I'm trying to get some Nidhogg Extreme runs to get the bird, and it's taking quite a while to get in. I've let one person in and added to the PF message that it's a clear for one person. Right now, I have let two others who have not cleared, but have apparently gotten far enough to give them a shot (bomb phase). I'm desperate to get some runs in, so I told them to shush, because as far as everyone in the party knows, it's still clear for one.
Going in now, hoping that we can clear after at most 2 wipes.
Opinions on lying about who has/hasn't cleared a fight?
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09-25-2016, 04:17 AMRenniesOpinions on lying about who has/hasn't cleared a fight?
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09-25-2016, 04:23 AMCroweyes
I'm upfront about it, if i'm confident enough to join a bird farm for a clear I ask " Hey, haven't cleared it but i know the fight, could you ask your group if its cool? " they say yes, awesome, if not I don't get mad.
Hell i got my sephirot clear in a bird farm, and we kept going. -
09-25-2016, 04:24 AMRennies
So, one of the hiding clearers had connection issues and died first dive. We kicked them if only because it wasn't something immediately remediable.
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09-25-2016, 04:25 AMKaurieGood to know that you are both honest and patient.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rennies
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09-25-2016, 04:48 AMRennies
It was going on for a while. D=
And I've had people leave from sillier stuff. I upvoted you because your comment made me giggle. -
09-25-2016, 04:59 AMCUTS3R
I'll probably sound like a jerk but deliberately lying to get a free clear in farm groups is a dick move no matter how you put it.
You need a kill? Make your own PF for it or buy a carry. Don't try to leech from supposedly "experienced" players if you aint gonna tell them beforehand.
I had so many farm groups ruined by that one guy not telling anyone and having no idea what to do. Yes we could have left and kicked that person but when you're already in the instance and ask who has the bonus without any replies, people get impatient and pull anyway. More often than not, to a certain wipe and the group will prematurely disband, thanks to that person.
I may be a mentor but don't expect me to teach you anything when im in a farm party, for the sole reason that you are supposed to know the in and out of the fight already. And if you don't, you do not belong in a farm group.
In the other hand if a player with bonus and enough experience in the fight asks nicely BEFORE we get in the instance and the majority of the group is voting in favor of letting him in, i will give him a chance. -
09-25-2016, 05:31 AMKhanscott
If someone can tell me how to what, where, and how; I will happily take the free broken Allag circuit boards and keep farming with them after they get their clear. Just because there is no bonus, it certainly doesn't mean a player was not carried. I tend to shy from random farm parties as of late because of people like this turning 1 or 2 shots into me leaving after 30 mins, because I want to accomplish something and have my fun too and dealing with someone hitting the floor constantly in Phase 1 of a fight is neither of these things.
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09-25-2016, 05:33 AMCatwho
True story: A few weeks ago we burned T1-T8 in a small group for a FC member who had just hit 60 a month ago and hadn't had a chance to do the content.
Then we hit T9, which our group had struggled with last year (through the divebombs) and we kind of just stopped trying. One member of the FC had cleared through T13, but another three of us besides the new person also technically needed our T9 clear.
So we took our new person in as a 5 man to teach him the meteors phase, and spent an hour ensuring he could do the meteor dance with the best of us.
Then we put up a party finder with the following message: "T9 clear party for one of our FC members. We've practiced meteors and got them down to a science. Come get bonus poetics!"
We entirely did not mention that another three of us also needed the clear! Fortunately, we picked up 2 more who needed clear, and 1 other mentor who wanted the bonus. And we burned it through in two tries. -
09-25-2016, 05:36 AMRennies
As expected, it went horribly. I'm too optimistic about these things LOL.
On the bright side, after several swaps, we had one of the original newbs and a new newb and made it to last phase. Progress for them I guess.
Farm parties often are worse than this anyway... -
09-25-2016, 05:40 AMCUTS3RThat's not an excuse to keep doing it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rennies
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09-25-2016, 05:41 AMRenniesI haven't done it before and I won't be doing it again. ;PQuote:
Originally Posted by CUTS3R
You live and you learn. -
09-25-2016, 05:45 AMLokier
I went into Ravana EXT with a P/F group, they omg'd to begin with, but at least I only died when it was a wipe. Poor non-noob however kept wiping, which at least made me look good, lmao.
Of course, they didn't out 'no noobs', so it's their fault I even joined.... -
09-25-2016, 05:56 AMZhaneX
I don't see anything wrong with it per-se.
Granted I've never out-right lied about it. I've started up SephEX Farm parties a couple times recently, and a couple times have had someone whisper me that they need a clear, and both times I just shrugged and said "Sure".
First time did not go well. Honestly didn't really pay attention to the guy who needed a clear, so I can't be sure how much of it was their fault, but regardless, no clear that day.
Next time it happened was just last night. It was a complete mess. It was like, 4am in the morning, took forever to get a full party together, had to reset the PF once, and since many of us were off doing other things at the time, when we did get a Full Party, we were down a tank and had an extra DPS. So I asked one of the DPS if they could tank, someone spoke up, and we proceeded. At first, I tried MT, but I'm horrid at it, since I'd only ever been OT before. Two wipes in I suggested that we switch, since the other tank seemed to be doing a great job of getting and keeping aggro when I kept dying. Then we had two more wipes because the DPS kept falling short on the Wind. Then, try #5, and we did it! Only issue to come up at all was that a Healer fell off during the second Pillars of Mercy. But he only had 2% Health then, so...
Basically, all's well that ends well? Guy got a clear, rest of us got a token. -
09-25-2016, 05:56 AMCUTS3RQuote:
Originally Posted by Lokier
That is one thing i noticed recently that pisses me the F out.
Apparently nowadays if you don't specifically mention "no bonus" in your PF comment, people with bonus will join.
I don't know when that changed but apparently typing "farm" alone in your comment doesn't imply to have downed it anymore... SMH -
09-25-2016, 06:04 AMLokierIf you don't SAY I can't join... I'm going to join. I anticipate you don't really mind who joins if you don't say anything. >_>Quote:
Originally Posted by CUTS3R
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09-25-2016, 06:07 AMCUTS3RQuote:
Originally Posted by Lokier
But that's the thing, if i say "farm" in my PF comment, this alone is saying that everyone needing a clear is not welcome. -
09-25-2016, 06:10 AMLokierThey never put farm in their title, just "Ravana EXT group" Along with an ilvl requirement. :P They all left after as well, so god knows what they were doing, lol.Quote:
Originally Posted by CUTS3R
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09-25-2016, 06:12 AMCUTS3RIn the case of your example, it's totally their fault.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lokier
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09-25-2016, 06:15 AMLokierDon't get me wrong, if "farm" had been in the title I'd have made it known I was new, but I thought it was just like a practice run for an FC with a few members short, but I'm not sure. :SQuote:
Originally Posted by CUTS3R
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09-25-2016, 06:15 AMLambdafish
Without any context and as a blanket statement, I will say: Lying is always bad if you are wanting people to trust you.
I'm not sure you understand what farm is, it is the expectation that everyone has beaten the fight and is comfortable quickly clearing multiple times (sometimes even having cleared is not enough to be at farm status). So yes, farm parties do say that you can't join if you haven't cleared.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lokier
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09-25-2016, 06:22 AMLokierRead convo above for context.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lambdafish
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09-25-2016, 06:26 AMLambdafishMy apologies, your relevant information (their unclear information) had not been posted when I was editing my post. My point does still stand though to anyone who thinks it is ok to join farm parties without getting explicit permission from the party leader (happens more often than not if you are upfront about your experience)Quote:
Originally Posted by Lokier
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09-25-2016, 06:30 AMSpookyGhostIf I'm making a farm party and you join it expecting a clear, you're getting kicked.Quote:
Opinions on lying about who has/hasn't cleared a fight?
If I'm making a clear party and you join it to clear and have experience through at least 3/4 of the fight, then you're welcome to join.
If I'm making a learning/practice party and you join expecting a clear, you're getting kicked. -
09-25-2016, 06:31 AMLokierIt's ok, just wanted to clear up that i'm not advocating ninja-joining groups, just that I myself have wandered into P/F groups without saying anything. Though in my case it was down to the group not giving enough information on what exactly they wanted.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lambdafish
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09-25-2016, 06:39 AMHungryHippo
If people fake dc and it's obvious because they don't know the fight fully = kicked. If you say you know the fight but die 24-7, you get kicked. If you gonna lie and say you never ever died a lot on the run you actually cleared on and expect people to do your weight, you are wrong. This is team effort, everyone has to pull equal ways to play, it's unfair that some people have to dish out more job, just to satisfy 1 guy being selfish and greedy in something.
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09-25-2016, 07:11 AMRennies
Holy crap, I forgot I even made this thread. I need to stop drinking.
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09-25-2016, 07:24 AMUrthdigger
I'm a little torn on it. On the one hand, I prefer that people be honest at all times. On the other hand? I've seen content become farm parties only, with nobody interested in clear or learning parties, after the FIRST day. Sometimes it's what you have to do.
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09-25-2016, 07:45 AMLambdafishcross server party finder will improve this, however part of the problem is peoples refusal to make learning and clear parties if they need them, expecting others to do it and moaning if none exist in PFQuote:
Originally Posted by Urthdigger
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09-25-2016, 07:52 AMViduI disagree - its not "what you have to do" - what you have to do is the same everyone putting up farm parties now did: Build a network of like minded players, have some sort of a static etc.Quote:
Originally Posted by Urthdigger
Sneaking into a farm party is the laziest way to do those fights and to me it feels like you dont wanna put the actual effort in to learn the fight - wipe two times and then you should have the kill, right? Nope, not right! And its a big difference if only one person doesnt know the fight or if eight people still have to learn it - still that one person can mess it all up.
"lying" (or just not speaking up) is never the only option - its the easy option, ofc.