Mobility discussion

please take note that i am still getting used to the game, im only noting some things as i go along.

one thing id like to discuss is mobility in general. this can be anything from mounts, abilities that include moving from one point to another (shukuchi), and the simple sprint.

there is just this lack of "momentum" in in terms of mobility.

for example, i never noticed how sluggish i looked until i panned the camera further from my character.

please note that i fully understand that the developers want to control the pace of the player, but i feel as if they have been a little too strict as to how much freedom a player could have. as big as the world is getting, i feel as if the lack of momentum will become more and more noticeable over time.

Eer are you talking about animations or responsiveness? We don't have more weighted animations because animation lock is deadly in this game and was probably responsible for more players deaths than anything else in 1.0. If you are talking about responsive time there is a lot of things that could be--and many of them aren't on SE's end like ISP routing/your settings/your hardware.

I do miss the realistic animations in 1.0 but my next party member PK by Benediction at least cures me of that sentiment fast.

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Originally Posted by Naria

Eer are you talking about animations or responsiveness? We don't have more weighted animations because animation lock is deadly in this game and was probably responsible for more players deaths than anything else in 1.0. If you are talking about responsive time there is a lot of things that could be--and many of them aren't on SE's end like ISP routing/your settings/your hardware.

I do miss the realistic animations in 1.0 but my next party member PK by Benediction at least cures me of that sentiment fast.

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your kind of overthinking it...

just mobility in general in any form.

compared to other games similar to FFXIV, how is the mobility of the game more or less appealing?

Are you literally just talking about the player's ability to move about the world/travel? In that case, the only times I've ever really felt like I was taking too long to get somewhere were crossing Heavensward maps before I unlocked flying in them -- and even then I didn't mind so much thanks to the persistent background tunes and freshness of those areas. Moving between maps is mostly covered by Teleport, and movement within the major city-states is mostly handled with Aetherytes.

If we moved much faster, I worry that the maps would feel too small. But then, I also like to look around and take in the scenery somewhat when I'm moving about, so maybe that's just me.

I admit that I'm not well-versed in many other MMOs. I've played ESO a little, and travel there often feels rewarding since I'll bump into sidequests and such just by wandering around, but in terms of pace, I didn't feel like it was terribly different...

I agree with mounts, if by that you mean they took too long to get you across a map. Flying mounts move faster when flying, but even then they feel too slow when i need to to get from one end of a map to the other end. Like when i need to do some gathering in the sea of cloud.

I don't understand what you are saying about everything else. I don't see what's wrong with sukuchi or sprint (neither feel or look sluggish to me), or what you mean by appealing or not in this regards. Maybe give more examples about what you think is unappealing and in what way you think it can be made more appealing?

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Originally Posted by Nestmile

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definitely, there are many things to take in even if you are not a sightseer. Fates, for example, are excellent factors of the game that helps players feel engaged while traveling. however, ive been doing less and less fates overtime, and no longer found value in participating. i just wanted to get to my destination however lengthy or short the travel time was. increasing the pace by a little would probably not make big a difference in this case.

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Originally Posted by ananda

I don't understand what you are saying about everything else. I don't see what's wrong with sukuchi or sprint (neither feel or look sluggish to me), or what you mean by appealing or not in this regards. Maybe give more examples about what you think is unappealing and in what way you think it can be made more appealing?

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shukuchi, for example, feels redundant considering how long it takes to execute and how much more simpler/faster it would be just to move from point "A" to point "B". there are other abilities that i cant name similar to Shukuchi that may have the same case.

sprint just feels a little off to me considered that most if not all other games at least have a stamina system or something the player can manage: sometimes no stamina system at all or just an unlimited sprint depending on the game. in FFXIV, however, it's just a "go faster" cool-down ability.

Shukuchi is not something that you use whenever you need to move, it has it's niche uses. For example, several fights in the game has ice floor mechanic, where if you move normally, you will slide around uncontrollably. Shukuchi allows you to still move during this mechanic. But it's real use imo is for min-maxing dps at the end game raid. If the use is pre-planned (and with a bit of practice), it is not hard to execute anymore and can get in a couple more hits before you are forced to disengage from the boss.

Similarly for sprint, which incidentally certainly has a stamina system in the form of tp. In a fight, using sprint during certain mechanics can really help you deal with them more easily. But it has limited usage (even for casters who don't otherwise use the tp), so you are forced to plan when you want to use it. For melee, using it obviously requires even more consideration (will using up all these tp hinder your ability to deal damage later on, and if it does, by how much and is it still worth it).

Out of combat though (and especially in towns where you cannot use mount), I do feel they should just let us sprint infinitely.

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Originally Posted by Mysticdraggon

shukuchi, for example, feels redundant considering how long it takes to execute and how much more simpler/faster it would be just to move from point "A" to point "B". there are other abilities that i cant name similar to Shukuchi that may have the same case.

sprint just feels a little off to me considered that most if not all other games at least have a stamina system or something the player can manage: sometimes no stamina system at all or just an unlimited sprint depending on the game. in FFXIV, however, it's just a "go faster" cool-down ability.

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Ah I see. Your not used to the stiff style of movement. Generally everyone goes one speed from start to finish, there's no momentum so you literally stop on the dime, its gross I know but they do that because......I really have no friggen clue. Alot of the mechanics now are built around that and make all movement precise. Sprint is on a grand cool-down which is also gross and only has one speed output.

If your a ninja your normal speed is slightly faster than other classes but lower than sprint speed. If they added momentum it would be beautiful to look at, I agree wholeheartedly, but I'd say it may be a little late to ask for it now. I'd request it anyways as it adds to the beauty of the game, maybe even some challenge to battles, players would just have to adapt and...well....get gud :p

Being able to teleport instantly to any zone is already all the mobility I really care about. Well, that and mounts. Especially now that fates aren't as big of a deal, it really isn't as important how fast I move in the open world because I'm simply not spending as much time there and when I am it's often doing things where mount speed isn't super important anyway, like gathering.

Aetherytes are numerous and well placed (Except CCH, it desperately needs a Whitebrim or Boulder Downs crystal).
You can ride just about anywhere in a zone in under 3 minutes, and fly in about half that.

The biggest problem with continuity / momentum / flow is the egregious lack of actions while mounted. You can't speak to an NPC. You can't initiate an attack action. You can't repair (although you can do this while sprinting).
Forced manual dismounting is a clunky mechanic. Mount. Move. Dismount. Do something. Re-mount. Rinse and repeat.

I feel like my inexperience with MMOS in general makes me unqualified to comment much on this but I don't think this has ever been a concern for me. Going places too fast would be a concern though, as with the poster above, I too have groaned a little at the thought of having to run all the way down to Whitebrim for example, but I am glad for the fact that not every single place ever has an aetheryte. Even on Balmung, maps can be quite empty as it is, how sad would it be if everyone could teleport directly to where they needed to be most of the time? I like the world looking a little more alive with actual travellers, especially ground-travellers. I'm not in support of flight completing wiping out regular mounts personally, so the general concept of getting places even more quickly strikes me with a feeling of uncertainty.

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Originally Posted by Kurogaea

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FFXIV is a beautiful game. its just that any form of movement from sprinting to simple jumping feels out-of-place and limited compared to the rest of the game.

again, simple teleportation abilities like shukuchi have limits in terms of range and how often you may use them just because the developers are afraid that players will abuse these abilities in terms of short range travel: it makes sense considering the devs would most likely want the player to physically walk from one NPC to another, not awkwardly teleport to them.

The main change I wish they'd implement to mobility in this game is to give us a proper stamina/endurance bar for sprint (this would make it so TP-using classes aren't unfairly punished for using sprint) and add in a dodge roll that uses a chunk of the stamina bar (or its own dash tokens, a la WildStar).

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Originally Posted by Naunet

The main change I wish they'd implement to mobility in this game is to give us a proper stamina/endurance bar for sprint (this would make it so TP-using classes aren't unfairly punished for using sprint) and add in a dodge roll that uses a chunk of the stamina bar (or its own dash tokens, a la WildStar).

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it has always bothered me how TP was considered to be stamina cost for sprint, yet your TP is nearly restored once sprint is ready to use again. for some reason, the developers just dont want us to use sprint during combat. not sure why exactly. using it during combat does not really help much unless its a moment when an enemy uses arena/aoe based attacks: even so, not using sprint is just as effective.

I wish that Sprint worked as long as you held the button and TP was consumed every second instead of all at once. So melee could get just the small burst of speed that they need without depleting their whole bar.

Just on the topic of momentum, I would actually like to point out it is not only purposeful, but I would even say required due to ff14's combat design.

the added time it would take to stop and the added distance you travel not only takes away very important presicion, but also interferes with the "flow" of positional requirements.

OP, as a ninja, I would hate for you to have that momentum and miss your trick attack because you inched every so slightly forward into the butt flank zone, or skid yourself into a cleave for your armor crush.


The one thing I would agree on, though is Shukuchi. The skill has utility, but that utility is hampered by its overall speed. I feel it either needs to activate faster, teleport instantly, and/or give you invulnerability from damage during the travel time. It's only marginally faster than regular movement speed, and it's a shame. It really prevents it from being a gap closer or an escape plan.

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Originally Posted by Fluffernuff

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I see what you mean, but "momentum" is only an example or the use of the word is for the lack of a better explanation. i definitely do not want drifting, skidding, or any form of unpredictable movement.

you could say that i just want more development in mobility speed, design, and freedom in general: there are too many restrictions that feel unnecessary in game like FFXIV, restrictions that feel like it is there for the sake of balance and control over the player's pacing.

Its not an action game though. There is plenty of mobility in the game.

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

Its not an action game though. There is plenty of mobility in the game.

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*starts casting Teraflare*
*fills the thread with AoE circles*

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Originally Posted by Ririta

I wish that Sprint worked as long as you held the button and TP was consumed every second instead of all at once. So melee could get just the small burst of speed that they need without depleting their whole bar.

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i would like that.

yeesh, playing devil's advocate for the sake of sparking more discussion is getting to me. I'll try my hand at actually agreeing with something.


I DO actually wonder why the TP cost of sprint was removed for PvP only. I forget the actual reasoning behind making that PvP only (assuming they even gave us one). I find it hard to think of any instance where it would actually be a negative impact on PvE content.

Very often, the characters that will be in danger are those in melee range- I.E those that have the largest distance to travel to safety. Yet their most obvious and best ability to use, completely drains their resources to actually play at all. Not to Say ranged players don't need to move large distances in combat, but I've rarely noticed, seen, or needed to use sprint as a ranged caster or healer, personally. Not accounting for specific boss mechanics. Sprint isn't a value to those classes very often.

Compounding onto that, the content i fear might be the reason this wont change often puts a strain on TP to begin with, which makes it not even usable to those classes even if they are desperate to move away quickly.

If nothing else, I wouldn't mind the current way sprint works in PvP to extend to both game modes.

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Originally Posted by Fluffernuff

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i agree completely. but i can think of a few reasons why the devs want want to place a limit on Sprinting during PvE: they may not want players to rush dungeons, and get punished if they are caught by an enemy with no TP to use. however, this is happening regardless and some people have found ways to manage.

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Originally Posted by Mysticdraggon

i agree completely. but i can think of a few reasons why the devs want want to place a limit on Sprinting during PvE: they may not want players to rush dungeons, and get punished if they are caught by an enemy with no TP to use. however, this is happening regardless and some people have found ways to manage.

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It's mostly on classes that have access to both resources, namely DRK and PLD. DRG, WAR, and BRD to a lesser degree because of their TP regen, though they rarely need to sprint to speedrun dungeons if the DRK or PLD is capable enough with their sprinting.

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Originally Posted by Fluffernuff

It's mostly on classes that have access to both resources, namely DRK and PLD. DRG, WAR, and BRD to a lesser degree because of their TP regen, though they rarely need to sprint to speedrun dungeons if the DRK or PLD is capable enough with their sprinting.

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makes sense.

"Lack of momentum"? You should have played FFXI back in the day when in order to travel from one nation to another, or from one land mass to another, you had to wait similar to a bus stop for your airship or boat to arrive, and then endure the five Earth minute travel time.

It was a great time to socialize with others though.

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Originally Posted by Gemina

"Lack of momentum"? You should have played FFXI back in the day when in order to travel from one nation to another, or from one land mass to another, you had to wait similar to a bus stop for your airship or boat to arrive, and then endure the five Earth minute travel time.

It was a great time to socialize with others though.

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i dont understand your point.

are you saying that the game should not further improve its mobility because it already has from its previous version?

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Originally Posted by Mysticdraggon

i dont understand your point.

are you saying that the game should not further improve its mobility because it already has from its previous version?

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No that's one of the FF XI vet's "back in my day we had to walk 5 miles barefoot with a group of paid protection through the snow to get where we had to go. It took 3 irl hours to get from a to be and we liked it. you kids with your aetherytes and your linklepoops don't know whats good" things that gets posted here a lot.

On topic for the thread though, I just changed from Elezen to Lala and being taller makes running feel really really slow now. It's like I'm running through syrup. I know its still the same speed I guess I'm just used to having short rodent legs > <

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Originally Posted by Texa

No that's one of the FF XI vet's "back in my day we had to walk 5 miles barefoot with a group of paid protection through the snow to get where we had to go. It took 3 irl hours to get from a to be and we liked it. you kids with your aetherytes and your linklepoops don't know whats good" things that gets posted here a lot.

On topic for the thread though, I just changed from Elezen to Lala and being taller makes running feel really really slow now. It's like I'm running through syrup. I know its still the same speed I guess I'm just used to having short rodent legs > <

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i suppose they could have made it so that the universal movement speed/quality was not entirely centered around medium sized character models. sometimes i see larger models look as if they are on trying to run on ice.