ATMAs should just drop on the first fate

I did this on my old character. I started anew and was having a lot of fun with the game up to this point, and I've spent about an hour trying to get just one. I heard they improved the drop rate, but I call BS. Regardless, I think at this point in the game, there's no reason to grind THIS heavily for the relic weapon anymore, considering I bought a weapon off the Marketplace that's a lot stronger.

I've heard this game has made many changes to help bring new players up to speed for new content. Well, the ATMA part of the relic quest is something that still needs to be greatly improved. Just let the ATMAs drop on the first fates please.

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Originally Posted by JustPlainLucas

I've heard this game has made many changes to help bring new players up to speed for new content. Well, the ATMA part of the relic quest is something that still needs to be greatly improved. Just let the ATMAs drop on the first fates please.

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new players don't have to make an atma weapon. they can skip the whole thing.

letting the atmas drop in first fate is laughable. why not just place an NPC beside jalzahn where you can purchase them for 500 gil? (this is the price you have to spend for the teleports but it will save you another like 5 minutes)

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Originally Posted by Tint

letting the atmas drop in first fate is laughable. why not just place an NPC beside jalzahn where you can purchase them for 500 gil? (this is the price you have to spend for the teleports but it will save you another like 5 minutes)

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Why is it laughable?
People still will have to do Animus, Novus, Nexus, and Zodiac.

yeah, and then those same people will say " please make the melds 100%, there's no reason.... Please give all the lights in one run, there's no reason..."

When you take into account the fact that EVERY stage of the relic weapon has an achievement attached to it, doesn't it make more sense for the relic to actually take some WORK?

Each stage of the relic has been made easier in one way or another over time, but ATMA's dropping on the first fate is more than a bit excessive. Speaking from recent personal experience, the drop rates are more than good enough as they are.

The achievement of actually obtaining the relic and upgrading it to the final pre-HW stage has already become of less value. It really doesn't need to be devalued further.

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Originally Posted by Aetharon

When you take into account the fact that EVERY stage of the relic weapon has an achievement attached to it, doesn't it make more sense for the relic to actually take some WORK?

Each stage of the relic has been made easier in one way or another over time, but ATMA's dropping on the first fate is more than a bit excessive. Speaking from recent personal experience, the drop rates are more than good enough as they are.

The achievement of actually obtaining the relic and upgrading it to the final pre-HW stage has already become of less value. It really doesn't need to be devalued further.

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Achievements are lame and should never have been implemented in XIV because of some people putting too much importance on them. :B

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Originally Posted by Mimilu

Achievements are lame and should never have been implemented in XIV because of some people putting too much importance on them. :B

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While achievements aren't all THAT important, they are still a good milestone for a task or challenge being completed. Don't you get a small sense that you've accomplished something when you get a notification that you've completed an achievement?

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Originally Posted by Aetharon

While achievements aren't all THAT important, they are still a good milestone for a task or challenge being completed. Don't you get a small sense that you've accomplished something when you get a notification that you've completed an achievement?

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Other then winning a fight, no.
Grind and RNG-based achievements are just a reminder that you waste too much time on this game. >w>

MMO's are all about the grind, unfortunately. It's what keeps people playing and subscribing. However, as has already been said, the relic is now optional. Aside from that, the drop rate for ATMA was increased to the point where it's easy to get them all relatively quickly. When did you last hunt for ATMA?

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Originally Posted by Mimilu

Why is it laughable?
People still will have to do Animus, Novus, Nexus, and Zodiac.

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Have to? You don't have to do it at all. Its not even needed for the newer relics whatsoever.

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Originally Posted by Mimilu

Achievements are lame and should never have been implemented in XIV because of some people putting too much importance on them. :B

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Pretty sure this was sarcastic, but either way, you have no right to tell people what is important to them.

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Originally Posted by Aetharon

MMO's are all about the grind, unfortunately. It's what keeps people playing and subscribing. However, as has already been said, the relic is now optional. Aside from that, the drop rate for ATMA was increased to the point where it's easy to get them all relatively quickly. When did you last hunt for ATMA?

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30 minutes for the first one (which is hilarious because when the quest was first instituted, I got my first on the very first fate), over an hour for the second, and well over an hour trying to get a third until I gave up when I found out you don't even need to do the quest at all.

That is pretty rotten luck, but it's not usually that bad. Believe me, if the rates were bad enough, more people would've asked for them to be adjusted.

Farmed a bit of FATEs while i get bored and used to farm a bit of ATMA in the shrouds got like 7 ATMAs in a half hour. No reason for complaining.

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Originally Posted by Nyghtmarerobu

Have to? You don't have to do it at all. Its not even needed for the newer relics whatsoever.

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The topic isn't about how mandatory doing the phases of the relic quest-line is, it's making the Atma from FATEs drop quicker. I was just showing that it wouldn't really matter if the Atmas dropped instantaneously because there are four other phases of the quest that you need to grind your ass off.

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Originally Posted by Nyghtmarerobu

Pretty sure this was sarcastic, but either way, you have no right to tell people what is important to them.

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It's not sarcasm, I think achievements are lame, some people to too much emphasis on them, and I have every right to say what I think is and isn't important.

All hail achievments, for 5 kills, 10 kills, 1st crafted recipe...
That are the achievments which most games have.
So achievments are mostly thrown out like candy, not for representation.
For representation there are titles, mimions, mounts... Achievments bring nothing like selfsatisfaction but you can't show them to everyone.

Well... I'm one of the few people who still are working on the old relic. Why? glamour of course. I can care less about the achievements. I totally agree that achievements were a waste of time and space being implemented into the game and all... you dont buy or do anything with them. what are the achievements points for by the way?

Edit: i just remembered about the achievements that actually give you something like my 3k commendation fat chocobo. But my point was there are alot of them that give you nothing - tittles at most.

as for the OP, i disagree. I got 13 atmas of each 12 within just 1 month. Only took me dedicated grinding fates for 2 to 3 hours every day. what i find ridiculous is going for the new atmas (crystals) then again they boost you past the last stage of the old relic so i guess its fare but im not the no life that will farm 16 atmas at 1% rate, i rather call it safe and keep my sanity

I've been grinding three days and no atmas. That's a bit ridiculous.

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Originally Posted by valeriusdemetri

I've been grinding three days and no atmas. That's a bit ridiculous.

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Equip your zenith and try again?

It is equipped, I'm not that stupid LOL

I never really had any troubles with my Atma, hell, two or three of them dropped on the first fate. RNG is RNG, and relics are supposed to be symbols of having put up with it. Instead of wanting things to be easier for you, you should keep your head held high and strive to achieve it! Then you will be even more proud to have it.

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Originally Posted by Mimilu

Other then winning a fight, no.
Grind and RNG-based achievements are just a reminder that you waste too much time on this game. >w>

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So don't play it. Simple answer. If you hate the game & hate putting time into it then you have a serious problem if you continue to do it.

Well the goal of that stage is to get people into low level areas for new players. So SE will want to keep a that aspect, so they won't do one fate.

What would be good is if they matched the drop rates or a bit better than the first Anima stage and allowed you to run it in alternate classes. That last part is what I always found the most annoying about the relic quests. If the goal to rejuvinate old content, why not let us level as well, its not like they nedd lvl 50 to run fates.

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Originally Posted by Culfinrandir

So don't play it. Simple answer. If you hate the game & hate putting time into it then you have a serious problem if you continue to do it.

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Are you really raging in a necro'ed thread that hasn't been touched for three-months? :-B

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Originally Posted by AnduinLynn

I never really had any troubles with my Atma, hell, two or three of them dropped on the first fate. RNG is RNG, and relics are supposed to be symbols of having put up with it. Instead of wanting things to be easier for you, you should keep your head held high and strive to achieve it! Then you will be even more proud to have it.

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Relics are supposed to be symbols of having to put up with it? Does that not sound wrong to you? You aren't supposed to put up with anything in games. They're meant to be fun. Grinding for items that may or may not drop is not fun; it's a waste of time. When you finally achieve that weapon, you then stand back and go, "Wow... I spent THAT much time doing it?" Once I learned that the Zenith (or whatever the final step is called) would just be traded in to skip a step in a whole new relic quest, I stopped ATMA grinding immediately and just waited until I hit 60 and started my anima quest.

Now, I already got an anima relic and am starting a new one. I'm finding the luminous crystal grind not nearly as bad as ATMA when I first did it years ago, but my second run is proving not to be as bountiful as my first. And honestly, it doesn't feel like I'm achieving anything with these quests. Find 18 crystals, run 10 dungeons, get 80 items and spend millions on HQ items. It's so dull, repetitive and boring. It doesn't make the weapon feel special to you at all, just a constant reminder that you've spent far too much time playing this game. At least with an Alex weapon, you've trained and gotten better at raids so when you finally win one, it feels like a real accomplishment.

4 days of nothing and then yesterday got two for a now grand total of 4 in two weeks.

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Originally Posted by JustPlainLucas

Now, I already got an anima relic and am starting a new one. I'm finding the luminous crystal grind not nearly as bad as ATMA when I first did it years ago, but my second run is proving not to be as bountiful as my first. And honestly, it doesn't feel like I'm achieving anything with these quests. Find 18 crystals, run 10 dungeons, get 80 items and spend millions on HQ items. It's so dull, repetitive and boring. It doesn't make the weapon feel special to you at all, just a constant reminder that you've spent far too much time playing this game. At least with an Alex weapon, you've trained and gotten better at raids so when you finally win one, it feels like a real accomplishment.

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You realize what the point of the relic weapons ARE right??

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Originally Posted by valeriusdemetri

4 days of nothing and then yesterday got two for a now grand total of 4 in two weeks.

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Better tell tumblr or twitter /shot

But seriously, everyone has RNG screw them over in one way or another. RNG exists in every game just about (Loot drops/rarity of an item/ect). Earlier relic quests have been beefed up a bit, making them a bit easier. A lot of people like to achievement hunt (I'm somewhat one of those), but it doesn't mean you HAVE to do it. the Relic are weapons that slowly get upgraded over time, and offer players another way of getting a better weapon without being hardcore raidy or anything like that. It's just a good bit of a time sink (Hello 1/265 sword of kings in earthbound).


You don't HAVE to do it. If it makes you that miserable then just ignore it. You can get an i230 weapon by doing Midas 4 for seven weeks (One gear per week) then you only need to save up about 2-3 weeks of Law for special items to get an i230 weapon of your choice (With materia slots).

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Originally Posted by Zari

You realize what the point of the relic weapons ARE right??

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To keep people playing irrelevant content?

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Originally Posted by JustPlainLucas

It doesn't make the weapon feel special to you at all, just a constant reminder that you've spent far too much time playing this game. At least with an Alex weapon, you've trained and gotten better at raids so when you finally win one, it feels like a real accomplishment.

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And People who did alex and got their weapon don't look back and go "man I sure did put a lot of effort into training everyday to get this awesome weapon, what a waste of time". I have a hard time believing that. Relic was and still is, supposed to be a work in progress from the start of major raid patchs, to give people who do not have the skills or time to raid, and comparable weapon, and something for them to work and strive towards on their own time. With that said, people have different idea's of what and "acomplishment" is, for example, in FF11, getting a relic was a great undertaking, it took lots of money, and many many many man hours, of not just your own, but your FC's to just make 1 weapon. Waste of time or grand acomplishment? Its subjective, and while you might not find it good to pat yourself on the back for finishing it, others are happy about doing it and completing it.

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Originally Posted by JustPlainLucas

Find 18 crystals, run 10 dungeons, get 80 items and spend millions on HQ items. It's so dull, repetitive and boring.

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While I agree that the quest is dull and boring, in the grinding sence, its not meant to be fun or easy in any way. This is on the trail to one of the best weapons in the game, a 245 weapon. I hate to say it, its not gonna be that easy, and I don't want it to be easy. I want it to be a grind, I want to see people struggle for something that is actually worthwhile and stand at the top going, this is a kickass weapon, and I endured this, this, and this to get it. It was long and annoying, but I finished it. Its everything I want the quest chain to be, minus possibly some more lore on the weapons themselves, but they are getting better at that.

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Originally Posted by Nyghtmarerobu

I hate to say it, its not gonna be that easy, and I don't want it to be easy. I want it to be a grind, I want to see people struggle for something that is actually worthwhile and stand at the top going, this is a kickass weapon, and I endured this, this, and this to get it. It was long and annoying, but I finished it. Its everything I want the quest chain to be, minus possibly some more lore on the weapons themselves, but they are getting better at that.

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It is actually very easy to get it. There is absolutely no challenge, just a tedious long grind. I mean, where is the point? We go to work and do boring/annoying things in RL. Do we actually need the same thing in our freetime/game, too? It feels like work, not like a game. Games are meant to be fun. Where is the fun in grinding for weeks for just one weapon?

No matter if relic or anima, this weapon is just for those people who arent good enough to farm Sephiroth Ex (for example), but have enough time to do the grind. And its not even the long grind itself, its that RNG-Factor which makes this questline so annoying. I would rather farm 10 Fates per Atma instead of having an unfair droprate.

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Originally Posted by Caitlyn

It is actually very easy to get it. There is absolutely no challenge, just a tedious long grind. I mean, where is the point? We go to work and do boring/annoying things in RL. Do we actually need the same thing in our freetime/game, too? It feels like work, not like a game. Games are meant to be fun. Where is the fun in grinding for weeks for just one weapon?

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This is what I'm getting at. Grinding over and over and over and over again is work. If you want to grind, make it interesting. Assign different dungeons, trials, make new enemies to kill, new areas to explore, something unique, something tied directly to weapon's lore, and make each weapon have their own quest lines. The fact that EVERY weapon shares EXACTLY the same quest objectives shows a lack of imagination on SE's part. As it stands, the relics' purpose really is nothing more than to keep FATEs and dungeons alive.

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Originally Posted by JustPlainLucas

This is what I'm getting at. Grinding over and over and over and over again is work. If you want to grind, make it interesting. Assign different dungeons, trials, make new enemies to kill, new areas to explore, something unique, something tied directly to weapon's lore, and make each weapon have their own quest lines. The fact that EVERY weapon shares EXACTLY the same quest objectives shows a lack of imagination on SE's part. As it stands, the relics' purpose really is nothing more than to keep FATEs and dungeons alive.

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Well I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but the intresting content went out the window with the anima quest line. It was something people had been asking for, for quite some time. An involved quest chain, with new enemys and fun trials. There was an article that came out some time before anima was released, or maybe when it was just released, where Yoshida commented on how, they didn't want to gate the completion behind any "Difficult" content, so things like, chimera and hydra from the original line, were scrapped for the new anima quest line. In responce to this, they added more grind. Something easy to obtain, but mind-numbingly grindy. Suffice it to say, I don't think this will change.

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Originally Posted by Caitlyn

There is absolutely no challenge, just a tedious long grind. I mean, where is the point? We go to work and do boring/annoying things in RL. Do we actually need the same thing in our freetime/game, too? It feels like work, not like a game. Games are meant to be fun. Where is the fun in grinding for weeks for just one weapon?

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You're right it is work, but thats what I feel like it should be in terms of obtaining it. No one is forced to do the relic, you choose to take part in it. And if the work is too hard, door is over there. Relic is not for everyone.

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Originally Posted by Nyghtmarerobu

they didn't want to gate the completion behind any "Difficult" content, so things like, chimera and hydra from the original line, were scrapped for the new anima quest line.

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The expresses so well the status of the game right now : lowering the standards for the mass.
aka : make it so less enjoyable. No challenge, no interest.

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Originally Posted by cgbspender

The expresses so well the status of the game right now : lowering the standards for the mass.
aka : make it so less enjoyable. No challenge, no interest.

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We saw where stepping up the difficulty went, lest we forget Alexander Gordias Savage and Thordan Extreme. The many will always out weigh the few, its a simple fact of life.

There is a major difference between designing chimera for a relic purpose and designing the savage. Chimera was never created for "raiders", it's a team of 8, and that's about it regarding the comparison. The difficulty can't compare but at least it was something entirely new, designed specifically for the relic. I remember it being challenging a bit in the first few months, when every hit would leave you half-dead, and everyone had to pay attention to orbs and castbar.