[To the Devs] Please add this to Wolves' Den 2.0

With the upcoming additions to Wolves' Den in 3.2, this is a perfect opportunity to make some quality of life changes. One of the most in demand ones would be to add an enemy list of your opponents, to make it easier to target, see their health bars, and see what jobs you're up against. Here is an example (not real):
http://i.imgur.com/aZ43Nz2.jpg?1
http://i.imgur.com/aZ43Nz2.jpg?1

I understand that memory limitations seem to always be an issue, however, this would simply be using the same enemy list already provided in the HUD.

Using the same idea above, this could also tell both teams what jobs they are up against before the gates open. As of right now, we can "kind of" see the enemies through the gates (especially summoner and scholar pets), so why not? Either show the jobs of the opposing team before the gates open or don't show them at all. Having us zoom in between the gates and kind of see what we're up against seems silly and outdated.

Who is even going to do this content??

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Originally Posted by Mikedizzy

Who is even going to do this content??

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...the ones that already do wolves den and those that prefer a competitive setting over a casual one like frontlines?

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Originally Posted by Mikedizzy

Who is even going to do this content??

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It's actually very popular with many players. The issue is, right now, those who enjoy it can only play against each other because nobody new wants to join.

The reason nobody new is playing is because the entire player base (most of whom down n't even know what WD is) keeps telling them it's not worth it, or that it's dead. It became a self perpetuating myth. Those who have played it properly tend to lament this fact.

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Originally Posted by Culfinrandir

The reason nobody new is playing is because the entire player base (most of whom down n't even know what WD is) keeps telling them it's not worth it, or that it's dead. It became a self perpetuating myth. Those who have played it properly tend to lament this fact.

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A self Perpetuating myth that's also partly perpetuated by horrible que times. I know Wolves Den isn't dead. C'eve told me as much in another thread, and I followed C'eve's advice to try and get some variety in my PvP experience. However, the que times are absurd. Regardless of the time of day I've qued at, the result is always the same. The average wait time for me has never, not even once, been less than 30 minutes, and, if you have the patience to stick it out, it only gets worse. Longest I waited before I just gave up was 45 (getting close to the halfway point through a movie without so much as a blip on the radar was a little frustrating).

I don't know why it's like that. I know there are people out there who still play it, but I can't seem to get in. It's like my DF just locks me out of it. The only option I haven't been able to try is a pre-made group. C'eve recommended joining a LS for this kind of thing, which I have. Several, in fact. However, the PvP community on Diabolos is not even remotely close to being what you guys would call "active." 3 LS's and counting and I can't get a group, let alone organize a match.

So, as much as the die hard, "hardcore," PvP'ers out there swear that the death of Wolves Den is just a myth, to people like me, who have spent hours trying to play even one match, it seems pretty dead. It might very well be a myth, but, at this point I can't say the myth is entirely self perpetuated or unjustified.

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Originally Posted by Februs

post ^

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Doesn't part of the issue have to do with the awkward way that they match people?

IIRC you can only fight a group who's total overall PvP rank is within +7/-7 of your own group's or something like that.

I understand its trying to put you up against players who have similar ranks, though by that logic there'd be nothing stopping a team with a rank 50/0/0/0 from going up against a team with a rank 10/15/15/10, if it works how I think it does.

In all honesty it seems like that also contributes to the longer queues, if not outright butchers them sometimes. I could be wrong.

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Originally Posted by Soular

Doesn't part of the issue have to do with the awkward way that they match people?

IIRC you can only fight a group who's total overall PvP rank is within +7/-7 of your own group's or something like that.

I understand its trying to put you up against players who have similar ranks, though by that logic there'd be nothing stopping a team with a rank 50/0/0/0 from going up against a team with a rank 10/15/15/10, if it works how I think it does.

In all honesty it seems like that also contributes to the longer queues, if not outright butchers them sometimes. I could be wrong.

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you arn;t wrong, minus some minor nuances you have to deal with as a max ranker this is pretty much how the system works

This would definitely be a huge quality of life adjustment. I'm weird and enjoy the antics of hiding before the gate opens and peeking through to figure out who I'm up against, but I definitely wouldn't be sad to see that go either.

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Originally Posted by Blubbers

This would definitely be a huge quality of life adjustment. I'm weird and enjoy the antics of hiding before the gate opens and peeking through to figure out who I'm up against, but I definitely wouldn't be sad to see that go either.

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Yeah, perhaps the whole "peeking through the gates" change is just my preference and isn't really detrimental right now, and I'd rather most of the focus be on adding that enemy list for sure.

It would also be great if anyone who regularly posts on the JP forums could display that picture example over on their PvP forums, as I believe that forum gets a little more dev attention than ours.

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Originally Posted by Soular

Doesn't part of the issue have to do with the awkward way that they match people?

IIRC you can only fight a group who's total overall PvP rank is within +7/-7 of your own group's or something like that.

(snip)

In all honesty it seems like that also contributes to the longer queues, if not outright butchers them sometimes. I could be wrong.

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That's exactly the problem. Why people organise 4x2 on the PF is because they can use a spreadsheet to balance the team to ensure that they get it. It's SE's fault because most WD devotees already have these teams sorted so a lone queuer can never get in.

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Originally Posted by Culfinrandir

That's exactly the problem. Why people organise 4x2 on the PF is because they can use a spreadsheet to balance the team to ensure that they get it. It's SE's fault because most WD devotees already have these teams sorted so a lone queuer can never get in.

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This, and soular's explanation explain it, then. It's an access issue for those of us who weren't around when Wolves Den came out. Because I missed the glory days when everyone playing it was starting at Rank 0 and working up together (Some faster than others, for those of you who were devoted to it) I'm essentially locked out of it, especially on my server, where PvP is considered the shady corner under the bleachers where all the smokers hang out. The one thing that gives me hope for it, is that, maybe, if i'm lucky, once I reach rank 50 I might have better luck with quing with the "hardcore crowd," though, I still don't see that happening, because I'm already with 7 ranks of 50 and still can't manage to get a que time less than 30 minutes.

The main hope I have right now is that the reboot of Wolves Den might pick it up in popularity on my server, so that I can find some PF groups or LS groups willing to get into it with me.

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Originally Posted by nickx

Yeah, perhaps the whole "peeking through the gates" change is just my preference and isn't really detrimental right now, and I'd rather most of the focus be on adding that enemy list for sure.

It would also be great if anyone who regularly posts on the JP forums could display that picture example over on their PvP forums, as I believe that forum gets a little more dev attention than ours.

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Personally, I think this should be a "must have" feature for the simple sake of targeting. I Play on PS4, and, as much as I know I can set up a mouse and keyboard, I prefer to not play hot potatoes with my control set ups. When it comes to playing on controller, the ONE thing that I can say proves to be a disadvantage is targeting. Cycling with the D pad is a pain in the butt, and circle jerking targets can get mixed results. A lot of the time I end up targeting pets or tanks by default and have to spend precious seconds cycling to find the squishy caster I want to pulverize into dirt. It's a pain. Having an enemy list, like in PvE, would make it WAY easier to be able to see what I'm targeting at a moment's notice. Plus, as much as the track pad is cumbersome to use, if I'm in a bind I can also just slide and click my target from there, instead of cycling endlessly on the Dpad.

Februs - I'm only Rank 33. What I do is keep an eye on PF because on a weekend there's usually some people doing win trading. It consists of ten games, three team A wins & three team B wins. The final four games are proper games. Its to complete the Challenge Log. Not ideal but you do get a chance to play.

Admittedly, I've not been able to PVP as much recently as I want to due to being from the UK on a US server where WD gets going in the early hours.

They need to balance skills for 4v4 pvp before you get that kind of interest in it. I personally won't touch that stuff until, as a healer, I get an anti stun/purify get an even short recharge(60s or so), or they remove interrupt on hit/crit (make people use stun/silence intelligently). Not to mention if you're not r50 now, you'll be at an extreme disadvantage without gear/allocation points.

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Originally Posted by Culfinrandir

Februs - I'm only Rank 33. What I do is keep an eye on PF because on a weekend there's usually some people doing win trading. It consists of ten games, three team A wins & three team B wins. The final four games are proper games. Its to complete the Challenge Log. Not ideal but you do get a chance to play.

Admittedly, I've not been able to PVP as much recently as I want to due to being from the UK on a US server where WD gets going in the early hours.

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You underestimate the complete and utter disdain my server has for PvP. I'm a raid tank, so I am constantly watching the PF (for raids in need, paid carries, and farm runs of extreme content or weekly loot drops). I basically have the PF open 100% of the time I'm not in a match or duty. I have never once, not ever, seen PvP parties in the PF on Diabolos. If anything, my only hope for a win trade group would be with a PvP LS, but I'm in 3 of those (currently), and the chatter is almost always dead. Sometimes you get the occasional group for seize, but I've never had anyone answer me for Wolve's Den.

I'm sure it happens out there somewhere, but, if it's happening on my server than it must be happening at times when I'm not, or can't be, logged in. Otherwise I would have seen it by now.

Diabolos is not that big of a server to begin with (mid size population at best, was ranked something like 14th last I saw among NA servers) and the server as a whole is not very big on pvp yes. As a result you won't find many (if any cause I have never seen one either) PF's for wolves den. My maelstrom linkshell has people that try to organize a run sometimes for the weekly challenge log but finding people that will go is still as painful as pulling teeth. There was one person who was trying to organize a big wolves den event for this weekend but idk how that's gonna turn out.

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Originally Posted by Dimitrii

Diabolos is not that big of a server to begin with (mid size population at best, was ranked something like 14th last I saw among NA servers) and the server as a whole is not very big on pvp yes. As a result you won't find many (if any cause I have never seen one either) PF's for wolves den. My maelstrom linkshell has people that try to organize a run sometimes for the weekly challenge log but finding people that will go is still as painful as pulling teeth. There was one person who was trying to organize a big wolves den event for this weekend but idk how that's gonna turn out.

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Exactly. I've had the same experience. Even on my LS's for PvP, if you do a shout out for a pre-made in frontlines you might get a response, if you're lucky. Check the LS registry and most of them are probably not even running PvP. Mention wolve's den to them and you are met with the sound of dead crickets. I thought that at least getting the weekly challenge run would be a nice exp boost for leveling, but that's a pipe dream on Diabolos. Diabolos's server size isn't too bad when it comes to PvE, but PvP is another story. Forget Wolves Den, if it wasn't for cross server PvP ques, PvP in it's entirety would be utterly dead. We wouldn't even have enough active players to get a full match of Seize going.

And probably not good. I saw the post, but it had barely been up before it got shafted to another page due to low views and few responses. Further, the timing is a bit off. Semester start up is here for a lot of people, and MGSV's release will probably have a lot more people taking a temporary hiatus from FFXIV, at least for a bit.