The Feast.

Arena PvP is the worst thing that has ever happened to MMORPGs.

Lower the requirement for the "Fatal Feast" achievement to 10 wins to match Frontline.

If PvP was something that Square Enix valued, Morale would have had some sort of modification for over 2 years and 3 months since they broke it.

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Originally Posted by Alyx

Lower the requirement for the "Fatal Feast" achievement to 10 wins to match Frontline.

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8v8s are short, and 4v4s are even shorter. 30 wins isn't going to kill you.

Morale was terrible and I'm glad it's not back and I'm also glad it probably won't be modified. Please keep statistical advantages out of my pvp, thanks. Players already have progression in the form of glamour, ranked rewards, and pvp skills.

It was very easy to get Goten...and you want it to be easier?

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Originally Posted by Praesul

Morale was terrible and I'm glad it's not back and I'm also glad it probably won't be modified. Please keep statistical advantages out of my pvp, thanks. Players already have progression in the form of glamour, ranked rewards, and pvp skills.

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I have to second this, keeping any kind of gear advantage out of PVP was actually a really good idea.

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Originally Posted by bounddreamer

It was very easy to get Goten...and you want it to be easier?

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"Easy" is a bit subjective relative to the types of teams you get in 8s, but statistically speaking it shouldn't take much more than 60 matches to get Goten. It took me significantly less than that...I had it done in half a days' worth of solid grinding. Hardly an insurmountable endeavor. Of course, I suppose it could be argued that all the decent PVPers have already gotten Goten and don't do 8v8 now, just leaving new players and unskilled players left in the queues.

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Originally Posted by loreleidiangelo

Of course, I suppose it could be argued that all the decent PVPers have already gotten Goten and don't do 8v8 now, just leaving new players and unskilled players left in the queues.

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This. And when you factor in the removal of chat - a tool that could've been used to help and teach these players to get better and win what they want. . . well. . .

Nice Job!

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Originally Posted by loreleidiangelo

Of course, I suppose it could be argued that all the decent PVPers have already gotten Goten and don't do 8v8 now, just leaving new players and unskilled players left in the queues.

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Which makes winning all that much easier, since you'll only have new and unskilled opponents.

These arguments always go both ways.

No. . . not it doesn't.

When a team predominantly made of BRDs gets stuck fighting on/across a bridge, grouped up against SMNs, while a PLD, DRG, and MNK freely run in and out taking people down, and the enemy PLD 10 stacks then stands behind his team remaining untouched, meanwhile the MCH who knows how wrong that entire situation is hops the fence, runs up the stairs, takes out the PLD, grabs the medals, then WALKS back across the bridge untouched, both damage or healing wise, having noticed no one else on their team got the idea that they could do the same thing and push out of being stuck where they are. . . no, that team is NOT going to win. And they won't even know why.

^ True story, BTW.

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Originally Posted by ThirdChild_ZKI

No. . . not it doesn't.

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Logically, it has to go both ways - there's no way around that.

Premise one: Both teams are made of players from the queue.
Premise two: Players from the queue may end up on either team.
Premise three: Every player from the queue has a skill level.

From 3 and 1 follows that both teams are made of players with a skill level. Because of 2, the players and thus their skill levels may end up on either team. What that skill level actually is doesn't matter - both teams may end up with it. Provided, of course, the premises are true.

I could go on further, because the formal proof is not yet finished - It still needs conclusions on the likelihood of a given skill level on either team and the bias that's created from that fact that your own skill level is a known variable. But honestly? That's cumbersome to formalize and easy to understand intuitively. Have a meme instead: http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/elo-hell

Just finished up all remaining 17 wins in the last two days. I lost... I think 3 of those. Just git gud, and carry your team. It's really not that hard.

As far as goten, I did forget to mention how long it took me, got my thirty wins after about 53 matches. Took me about nine hours counting breaks.

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Originally Posted by Zojha

Which makes winning all that much easier, since you'll only have new and unskilled opponents.

These arguments always go both ways.

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As is to be expected of you, you are making blind assumptions based off bad data pulled from your own beliefs, rather than experience.

Good players were doing 8s into the end of season 3 so they didn't risk their rank.

Good players are still doing 8s to farm the new achievements.

If you want goten, go heals, and bring a friend who also goes heals. I have a 75% win ratio in 8v8 from this. the 25% losses were from people getting 10 stacks, and then staying in the fray. It's like, Why grab 10 stacks in the first place? Why grab 10 stacks when you're not even a tank? Why, when you are warrior, grab 10 stacks and not even go into defiance? Why do you stay there getting hit by everyone when you have 10 stacks!? Why aren't you hiding with 10 stacks!? Why are you especially targeting people who get melee LB when you have 10 stacks?! It just gets their attention, and they'll revenge LB you if they're not already hitting you. *eye twitches*

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Originally Posted by NessaWyvern

If you want goten, go heals, and bring a friend who also goes heals. I have a 75% win ratio in 8v8 from this. the 25% losses were from people getting 10 stacks, and then staying in the fray. It's like, Why grab 10 stacks in the first place? Why grab 10 stacks when you're not even a tank? Why, when you are warrior, grab 10 stacks and not even go into defiance? Why do you stay there getting hit by everyone when you have 10 stacks!? Why aren't you hiding with 10 stacks!? Why are you especially targeting people who get melee LB when you have 10 stacks?! It just gets their attention, and they'll revenge LB you if they're not already hitting you. *eye twitches*

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Because there's no free speech in matches, so non-tank players could care less about grabbing 10 stacks. They know that the opposing team isn't going to notice especially with it's a bunch of rando's that can't bother to single target.

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Originally Posted by Zojha

Logically, it has to go both ways - there's no way around that.

Premise one: Both teams are made of players from the queue.
Premise two: Players from the queue may end up on either team.
Premise three: Every player from the queue has a skill level.

From 3 and 1 follows that both teams are made of players with a skill level. Because of 2, the players and thus their skill levels may end up on either team. What that skill level actually is doesn't matter - both teams may end up with it. Provided, of course, the premises are true.

I could go on further, because the formal proof is not yet finished

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I like this clear form XD
Remind me the course I took last year
Symbols will be more clear but this easier to understand

Oh the thread...
No it's easy enough

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Originally Posted by ThirdChild_ZKI

No. . . not it doesn't.

When a team predominantly made of BRDs gets stuck fighting on/across a bridge, grouped up against SMNs, while a PLD, DRG, and MNK freely run in and out taking people down, and the enemy PLD 10 stacks then stands behind his team remaining untouched, meanwhile the MCH who knows how wrong that entire situation is hops the fence, runs up the stairs, takes out the PLD, grabs the medals, then WALKS back across the bridge untouched, both damage or healing wise, having noticed no one else on their team got the idea that they could do the same thing and push out of being stuck where they are. . . no, that team is NOT going to win. And they won't even know why.

^ True story, BTW.

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and that mch was you I take it?

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Originally Posted by Arthur_Gwen

Remind me the course I took last year

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PHIL 1101, perhaps? Or maybe it's 101 in the States ... Introductory Philosophy, in any case. Not complicated stuff. Unfortunately, what they don't teach in those classes is that theory does not always translate to fact, especially in practical application scenarios. In theory, yes. this goes both ways, but in practice? Not necessarily. Straight logical reasoning does not account for blind luck, only probability. In theory, the everything shakes out equally on paper, but if you tell that to an extraordinarily unlucky person and they'd think you're barking mad. No logic, no matter how straightforward, can account for the unknowable.

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Originally Posted by Februs

PHIL 1101, perhaps? Or maybe it's 101 in the States ... Introductory Philosophy, in any case. Not complicated stuff. Unfortunately, what they don't teach in those classes is that theory does not always translate to fact, especially in practical application scenarios. In theory, yes. this goes both ways, but in practice? Not necessarily. Straight logical reasoning does not account for blind luck, only probability. In theory, the everything shakes out equally on paper, but if you tell that to an extraordinarily unlucky person and they'd think you're barking mad. No logic, no matter how straightforward, can account for the unknowable.

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Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar...

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Originally Posted by loreleidiangelo

"Easy" is a bit subjective relative to the types of teams you get in 8s, but statistically speaking it shouldn't take much more than 60 matches to get Goten. It took me significantly less than that...I had it done in half a days' worth of solid grinding. Hardly an insurmountable endeavor. Of course, I suppose it could be argued that all the decent PVPers have already gotten Goten and don't do 8v8 now, just leaving new players and unskilled players left in the queues.

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I got Goten, and Raigo, and now I'm queuing with FC mates so they can earn theirs. I love queuing with them bc we've had matches where we absolutely CRUSH it. Going in as two healers in voice chat is OP. Queuing as two teams of two, with a tank, two heals, and a Smn...unless the other team is very good or our other four people are dumb, we win big time.

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Originally Posted by bounddreamer

I got Goten, and Raigo, and now I'm queuing with FC mates so they can earn theirs. I love queuing with them bc we've had matches where we absolutely CRUSH it. Going in as two healers in voice chat is OP. Queuing as two teams of two, with a tank, two heals, and a Smn...unless the other team is very good or our other four people are dumb, we win big time.

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If you que with another decent healer you can get up to 80% win rate. But if there'll be another healer who refuses to switch it can ruin the match, because 3+ healers is bad, and if you switch to dps that refusing healer may be not good at all (random healers are usually very bad, with 8-9k hp = dying often, using pve rez giving people weakness and other nonsense).