Taking a lot of damage as a DRK

So while leveling my DRK in sohm al, a healer said something that got my attention, and this was "man drk why are you taking so much damage, did you forget to repair your gear or something."

And it truly did feel like that even though I had no broken pieces. My gear was the highest you can get at that point, the i130 gear that drops from that very dungeon so that couldn't have been it. Yet I'm getting hit in the high 800 ranges (maybe 650-750 with some CDs), and of course even higher when something crits, so in a group of 3 I'm getting hit like 1500-2500 every few seconds depending on the mob or which CDs are active. I have 10050 HP.

Any reason as to why this is happening other than defensive CDs? My PLd doesn't take this much damage, YouTube videos of DRKs don't seem to take as much damage AND they're popping less defensive CDs than I was, some even going into dps stance straight up. I always have tanking stance on unless nothing is focusing on me specifically

As a DRK I found myself popping CDs more often then the usual tank but that's cause I worry the healer is working to hard lol but that seems odd I wasn't taking that much dmg in sohm al in barely i115-120 gears and less hp or maybe I didn't really pay much attention lol but it starts off rough hitting the HW dungeons cause you are no longer over geared and instead just geared enough for the dungeon so no more barely taking dmg..

That healer was most likely coming off the high we all get at lvl 50 cause of how ridiculously wide the ilvl gap gets but you are fine just play it safe cause a good healer can keep you alive fine as long as dps arnt getting hit to much lol...

It's because it's a levelling dungeon, you're no longer outgearing it like you would with level 50 dungeons and like you will with level 60 dungeons once in the i180-190 range. You're most likely taking completely normal damage. As long as you're rotating CDs when there is more than 2-3 monsters, using Delirium on magic-hitting targets, using Reprisal and Low Blow when they proc, there is nothing much you can do to take less damage (except having a SCH healing you because it shields you and thus your HP doesn't drop as low as with other healers, and it translates directly into the feeling that you're taking less damage, which is technically true because they're mitigated by adlos).

Sohm Al actually feels like it has probably the hardest hitting trash in any dungeon from 50-60.

The first packs with the plants and birds and the spawning pods can really maul you due to poison damage and burst, and pulling more than 3 mobs at a time there without heavy cooldown use can often be instadeath if people arent ready. Also, there are some packs with Vulnerability debuffs later which can surprise people.

As long as you're in Grit all the time and arent making super huge pulls of doom then you should be fine - if you WERE doing this cautiously then all I can suggest is to pick up your use of cooldowns. Nothing in that dungeon -needs- a cooldown saved for it so you should be rotating every tanking cooldown you have on most packs just to smooth things out.

The other question - are you wearing Fending or Slaying accessories, and where are your bonus stat points?

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Originally Posted by Sapphidia

The other question - are you wearing Fending or Slaying accessories, and where are your bonus stat points?

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Vit won't help you with damage and I can guess from his HP is that he's running vit accessories.

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Originally Posted by Sapphidia

The other question - are you wearing Fending or Slaying accessories, and where are your bonus stat points?

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Considering he has 10k HP in Sohm Al, he's most likely full VIT. When I levelled at HW launch, I was at ~9k HP in Sohm Al with 4 pentamelded i110 accessories and 1 i130 STR ring with all my bonus stats into STR.

Personally on DRK I mixed my CD's up and never ran with just one, but rather paired them together while doing dungeon runs. Like...Shadow skin + Convalescence. And Dark Dance should be up just about every pull. Though I also do this on all tanks and found that while gear helped a bit, it more or less depends on what you and the healer are doing.

If you're desperate and want to waste your MP you've always got DA+ Dark passenger -> DA + Dark dance to fall back on which will make you a evasion tank. In either case large pulls should get easier upon unlocking Abysal Drain @ 56. With blood price up and the ability to AoE Drain HP, makes things a lot easier.

Assuming you weren't doing something silly and were using the actual tank gear that drops from Dusk, then you're actually taking the expected amount of damage for your item level. Sohm Al just hurts a lot, and this is coming from someone with a Gaelikitten. For some reason all the story-relevant HW dungeons that aren't Research Lab (which is pain incarnate if you're in Gubal gear) seem to have an inverted damage curve, with each new one hitting softer than the last. At least, that's how it felt when I was doing everything.

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Originally Posted by Yaichiro

Vit won't help you with damage and I can guess from his HP is that he's running vit accessories.

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Technically not, just bear in mind that his comment about taking too much damage was due to a -healer- saying "you're taking a lot of damage". That's due to the perception of an individual, and if you arent too knowledgeable on what sort of health levels different tanks have at different levels, then a full vit tank WILL appear to take less damage than a full str tank simply because the health bar goes down slower as a percent of max health.

Definitely not advocating full vit, but a lower max health still gives the appearance of being squishier as the bar just depletes faster. A healer used to healing full vit tanks might be surprised at a full strength one suddenly, but clearly not the case here.

But yes, as pointed out 10k implies full vit at that level thinking about it.

I suppose the two biggies are...

1. You're leveling from 50-60. Based on various observations, we have reason to believe that each point of Defense on your left side gear becomes less powerful every time you level up. Sohm Al is the dungeon where this becomes the largest problem. You're still operating on i130-133 gear, which has very low natural Defense. Defense numbers don't start to rise quickly until you're wearing i136+ left side gear. I've heard more than one story of Tanks being fine in Sohm Al at level 53 but getting eviscerated at 54.

2. Judging from your lodestone profile, you have access to all of your cross class skills. Good stuff. This means that you have access to quite a few cooldowns. Most of them are individually weak, to be sure, but they start making more meaningful differences when combined. Awareness is particularly useful with Dark Dance, Convalescence is great paired with anything, and Foresight's waiting for any situation where you'd like to take a little less physical damage. I would also like to mention one of the Dark Knight's most potent survival combinations when it comes to trash: Applying Dark Arts to both Dark Dance and Dark Passenger on the same group of monsters. This costs a lot of MP, but the combination of raising your own evasion and blinding your enemies leads to a lot of dodging, which means happy healers! Just make sure to watch your MP consumption so that you have enough MP to get enmity on the next pack :)

Really good information to know guys, thanks. Yeah I am going full vit and was looking to switch to a couple strength soon but the amount of damage I was taking there kinda made me reluctant to do that

Here are some things I did to minimize the hassle whenever I got stuck with Sohm Al. It pretty much negates all the extra damage you'll take.

1. Kill the plants first. The ones that spawn the bombs. The opening section with the bomb plants is the worst part of the whole dugeon; It gets a lot easier past there.

2. Split up the dragon trash: For the second part of the dungeon, there are trash packs nested close to where some flying dragons drop down. For some reason, tanks like to pull all that trash plus the big AOE casting ice or fire dragon all at once, It's a lot of unnecessary work; instead, use provoke to grab that trash from a distance and pull it all the way back to where the dragons won't drop on you. (Run up to the bridge, taunt, run all the way back to the patform. Let your dps know what you're doing so they don't attack early or pull the dragon.) Makes it a lot easier.

3. Pull the Earth dragon down. Same principal as suggestion 2. There's a part just before the last boss where you have to fight three big dragons all at once. Instead of doing that, use provoke to pull the first dragon down the stairs into the first room and kill it by itself. This way, you'll only need to fight two dragons at once in the next room. Makes it a lot easier.

Do these three things often and Sohm Al will bore you to tears in no time.

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Originally Posted by HolyGlassofWater

Really good information to know guys, thanks. Yeah I am going full vit and was looking to switch to a couple strength soon but the amount of damage I was taking there kinda made me reluctant to do that

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I wouldn't worry to much about building into your str accs until you hit 60 and start stacking up your law set a bit. Once you do hit lvl60 content fresh off the boat you'll be dealing with quite a bit of damage (likely more dramatic than your experience with sohm al) where those vit acc will come in handy until your gear grows to compensate the switch to str accs (hp and def wise). Haha that said nothing wrong with you trying/experimenting now anyways, since those str acc would help with aggro/kill-time as well.

PLD won't have significant mitigation over DRK unless they can spread RoH around, which is terrible in dungeons. WAR is just OP compared to both while leveling 50+ with IB & Bloodbath+Overpower for constant mitigation and self heals, don't bother trying to compete with them in dungeons.

Ability timing & positioning are most likely the issue. Open the fight with Shadowskin or Shadow Wall right as the mobs are converging on you to maximize damage reduced & allow the healer to catch up. Do not use Convalescence until after you've taken damage, it's 100% useless unless a cure is hitting you. Position yourself so that you can parry all mobs & pop Dark Dance+Awareness(crits bypass parry), use the extra Low Blow procs from it to spread a fresh 5 second stun to each mob if you don't have an AoE to interrupt. If you still feel that you're taking too much damage, bite the bullet & use unbuffed Souleater more.

If you where the same gear at the same level you will indeed take the same exact amount of damage as your pally regardless of what it may "seem" or hat bad healers may complain about.

The above was in respect to taking hits with no parry or blocks.

You also have to account for the fact that pallys have a block mechanic and the drk doesn't. This is why pally is a "defensive" tank so to speak. So while unmitigated damage taken will be equal to the drk, the chance of random proc mitigation is increased with a pally vs a dark which could also be what you are noticing in the rate of hp loss.

The same thing applies to warrior outside of parries.