Tacked-on Resource in SB is sort of... glunky

So, I've been playing with my FC, and a lot of them tend to agree that the resource management that they have now feels extremely clunky. Especially my WHM, complains that the lily system isn't needed at all and it's just a bunch of hogwash. Even the new "Stoneskin" is hogwash.

However, on the flip side... the samurai and rdm in my FC is agreed that the resource gauge feels good on them. Why? They were visualized and concept WITH the resource gauge, so it's natural for it to flow smoothly because their concept was based on it.

But the older class feels sort of... off putting to say. They weren't based on a gauge in the first place and a lot of them don't add any true meaning to the game other than allowing you to know which stance you're in.

How do you guys feel about it?

I've seen this being the general consensus when it comes to gauges that's not SAM or RDM. I mean, heck, for SCH, it is literally tacked on at the end (except for Aetherflow). I think NIN integrated it better than most, and I can understand why it exists (to give less skilled players large visual queues that light up for doing certain things that you want to be doing for your Job). Like, for NIN, you want to be on the boss as much as possible for those Auto attacks, thus the gauge fills up for each one. For SAM, hitting positionals and using each of your skills builds up your gauge, again, showing and rewarding players for doing what you should be doing. SCH's fairy gauge builds up for using your Aetherflow instead of sitting on it (though the reward itself is very lackluster).

People argue if WHM's "reward" is worth spending the actions to get it (since good healers don't really want to cast Cure I and Cure II if it can be avoided, so this teaches bad WHMs less optimal play), and some essential job functions were just moved to the gauge which can be a detriment in trying to figure out who has what buff (it mostly hurts double AST comps the most, but there are probably other cases). And, weirdly, other important buffs, like DRG's Heavy Thrust, MCH's Hot Shot, and RDM's dualcast (a job that was designed with the gauge in mind, btw) weren't put on the job gauges, making them buffs that need to be tracked in the buff bar. This goes against the reason these gauges exist (they wanted to make it easier for buffs to track, and these three buffs are extremely important for these three jobs). So, not all design choices seem to be uniform.

It is ok, most jobs had a resource already which was tracked on the status bar instead. They just made it prettier and easier to see. Whm lily is more of an exception, the most tacked-on resource there is. Well, they've got some room to improve the feel of whm resource next expansion. Hard to think of uses for them because WHM so strong already without them, in healing and mp conservation, and it doesn't need to become a big shield healer. Maybe give it a mini hallowed, makes a target invulnerable for a short duration, only usable after you've consumed a certain amount of lilies, so gaining and using them is building towards something bigger.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by inhaledcorn

And, weirdly, other important buffs, like DRG's Heavy Thrust, MCH's Hot Shot, and RDM's dualcast (a job that was designed with the gauge in mind, btw) weren't put on the job gauges, making them buffs that need to be tracked in the buff bar. This goes against the reason these gauges exist (they wanted to make it easier for buffs to track, and these three buffs are extremely important for these three jobs). So, not all design choices seem to be uniform.

---

This is exactly why I think the job gauge is incredibly annoying, we should be able to toggle it, if I'm going to have to look at my bar every 15-30 seconds to see if I have to refresh Hot Shot, I should be able to see my ammo there too and that gauge should just get out of my way, their idea of the gauges was to make us have less to keep track of, but I find myself looking around more now than I ever did before because of it, it's frustrating, people keep telling me to put it in a place where I can see it in my peripheral so it doesn't keep me looking around, and it is there in my peripheral, but that doesn't make it any less annoying or any less of a waste of screen space for some jobs like NIN/MCH.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alvuru

This is exactly why I think the job gauge is incredibly annoying, we should be able to toggle it

---

An option that is coming, according to the last Live Letter. Not sure if it's supposed to arrive with 4.1 or not (we may find out with the LL coming in a few hours), but the option is supposed to be added.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by inhaledcorn

I've seen this being the general consensus when it comes to gauges that's not SAM or RDM. I mean, heck, for SCH, it is literally tacked on at the end (except for Aetherflow). I think NIN integrated it better than most, and I can understand why it exists (to give less skilled players large visual queues that light up for doing certain things that you want to be doing for your Job). Like, for NIN, you want to be on the boss as much as possible for those Auto attacks, thus the gauge fills up for each one. For SAM, hitting positionals and using each of your skills builds up your gauge, again, showing and rewarding players for doing what you should be doing. SCH's fairy gauge builds up for using your Aetherflow instead of sitting on it (though the reward itself is very lackluster).

People argue if WHM's "reward" is worth spending the actions to get it (since good healers don't really want to cast Cure I and Cure II if it can be avoided, so this teaches bad WHMs less optimal play), and some essential job functions were just moved to the gauge which can be a detriment in trying to figure out who has what buff (it mostly hurts double AST comps the most, but there are probably other cases). And, weirdly, other important buffs, like DRG's Heavy Thrust, MCH's Hot Shot, and RDM's dualcast (a job that was designed with the gauge in mind, btw) weren't put on the job gauges, making them buffs that need to be tracked in the buff bar. This goes against the reason these gauges exist (they wanted to make it easier for buffs to track, and these three buffs are extremely important for these three jobs). So, not all design choices seem to be uniform.

---

Since you have pointed this out, it is actually bothering more than it should. especially as someone who plays both DRG and RDM. Not that I worry about the timer on RDM all that much but it's the principle. As well as DRG's tracking for heavy thrust. Part of me feels like they originally wanted to get rid of it as well or have some sort of WT refresh for it like they do with Armor crush and ninja's but decided to scrap the idea and now DRG's have to deal with it for who knows what reason.

Lilies are pretty awkward because depending on the situation you won't just be spamming cures lol I find myself over healing just to grab a quick lily :/ SE why you do this to WHM lol as for the gauges they kind of messed up on a few classes especially SCH all this time no gauge than bam lvl 70 a whole new gauge lol like but other older jobs redesigned meshes well I.e. bards sing gauge

Samurai is cool. Paladins is ok especially at 70 where you can actually build it pretty fast. I do think intervention should be a 10 second thing though not 6. Seems tricky to time with a few abilities. Do it to early on a boss cast and the effect drops off before the hit. Do it to late and the damage is already calculated.

Scholars could be better if it worked slightly different. Have every embrace cast build the gauge and also use the gauge for fey wind, whispering dawn etc etc. With some duration tweaks. 100 gauge might be 60 seconds of fey wind or dawn where 50 guage might only be 30 seconds.

I like the ninja guages. I only hate ten chi jin and it's incredible lagginess.

Oh and in general for a lot of jobs keep the guages on death.
Especially scholar where it takes so long to build the thing up in the first place

I dislike having to check two separate places whenever I want to check how much ammo i have on MCH AND how much long my hotshot duration still has left.

I don't really like the system that SE brought in. Before you had your stuff right in sight and now you have 1-2 new indicators to keep track off.

I like the bard gauge. I just wish it was less floofy. I don't need nice frilly sheet music icons and crap on my screen. I want something clean, with proc indicators and a countdown bar (not up).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ChloeGrace

I like the bard gauge. I just wish it was less floofy. I don't need nice frilly sheet music icons and crap on my screen. I want something clean, with proc indicators and a countdown bar (not up).

---

Just wish the bard one had straight shot on it. Sometimes that gets lost in all the buffs and cards and things going around

From a warrior perspective it actually improved on our stacks mechanic, giving us more freedom. Now we have a chunk of other issues, some tied to generators and spenders and dps windows around using the gauge but still, the inclusion of the gauge itself worked well I think.

When I play my bar however. Just more to watch, but 4.1 should address these issues. Wait and see!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alvuru

if I'm going to have to look at my bar every 15-30 seconds to see if I have to refresh Hot Shot,

---

Hot Shot has a 1 minute duration, use it while your GB is on cooldown after every OH+WF and it will always be up.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thoro39

I dislike having to check two separate places whenever I want to check how much ammo i have on MCH AND how much long my hotshot duration still has left.

---

Same thing as above, it's just at the end part of your OH+WF rotation.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ixon

Hot Shot has a 1 minute duration, use it while your GB is on cooldown after every OH+WF and it will always be up.



Same thing as above, it's just at the end part of your OH+WF rotation.

---

Thank you for reminding me of the optimal way to play my job.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alvuru

Thank you for reminding me of the optimal way to play my job.

---

You are welcome. I mentioned it only because considering it is almost always in the same part of your rotation, you rarely have to look at it's countdown timer which eliminates your original problem of having to look back and forth between your buff bar and your gauge.

But I am sure you already knew that. :P

Lilies are really terrible and I feel the need to say it at every opportunity, even in the DPS forum. They get consumed in the course of using your best abilities, yet they're also required to cast the sole mitigating ability in the WHM arsenal. This is... unwieldy (to put it kindly). Compounding this is the restriction against getting a Lily from a 100% overheal. I have to intentionally not heal somebody to full in Savage content when I know that I'm going to need to use Benison. And if the other healer can't read my mind and tops them off, or if I'm "lucky" and get a crit, I'm SOL.

I'd say it's hard to imagine how the design could've been worse, but then it originally was worse.

This is the problem with having shield healers. Benison is a vital ability which is used constantly to partially absorb gigantic hits which are only so gigantic because they're tuned to eat through the regularly-applied shielding of SCH/AST. Thus putting restrictions on it is an inherent problem for WHM, but removing restrictions exacerbates the underlying problem. It's a feedback loop.