Tank Balance

Nvm.was badly thought out

Why do you hate paladin?

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Originally Posted by Brannigan

Why do you hate paladin?

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I don't.I been starting to level gladiator and level paladin.I main warrior and have llv 55 Dark knight.I feel those changes would help balance and benefit Paladin.Why do you think i hate paladin based on my suggestions?

I have no idea how crit helps in anyway shape or form or why you want it on a defensive oath.

Sentinel already reduces magic damage and physical as it "Reduces damage taken by 30%." - 40% with trait

but the icing on the cake for me is WHY WOULD YOU WANT A SHORTER STUN DURATION!!!!?

So if anything your changes make PLD worse or have little impact.

War doesn't really need a buff to fell cleave

and why would you nerf one of the DKs CDs?

I wasn't aware that sentinel reduced magical damage aswell as physical.And the warrior thing is a nerf and not a buff.
I had thought that that sentinel didn't include magical damage.i suggested the dark magic nerf to make Paladin more viable.
My mistake.I'd assumed from all the complaining on the forums about Paladin against Dark that Paladin didn't have a magic defense cooldown.

yes nerf the other tanks and buff only warrior some more.

Edit: lol nvm these are all nefts xD

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Originally Posted by PotatoWafflez

I have no idea how crit helps in anyway shape or form or why you want it on a defensive oath.

Sentinel already reduces magic damage and physical as it "Reduces damage taken by 30%."

but the icing on the cake for me is WHY WOULD YOU WANT A SHORTER STUN DURATION!!!!?

So if anything your changes make PLD worse or have little impact.

War doesn't really need a buff to fell cleave

and why would you nerf one of the DKs CDs?

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Also the shorter stun duration woule be inline with buffing other things.Changed my original post.

You want to kill what little aoe Paladin's have?

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Originally Posted by Isius

yes nerf the other tanks and buff only warrior some more.

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How is that a buff to warrior?What i am saying nerfs the damage of fell cleave.that you can only do the highest potential 500 which you can do from any situation currently into being a certain position.this makes the warrior still strong but more potent as an off tank.

It buffs the damage thus buffing the emenity.Will have longer cooldown but be a more effective skill inbetween flash.In the long run would be a better threat holder for blm nukes or summoners

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Originally Posted by Metalwrath

It buffs the damage thus buffing the emenity.Will have longer cooldown but be a more effective skill inbetween flash.In the long run would be a better threat holder for blm nukes or summoners

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It nerfs the damage though because you are trading 1100 for 600 due to the fact you can cast it twice for every once with your change.

There is only 10 seconds down time with the 25 CD when you don't have the DoT up as it stands.
Your change would mean there is 25 second of nothing after the DoT falls off.
So if anything the longer the fight went on the worse off you'd be.

I also misread your fell cleave change due to not having the original potency on hand and how you had laid out the other changes but it seems like a unnecessary change.

Also my math is bad because I don't do damage calculations ;-; so Pooky down there V probably explains it better!

You actually just nerfed Circle of Scorn by 25%. Right now it's 250 pot/25 sec = 10 pot/sec. Yours is 300 pot/40 sec = 7.5 pot/sec. (10 - 7.5) / 10 = .25 = 25%. And that is BEFORE you factor in Flight or Fight, which can buff 2 out of 4 CoS right now. You nerfed it pretty bad.

Also, people should stop underestimating Sword Oath. It is a roughly +12% damage from neutral stance (not in sword or shield oath). It really is incredibly powerful for being persistent.

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Originally Posted by Metalwrath

How is that a buff to warrior?What i am saying nerfs the damage of fell cleave.that you can only do the highest potential 500 which you can do from any situation currently into being a certain position.this makes the warrior still strong but more potent as an off tank.

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Yeah nvm I made a edit in last post. Numbers seemed odd to me so I had to relooked at it, but seriously none of these changes make sense. Yes it would nerf warrior's dmg but that is not SE plan. Warrior is meant to be top dps tank. You are basically making Fell Cleave slightly better potency then Inner Beast but with no benefits that Inner Beast has if a Warrior is MT at the time or even having to tank a target...you know tanking while being a tank. Many warriors wouldn't like this change, since they love dmg. xD And currently tank dps is very important toward endgame, so you are basically making things harder for everyone in alex savage savage worst.

I think most people on these forums are okay where Warrior is at, but Dark Knight needs to have some skills tweak, and have better physical defenses, while Paladin needs QoL changes on several skills, and enmity, and arguable more dps/magic mitigation. But this is not for us to decide that is for SE to decide.

Edit: And again yes sorry I assumed you wanted Fell Cleave to be buffed, just read these forums for too long, and after seeing some people wanting to buff the best performing tank more while the other two tanks are behind drives me crazy. Maybe once Drk/Pld are "fixed" then I would accept some warrior buffs/changes.

Yeah i forgot to add about the DOT.i'd change it to 40 potency over 30 seconds.

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Originally Posted by Metalwrath

Dark knight.Dark mind reduced to 10% Bonus decreased to 20%.Make mana cost much higher.
would like to hear other players thoughts on these.

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What get your facts straight Dark mind costs no mp to use you only use mp on it when you use Dark Arts and DA costs the same for every thing.

And you forgot to add this nerf to your WAR.

Put WARs tank and dps stance on the GCD and add a 777 mp cost to each. And add instant hp to tank stance war who has full hp before stance.

WAR is not overpowered. WAR does not need a nerf, there is nothing broken about a tank that can sustain itself and put out good DPS when played correctly.
The other tanks are just (comparatively) weak and need buffs.

This is not even good balance. I don't mean to bash you, but this post just shows what ignorance you have about the other classes, namely the Dark Mind nerf you suggested. Why is this even suggested? Because they are good in Alexander Savage? Do you realize that Dark Knight is actually a terribly designed class. It's kit is entirely disjointed, but SE ensured that it wouldn't suck by making all of the hardest hitting moves in Alexander magic based, which ended up giving them a significant edge over PLD in terms of MT for Alex. Put DRK in a set of turns where all the damage is physical and you'll see how poorly designed the class is. It's already evident, by the fact that most groups prefer PLD/WAR to DRK/WAR for A2S. Do you realize that 2 of their mitigation abilities aren't even functional in raid content? Dark Arts Dark Dance and Dark Arts Dark Passenger are entirely worthless for anything that isn't a dungeon, aside from adding a little extra damage onto DP when killing adds in A2S. Furthermore, for a Tank that specializes in tanking magic damage, don't you find it odd that one of their mitigation tools is gated by a parry?

Warrior on the other hand is in a good spot, but it's not because Warrior is broken per se. I am of the opinion that Warrior is the epitome of a perfectly designed tank. Their skills make sense, and their ability to stance dance with ease allows their kit to be so fluid. What do your nerfs to Fell Cleave and Decimate serve to do by making them barely better than their Defiance respective counterparts Inner Beast and Steel Cyclone? Warrior does a lot of damage, but it comes at the cost of tanking more damage than either of either of the other tanks. Just ask any healer they'll tell you. My static healers have a significant better experience healing me as the DRK than they do our WAR because there is less spiking involved. There is a trade off for the damage they do. It just seems like a pointless nerf to be honest. The only reason WAR is as good as it is right now is due to the fact that there is no possible contender for the OT spot. The amount of utility a WAR can provide from Storm's Eye and Storm's Path is insane and is the predominant reason for its dominance. No other tank has that sort of raid utility. It's strong, but I think the illusion of it being over powered is due to the fact that DRK was never designed to be an OT so WAR remains uncontested as an OT. If SE wanted to make DRK function better as an OT they'd have to give it utility for it to be worth taking over WAR.

PLD on the other hand wouldn't really benefit from crit in any way shape or form. I don't understand why this change was suggested. As for the Sentinel change, are you just trying to homogenize this ability to make it more like Vengeance? PLD has enough mitigation available that they don't need another mitigation spell to be up that frequently. I don't understand the CoS changes either. You added 50 potency to the base hit of a DoT and want to increase the CD by 15 seconds? Also your Shield Bash change makes no sense either. What is the logic behind it? IMO it should be made into an oGCD, but that would further homogenize the tanking classes.

If you're going to suggest changes like this, present your logic behind it. As of right now you make zero points with regards to "Tank Balance" and contribute nothing at all to the concept of balance. This offers no productive feedback and would not garner the attention of any developers for suggestions.

After reading this OP I'm glad that forum posters are not in charge of job changes.