Make Each Class Use Each Stat

Here is an idea that everyone will hate! \o/ (except a few others like myself)

Let's make each primary stat actually have an effect on each of the jobs.

STR could improve CRT
DEX could improve accuracy and determination
MND could improve spell speed/skill speed
INT could improve TP refresh/MP refresh

Then

You could have a SCH who slots up STR accessories or the 30 points, for higher crit'd adlos if they so choose to sacrifice the MND

You could have a WHM slot in DEX to meet accuracy requirements

You could have BLM using MND for faster Fire IV's

You could have tanks slot in DEX for to meet the high frontal accuracy cap

You could have bards slot in STR for CRITs and bloodletter procs

You could have melee slot in INT so they wouldn't have to worry about TP woes on AoE heavy encounters

etc etc.

I think this change would couple well with the upcoming changes to Materia slots being added to more gear


EDIT: Alternatively, can we remove the 35 bonus attributes and have them automatic. 0 reason to pick anything other than your main stat currently.

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Originally Posted by Kaurie

Here is an idea that everyone will hate! \o/ (except a few others like myself)

Let's make each primary stat actually have an effect on each of the jobs.

STR could improve CRT
DEX could improve accuracy and determination
MND could improve spell speed/skill speed
INT could improve TP refresh/MP refresh

.

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makes gear progression too hard to "control" on SE's end.
They killed STR accessories for tank and force tank to use VIT accessories... you think they gonna allow that to happen?

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Originally Posted by Furiea

makes gear progression too hard to "control" on SE's end.
They killed STR accessories for tank and force tank to use VIT accessories... you think they gonna allow that to happen?

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No, sadly, I doubt they would let this happen. That said, I think 99.9% (999 of every 1000) of the suggestions/threads on the forum would go largely ignored by the devs.

Despite this, I can dream. This would create a much more involved and interesting system.

I can't see anyone wanting to give up 47 points of their primary stat per piece for what amounts to an alternate way to get secondary stats. Even if you assume a 1:1 ratio on, say, STR to CRIT, there's no way I'd give up 47 mind for 47 crit. That's losing way too much overall heal potency (and attack potency, when in Cleric Stance) for a smidge more possibility at a crit. Our secondary stats aren't powerful enough for this to be anything but another illusion of choice.

What's the justification for DEX increasing DET, MND increasing SKSP, and INT increasing TP refresh though? o.O

This is such a terrible idea...

I'm sorry but no. Just having more secondary stats would be better than this.

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Originally Posted by Ashkendor

I can't see anyone wanting to give up 47 points of their primary stat per piece for what amounts to an alternate way to get secondary stats. Even if you assume a 1:1 ratio on, say, STR to CRIT, there's no way I'd give up 47 mind for 47 crit. That's losing way too much overall heal potency (and attack potency, when in Cleric Stance) for a smidge more possibility at a crit. Our secondary stats aren't powerful enough for this to be anything but another illusion of choice.

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I was assuming a higher stat proficiency than the current secondary stats. As for an Illusion of Choice, I personally really dislike this statement and feel it is thrown around way to often. One could make an argument that everything in the world is an illusion of choice, but that is way too philosophical. I don't think having different playstyles needs to be some illusion. I also think that certain builds would be better for certain encounters, i.e. MNK using INT for TP refresh on A2S, but not during other savage levels - or a WHM slotting in DEX for accuracy when they want to DPS, but going full MND during more progression minded encounters.

EDIT: To elaborate a little bit more on this. Currently, with stat weights, my Summoner has ~3500 INT. When I remove 35 int, I lost 1% of my DPS, or theoretically going from 1300 to 1287. It's fairly insignificant, and the variation in latency, critical hits, and RNG will affect your DPS more than this change. However, if you were adding those 35 points into TP refresh, so that your BRD doesn't need to use Paeon, or add it to CRT so you (as a BRD now) can get more bloodletter procs, could result in a higher raid DPS. It would be probably the most beneficial to a BLM who could slot in for spell speed to get an extra Fire IV in their rotation - which would be more beneficial than a 1% damage increase.

I figure that many of us have these varied accessories anyway, and we have the ability to change our 35 attribute points quite easily, this would open doors to actually let people do that.

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What's the justification for DEX increasing DET, MND increasing SKSP, and INT increasing TP refresh though? o.O

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Great question and that's totally up for discussion. That said, I think someone who is mindful would be able to do things more quickly, and someone who is intelligent would be great at managing resources. I picked DET for DEX as it was the closest we have to something like armor piercing, which I'd associate with DEX.

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Originally Posted by FoxyAreku

This is such a terrible idea...

I'm sorry but no. Just having more secondary stats would be better than this.

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As much as I appreciate everyone who takes part in the discussion, whether you agree or disagree, I feel you could phrase your disagreement in a more respectful and productive manner. To argue your point, the reason why I think this system is superior, is due to the systems we have in place (attribute point spending and cross gear accessories). That said, I am all for interesting secondary stats.


Forum limit, replying to below posts here.

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Originally Posted by Averax

Then what exactly would be the point of secondary stats like skill/spell speed, crit, piety, etc...???

I have a suggestions.

Keep stats as they are, but change stats we can put points into to the secondary stats.

As it is now, everyone's just throwing their points into their main stat, there's not a whole huge point to them. If we could put them into secondary stats, we could enhance the secondary stats we're lacking in.

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Great idea for sure. That would be another way to work around it! However, I'd suggest we lock accessories by job and class if we went this direction instead.

To answer your first question, skill speed, spell speed, crit etc would still be useful. For example, you may have 600 CRIT on your current gear build. You could swap out 35 MND (as you're a WHM) for 35 STR, as the general stat weight for CRT for most jobs (no idea for WHM) is ~0.2ish, we could say 35 STR = 175 CRT, so your CRIT would jump to 775. The majority is still clearly from your other gear, but the 35 attribute points make a significant dent.

Weights, values etc. would naturally need to be tested and balanced.

Then what exactly would be the point of secondary stats like skill/spell speed, crit, piety, etc...???

I have a suggestions.

Keep stats as they are, but change stats we can put points into to the secondary stats.

As it is now, everyone's just throwing their points into their main stat, there's not a whole huge point to them. If we could put them into secondary stats, we could enhance the secondary stats we're lacking in.

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Originally Posted by Kaurie

As much as I appreciate everyone who takes part in the discussion, whether you agree or disagree, I feel you could phrase your disagreement in a more respectful and productive manner. To argue your point, the reason why I think this system is superior, is due to the systems we have in place (attribute point spending and cross gear accessories). That said, I am all for interesting secondary stats.

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It bleeds illusion of choice and it breaks the foundation that the game already sits on. People would just theorycraft which stat gives each class the most damage anyway and then that would be their new main stat, while everyone else who tries something different is labeled as a terrible player and would be kicked from groups, that's why it's terrible.

Sorry if that offended you. This just would not work in this current MMO age, thus it's a terrible idea.

FFXIV is designed with almost no variety or diversity in builds and stats. Sadly, there's barely even an illusion of choice. Every job has the same abilities with the same stats and the same rotation. While I would like to see more interesting stats, I think we're stuck with what we have given that SE seems to like everything as homogenized as possible.

The most we are likely to see is smaller changes like VIT on tanks rather than an entire overhaul of the stat system.

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Originally Posted by FoxyAreku

This just would not work in this current MMO age, thus it's a terrible idea.

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Stats could still have been made more interesting than they are. They are reallllly bland.Using an example from a less popular game (with much more interesting gameplay, in my opinion):

The Secret World stats:

Hit Rating: determines accuracy. low Hit Rating results in Glanced attacks (lower damage and no procs) or can be evaded.

Critical Rating: increases Critical Hit/Heal%. Critical Hits can be Blocked, however, reducing their damage.

Critical Power: increases the potency of Critical Hits and Critical Heals.

Penetration: prevents attacks from being Blocked, and can cause hits to Penetrate, which ignores a portion of defensive stats dealing extra damage.

Evasion: chance to complete evade an attack and take no damage.

Block: chance to Block an attack and receive less damage. Chance to negate critical hits.

Defense: chance to have attacks against you Glance, reducing incoming damage and negating any additional effects such as procs.

Gear can be custom-made to include any combination of these stats, but they work together. You can make a high Critical build, but you might be Blocked a lot. You can make a Penetration build to avoid blocks altogether, but your critical hits will be less frequent. You can make a balanced build with some of everything. Tank stats can be mixed and matched or you can focus on one. Or, you can be a DPS-focused tank - one of the more popular builds stacks Penetration rather than defensive stays because a particular ability reduces enemy damage output by a large amount if you frequently Penetrate. Even certain Healers can male use of every stat as Leech healing requires DPS to heal your defensive target.

The game is designed to allow you to make these choices. I'm not generally one to compare one game to another, but in this case, I do think more interesting stats can work just fine in a current MMO. The problem is that FFXIV was designed to be waaaay too vanilla, and now it's probably too late to make any sort of massive changes to the core elements of the game. Heck, it's already been destroyed and Reborn once already.

This is actually a very good idea. I applaud the OP for thinking outside the box a bit. :)

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Originally Posted by Darkstride

FFXIV is designed with almost no variety or diversity in builds and stats. Sadly, there's barely even an illusion of choice. Every job has the same abilities with the same stats and the same rotation. While I would like to see more interesting stats, I think we're stuck with what we have given that SE seems to like everything as homogenized as possible.

The most we are likely to see is smaller changes like VIT on tanks rather than an entire overhaul of the stat system.

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https://i.imgur.com/f7FdEdG.jpg

Folks like to bash this game over the "lack of choice" / "illusion of choice" but honestly the devs have said themselves that if they did give us paths, choices and etc that everyone would still gravitate to the same cookie-cutter build.
And they are 100% correct. EQ1, EQ2, WoW, honestly almost every MMO that had these features went that way.

Arguing against the idea...
Why would you want say a WHM who is gearing fully for say accuracy and crit? That WHM's heals would then be laughable while the WHM job is designed to be a healer.

Arguing for the idea...
Some classes could really benefit. BLM being able to build as a quick caster ast the cost of some of the "umph" their spells pack is a very legitimate choice.
Many folks might actually like it as it could debateably give BLM more mobility and alleviate those moments where every AOE and mechanic targets the BLM and in effect CC's the BLM.

I'd rather they take away us speccing in main stats and let us spec in Determination, Crit Chance, Spell Speed, Skill Speed.
Or...
Just give us modifiers/choice in traits. Like a boost in the main or secondary stats or overall cooldown reduction.

Paths/Trees end with multiple traits that are:
1. Taken to unlock a "good" ability/skill
2. Stat increases you'd normally get during the leveling process if you did not have a tree.
3. 1 Tree that is found to be lackluster and thusbfrowned upon by 90% of the community.
4. Cookie Cutter specs.

@OP
I like the thinking out of the box. Honestly...I think if they homogenized/merged the secondary stats into the main stats theu could simplify things and just have main stats on armor & weapons and thus make gearing and nateria less of a PITA.

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Originally Posted by Defias

Folks like to bash this game over the "lack of choice" / "illusion of choice" but honestly the devs have said themselves thay of they did give us paths, choices and etc that everyone would still gravitate to the same cookie-cutter build.
And they are 100% correct. EQ1, EQ2, WoW, honestly almost every MMO that had these features went that way.

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They are 100% Incorrect.

Cookie cutter builds exist, yes, even in games like GW2 with relatively speaking no powercreep at all (absolute oposite of XIV) there are cookie cutter builds for dungeons/PvP/Alliance PvP (world vs world vs world). But outside that, you have an incredible freedom of choice, and in fact, something XIV has that GW2 is in dire need is of a profile collection system to easily change gearsets/classes which in XIV could be expanded into stats.

Maybe in high end savage level raids or extreme primals i would run the cookie cutter build, but i don`t see why an ultra skillspeed (incredibly low damage, 0.5s skill speed xD) or an evasion off-tank DRG don`t have a room in dungeons or overworld.

In fact i will always take in consideration Ragnarok Online, which of course had cookie cutter builds, but the freedom was so inmense and so fun that "for fun builds" were basically the motivation to raid/get incredibly rare gear.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mu24yfMuzDM

Of course build is radically diferent, but i don`t see why we can`t have for example a dedicated healer gladiator, and even more, such freedom would bring back the classes into relevance since you can cross much more skills. Make more skills cross-able and you would never need to add an spellsword class, make it yourself.

We kinda had this in 1.0. For example MNKs WSs had an INT modifier along with STR, so you'd see a lot of INT penta-melded MNK head pieces etc (materia was limited as to what could be melded where).

Give jobs a second mainstat

example Monks damage can be based on Str and Int (like during 1.21-1.23c). Int can give bonus damage if the Monk is in a Fist stance (and Fist stance can consume MP over time while active)

Of course if they give us different path, people will find wich one gives the most damage...since EVERYTHING in this game is about damage.

What does STR do ? Increase damage
What does DEX do ? Increase damage
What does INT do ? Increase damage
What does MND do ? ...increase damage for Cleric Stance
What does VIT do ? Nobody cares...what ? tank damage based on VIT ? Then, it increases damage
What does PIE do ? Please...
What does Accuracy do ? Bothering us, so it disappears more and more from gear AND from requirements
What does Crit do ? Increase damage
What does Determination do ? Increase damage
What does Skillspeed do ? Increase damage
What does Spellspeed do ? Increase damage
What does Parry do ? Make people run away from it
What does Defense do ? Who cares, the same ilvl always bring the same Defense
What does M.Defense do ? See above

Do you see a pattern, there ? Do you see how bland the stats are ?

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Originally Posted by Darkstride

Stats could still have been made more interesting than they are. They are reallllly bland.Using an example from a less popular game (with much more interesting gameplay, in my opinion):

The Secret World stats:

Hit Rating: determines accuracy. low Hit Rating results in Glanced attacks (lower damage and no procs) or can be evaded.

Critical Rating: increases Critical Hit/Heal%. Critical Hits can be Blocked, however, reducing their damage.

Critical Power: increases the potency of Critical Hits and Critical Heals.

Penetration: prevents attacks from being Blocked, and can cause hits to Penetrate, which ignores a portion of defensive stats dealing extra damage.

Evasion: chance to complete evade an attack and take no damage.

Block: chance to Block an attack and receive less damage. Chance to negate critical hits.

Defense: chance to have attacks against you Glance, reducing incoming damage and negating any additional effects such as procs.

Gear can be custom-made to include any combination of these stats, but they work together. You can make a high Critical build, but you might be Blocked a lot. You can make a Penetration build to avoid blocks altogether, but your critical hits will be less frequent. You can make a balanced build with some of everything. Tank stats can be mixed and matched or you can focus on one. Or, you can be a DPS-focused tank - one of the more popular builds stacks Penetration rather than defensive stays because a particular ability reduces enemy damage output by a large amount if you frequently Penetrate. Even certain Healers can male use of every stat as Leech healing requires DPS to heal your defensive target.

The game is designed to allow you to make these choices. I'm not generally one to compare one game to another, but in this case, I do think more interesting stats can work just fine in a current MMO. The problem is that FFXIV was designed to be waaaay too vanilla, and now it's probably too late to make any sort of massive changes to the core elements of the game. Heck, it's already been destroyed and Reborn once already.

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This is what I support and what I wish they would do, more interesting secondaries, not messing with the foundation of main stats like this thread suggests.

Personally I would prefer if they removed the primary stats and only kept the secondary stats.

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Originally Posted by Cuervo78

Personally I would prefer if they removed the primary stats and only kept the secondary stats.

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That does not even make sense and is actually completely impossible without changing how the game works completely. >_>

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Originally Posted by Kaurie

Let's make each primary stat actually have an effect on each of the jobs.

STR could improve CRT
DEX could improve accuracy and determination
MND could improve spell speed/skill speed
INT could improve TP refresh/MP refresh

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Well they did have mroe interesting uses for stats in 2.x. Dtreght would give parry and dex would get crit but they just amde them outright power increases in 3.0.

Wildstar when it released had four stats and depending on what class you picked you would get a different benefit.

For their free to play launch they reverted to the 'normal' combat rating type stats but they still have a fair few though.

The problem they faced was that it was complexity for the sake of complexity and generally confusing having one stat do this and do other thing for that other class and even more different for a third class.

The what they had it in 2.x was fine in my opinion.

FF14 has very boring stats and they just feel pointless: haste, crit and attack/spell power. /doze

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Originally Posted by Kaurie

EDIT: Alternatively, can we remove the 35 bonus attributes and have them automatic. 0 reason to pick anything other than your main stat currently.

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It does have some use. Currently if you're a tank you can stat for vit or strength or a mizture. However in 3.2 it's likely going to be vit now.

For a BLM you might stat for some pie if you can get one more fire spell off until you regen.

Personally I'd like it if it was secondary stats including pie that you can stat for. maybe you need some accuracy, then stat for some of that. Are you a healer with mana problems - some pie then maybe some crit if you're a SCH etc.

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Originally Posted by FoxyAreku

That does not even make sense and is actually completely impossible without changing how the game works completely. >_>

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Actually, it does.
Nobody cares about VIT and PIE, so you jsut have to set HP and MP values for each job/level.
And apart from that, you could just fuse STR and DEX into Attack, use Magic Attack for INT, and Healing Potency for MND.

And again, pretty much all stats just increase damage, no need to have tons of them...

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

Actually, it does.
Nobody cares about VIT and PIE, so you jsut have to set HP and MP values for each job/level.
And apart from that, you could just fuse STR and DEX into Attack, use Magic Attack for INT, and Healing Potency for MND.

And again, pretty much all stats just increase damage, no need to have tons of them...

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And how would you code this?

It really is not that simple when the entire foundation, party buffs, and all ability calculation is made with these stats in mind.

(Also PIE is actually pretty important for healers since they went and tripled mana costs with heavensward release)

I'd like to see all Jobs use two or three stats, personally, just like in 1.23... Lets just stick with two, work it like how Tanks will work VIT and STR, and rework content/gear somewhat, and make that second Ring slot significantly less annoying to gear.

Paladin: VIT and MND, rather than VIT and STR, perhaps make Cure worth a damn with some added enmity gain on it to boot.
Warrior: VIT and STR, as is currently planned.
Dark Knight: VIT and PIE, with PIE enhancing Magic Defense somehow, damn I'd love a nice MP pool on Dark Knight though...

White Mage: MND and PIE, maybe VIT instead, IDK. White Mage and Monk always struck me as high HP Jobs.
Scholar: MND and INT, loose Clerics Stance, those DoTs are already OP.
Astrologian: MND and PIE.

Dragoon: STR and PIE, just like 1.23, because PIE boosts Magic Defense, and I expect knights trained in fighting dragons to be somewhat resistant to magic fire breathing lizards... Just sayin'.
Monk: STR and VIT, Monks thing was always a high HP pool.
Ninja: DEX and INT, since Ninjutsu is just silly hand magic.
Bard: DEX and PIE, more MP for the Songs Bard doesn't have... Sigh...
Machinist: IDK, DEX and MND? DEX and INT? You'd think the whole turret stuff would require some brain power... Given its the same as Bard, I'd like to see some difference, Bard could have Songs up for longer, for example, while Machinist could be more potent through INT or something.

Black Mage: INT and PIE, since you'd figure they'd be fairly immune to magic...
Summoner: INT and MND, same as Scholar.

When it comes to gear, you then drop VIT off most of it, in favor of their "new" second primary stat. We'd see less HP bloat as a result, DPS would be squishy (except Monk), like they should be. Obviously not going to happen considering everything is already balanced around the extra mountain of VIT gear provides everyone, though they could easily just slap +HP on all gear to keep us at the current level of HP... That really annoys me actually, currently VIT is literally just HP, PIE just MP, granted they're not a 1:1 ratio like INT/MND/STR/DEX are for Magic Attack Potency/Healing Potency/Attack Potency, but yeah... That really annoys me... Why do we have VIT/STR/DEX/MND/INT/PIE? We could literally remove them and just have HP/MP/Potency... At least if you have two primary stats to work with, your potency isn't exactly the same as your primary stat, for something like Ninja, Attack Potency would be a combination of DEX and INT...

Oh, and while we're on the subject of stats;

Change Critical Hit Rate to Critical Hit Power (which 3.0 also gave it), and make Accuracy double up as Critical Hit Rate. Currently Accuracy is just hit the cap and you're done with it, it's a worthless stat beyond that, but if I'm more Accuracy, surely I'm more likely you hit your weak point for massive damage? That's a Critical, Accuracy should improve Critical Hit Rate to make stacking it worthwhile beyond some arbitrary cap, while the Critical stat can improve the potency of Critical hits.

This would also give us a better sense of horizontal progression. Two i200 sets, for example, could have varying amounts of the two primary stats. A Monk could have a high VIT low STR i200 body, or a low VIT high STR i200 body, with which one you pick depending on which stat you've currently got the most of. The idea would be to balance the two out (building just pure STR would have diminishing returns unless you raise VIT as well, for example). So while we might currently look at something like Void Ark, and go "This is worthless to me since I've already gotten Esoterics gear", with a system like this in place, we'd get more use out of the Void Ark gear, because while i210 Esoterics might be "better", its left you with a low amount of your second primary stat which overall makes it weaker. Slapping on a high VIT/low STR Void Ark piece (for Monk) could potentially give you a higher attack potency than the i210 alternative, just because of how such a system would work. You'd lose some of your STR, but the higher VIT would make less STR go further. It would be a much better system to min/max than the current secondary stats, which have a very minimal impact.

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Originally Posted by FoxyAreku

It really is not that simple when the entire foundation, party buffs, and all ability calculation is made with these stats in mind.

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"All ability" calculation ?!
Name one where you absolutely need main stats.

Piety is important ? So why does every healer just use the highest gear they can, even though it can have less piety ?

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Originally Posted by Kaurie

Here is an idea that everyone will hate! \o/ (except a few others like myself)

Let's make each primary stat actually have an effect on each of the jobs.

STR could improve CRT
DEX could improve accuracy and determination
MND could improve spell speed/skill speed
INT could improve TP refresh/MP refresh

Then

You could have a SCH who slots up STR accessories or the 30 points, for higher crit'd adlos if they so choose to sacrifice the MND

You could have a WHM slot in DEX to meet accuracy requirements

You could have BLM using MND for faster Fire IV's

You could have tanks slot in DEX for to meet the high frontal accuracy cap

You could have bards slot in STR for CRITs and bloodletter procs

You could have melee slot in INT so they wouldn't have to worry about TP woes on AoE heavy encounters

etc etc.

I think this change would couple well with the upcoming changes to Materia slots being added to more gear


EDIT: Alternatively, can we remove the 35 bonus attributes and have them automatic. 0 reason to pick anything other than your main stat currently.

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This is how FFXI and 1.0 worked, each stat did its own thing that was mainly used by specific jobs but wasn't necessarily just for them.

STR increased physical damage (mages actually used to use their weapons)
VIT reduced damage taken and increased hp
DEX increased crit rate and accuracy
INT increased magic damage and reduced magic damage taken
MND increased healing magic and magic defence
PIE increased mp

Stats were also used as modifiers for weaponskills to increase damage, so if you used say red lotus (attack with fire damage) it had a STR and INT modifier.

Since all classes could cross class healing and offensive magic and mages could use physical damage, jobs wore gear with all sorts of stats on it based on what they were doing and could swap out gear pieces in battle. So you could wear your MND set to cast cure then swap to your STR set to weaponskill then to your VIT set to take a big hit etc. etc.

If you're looking for this kind of system I'd recommend trying ffxi, it is fun but it's not what they're going for in this game.

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Originally Posted by Cabalabob

If you're looking for this kind of system I'd recommend trying ffxi, it is fun but it's not what they're going for in this game.

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It's a good thing that this game is not like FFXI, but if they don't expand the effect of stats, why bother having them ?
And also, how will they make more jobs relevant if they all focus on the exact same thing ?

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Originally Posted by FoxyAreku

That does not even make sense and is actually completely impossible without changing how the game works completely. >_>

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The difficulity would be more in rebalancing everything, from the coding point of view it shouldn't be that much of a challenge

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

It's a good thing that this game is not like FFXI, but if they don't expand the effect of stats, why bother having them ?

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This. With the direction FFXIV is going there's really no reason to have stats at all. Every job has every so-called "main" stat, but only two or three affect that job at all, and generally only one does the player bother boosting. You could pretty much straight up remove STR VIT INT MND DEX PIE from the game and replace them all with "Damage", "HP", and "MP", and the game would be otherwise largely unchanged.

Really the only reason we have them at all is that it's expected for those stats (or similar ones) to exist in an RPG.

It'd be nice if players were expected to balance their stats. For example, you want to max out your damage, but if you negelct your defensive stats too much you're a glass cannon and no use to anyone, so sacrifice some of that damage to build up your defenseive stats. In FFXIV, though, players have one option and one option only: pump up your main stat as high as it will go.

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Originally Posted by LineageRazor

In FFXIV, though, players have one option and one option only: pump up your main stat as high as it will go.

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Let me take something from a game almost as despised as FFXI (in the official forum :p)...FFXIV 1.0. /thunder

Back when class ranks and physical level were separated, every point of stat you had was a result of bonus points. It meant that you really could go the glass cannon way by putting nothing into Vitality. You had to find the good balance between those stats.
Even more, you kept the same stats for any class you level, so if you wanted to be good, you had to make choices...but it was poorly implemented, sadly

Now that gear provides more than 90% of our stats, while still only being chosen on ilvl only (Most of the time), stats don't do anything.

My good concept sense does not tingle upon reading through this thread.