4.x raid series

I know it is far too early to speculate, but it's fun to imagine what ideas SE has in store for us in 4.x.

We have had Bahamut and Alexander, arguably two of the most powerful eidolons (espers, summons etc.) in final fantasy, so what can they do next?

I was thinking that perhaps the next raid could have something to do with omega weapon, and perhaps we would either ally with shinryu, or fight both of them in a 3 way war. The only issue with this is that with the current lore for omega weapon, this would likely be another Allagan raid, and I can see SE wanting to move away from that.

What does everyone else want (or think) the 4.x raid to be?

I would say 4.X raid will be Omega Weapon, 3.X will probably end with us being absolutely rekt by it and having to flee to Meracydia to search for a way to face this threat while the empire "tanks it".

Anything fun and without stupid lockouts and in same time being hard. Alex 1 was a failure in several areas but Alex 2 is better and funnier.

As long they make a good history, and with some humor, good fights and interesting mechanics without depending on stupid heavy dps checks but something else then anything goes for me.

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Originally Posted by Shiki_Lockhart

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I was more thinking lore and visuals wise but I agree with you. I think (hope) SE learned from gordias, midas made it seem like they have, and it is currently my second favourite raid tier (slightly behind SCOB mainly due to creativity of the visuals). They seem to be pushing towards mechanics heavy fights, which is how raiding should be. Also, I disagree with your comment about humour, in that I would prefer the next raid tier to far more epic with a lot more knowingly at stake (like coil), I want it to be an ordeal on the characters involved, and I want it to seem in the world as hard as it is in game.

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Originally Posted by Alexander_Dragonfang

I would say 4.X raid will be Omega Weapon, 3.X will probably end with us being absolutely rekt by it and having to flee to Meracydia to search for a way to face this threat while the empire "tanks it".

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Each release of the raid could end with you fighting Omega on a different front, trying to defeat him, but being able to do little more than deflect or dely him, (maybe resulting in the destruction of a city or village) while finally dealing with him in what I imagine would be called O12.

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Originally Posted by Whiteroom

Each release of the raid could end with you fighting Omega on a different front, trying to defeat him, but being able to do little more than deflect or dely him, (maybe resulting in the destruction of a city or village) while finally dealing with him in what I imagine would be called O12.

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Zhaitan - GW2.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8CmZ5O_XjKs

I want to imagine a fight on this level of "spectacle" but being actually fun, not just a spamy glorified cutscene. Its how i thought Bahamut could have ended, but they went a more traditional, yet lazy, way with it. I can imagine Omega being inmense, having to attack it from diferent flanks, like having to attack her from the shroud, then from thanalan and after that from ala mhigo.

Thinking about it, I could see them bringing Asura for the next 8-man raid. Like Knights of the Round she isn't seen in many games (Most of her apperances being tied to IV) which would also give them some room to work with since people won't have quite as many pre-concieved notions about her in comparison to Bahamut and Alexander. In paticular she's the Queen of the Eidolons in IV, which could be worked into her having once been a ruler of Ala Mhigo or a previous civilization.

She also has three faces (Anger, Benevolence, and Joy) which easily could work into the naming conventions for the raids.

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Originally Posted by Dualblade

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The main problem I see with asura is that she is very similar in design to ravana, and there is clearly some heavy influence from asura in ravanas design. I wouldnt be opposed at all if they made the two different enough however.

Something different please. Not the same type thing with the 4 bosses blah blah blah...

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Originally Posted by Iromi

Something different please. Not the same type thing with the 4 bosses blah blah blah...

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What would you suggest? I'd love to know different possibilities and new experiences that we could have in our raid environment

Does it have to be Primal related? I'd quite like a Memoria-style romp through Eorzeas ancient history... Four Fiends and Chaos as bosses, who I guess might be a Primal if Belias-Egi is anything to go off... Although Cúchulainn is chillin' in Void Ark as a Voidsent, rather than Primal, so to hell with any consistency on the XII Espers appearing in this game...

Completely off topic, but what about the final boss of 4.0? So far we've had;

1.0, Nael van Darnus, projecting Sephiroth to the extreme (dropping a meteor on the planet, that walking through flames scene, etc.)
2.0, Ultima Weapon, very much modeled after the VII version...
3.0, Thordan, who was obviously this games Knights of the Round...

Point being, all very much VII inspired... So... Don Corneo for 4.0s final boss?!

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Originally Posted by Nalien

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No... Scarier, the darkest most terrifying savage boss...



... Palmer

First it was Bahamut, then Alexander. Those two were major plot elements from FF9. So the next raid should be Madeen or Trance Kuja.

Oh come on guys. Bahamut and Alexander are both "big" summons, the kind that are obviously going to ruin a whole lot of people's days when they show up. So what other "big" summons do we have that haven't appeared ingame already? My first thought would have been Knights of the Round, but 3.0 did that for the final boss. Leviathan has been downgraded to a regular Primal, and Odin is an Elder.

So I'm going to guess Eden.

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Originally Posted by Jacost

So I'm going to guess Eden.

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There is not enough Ff8 love in this game, I'd love Eden (or Ark from 9) to be difficult bosses

Hard to specule about it without knowing 4.0 context.

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Originally Posted by Alexander_Dragonfang

I would say 4.X raid will be Omega Weapon, 3.X will probably end with us being absolutely rekt by it and having to flee to Meracydia to search for a way to face this threat while the empire "tanks it".

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the 4.x will probably the third war against the empire, and try to reconquers the north east of eorzea... Yoshida did told us that he don't plan to make use leave eorzea before we have it completed, the only part left is the north east, that belong to the empire since the first war. every video at the end of the MSQ of the 3.x serie point in this sense, since we see papalymo and ida that talk about the resistance in ala miggho.

about the raid, who know, all i hope it's to see another end game content that is as hard and challenging than the raid savage for 4 and 24 player. for allows small and big FC to have something to do. not every guild can gather 8 member enough of time for face savage content tailored to 8 player only. some will have a hard time to gather more of 5-6 person at the same time and end always calling pick up and randomized them progression. and some guild have tons of member and need to build a lot of different roster for face the endgame content.

Raid at 8 have show it limit and it's time to think bigger, indeed, small group that will only be able to do group of 4 will still be stuck at this but for the other group that can gather 8 or 24 it will give them more activity. ohh and mode important i want them to stop to try to limitate the choice of our jobs we can equip per tier to 2-3 max... some person enjoy to have acces at a lot of jobs at the same time. will be nice to not forget them.

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Originally Posted by silentwindfr

Yoshida did told us that he don't plan to make use leave eorzea before we have it completed

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When? Will we really be able to leave eorzea o_O

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Originally Posted by Konicorgi

When? Will we really be able to leave eorzea o_O

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WoW has multiple continents so why not

I'd rather we don't have a primal as the next raid as we seem to be stepping away from Primals.
And have something Garlean as the next raid...

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Originally Posted by Konicorgi

When? Will we really be able to leave eorzea o_O

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hyadelyn have 3 continent you know?
- Eorzea, the one we live on.
- Ilsabard, the one the empire come from (normally the biggest one of the three)
- Meracydian, that was while the allagan empire time, the continent owned by the dragon mostly.

ps: Eorzea is the smaller of the three continent by the way.

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Originally Posted by Pomelo

I'd rather we don't have a primal as the next raid as we seem to be stepping away from Primals.
And have something Garlean as the next raid...

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i feel the same, i see raid that will be more like operation against the empire, if not battle against the invading force.... why not see some stuff like:
- first raid, we fight for retake the land next to ala miggho by attacking the base there.
- second raid, we retake ala miggho, begining by the battle outside the city, the battle on the defense, before throught a battle into the street of the town for beat the commanding officier still there.
- third raid, attack of the last bastion of the empire on Eorzea.

and one point they can for one time add this throught the story, since let's be honest the normal mode of the raid are quite accessible now, they can perfectly add it into the MSQ, like this they can add an epic feeling that we are lacking in the msq soo far.

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Originally Posted by silentwindfr

hyadelyn have 3 continent you know?
- Eorzea, the one we live on.
- Ilsabard, the one the empire come from (normally the biggest one of the three)
- Meracydian, that was while the allagan empire time, the continent owned by the dragon mostly.

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Hydaelyn is actually even bigger than that, you missed Othard (the continent that Doma is on) and the (largely unexplored) old and new worlds.

As for your warfront raid idea, it sounds interesting but I think it would feel forced in a raid setting. I'd much rather something like that be brand new content (perhaps open world PVP or a PVE equivilent)

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Originally Posted by Lambdafish

Hydaelyn is actually even bigger than that, you missed Othard (the continent that Doma is on) and the (largely unexplored) old and new worlds.

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it's not clear, maybe othard is something of the size of Vylbrand or Aldenard, that are both not counted as the main continent of hyadelyn, after they can yes add more area, but soo far the three main continent are Eorzea, Meracydian and Ilsabard.

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Originally Posted by Lambdafish

As for your warfront raid idea, it sounds interesting but I think it would feel forced in a raid setting. I'd much rather something like that be brand new content (perhaps open world PVP or a PVE equivilent)

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open world content can't work, we have too many people per server, plus when new content will be release if the area recquire a group new player will be blocked since no one will want to do this sort of stuff anymore. leaving large part of the world unused, that why they didn't bring open world dungeon, for avoid to have place not used or blocking player.

for the warfront i still hope for SE to bring this sort of content under different size of group... it's possible to tailored different size group content with a challenge equal. but i digress, it will be a nice way to make evolve the raiding in FF14 that really need to be changed from it format actual that have reach a point where it look a bit....weird. adding more epic encounter, with maybe randomized boss, i means on a battlefield you don't know what you can meet, adding 2-3 boss for the same location will, naturally add more work, but will increase the replayability of the raid.

ps: for pvp part forget it, since we can't play imperial, remember, then a battlefield where the three grand company fight each other while facing an enemy have 10 times them number is stupid.

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Originally Posted by silentwindfr

the 4.x will probably the third war against the empire, and try to reconquers the north east of eorzea... Yoshida did told us that he don't plan to make use leave eorzea before we have it completed, the only part left is the north east, that belong to the empire since the first war. every video at the end of the MSQ of the 3.x serie point in this sense, since we see papalymo and ida that talk about the resistance in ala miggho.

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Unless the next expansion deals with the lost HQ of the Students of Baldesion up slightly NW from where we are now. It was an island, right? So... If an island vanishes, you're bound to have a bunch of excess water to investigate in/around. And if they add (as has been rumoured/suspected/hyped) swimming in 4.0, that seems like an excellent combination. It'd also make us focus a bit more on the Ascians, since 2.x story mentions all students who vanished being involved in research on a particular subject, using a term which (as far as I remember) Ascians have also used.

Since that's referred to in 2.x story, it also makes a bit more sense not requiring 3.x completion to access it. If 4.x is to be accessible without completing 3.x, it makes a little less sense to say "well, they talk about this in 3.x, so it must be regarding that".

(Sure, they could add those parts in 3.x as well, but it'd require making more area maps, something I haven't seen them do yet outside of an expansion -- counting ARR as an expansion in this case.)

I'd personally love to see something like X's Omega Ruins, or a version thereof for the next raid.

Bring back the sense of exploration, mystery, and danger that Coil had. Possible currently existing locales that can be used:

Gelmorra (Spanning much of the Shroud underground)
The West Shroud (Devastated on the surface, yes, but perhaps underground?)
Sil'dih Ruins
Cartenau (PERFECT location for Omega Ruins, if not Azys Lla)
Amdapor, Nym, and Mhach (Assuming Mhachi lore isn't reserved for Void Ark, there's MUCH lore and mystery to explore there)
The Cieldales Isles (Hullbreaker was just one of them)

Coerthas Central LOWlands might be interesting, assuming it'd be hard/impossible to re-add as a zone (because CCH is generally the lv30-40 area), and also assuming the Eastern High/Lowlands might be reserved for an Ala Mhigan/4.0 expansion.

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Originally Posted by Noxifer

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the disappearing student was explained already the island was wiped by the asciens, pointless to go check a place where they have use a massive attack for this. we have tons of area with water around limsa. plus they will not have bring the emperor on Eorzea and him admiral ship only for show off... you don't move an emperor without reason... you can be sure that the empire will strike soon. and you can be sure too that the admiral ship is not the only one around.

the war with the empire was tease for long enough, even before hw, they was saying that it's only a matter of time for the empire to come back for take eorzea.

and about the 3.X needed for the 4.X since we will have an increase of level (probably) it will be mandatory to have done the 3.X (that are for now, shorter than 2.X) for get into 4.X, how explained that our character did flee to ishgard at the end of the 2.X and suddenly go somewhere else?

ps: and for yoshida he want to complete Eorzea, and the only really missing part are the north east part, indeed we miss a few area in the other part, but we need to move on, they can be added later. about omega weapon it's only an escuse for justify the pvp frontline, don't read too much into it.

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Originally Posted by Lambdafish

No... Scarier, the darkest most terrifying savage boss...



... Palmer

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Only if we get to hit him with a truck for a one shot.

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Originally Posted by silentwindfr

the disappearing student was explained already

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Well, yes. But it wasn't simply destroyed. It was vanished, as far as I remember. Could definitely warrant some research on figuring out where it went (void or something else) and to see if we can bring something of it back (physically or just some of the knowledge from it). I mean, research into that very thing the Ascians seem to want to do? And they get attacked/killed/kidnapped for it? Seems totally worth finding out more about. Who knows, maybe they were starting to figure out ways to stop the Ascians? =)
(And yes, I'm trying to write stuff fairly ambiguously, so as to not spoil people too much who haven't finished those particular storylines. If that makes what I'm saying unclear or confusing, it's... kind of the point. But sorry anyway.)

Of course, it could very well be that both the lost island and Ala Mhigan resistance are part of 4.x, especially since the former would (theoretically) make for a very short expansion story on its own. And having both in an expansion would mean retaining our focus on both Ascians and Empire, something they seem to like us to do ^_~

To return to the actual topic of this thread, having both as part of 4.x would mean one raid could be focusing on one side of it (whether the 8-man or 24-man, assuming they're going with the same pattern), and the other could focus on the other side.

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Originally Posted by silentwindfr

ps: for pvp part forget it, since we can't play imperial, remember, then a battlefield where the three grand company fight each other while facing an enemy have 10 times them number is stupid.

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Omg if Ff14 pulls a wow and we get Empire vs Eorzian Alliance as factions that you choose when you make a character I will absolutely lose my shit.

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Originally Posted by silentwindfr

ps: for pvp part forget it, since we can't play imperial, remember, then a battlefield where the three grand company fight each other while facing an enemy have 10 times them number is stupid.

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So having clever writing give you a difficult decision on whether to liberate ala mhigo or leave it under the control of the imperials isn't an option? 4.0 is a good opportunity to see the lives of people under imperial rule first hand. Ala Mhigo has been under imperial rule for a decade, the country could have benefited from this with technology and better living, and some people might not want independence. This could lead into a mini civil war, in which the player can choose which side they are on. Slightly long winded, but it shows that you don't have to be an imperial to choose a side.

Also... alliance content has been in so many MMOs, FFXI included, and yoshi P even said that open world PVP could be considered if there is enough demand and lore justification.

If we're talking op summons there was always sin or anima in ffx. Unlikely but possible. Especially if we really do get water as part of the next expansion.

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Originally Posted by Alexander_Dragonfang

Zhaitan - GW2.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8CmZ5O_XjKs

I want to imagine a fight on this level of "spectacle" but being actually fun, not just a spamy glorified cutscene. Its how i thought Bahamut could have ended, but they went a more traditional, yet lazy, way with it. I can imagine Omega being inmense, having to attack it from diferent flanks, like having to attack her from the shroud, then from thanalan and after that from ala mhigo.

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Guild Wars 2 had easily the worst final boss in the history of final bosses. It was like GW2's biggest weak point 0.o

Probably something mini-war related as to seeing we will get the GC updates around 4.0 or a bit earlier before it.

Idc if it's a raid or not I just want Ozma and Hades in the game

Hopefully, and fingers crossed here, we get more than 6 new zones/maps to explore. HW was a let down in that aspect.

I was really hoping they would unlock more as the patches released but it doesn't seem like it.

If we do get water as the next expansion then Anima possibly.

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Originally Posted by MicahZerrshia

Hopefully, and fingers crossed here, we get more than 6 new zones/maps to explore. HW was a let down in that aspect.

I was really hoping they would unlock more as the patches released but it doesn't seem like it.

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6 new zones but each zone was at least twice bigger than an old zone, mean 12 zones

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Originally Posted by Konicorgi

6 new zones but each zone was at least twice bigger than an old zone, mean 12 zones

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For me personally, the zones in HW were a letdown not because of how many or few there were, but because of the locking of them behind MSQ. Some, I get (like Azys Lla), but others? Flight is locked not only behind exploration and side-quests but also behind MSQ, so it's not like you'd be able to completely ignore MSQ anyway to go everywhere on the maps, but part of what was so enjoyable with ARR was the whole "oh gods oh gods I'm not supposed to be here, please don't let that monster see me and eat me" feeling of running around in too high areas, just exploring. When it comes to games, I'm very much a "Oh, I'm supposed to go left here? Then let's go right and straight forward first, before we go left, just so I don't miss anything" kind of person. So for me, being able to go into, say, Hinterlands through careful hide-and-run exploration, while my MSQ was still stranded in Western Highlands would have been amazing. Now it felt more like a railroaded point-A-to-point-B kind of game.
(I still enjoyed it, don't take me wrong. I just didn't enjoy it as much as I would have with the kind of free exploration we had/have in ARR.)

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Originally Posted by Noxifer

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It's understadable that they "locked" it this way, in ARR all the places were known by the 3 big city state. In HS, you're mostly going straight ahead in the unknown.

Magus sisters, with each of the three sets of raids dedicated to one of them maybe