100% skills / 0% gear

Please SE, make an elite endgame purely based on skills, not gear.

Imagine going in an elite engame, with the usual 4 battles, with no gear rewards at all (ok could be only super nice looking gear for glamour), except the last battle that would actually give the best wep in game.

Now how it would work... you do a quest to unlock the content of these 4 battles. These quests would give you a wep and all gear (left and right side) that would ONLY be relevant in fighting in these said battles.

Here is the kicker : ALL members would have SAME LEVEL of gear. You complete that content, it's 100% skills, 0% gear.

Then, you receive the best wep in game as a reward, you go back in the other elite game content for the other gear pieces. (all except the wep).

If you're skilled enough, as is your whole group, you can beat any fight at minimum ilvl. Even less than, in some cases.
This has been true for as far back as first Coil.

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Originally Posted by Canadane

If you're skilled enough, as is your whole group, you can beat any fight at minimum ilvl.

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To be fair though, since 1.x ended, rewards for "special" runs have been severely lacking.
I remember in Aurum Vale in 1.x, you got more reward chests at the end if you beat the dungeon without the "easy mode" things like fruits and the like.
What rewards do we get for clearing content at min ilvl though? A slightly higher droprate for TT cards and primal items, if I remember right...which is more than outweight by the fact that you can run said content 5 times at max ilvl and unsynced vs. min ilvl and synced in the same time.

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Originally Posted by ZaaZaa

Please SE, make an elite endgame purely based on skills, not gear.

Imagine going in an elite engame, with the usual 4 battles, with no gear rewards at all (ok could be only super nice looking gear for glamour), except the last battle that would actually give the best wep in game.

Now how it would work... you do a quest to unlock the content of these 4 battles. These quests would give you a wep and all gear (left and right side) that would ONLY be relevant in fighting in these said battles.

Here is the kicker : ALL members would have SAME LEVEL of gear. You complete that content, it's 100% skills, 0% gear.

Then, you receive the best wep in game as a reward, you go back in the other elite game content for the other gear pieces. (all except the wep).

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Something like this is already in the game not to 100% but most of it. It's called savage raids. You should try it someday.

oh boy. potencies scaled down 300 percent unless positional is met entirely. Good luck good sir! skill your butt off with damage penalties unless perfectly done, even when boss turns around to spit on random healer or something they seem to do alot. wait, best weapon for syncing down? youre kidding me right? you can sync down any raid, why would this be a req for best weapon? Best weapon should be earned. not doing things at the intended i level,


This will only be a challenge to newer players and people who have no clue about mechanics or raid awareness. sure extending turn 5 by an addition 5 minutes is a bit more button pressing, but does it really mean youre that great? hell people were touching it in pprobably less than the intended/i level suggested i level(because that didnt even exist untiall months later after the game was out ad people were complaining about people entering titan with only 2k gp and dungeon gear from the only 2 level 50 dungeons available) and thus, not clearing it.

anyway, you could be a very skilled player, but in this game if youre not a very skilled warrior, youre not going to prevent a wipe anyway. Youre sort of forced to rely on everyone in the party to succeed so really

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Originally Posted by Atoli

To be fair though, since 1.x ended, rewards for "special" runs have been severely lacking.
I remember in Aurum Vale in 1.x, you got more reward chests at the end if you beat the dungeon without the "easy mode" things like fruits and the like.
What rewards do we get for clearing content at min ilvl though? A slightly higher droprate for TT cards and primal items, if I remember right...which is more than outweight by the fact that you can run said content 5 times at max ilvl and unsynced vs. min ilvl and synced in the same time.

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I completely agree. I wish the Breathless achievement that you mentioned was a title. I'd have worn that with pride. Instead I use the equally outdated spearfishing title, hah.

I do wish we had more unique clear requirements back again. Tight requirements on speedrun options, and killing things a specific way, or taking an optional route, etc. Everything's pretty cookie-cutter nowadays.

If i had no glue of sub stats like you i would agree:p you really enjoy to troll or are you really retardet like this?

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Originally Posted by Ilan

Something like this is already in the game not to 100% but most of it. It's called savage raids. You should try it someday.

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Savage is NOT 100% skills. Some players have an edge because they have better gear... In other words, a static needs a tank to fill his last role. Leader made an announcement in GC. Leader knows all the tanks in there... 2 tanks are interested for the job. They both got equal skills. One has 220 gear, and the other is 240. Who do you think will get picked ?

Correct me if I am wrong, but isn't there an option in Duty Finder called "Minimum IL" that allows you to sync everyone's gear to that duty's minimum IL?

You could run any instance with a preformed group this way and rely on skills more than gear.

I guess the two problems would be: A.) Finding a group to do this with. and B.) Not getting any better / specific rewards for doing it.

It would just be for fun.

If there are enough people interested in doing this, you could make a group using the Party Finder tool.
I don't think there are enough people interested in it for SE to create a whole new system though.

Whoever cleared T5 and titan extreme back in the day with darklight gear (i70) trully answers your question.

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Originally Posted by ADVSS

Best weapon should be earned. not doing things at the intended i level (...) anyway, you could be a very skilled player, but in this game if youre not a very skilled warrior, youre not going to prevent a wipe anyway. Youre sort of forced to rely on everyone in the party to succeed so really

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Where is your logic ? I fail to see it. Best wep in game should be earned. Well, EXACTLY ! Ok, it's like this. Which group you think earns more the 245 wep :

Group A : synced to 220 for A5s - a8S
Group B : getting better gear with time.. clearing A8s with i-240

I say group A earned it way more, as it was more difficult for them. Clearing hardest content in game... i wish it was 100% skills based, not skills AND gear. See, there is always a moron going "yeah, yeah, he has a 245 wep, he cleared savage... i bet all the members were 240."

Thhis game is not only mechanics, it's also a numbers game.. stats, and gear plays a role in it.

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Originally Posted by Azaelyia

If i had no glue of sub stats like you i would agree:p you really enjoy to troll or are you really retardet like this?

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Are you a moron ? I just want to know before i waste more time.

Winning the actual savage (A5s-A8s) for instance, with all players having same gear, would mean these players won with skills, not because some players had kick-ass gear. What is so hard to understand ?

Yeah, yeah, mechanics, mechanics... nothing to do with gear. Ok, next time you go in savage, please do wear your wep 220, along with the rest of your gear... and see what your party members would say.

Now if ALL players had no choice to suck it up and wear somewhat weaker gear... the feeling of achievement would be even greater... And you would feel you deserve the wep 245 way more as getting there had NOTHING to do with gear.

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Originally Posted by FinaSel

Correct me if I am wrong, but isn't there an option in Duty Finder called "Minimum IL" ...

...
I guess the two problems would be: A.) Finding a group to do this with. and B.) Not getting any better / specific rewards for doing it.

...

If there are enough people interested in doing this, you could make a group using the Party Finder tool.
I don't think there are enough people interested in it for SE to create a whole new system though.

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Yup, such option exist, but as you said, people don'T want that for the reasons you mentionned. You must motivate people, thus my idea. If getting best wep in game would mean going trough hardest content in game with a 100% skills system, players would go for it, trust me.

Getting trough savage, for instance, would mean your static did what they were suppose to do, skills wise, not because some players had kick ass gear. More like because you had kick ass players with kick-ass skills, you feel me ?

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Originally Posted by ZaaZaa

Savage is NOT 100% skills. Some players have an edge because they have better gear... In other words, a static needs a tank to fill his last role. Leader made an announcement in GC. Leader knows all the tanks in there... 2 tanks are interested for the job. They both got equal skills. One has 220 gear, and the other is 240. Who do you think will get picked ?

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If you don't have your OWN static, this may be true. But if you have a own static over a long time, everyone will have around the same ilvl. And most of the people started raiding with ilvl 220 or even below and they did it.
And still savage is that what is close to your "idea" thats why i wrote it.

Sorry OP, but just because you want to see more skill based rewards, doesn't mean everyone shares your sentiment. If you want to rely on more player skill than gear, then you need to be in some world first groups. Not everyone here is hardcore enough to want to do something like that, and why even make it optional, no one would do it, best weapon or not. This sounds like first alexander all over again and a huge fiasco and waste of time. Just my shitty opinion and 2 cents.

Skill is still more important than gear in this game. We still have a handful of players who cannot even output 50% of their classes potential, which is why Nidhogg Story Mode is such a burden to get into. Even in iLvL 230 ~ 240, some duty finder groups aren't meeting DPS checks or even living through basic mechanics. I think that speaks more than your little rant on savage content, especially considering a majority of the player base are casual gamers.

I did A5s with my static and we all had 213-215ilv. so its nothing special. Many grps cleared A5s with 210 Gear/ A6s aswell.

I don't think introducing this kind of content would amount to anything, only world first groups would be carrying the best weapons thereafter and you would have a community literally liquidate itself because we are in an era of "Simple and easy is best!"

I miss the satisfaction of clearing new content, I mean I still feel great when I do but I mainly PF content now, without a compatible static, actual built friendships with online friends, the feeling has greatly diminished. Oh the days of voice chat has all but left me, no one wants to join to talk and have fun anymore, Eozera is literally painted gray for me. (Typing just isn't the same, actual voices just make it so much more personable)

i think i have to disagree with you. I still have fun with my FC and other players in my server when we do mhach or roulettes but I know the hard content is out there and i know and respect that SE designed this not to be for average players. Its that simple. When T5 was out, i believe there was an official statement by yoshi that only 5% or less of statics will have a clear. Despite being a gutsy statement, i understood what this meant about this kind of gameplay. Theres no need for players to be toxic. IF you want savage content, grab 7 more friends, join ts,rc,skype,practice a few hours/day and you will have a kill in no time.

What they need to do is give extra rewards for quick runs and no wipes in a run to establish skill cause current loot Raid system sucks atm why coil was awesome cause it weeded out the scrubs with skill and needed to beat bossed to Advance to the next tier this savage is pretty stupid and having to get new gear every 6 months is stupid as well I'm Kusturica waiting for Alex 9-12 to bust out the skills cause that's when it will really matter