a 3 k heal , even though it can be added to your main spell, is not useful and the addition feels unpractical ).

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The last one seems overpowered with rouse

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Originally Posted by Jukebox12

The last one seems overpowered with rouse

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Pet potency is not the same as our character potency. It used to be 300 in HW and that was a nerfed version of Embrace too. I would love to have Embrace buffed at the cost of one of our heals, but I don't think it will happen. Mainly because in lower level content, it makes the Faerie very powerful.

We shouldn't really get jobs balanced based on content outside of Savage though, and our Faerie being only marginally better than a Regen tick is pretty disappointing. Maybe in 5.0 we will actually be a proper pet job with a powerful pet focused style.

Fey Wind boils down to everyone receiving a 1.5% speed increase since it is up 50% of the fight. Making it more potent would be game breaking imo since Scholars have Chain Strategem now as well so if Fey Wind gets a buff we will probably see a nerf to Strategem. These are both reliable party buffs unlike Astro and their cards.

I would like Physick to interact with Embrace by adding a healing buff to target that increases Embrace Potency for 15-30 seconds. This would be a nice trait for Scholars to use at later levels that solves the problem of lowered pet potency and gives Physick a real purpose. All healers should have a proc or useful trait attached to their base heal.

Silent Dusk has always been trash. Silence, stun, and sleep can be resisted so I always believed that the fairy should offer a defense down debuff. Something that remains useful in every encounter and can't be resisted. This way no ability is wasted like Eos who is always beneficial.

Scholar is finally stable again.
I don't want them to change anything else so just
No.

No more changes.
Everything's fine now.

Even if Silent dusk is useless.
The dispel became more useful now because of esuna being in cross class system.

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Originally Posted by Kabzy

Pet potency is not the same as our character potency. It used to be 300 in HW and that was a nerfed version of Embrace too. I would love to have Embrace buffed at the cost of one of our heals, but I don't think it will happen. Mainly because in lower level content, it makes the Faerie very powerful.

We shouldn't really get jobs balanced based on content outside of Savage though, and our Faerie being only marginally better than a Regen tick is pretty disappointing. Maybe in 5.0 we will actually be a proper pet job with a powerful pet focused style.

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It's a mana free heal no matter what potency. The higher potency it the overpower it is

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Originally Posted by Jukebox12

It's a mana free heal no matter what potency. The higher potency it the overpower it is

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This is a silly argument though. Firstly, SCH has the hardest time with mana anyway. You can argue that AST has weaker MP refresh, but they also have much less mana usage in the first place. And secondly the whole point in us having weaker heals is because of the Faerie.

Given that Cleric Stance doesn't penalise the other healers anymore, there was literally no reason for the Faerie to get nerfed again. And before people argue about Eos solo healing everything, it's irrelevant to talk about job balance based on overgeared fights.

I will never not be entertained by this meme that having the highest potency regens in the game for zero MP, 100% uptime, and no GCD investment is "weak", especially on the non-HoT focused healer.

Technically the strongest regen in the game is Fey Union, which depending on how you look at it has one the highest investments of any skill in the game (Aetherflow stacks and fairy lockout), as well as one of the highest cooldowns (variable cost based on a resource that gives us a whopping 3-4 ticks per minute).

As long as Embrace has to fill the roles of both "SCH's regen" as well as "making up for SCH's lower healing potencies", it will continue to be called weak at it's current level, because it just isn't strong enough to really cover both. On top of that there's the mechanical issues with it - it is the only "regen" in the game that can only be on one target at a time, there's no way to actually set that target because even if you spam Embrace throughout the entire fight, the AI will still sometimes decide to ignore you and do it's own thing, you straight up unavoidably lose Embraces in some movement-heavy fights, and that same AI also deciding that Embrace will sometimes interfere with casting other potentially time-sensitive abilities (The amount of times I've had Eos completely ignore my telling her to use Whispering Dawn for the entire duration of Rouse...).

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Originally Posted by Semirhage

I will never not be entertained by this meme that having the highest potency regens in the game for zero MP, 100% uptime, and no GCD investment is "weak", especially on the non-HoT focused healer.

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This is a simple case of you failing to see the entire kit of the job then. And also how the job actually functions, or ‘should’ function.

It’s a pet job, a good portion of our power should come from our pet. Generally nobody is asking for buffs here, all people have asked for is for Selene to be made relevant. And I clearly stated that if they would buff Embrace to make the Faeries more potent, another part of our kit would need to be nerfed.

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Originally Posted by Kabzy

This is a silly argument though. Firstly, SCH has the hardest time with mana anyway. You can argue that AST has weaker MP refresh, but they also have much less mana usage in the first place. And secondly the whole point in us having weaker heals is because of the Faerie.

Given that Cleric Stance doesn\\'t penalise the other healers anymore, there was literally no reason for the Faerie to get nerfed again. And before people argue about Eos solo healing everything, it\\'s irrelevant to talk about job balance based on overgeared fights.

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How are you having problems with mp

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Originally Posted by Hottotrot

Slyvain picking eos would be safety in Duty Roulette where you can safely do healing while assisting in dps with people you don't know, and if you say then don't do duty roulette isn't that just sad because there are some people like to help help strangers do dungeons and selene would be used in advanced group to clear faster and boss battles. Like I said third fairy is just a wish for fun solo.

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This is exactly what I said. Pug only
I'm all for a moogle skin tho

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Originally Posted by Jukebox12

How are you having problems with mp

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I didn't at any point state that I was having problems with MP. But when you're constantly playing through savage fights and using Miasma II to weave in oGCDs, you'll notice that you actually do need to somewhat manage your MP. Unlike the other two jobs which do just fine if no resses have to be thrown out. Add that with the fact that our kit is generally more expensive, you do need to watch your MP bar every now and then.

I'm not saying it's a dire situation on SCH, it's really not. But once again you have to look at the entire kit of the job, you can't just compare one thing with another.

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Originally Posted by Kabzy

This is a simple case of you failing to see the entire kit of the job then. And also how the job actually functions, or ‘should’ function.

It’s a pet job, a good portion of our power should come from our pet. Generally nobody is asking for buffs here, all people have asked for is for Selene to be made relevant. And I clearly stated that if they would buff Embrace to make the Faeries more potent, another part of our kit would need to be nerfed.

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I have to agree. Back in SCH's golden age (late 2.x particularly comes to mind), the faerie was strong enough that its inherent disadvantages of occasionally contrary pet AI and need for constant micromanagement to be as effective as possible were more of an acceptable check on its power level.

At this point SE has obviously been shifting more of the healing power away from the pet and back to the SCH's actions, which is a legitimate design decision, but it does raise the question of what can or should be done to keep the pet kit feeling fun and relevant. Personally I was okay with having fewer intrinsic healing options and managing my pet's relatively strong abilities to make up for it, but since AST's introduction it has been deemed that each healer needs to be able to do nearly everything, and the faerie has been both deliberately nerfed and overtaken by power creep. While the faerie is obviously still useful (even though Selene does need help), it feels increasingly more like a gimmick than it does a vital part of the SCH kit

Has anyone ever successfully used Silent Dusk to Silence anything? Sometimes I have seen it work on a enemy in a mob when I leave her on Sic but it doesn't even seem practical to try and use that ability as a real mitigation tool. Giving Selene a burst heal like Medica just seems so much more useful. It would obviously be less powerful than Whispering Dawn and if it could be synced with Rouse this fairy would be perfect. It just feels really dangerous to lose so much healing potential in Eos kit for a lackluster Silence and fancy Esuna from Selene.

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Originally Posted by NobleWinter

Has anyone ever successfully used Silent Dusk to Silence anything? Sometimes I have seen it work on a enemy in a mob when I leave her on Sic but it doesn't even seem practical to try and use that ability as a real mitigation tool. Giving Selene a burst heal like Medica just seems so much more useful. It would obviously be less powerful than Whispering Dawn and if it could be synced with Rouse this fairy would be perfect. It just feels really dangerous to lose so much healing potential in Eos kit for a lackluster Silence and fancy Esuna from Selene.

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I recall using her to silence the odd mechanic in 2.x raids, but it was never really needed. If it was that important to silence the target, you usually had another player with a silencing action of their own, which was preferable to wrestling with pet lack of responsiveness.

Her silence seems to be more consistent if you leave her on Sic, but A) Sic is the devil and robs you of a ton of healing output since you can't manually control Embrace outside of Obey and B) she will almost never manage to silence anything that matters and will gleefully blow her CD on targets that cannot be silenced, anyway.

While I do agree that Selene needs some sort of edge to justify using her over Eos, I think its far to easy to tip the scale the other way and thats not healthy, even SMN has the option of choosing their pet based on party comp. The only thing i feel comfortable with would be to changing Silent Dusk to something that would justify using her, like say a Physical Damage defense buff.

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Originally Posted by NobleWinter

Has anyone ever successfully used Silent Dusk to Silence anything? Sometimes I have seen it work on a enemy in a mob when I leave her on Sic but it doesn't even seem practical to try and use that ability as a real mitigation tool. Giving Selene a burst heal like Medica just seems so much more useful. It would obviously be less powerful than Whispering Dawn and if it could be synced with Rouse this fairy would be perfect. It just feels really dangerous to lose so much healing potential in Eos kit for a lackluster Silence and fancy Esuna from Selene.

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Um... once in A6S; Blaster. I think. I started that fight with Selene into a Dissipation swap when Brawler went into his second phase, and one of the times our BRD used his silence early. We were never entirely sure if I managed the silence or if our MNK managed to get Arm of the Destroyer off in time.