Monk around the bush

Maybe it's SE's idea of giving the class more utility but I still think chackra is a crap way of giving us a one time burst damage per fight. And the constant spamming of chackra all the time. I seems more like work then play to me. I loved mnk 2.0 due to the amount of dps it can dish out if in the right hands.

I would really like to see the class shine to the point of pulling hate off the tank and being forced to use second wind, featherfoot, haymaker, but SE seems to love making skills that don't matter in meta. I'm to the point now to level SMN, and MCH simply because I want a challenge, and like the idea behind "pet" classes. SE needs to make chackra a proc ability on a critical hit and give it a 20 sec cooldown. So this way atleast every 20 seconds you can automatically earn a burst damage bonus instead of in between fights. I never seem to find time to spam this in a raid fight, at the loss of dps to the mob. Thoughts?

This isn't the problem with monks imo. Monks can still deal alot of damage in the right hands and there plenty of times in raids when moving out of aoes etc to charge some (not all) of your chackra which eventually leads to another forbidden.

I'm not saying the idea isn't a good one, just this isn't the issue and has nothing to do with meta. Simply we offer little to no utility and as the only blunt dmg job we don't contribute much to the party beyond personal dps.

Between a equally skilled drg and monk the drg will always win due to the utility and buff it brings for the rest of the party.

I do hope though come SB they make monks alot more viable in raids.

So then we can admit that Monk has an issue with contributing in meta? And like you said that it's mostly personal DPS. I have always felt mnk was typically on it's own due to the fact of positional dps and focusing on grease to maintain high DPS. I rarely have ever wondered what other DPS was doing.

When I see a battle litancy pop I instantly pop Blood for Blood and internal, followed up with Forbidden, Tornado Kick, Howling Fist, Perfect Balance, and just decimate everything I can until back up to 3 grease and try to. It's not uncommon to see 7k crits with tornado, and forbidden 5k-6k. Monk is a force to reckon with if you use food and use your CD's at opportune times.

But I still have trouble with keeping track of chackra or form shifting when I need to to keep grease up more. I'm just asking for some more synergy to the job.

Thoughts?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sqwall

When I see a battle litancy pop I instantly pop Blood for Blood and internal, followed up with Forbidden, Tornado Kick, Howling Fist, Perfect Balance, and just decimate everything I can until back up to 3 grease and try to. It's not uncommon to see 7k crits with tornado, and forbidden 5k-6k.

---

Found your issue, you're using tornado kick when you shouldn't.

Chakra is literally monks version of a ranged attack to do when you can't hit the boss, form shift working in a way to save your stacks. You're never going to use these two abilities in a fight where there is 100% uptime, like A9S. Tornado kick also falls into this category, it's an ability that has a specific usage other than using it whenever possible, it's used if you know you're going to drop your stacks.

Removing/changing these wouldn't be solving the issue with monk being out of the meta, they are still the top personal DPS. Monk needs more synergy with other jobs in terms of damage, a party dps buffing ability is the only thing the monk would need.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Krindor

Found your issue, you're using tornado kick when you shouldn't.

Chakra is literally monks version of a ranged attack to do when you can't hit the boss, form shift working in a way to save your stacks. You're never going to use these two abilities in a fight where there is 100% uptime, like A9S. Tornado kick also falls into this category, it's an ability that has a specific usage other than using it whenever possible, it's used if you know you're going to drop your stacks.

---

Well I use Tornado at specific instances in raid or dungeons. If Perfect Balance is up I blow forbidden, howling, elixir, and tornado kick followed up with perfect balance. Rock Breaker for AOE or Snap Punch for single target. All of this is in that specific order to get GL back asap. It's not that i'm using tornado when I feel like it, I use it when I know I can get GL back fast. Am I doing this wrong?

And to further your thoughts on Chackra you say I'm never going to use these skills in a fight with 100% uptime. Then that would make my argument for auto-maintenance for chackra even more viable. If I am striped of 2 MAIN abilities right off the bat in a raid where DPS is key. Then why even have them essentially.

This is like One-Ilm-Punch all over again. I have never used it because there isn't a MOMENT in this game that would make me use it. Now if one-ilm-punch would grant me a stack of chackra say at a 15% chance then I would use it.

Thoughts?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sqwall

snip

---

You wouldn't use Throwing Dagger, Piercing Talon, Scathe either. Should those also get the same treatment? In some fights with a lot of downtime invigorate is worthless as well should we change that as well? They are all situational abilities that the class needs in those situations, the developers nor I see any reason for additional abilities in fights with 100% uptime for monk. They already had enough in ARR. The issue with monk was that when they had to disengage from the boss they would have a large chance of dropping stacks and due to lack of no ranged attack deal no damage either. This was fixed with the addition of form shift and chakra.

At this point, all I want for MNK is an aggro decreasing skill.
It's happened so often lately that it's even come down to the point that NIN will throw Smokescreen on me in Raids to prevent me from stealing aggro and while it makes me feel as though I'm doing phenomenal DPS, getting killed via Tank Buster isn't exactly what I signed up for when I decide to deal with the DPS queue times. '
The closest skill I have to an Aggro decreasing skill is Tornado Kick so I can intentionally nerf myself and that's just sad.

You're arguing for ways for MNK to deal more damage, but that's not why MNK isn't favored. MNK already has some of the highest personal DPS in the game. It just isn't enough to offset the massive synergy circlejerk that the "meta comp" is.

On that note, it's also not a significant enough difference to even prevent bringing a MNK. Monks can do all the content in the game very, very easily. They don't need buffs, especially with how SE has said they're working on how strong synergies are.

Also, you're using MNK's tools wrong, which is why your DPS suffers. It's not the class's fault. But if you like MCH and SMN more, then play those classes.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sqwall

And to further your thoughts on Chackra you say I'm never going to use these skills in a fight with 100% uptime. Then that would make my argument for auto-maintenance for chackra even more viable. If I am striped of 2 MAIN abilities right off the bat in a raid where DPS is key. Then why even have them essentially.

This is like One-Ilm-Punch all over again. I have never used it because there isn't a MOMENT in this game that would make me use it. Now if one-ilm-punch would grant me a stack of chackra say at a 15% chance then I would use it.

Thoughts?

---

While I'd agree that IIP could use a few more potential targets (even if something as "game-breaking" as popping PB and IIP spamming every add in A10S instead of crushing them -- oh gods the TP cost), it's a decently solid ability, and I suspect will be seeing more use of it and similar utilities in Stormblood.

Chakra, on the other hand is a ranged attack AND a half-GCD filler. It allows for no-clip Demolishes per DK/TS/Demo periods if you're running at a secondary SS plateau, and builds almost 50 potency per second with zero TP cost. Its only major flaw is that it doesn't scale with attack speed, causing it to have varying weight across different GL stages, and zero contribution from SS stat. Clunky or not, it's a theme-fitting tool that allows for a lot of differentiation. If it were a separate bind from Meditation, maybe it'd be nice to be able to early pop it, but personally I kind of like having the hard distinction between it being up and ready for a burst window or not.

Spamming Chakra feels clunky as heck.

Just allow monks to hold down Chakra to charge it.

Make it a meter that fills up ala street fighter and it'd feel a thousand times better to use.

The only issue I have with Meditation and Chakras is that Purification is attached to it rather than being an independent cooldown, having to choose between a TP and eating a damage loss is dumb and we're the only Job that has to do it (imagine if Warrior couldn't use Fell Cleave every time it used Equilibrium, they'd raise hell). Having an ability that lets you mitigate damage loss when the boss is untargetable due to range or being invulnerable is a godsend.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sqwall

Well I use Tornado at specific instances in raid or dungeons. If Perfect Balance is up I blow forbidden, howling, elixir, and tornado kick followed up with perfect balance. Rock Breaker for AOE or Snap Punch for single target. All of this is in that specific order to get GL back asap. It's not that i'm using tornado when I feel like it, I use it when I know I can get GL back fast. Am I doing this wrong?

---

Tornado Kick can be used for some quick burst if you absolutely need it, I blew it killing EDD in A11S progression a few times when we had deaths to save a few pulls. In an AOE situation it's probably better to just keep up your GL3 and use Perfect Balance>Rockbreaker Spam since the single target damage of a Tornado kick won't make up for the loss of 30% and 21% damage of Rockbreaker hitting a huge pack of adds. It's fine to also use Bootshine>Bootshine>Tornado Kick>Snap Punch> Snap Punch> Snap Punch in single target for a bit of burst damage, you just need to take care not to do it if you'll need Perfect Balance again in the next three minutes.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sqwall

I would really like to see the class shine to the point of pulling hate off the tank and being forced to use second wind, featherfoot, haymaker...

---

Oh don't worry we can, we just choose not to :3

But in all seriousness, I like how the chakra system work, but I am with you with the fact that it should intereact with our gameplay in a more direct manner. Dragoon have Blood of the Dragon which force them to keep it up, same as Enochian for Black mage. Those last 2 mechanic really give a difference in gameplay for both while for monk, all we really had added in our rotation is Elixir Field. Tornado kick is situational while Forbidden chakra can be usefull for more TP or again, some specific situation.

For now, all we can do is wait for the next Q&A that will talk more about the class. By reading the last one, SE really listen to is community so I am sure we will see a change for the forbidden chakra system.

Keep pushing and strike true!