Had a Warrior in vanilla. Thinking about taking a DRK to 60 after my SCH. are DRK's overlooked in group finders and statics? I feel like people consider them underwhelming.
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Had a Warrior in vanilla. Thinking about taking a DRK to 60 after my SCH. are DRK's overlooked in group finders and statics? I feel like people consider them underwhelming.
Hmm I'm not sure I know the real complaint they lack any real utility unlike pld and war.
They had a reputation for being the derp tank at the start of the expansion, but once the dedicated players figured out how to make 'em sing, regard for them rose greatly. No one in GF is going to give you any crap over being a DRK as long you hold aggro and don't die. If you get it into a static, you'll probably be the main tank, so, no pressure.
The only thing that i should be complaining about DRK is that they are a bit squishy compared to other tanks.
Did you have grit up? This DK pulled seven at the start and didn't dip below 10k. https://youtu.be/kFsJgxgOdXI?t=66
Dropping to 1/4th health on one pull sounds kinda nutty. (Or are you saying you only lost 1/4th health? Which still isn't a lot.)
Only hyur, lalafells, and miqo'te DK tanks.
Actually they handle physical attacks well...better then wars. I thought they sucked until I realised grit stays up so that 20% shadow skin and shadow wall does well. Dark arts plus dark dance....are yall sure yall playing DRK as a tank and not a watered down dps thinking you're hitting hard?
Only if they're Lalas or female Au Ra.
I'm a Lala Drk since day 1 of 3.0, and get more compliments on my Drk tanking than Pld. Pld has a shield which gives them the extra bit of mitigation, but if you're cycling your cooldowns well, and know which mobs to stun in a pack you'd be surprised how sturdy Drk can be.
Unless you're pushing content in Savage you really shouldn't worry about which tank you play. Pick a class you like and learn it, a good Drk is just as good as any other tank, and knowing your class is what really makes you shine. I've been making the double pulls in Antitower since the 2nd day and having no trouble with my HP dipping to frightening levels.
Reprisal makes up for our lack of a shield in a way.
Even if you are, they're all perfectly viable. WAR + PLD and WAR + DRK have cleared A5-7S so far. Unfortunately PLD + DRK still isn't really a completely viable thing, but with gear it's doable.
DRK's pretty good, a lot of it's use is taken away as OT but Reprisal is really strong as MT and having access to DA + DM for certain mechanics or just magical tank busters/cleaves is ridiculously good. I'm personally still not a fan of how they designed DRK in general though, as it basically just... has CDs... which is pretty boring... but that aside, still pretty fun and entirely viable.
It's not really due to either one being particularly deficient so much as neither being able to compete with WAR in the OT spot. WAR can supply a slashing resistance debuff (which boosts DPS for DRK, PLD, WAR, and NIN), as well as a 10% reduction to outgoing damage from the boss, which outclasses both PLD and DRK--all while providing near-DPS-job-levels of DPS in Deliverance. PLD and DRK do have similar utility to the damage reduction, but they aren't as good at it unless they're MT. There's also the fact that neither can provide the slashing resistance debuff, and so without a WAR (or a NIN playing to support them), they aren't going to be able to deal as much damage.
It also has to do with fight designs.
Technically, Pld's actually bring a lot to the table as OT. They can Cover the MT for Tank busters, Cast DV for party wide AoE's, and free up the healer's mp pool by casting stoneskins and the odd clemency. When in the MT position, a Pld has much more time to look at the party list and decide what the best way for them to provide support is. the problem is that almost all of their support comes in the form of extra defense and mitigation, which is widely not needed.
Pld's dmg reduction utility in the OT spot is actually pretty close (if not better than) War's, especially considering most War's ignore their dmg debuff in favour of dps. So, in theory, Pld's can provide more utility in that spot. The problem is that the utility they are providing is not considered as useful as straight dps. As things are, Healers really don't need the extra help. It's nice, and I'm sure that they like it, but they don't need it. They can keep a group up just fine without a Pld. Further, the MT doesn't strictly need to be covered for tank busters. It's nice, and I'm sure that they like it, but all of the Tanks can mitigate their own dmg. The amount of extra mitigation that a Pld can provide in the OT position is not proportionate to the amount of Dps utility that a War can provide in the same spot.
When comparing War's and Pld's in OT, what it falls to is which has the higher utility ceiling, and there is no ceiling to dps. There's never a time in which someone goes, "whoa guys ... we're killing this guy too fast. Gotta slow it down," but there could very well be a time in which someone says, "err... well that DV was nice, but my Galvanize would have handled it ..." Extra Dps is always considered an asset. The same cannot be said for extra mitigation. There's a limit to how much extra mitigation is actually required before it's just overkill or no one even notices it, so as long as that is the only thing that Pld's bring to OT, they will never be considered favourable in that role over War's.
I feel like the tanking forums are almost at a singularity consisting of 50% Stat bickering, 25% WARs discussing their DPS and/or how they can MT/OT anything DRK/PLD can, and 25% DRKs and PLDs contemplating their reason for even existing amongst the constant "anything you can do we can do the same/better" from the former.
In early ARR as a healer there was a point where I realized I had to DPS less when a WAR was tanking. Eventually they buffed WAR and now it's probably my preferred tank in DF just for the run speeds over PLD. In HW I've had to accept that I consistently can't DPS as much with DRK tanking.
This could absolutely be based on play styles/player ability but it's still the case with typical DRK in DF/PF which will potentially impact attitudes.
Noooo! dont leave us! You and Syz are propably only ones that actually knows how tanking should be handled, too many times suggestions offered by other players in here are either broken or flatout OP but usually both of you give resonable tweak and fix suggestions.
DRK is definitively squishier in trash pulls. It's not really something that's debatable. You can say "but you have tools" all you want. Their tools aren't "press 1 button" - they consist of knowing and understanding the Job's mechanics and executing them properly. DRK's trash tanking really shines when you blind the enemies or boost dodge rate or use DA+AD during Blood Price runoff. All of those require non-standard usage of Dark Arts. If you're not innately aware of these rarely-used effects, you're flat out not gonna do it.
Which results in DRK being squishier than PLD and WAR in trash pulls, in general. DA+DP/DD/AD is way trickier than "having a shield" or "hitting bloodbath" to be quite honest.
DRK's pretty easy for trash pulls. Pull everything, put down Salted earth, put up Blood Price, pop a CD, and spam Abyssal Drain while weaving in some DA Abyssal Drain if you start ping ponging or your healer is actively DPSing. Dark Dance is pretty powerful for trash as well, since you can put Reprisal on any heavy hitting mobs or you can DA it after Blood Price wears if you don't have anything worth putting up Reprisal on. I guess, relatively, it's difficult compared to WAR? Maybe? But in general it's not exactly hard to pop CDs and press the Abyssal Drain button.