Paladin and Total Eclipse Enmity

Should this be changed to increase enmity like all other tank weaponskills currently? It feels poorly designed and requires you to frontload or weave in Flash still when ideally you should just Flash during the pulling process and Total Eclipse once the enemies are in place, but its not enough when grouped with good DPS jobs currently. I think the way it was implemented isn't natural, and Yoshi's concept of PLD being a viable offtank wouldn't be hindered by it having bonus enmity. It was never an issue before with WAR and DRK, why would it be with PLD?

I don't have any issues holding aggro with only 1-3 Flashes and a Circle of Scorn before going full-on bey-blade. Do you use Total Eclipse while under FoF? It helps.

Total eclipse wasn't made to be an enmity tool, it was made to give PLD's a way to have sustained aoe dps. Scorn, 2x flash, FoF into eclipse spam should be plenty to keep aoe threat.

Yeah it should have an enmity modifier. using flash just feels really bad cause it does no damage. Drk has abysmal drain and unleash even though unleash does negligible dps. And then war has overpower and steel cyclone. There is zero point in NOT having it gain aggro.

PLD already has 2 aoe threat generators. It would be unbalanced to give it a 3rd

There still isn't any argument as to why it shouldn't have it considering all other tanks filler AoE skills have enmity bonuses. Its not a matter of it 'getting the job done' after 2-3 Flash which isn't actually the case against good players using SAM/BLM for example.

If it's a matter of parity, then Paladins don't get it because the other tanks don't get spammable, high potency, ranged attacks.

If they gave total eclipse enmity than flash would be obsolete, either it stays as is or they remove flash.

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Originally Posted by Raim

There still isn't any argument as to why it shouldn't have it considering all other tanks filler AoE skills have enmity bonuses. Its not a matter of it 'getting the job done' after 2-3 Flash which isn't actually the case against good players using SAM/BLM for example.

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Other tanks don't have flash and clemency.

Flash under shield oath gives ~1620 potency worth of enmity, if two flashes aren't holding against sam/blm you're probably doing something silly like trying to aoe tank dungeons against heavy hitting aoe dps in a dungeon in sword oath.

DRKs new aoe doesn't give emnity either. We have to weave it between abyssal drain to use up our blood meter.
The idea is to give us an aoe damage skill to use in the OT role. Now every tank has one.

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Originally Posted by Otorinth

I don't have any issues holding aggro with only 1-3 Flashes and a Circle of Scorn before going full-on bey-blade. Do you use Total Eclipse while under FoF? It helps.

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This.

I mean I lose aggro occasionally but most pulls I don't have any issues. Usually Flash/body pull, FoF, CoS, maybe another Flash depending on the group makeup, then spam TE till the stuff is dead or I'm out of TP/CoS is back up.

Why so negative about Flash? using it every 3 total eclipse is good for both emnity and mitigation. Spamming only TE Paladin will end up as a war that overpower spam, and pld do not have tp tools...

No reason not to replace flash with total eclipse. I think in some interviews the devs said they didn't give total eclipse an enmity modifier to prevent pld to rip mob's aggro from the MT, which is bullshit as fuck considering drk and war have been spamming overpower/abyssal drain for aoe situations.

I would rather have flash have a potency of 50 damage similiar to drk. Then it at least feels like I'm doing something for 3 whole gcd's

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Originally Posted by Bdyer

I would rather have flash have a potency of 50 damage similiar to drk. Then it at least feels like I'm doing something for 3 whole gcd's

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You are. You're generating threat.

It would be great if it lead into it's own combos that were similar to it's attack and increased enmity. A combo attack that increased enmity of enemies around you. Especially if you already have control of the mob and it'll keep you from having to use flash and CoS until adds come and/or you're desperate to regain enmety.

I was relieved that they added an attack outside the dreaded 1,2,3 RoH combo.

I flash once for the 12s blind then again in 12 sec for the 6 sec blind then spam Eclipse. I have 0 trouble holding hate. The blind helps reduce damage taken, especially on large pulls. Those 3 GCDs worth of 1kish damage wont make a differnce anyway. PLDs job is to tank enmity, leave the DPSing down of mobs to the DPS jobs. You generate enmity first, then when you have solid hate, you can AoE. IDK why tank mentality is that generating enmity is a chore. You're a tank not a blue dps. Asking for flash to deal damage is like asking if Physick can simultaneously also deal 300 potency like Assize. The answer is no. WAR and DRK get enmity AoE but thats what makes them different from PLD. PLD on the other hand gets a freakin shield to block ALL damage by 19-24% on top of their other tools, which WAR and DRK don't get.

Total eclipse should be changed to

Sword Oath : 30% chance of making next TE crit or free cost
Shield Oath : increased enmity :3

Give it a rest; warriors and darks are asking for flash BACK on the cross-class because it is without a doubt the best spammable snap aoe threat tool there is, and costs mana rather than tp which means you aren't subject to needing TP regen abilities from DPS that do a lot more damage with them.

Flash is a godly ability; it reduces the damage you take and gives you a tonne of upfront threat. You don't need to do damage on every gcd to be "doing something".

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Originally Posted by Furious

Give it a rest; warriors and darks are asking for flash BACK on the cross-class because it is without a doubt the best spammable snap aoe threat tool there is, and costs mana rather than tp which means you aren't subject to needing TP regen abilities from DPS that do a lot more damage with them.

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Those people should be ashamed to ask something like that

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Originally Posted by Baci

Those people should be ashamed to ask something like that

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:rolleyes:

Maybe a 25% increase so one doesn't feel compelled to waste Flash Blind uptime.

I'd rather that debuffs like Flash just apply enmity based on the duration added, though. Clipping a Blind at half duration remaining, for instance, would give no such bonus enmity, since the replacement would add no total duration.

Flash doesn't need to change, aoe scenarios are largely inconsequential and total eclipse is fine for what it's needed for.

This but also with full 270 slaying.

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Originally Posted by Otorinth

I don't have any issues holding aggro with only 1-3 Flashes and a Circle of Scorn before going full-on bey-blade. Do you use Total Eclipse while under FoF? It helps.

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This but also with full 270 slaying.