Open Ishgarde + create Ishgardian job npcs in each city state.

I know that there are objections to opening ishgarde for lore reasons but surely that is preferable over level up potions? Even with early access to Ishgarde there would still be alot of limitations with what you could do there without catching up in the MSQ. For example no access to external heavensward areas(western coerthas etc) and no access to 51+ quests. I found the 30 level jump with DRK/MCH/AST jarring; 50-60 levels is even worse. One of the main complaints is that players can't access DRK/MCH/AST from level 1 at each city state; so give it to them. Place an Npc to introduce players to the jobs from level 1 and then prompt them towards ishgarde at level 30. You can still let players access the jobs from level 30 onward and new players can start as the job they wish from level 1. I know this presents some plot holes but it wouldn't be the first time SE altered cutscenes depending on a player's choices; like the Azure Dragoon dialogue in heavensward.

What they should do is allow the jobs to be unlocked when the player reaches the central highlands for the that part of the story arc.I think its around level 30 or so? They already back track to these areas anyway and people will already have jobs unlocked so its not like they won't get practice. Revolve the quests until lvl 50 around there then 50+ you will need access to Ishgard which by that point isn't far off if they do decide to trim the main story down.

Obviously you will still need to buy the expansion to start the jobs.

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Originally Posted by bass9020

What they should do is allow the jobs to be unlocked when the player reaches the central highlands for the that part of the story arc.I think its around level 30 or so? They already back track to these areas anyway and people will already have jobs unlocked so its not like they won't get practice. Revolve the quests until lvl 50 around there then 50+ you will need access to Ishgard which by that point isn't far off if they do decide to trim the main story down.

Obviously you will still need to buy the expansion to start the jobs.

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This, really, and started at level 1 isn't even necessary since Rogue didn't and most people don't complain about it. Considering you need the subjobs to make the jobs themselves fully viable, leveling one to the point where you could unlock the rest, even if only to mid-30s (Coerthas takes place after Titan, which is 34. I don't recall much else beyond that), could cover most important cross class skills. The only cross class skill above 34 is Mantra anyways.

Cross class skills are important. I can't tell you how many other DRKs I have ran into without provoke.

Personally I would rather see it kept as is, except remove all the filler from like 2.2-2.? (Ysale) and make it a side quests.

Go kill this primal, go kill that primal, go kill another primal. Was just garbage story telling. I skipped most of it and theres so many trash filler quests "Go talk to this guy, run here, go back here" that make up like 70 quests after you do the level 50 finale.

Those are the quests holding back people from Ishgard. Not the whole story line.

Neither potions nor opening Ishgard should be allowed.

Just get rid of all the crap filler quests, boost the EXP rewards for whats left and let them enter HW for some decent story-telling.

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Originally Posted by KeluBehemoth

Personally I would rather see it kept as is, except remove all the filler from like 2.2-2.? (Ysale) and make it a side quests.

Go kill this primal, go kill that primal, go kill another primal. Was just garbage story telling. I skipped most of it and theres so many trash filler quests "Go talk to this guy, run here, go back here" that make up like 70 quests after you do the level 50 finale.

Those are the quests holding back people from Ishgard. Not the whole story line.

Neither potions nor opening Ishgard should be allowed.

Just get rid of all the crap filler quests, boost the EXP rewards for whats left and let them enter HW for some decent story-telling.

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Does that mean DRK won't be able to get any skills past 45? I know for a fact SE can gate quest skills based on what you have done, and if you've skipped a certain primal, an entire part of the quest just flat out doesn't make sense.

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Originally Posted by Ilenya

Does that mean DRK won't be able to get any skills past 45? I know for a fact SE can gate quest skills based on what you have done, and if you've skipped a certain primal, an entire part of the quest just flat out doesn't make sense.

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I dont understand what you mean.

No job has any skills locked behind any primals post 2.0

As for skipping the primals. They have already removed pre-requisite quests from other quests/battles in the past. Theres no reason it can't be done now.

The primal battles themselves aren't even quite that bad.

Its the 70 or so filler quests of absolute nonsense that really doesn't even effect the story.

With the odd "Speculation about Scions" or a little flash of text or something. The story from Levithan - Ramuh pretty much was just trash.

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Originally Posted by KeluBehemoth

I dont understand what you mean.

No job has any skills locked behind any primals post 2.0

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Technically they do. The original classes stop learning abilities automatically after level 50 and from then on you only get abilities through Job quests, and because those quests move into Heavensward areas... you would need to do the storyline to gain access to Ishgard to be able to complete these quests.

And because you need to do Primal fights as part of the main scenario... thus indirectly you need to do Primals in order to gain new skills past level 50.

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Originally Posted by Enkidoh

Technically they do. The original classes stop learning abilities automatically after level 50 and from then on you only get abilities through Job quests, and because those quests move into Heavensward areas... you would need to do the storyline to gain access to Ishgard. And because you need to do Primal fights as part of the main scenario... indirectly you need to do Primals in order to gain new skills past level 50.

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I never said to skip the story line.

I said to remove everything from 2.2-Ramuh and make it a side quest. Everything else that leads into Ishgard happens after that.



(Main Scenario Quest)+++++(Filler garbage story quests)+++++(Main Scenario quest)

Remove the trash quests but keep the story:

(Main Scenario Quest)+++++(Main Scenario Quest)+++++(Ishgard)

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Originally Posted by KeluBehemoth

I dont understand what you mean.

No job has any skills locked behind any primals post 2.0

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In my case, SMN can't do their 45 quest until they defeat Garuda. Unless that was changed since I ran it (In 2.0, granted.)
The point was, since the DRK 45 quest directly references the Leviathen fight, skipping it makes the DRK story just...Not make any sense. If they primals themselves are still required (Which they should be, really), then the comment really doesn't matter.

That is Garuda normal mode.

Were talking about content post level 50.

As for the DRK reference of Levithan? The primals themselves dont need to be taken out of the story.

The 70 or so quests of "go talk to this guy, run here, run back, more pointless bantar and trash" is what needs to be removed.

Im just using the primals as content release markers because I can't remember their exact patch numbers.

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Originally Posted by Derio

Cross class skills are important. I can't tell you how many other DRKs I have ran into without provoke.

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This soo much. I can't begin to tell how painful it was to level my DRG only to run into DRKs without any cross skills. "Stop taking hate!" is something that no Tank should ever say.

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Originally Posted by Reila_Circus

This soo much. I can't begin to tell how painful it was to level my DRG only to run into DRKs without any cross skills. "Stop taking hate!" is something that no Tank should ever say.

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Provoke will not help with this. It's either a case of "Tank needs more practice" or "DPS needs to pay attention to what the tank is doing"

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Originally Posted by Derio

Cross class skills are important. I can't tell you how many other DRKs I have ran into without provoke.

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GLA 30 and MRD 15 requirement for unlocking DRK. "I see you're not unfamiliar with taking hits for your group. Have this crystal."

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Originally Posted by Nestama

GLA 30 and MRD 15 requirement for unlocking DRK. "I see you're not unfamiliar with taking hits for your group. Have this crystal."

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I had an AST in Neverreap once that didn't have protect, so...Yes please.

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Originally Posted by Ilenya

Provoke will not help with this. It's either a case of "Tank needs more practice" or "DPS needs to pay attention to what the tank is doing"

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While that may be the case in early dunjins pre-level 50, by level 50 a DPS should not be able to snap aggro from a Tank attacking a singe target, which also happens to be a boss.

Even worse when said in-experienced Tank decides to take a shot at Bismark Extreme. Which has a mandatory Provoke mechanic. While said Tank has decided to never touch GLA for cross class skills... Heavensward was such an interesting release.

Speaking of which, while I don't think the Heavensward jobs should be obtained outside of Ishgard due to story reasons (just some things should not be changed just to appease a vocal minority,) I do believe any future expansion jobs should go to the base area as long as it fits with the story and lore.

Just let people have acces to 3.0 job at lvl 30 outside of Ishgard -_- we all know, the only reason they want a jumping level potion is to get access to the new jobs cause they are "so badass"

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Originally Posted by Reila_Circus

While that may be the case in early dunjins pre-level 50, by level 50 a DPS should not be able to snap aggro from a Tank attacking a singe target, which also happens to be a boss.

Even worse when said in-experienced Tank decides to take a shot at Bismark Extreme. Which has a mandatory Provoke mechanic. While said Tank has decided to never touch GLA for cross class skills... Heavensward was such an interesting release.

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I did forget about tank swap mechanics, but I stand by the fact that provoke won't help a tank who is somehow losing hate on a single target to a DPS. If the DPS doesn't hold back, the tank can't win, even with provoke, if s/he isn't ahead already.

End-game areas that contain only end game stuff should be the only thing possibly gated behind storyline, a la XI's sky and sea. Jobs (with their requirements), city hubs and the likes should be available to everyone regardless of progression in the story.

But I'm sure they learned their lessons and that they will eventually change HW accordingly in the future.

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Originally Posted by Ilenya

I had an AST in Neverreap once that didn't have protect, so...Yes please.

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For AST, it could be THM 30 and CNJ 15. Get Protect, Cleric Stance, Aero, as well as the all important Swiftcast.