Duty Roulette: Status of Leveling Roulette allowing parties

I believe this was talked about before, and I thought it was going to happen with 3.1, but is there any update on when the Duty Roulette: Leveling Dungeons will allow for parties to queue together.

I often find myself with a friend, and we are unable to take advantage of this Roulette, he playing a tank, and me a healer, just wanting to pick up some randos for DPS.

Anyway, didn't know if there was an update on this, or this was scrapped for now.

Thanks,

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Originally Posted by Delmontyb

I believe this was talked about before, and I thought it was going to happen with 3.1, but is there any update on when the Duty Roulette: Leveling Dungeons will allow for parties to queue together.

I often find myself with a friend, and we are unable to take advantage of this Roulette, he playing a tank, and me a healer, just wanting to pick up some randos for DPS.

Anyway, didn't know if there was an update on this, or this was scrapped for now.

Thanks,

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There are two purposes for leveling roulette. First is to net you a lot of exp to help progress your secondary jobs faster. The second is to help fill in spots for people who are trying to finish content required to progress in the MSQ or someone queuing for a specific dungeon and need three people. To help fill in for older content. Making pre-made parties would go against that.

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Originally Posted by Velhart

The second is to help fill in spots for people who are trying to finish content required to progress in the MSQ or someone queuing for a specific dungeon and need three people. To help fill in for older content. Making pre-made parties would go against that.

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I really fail to see how allowing parties of 2 (or for things like trial roulette, parties of 4) would go against this.

Worst case: 2 DPS, nothing really changes.
Middle case: A DPS, but also a healer or tank, so at least one person gets a faster queue and one needed role is taken care of.
Best case: Healer + Tank, making things much better for DPS.

In all cases, folks get to play with friends. And that can also draw in people who wouldn't otherwise queue for it.

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Originally Posted by Risvertasashi

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It is mostly in the benefit of others and you are rewarded for doing so. If you could make pre-made parties, they would likely reduce the reward.

Velhart, your logic is flawed.

I don't remember seeing this talked about by the devs at all. Link, please?

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Originally Posted by Fersaken

Velhart, your logic is flawed.

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Can you please elaborate?

That is simply how I interpret their intentions in the design. Don't count it as an actual fact. I never gave a stance on how I felt about it either before you all start grabbing pitch forks.

Doing what you suggest would defeat the whole purpose of the levelling roulette. It is mostly meant for new people and/or people levelling an alternate toon. It isnt meant for lvl 60 going into it wanting to get easy tokens. It is meant for players of higher levels helping lower levels to get through a place. What you want in appearance legitimate would make TRUE levelling players left aside and outside and left with longer queues.

This is my opinion of course...we might even see what you suggest implemented who knows...but it would be a mistake. That particular levelling roulette is the only roulette where low level players (Under 50) can go. Higher players have the lvl 60 and exp roulettes to group together if they so wish.

Of course, again, just my opinion.

I've argued for this same thing before.

At least allow people to have up to 2 people in their party for leveling roulette. This still leaves 2 more people, and will give people an actual reason to do leveling roulettes with their friends.

"But Eidolon!" I hear people cry, "then a DPS will use a tank/Healer to get a faster que than a DPS without a tank/healer!"

Except the fact that the thought in that statement instantly defeats itself, because you're actually bringing a tank/healer into the que who might not otherwise have done the que without them.

I will not understand the people who are against such a system. I understand the concern if people are talking about doing a full premade party for leveling roulette - in which case, you are correct. If you have rested EXP, just do the current on-level dungoun. But it does not help those who want to play with their friends.

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Originally Posted by Eidolon

But it does not help those who want to play with their friends.

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while i do not disagree with a maximum of 2 people for a leveling roulette premade, this game has plenty of opportunities to play with your friends. im sure people can seperate for a roulette or simply find another activity to hold hands through. or simply do it when you have time away from friends.

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Originally Posted by Eidolon

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but that is exactly my point, it leaves the door open to just about that...full premade 50/60 that will just go there to get their tokens do a speedy run because well they can and get out ergo defeating the purpose of the levelling dungeon.


If you want to do a dungeon, select a PF and go with it..ohh wait..I forgot...that means you wont have tokens right?

I personally dont understand people with that mindset of I want to go with friends or, shoudl I say, I DONT want to go with newby beacuse the dungeon will be slowwww and I dont have time to lose mentality type....tell me I am wrong in this.....but try to be honest when you will try to tell me is not so

When you are with friends, you probably are much faster underway in the dungeons compared to the random roulette party you are getting thrown into.

And the latter gives you a compensation in form of 'Hey, stick around and you get your XP bonus at the end."

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Originally Posted by Risvertasashi

I really fail to see how allowing parties of 2 (or for things like trial roulette, parties of 4) would go against this.

Worst case: 2 DPS, nothing really changes.
Middle case: A DPS, but also a healer or tank, so at least one person gets a faster queue and one needed role is taken care of.
Best case: Healer + Tank, making things much better for DPS.

In all cases, folks get to play with friends. And that can also draw in people who wouldn't otherwise queue for it.

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I think that there are more people who don't queue for this content because they can't play with their friends. I fully understand the argument against it. But from my own personal experiences, I'm helping my friends level up their character, and tell them, do this without me once a day. They typically go, no thanks, let's do something together.

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Originally Posted by Delmontyb

I think that there are more people who don't queue for this content because they can't play with their friends. I fully understand the argument against it. But from my own personal experiences, I'm helping my friends level up their character, and tell them, do this without me once a day. They typically go, no thanks, let's do something together.

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But you don't need a Roulette for this when you want to tag along with your friends. Entering the queue with them on the dungeon that is on their level works fine just as well.

I agree with the opinion that the purpose is to lower queue times for people leveling for MSQ, etc. Which is why you'll sometimes get the primals normal. I am however, annoyed with how long the que has been for DPS as of late.

How would the roulette be affected by letting 2 people que for it in the same party? We'd need a mathematician to determine that. I wish SE would be more transparent with their Roulette algorithm. So that us players can understand why it takes me 3 hrs to que as a dps and <30 seconds as a tank/healer -_-

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Originally Posted by Delmontyb

I think that there are more people who don't queue for this content because they can't play with their friends. I fully understand the argument against it. But from my own personal experiences, I'm helping my friends level up their character, and tell them, do this without me once a day. They typically go, no thanks, let's do something together.

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one day your children will grow older and have to venture out on their own
seriously though, i have friends like this and it astounds me how little they learn because they dont experience the different play styles or approaches to content others can offer

And this argument isn't just left to roulettes, it can be any content. I play with family and my best friend, and more often than not, they will not run content without me present (I play primarily tank or heal) and while I have no issues hopping on low level roulette, as I do twice a day as tank, but yeah, the countless others who are living with "stranger danger" does hinder its progress. I do want an explantion for how they pair people in roulettes.

Leveling roulette is just fine the way it is. There are plenty of ways to level with friends outside of roulettes.

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Originally Posted by Arrius

When you are with friends, you probably are much faster underway in the dungeons compared to the random roulette party you are getting thrown into.

And the latter gives you a compensation in form of 'Hey, stick around and you get your XP bonus at the end."

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Not always.. it feels better/comfortable to play with people you know than 3 people that don't give a shit about you.

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Originally Posted by Eidolon

I will not understand the people who are against such a system. I understand the concern if people are talking about doing a full premade party for leveling roulette.

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Ummm...at least 2 queuing people is still a guarantee that one less person will benefit from the intended purpose of the Leveling Roulette >.>. Nothing complex to understand about it.
I would also think that it's easier to fill in New Parties with a single individual rather than a premade of 2 or more members. Yes there are some new players/leveling alt players that play with a friend or friends, thus possibly fitting for the 2 premade members, but there are probably much more that dont.

- A Party missing an 1 member can be filled by 1 member but not 2 or more members.
- A Party missing 2 members can be filled by 2 Individual members but not 3 or more members.
- A Party missing 3 members can be filled by 3 Individual members but not 4
- A Party formed entirely of a Premade takes a shit on the whole system Lol

Be it full Premade or not, it still Takes a dump on the system, just to a lesser degree...almost like little Bunny Poops.

It can work, if the roulette exp reward get reduced by 20% for every extra member in a premade party.
This way the players will keep the premade party small enough and would not do it with 4 man.

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Originally Posted by Arrius

But you don't need a Roulette for this when you want to tag along with your friends. Entering the queue with them on the dungeon that is on their level works fine just as well.

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Agreed with you 100% and that's a lot of fun, and that's what we do. But we end up missing out on additional XP or tombs because we enjoy playing with one another.

I can understand both sides, I just think it would be nice to take part in this content together. Usually we have 2 to 3 people, and just need to pick up another DPS. Running their level dungons are fine, but what we end up doing is skipping leveling all together and do something else, thus keeping another tank and healer out of the leveling queue. Which is where I'm coming from. I think that this queue would be better for DPS if they allowed this. It might not be, so I'd be interested in seeing them turn it on and watch to see if it made the system better, and if it didn't, turn it back to solo. :)

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Originally Posted by Felis

It can work, if the roulette exp reward get reduced by 20% for every extra member in a premade party.
This way the players will keep the premade party small enough and would not do it with 4 man.

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Not a bad idea Felis.

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Originally Posted by LaylaTsarra

Leveling roulette is just fine the way it is. There are plenty of ways to level with friends outside of roulettes.

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"just fine" doesn't mean it can't be better. currently it does nothing to entice Lv 60 tanks and healers to help their friends.

currently, i would never ask a friend to help if they get nothing at all from the content. if they are able to get the Roulette bonus, it would make people more comfortable to ask their friends, which not only helps themselves but other people as well.

the only limitation to make it better would be to bar full 4 man groups and perhaps add a small penalty for 3 people.

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Originally Posted by SendohJin

"just fine" doesn't mean it can't be better. currently it does nothing to entice Lv 60 tanks and healers to help their friends.

currently, i would never ask a friend to help if they get nothing at all from the content. if they are able to get the Roulette bonus, it would make people more comfortable to ask their friends, which not only helps themselves but other people as well.

the only limitation to make it better would be to bar full 4 man groups and perhaps add a small penalty for 3 people.

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I help friends all the time and get nothing in turn for it. I enjoy helping them level up and running dungeons even without any kind of reward. Just playing together and chatting as we do so is enough for me to have fun. I have plenty of time to do other stuff when they aren't around.

I personally never run that roulette, like ever. (And alot of my friends in game are the same) Why? Because I can't run it with my gf. While I do agree it's possible that it makes for longer Q, it also means that some people who never run it start running it, making for a possible bigger pool of people running it and possibly lower Qs.

Personally I hope they decide to add group Queuing.

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Originally Posted by SendohJin

"just fine" doesn't mean it can't be better. currently it does nothing to entice Lv 60 tanks and healers to help their friends.

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No you can make it worse. It's fine the way it is. Sorry but queue with your friends for the tons of other content there is in the game. I queue as a tank all the time for leveling and I did it with my healers as well. It's meant for new players and those leveling and not for level 60 players. You can do that for level 60 dungeons and expert roulette as it. There is nothing wrong with the current venue other than you don't like it.

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Originally Posted by LaylaTsarra

No you can make it worse. It's fine the way it is. Sorry but queue with your friends for the tons of other content there is in the game. I queue as a tank all the time for leveling and I did it with my healers as well. It's meant for new players and those leveling and not for level 60 players. You can do that for level 60 dungeons and expert roulette as it. There is nothing wrong with the current venue other than you don't like it.

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You shouldn't stop from trying new ideas, for fear of making something worse, when they could very easily reverse it at patch, or hotfix later. Since we don't have any statistics any of our arguments at this point are all speculation and so we are all speaking from personal experience.

I say let's give it a shot and see if it ends up being better, and if it's not worse, then everyone wins. :)

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Originally Posted by Delmontyb

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Again, the developers would very likely reduce the reward if you were allowed to make pre-made parties for it. It's specific purpose is to help with newer players trying to get through lower level content and give you a nice amount of EXP for those that play casually. If you can make pre-made parties instead, it defeats the purpose and would likely give a reward similar to lv.50 roulette. The amount you get from doing it is just too nice to ask to change/reduce.

If anything, the system is brilliantly designed. Before barely anyone touched the Low Level Dungeon roulette till they altered it like this. It is a have your cake and eat it also situation on the dev's end. You not only get a good amount of EXP for completing it, but you also potentially help someone through a specific dungeon they need to complete.

Its something you do once a day. Surely you can take 20 minutes out of your busy grouphug sessions to do a single dungeon.

Hell, if you have 3 other friends who also need it, then you CAN end up in the same party if you all queue together. If you don't, then oh well. Clear the dungeon you get and then go back to playing with your friends. Its not difficult.

Also, if SE relented and allowed 2player groups to do the LEveling Roulette, eventually the pressure would mount for 3 people and then again for 4 and then whoops, we just invalidated the entire point of the Leveling Roulette!
It was implemented as a reward for helping other people. If you aren't helping strangers through a Dungeon, why should you deserve the same or even part of the reward that was designed to get high level players to help low level players who happened to NOT be on their friends list?

Not sure why this didn't seem to get noticed on the first page but... Once more: They could allow 2-person queuing.

New solo players get help. New group players get to play with friends. Oldbies with all their preferred classes at max level have the ability/incentive to go back and help new friends while also helping new players.

"Win-Win", I think is the term?

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Originally Posted by Velhart

There are two purposes for leveling roulette. First is to net you a lot of exp to help progress your secondary jobs faster. The second is to help fill in spots for people who are trying to finish content required to progress in the MSQ or someone queuing for a specific dungeon and need three people. To help fill in for older content. Making pre-made parties would go against that.

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BECAUSE WAITING 3 HOURS FOR QUEUE AS DPS MAKES SENSE.

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Originally Posted by LunaSnowfield

BECAUSE WAITING 3 HOURS FOR QUEUE AS DPS MAKES SENSE.

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You're on the more popular NA data center, and since ques seem to be fixed or reverted back or whatever, it should be back to 45 min or less. Has been for me.

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Originally Posted by Sylve

Its something you do once a day. Surely you can take 20 minutes out of your busy grouphug sessions to do a single dungeon.

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it's something i currently do none a day. i'd rather go watch TV with that time.

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Originally Posted by Sylve

Also, if SE relented and allowed 2player groups to do the LEveling Roulette, eventually the pressure would mount for 3 people and then again for 4 and then whoops

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this is the worse kind of fear-mongering with no basis in fact. do we have 200% echo for Titan HM? nope. there is almost 0 support for 4 man pre-made for Leveling roulette.

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Originally Posted by Velhart

If anything, the system is brilliantly designed. Before barely anyone touched the Low Level Dungeon roulette till they altered it like this. It is a have your cake and eat it also situation on the dev's end. You not only get a good amount of EXP for completing it, but you also potentially help someone through a specific dungeon they need to complete.

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I love the system as it is today, however all I ask is, could it be better... :) To that, I think it can, and like you said, I take no issue with there being a reduced reward for parties entering the level roulette together, but the question at hand, is... Would this roulette and the player base benefit from having it support parties (2 - 4) getting to play together, and help out others, as well as each other, or would it hurt the roulette... The only way I can see us finding out, is if they allowed it, and then did a compare on the data from before and after. :)

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Originally Posted by Delmontyb

I think that there are more people who don't queue for this content because they can't play with their friends. I fully understand the argument against it. But from my own personal experiences, I'm helping my friends level up their character, and tell them, do this without me once a day. They typically go, no thanks, let's do something together.

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I rarely queue for leveling roulette. When I do, it's usually because I'm trying to make leveling an alt go a bit faster, usually at very low levels, and even then it's not very often. Don't think I've touched it in weeks.

When leveling whm, I queued up for specific dungeons with a tank from my FC. Did dozens of runs with the 2 of us, occasionally pulling in other FC members (letting them know what happened and asking if they want to queue in progress) if people bailed on our groups. I've also had multiple players in my FC (several of them completely new to the game) ask if anyone wants to group up for roulette, only to learn that they can't. We usually end up just queuing specific, or they just go in alone and everyone keeps doing their own thing. It gets a bit frustrating at times.