The truth about the community of the game and the forums.

Done, I want this thread gone, I tried and worded it terribly. It wont let me delete this thread I created.

So opinions are wrong? In debates you are allowed to have opinions, I won't tell anyone they can't. I understand what you mean but please understand this is a good breather for people to really discuss exactly what it is, or at least point it out.

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Originally Posted by Yunona

I simply want to discuss about improving the forum community.

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Thats kind of like asking the sun not to rise in the morning.

I am not trying to start a fight, or be rude or anything but simply letting people voice themselves somewhere other than derailing a thread that has nothing to do with them. Is that so bad? I am not trying to be stubborn.

I honestly think that people sling around the word 'toxic' way too much. Most of what I see posted here doesn't even remotely qualify as toxic. Some of it is snarky, some of it isn't very constructive, but I think that many people don't really have any idea just how awful a forum can actually get. Overall, this forum is very tame.

I read what you said, but fine, why is the forum seem to be slightly aggressive, am I not allowed to use the forum to try to discuss something? Should I delete this because the idea is not agreed with?

I have met good and bad people no just in here, but in game too. It is natural to find people that we won't like or vice versa. Just because it is the internet, it doesn't mean that the people on the internet are from another dimension.

The problem is, there will always be "that guy", and when it involves many people there are alot of "them guys". I just live by this rule:
http://thebasispoint.com/wp-content/...02/BeNice.jpeg

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Originally Posted by dekal

I have met good and bad people no just in here, but in game too. It is natural to find people that we won't like or vice versa. Just because it is the internet, it doesn't mean that the people on the internet are from another dimension.

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At no point did I say they were, this is already becoming a lost cause, I wanted to help people understand eachother, I don't mind your criticism. I am looking to find common ground.

The truth is everyone has different opinions about the community. Where someone sees a "cesspool of hatred" others will see "heated debates" or simply "debates" if they don't try to place their emotional reaction to someones post as the intent.

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Originally Posted by Elim

The truth is everyone has different opinions about the community. Where someone sees a "cesspool of hatred" others will see "heated debates" or simply "debates" if they don't try to place their emotional reaction to someones post as the intent.

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See and I love the threads that are simply debates, and fun to read. I cannot stress enough that I was quoting how people see the community my personal view is that I enjoy reading about many things people learn and create for the enjoyment of others.

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Originally Posted by Yunona

At no point did I say they were, this is already becoming a lost cause, I wanted to help people understand eachother, I don't mind your criticism. I am looking to find common ground.

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You said "...I really didn't want to do anything, people I meet in game are normally for the most part nice(: I love it, made many friends just through dungeons, but... the forum, is so toxic, not because of whatever..." I am just clarifying and adding that in the game there are people that will be "toxic", too. I met great people thru the forums and I am friends with them in game if we got lucky enough to be in the same server otherwise we just use 1-2 threads to keep in touch.

Those are the same people that you will find in game. Who said that may be you are talking to someone in game that is cool and nice with you and your group, but come to the forums and others will find him/her toxic / I met people that don't even use their own square enix account to make threads/posts on the forums/.

You say you want to find a common ground, to understand each other. That is kind of impossible. you will find that we will understand just a part of what you say while others will agree 100% and another group that disagree with you completely.

I agree with you that there're people we all consider bad / good people according to our morals and standards. I agree with you, but you want to try to say you want love and peace 100% with every single person that is just not possible. Another thing you need to understand too is that we are influenced by our emotions and if someone got a bad day, they will reflect that state to whoever he/she gets in contact. The same can be said if someone got an awesome day.

Debates were made to see who agrees with our ideas and who doesn't. Of course, some people will overreact /letting themselves be influenced by their feelings/ and began to say bad things. If other posters get offended by it, then the debate is eradicated and start the nonsense fights that bring nothing good.

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Originally Posted by dekal

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I know how it works as I mention its common for disagreements, however we will find common ground one day, it will not be impossible. I discussed this with my husband who also plays, it takes time to make friends even here but still its not gonna be easy but you gotta try, its also like this, "people from different servers will not act as they do on the server as they do on the forums."

Just an observation: You say you want to have a discussion that calmly discusses the environment of the forums, but when people started replying and giving their opinions, you immediately became defensive. That changes the future replies.

Part of the reason the official forums of a game seem so...harsh, is because these are players trying to get the attention of developers. Most of the threads in the General Discussion forum are simply "SE, I don't like this change it" By keeping the combined disagreement of members, they are building up pages and pages of support that will influence how things are changed.

When "classes argue" it provides everyone perspective. Why should class A get something when class B has been pleading for adjustment? It's an honest question, however it can be brought up in terrible phrasing.

Unless people are being downright nasty (for which they usually receive some sort of punishment), I don't see the forums as being "toxic." I may have missed something, would you provide some examples?

Mm, I mostly stay in the new players area. It's nice and friendly over there.

As for the "toxicity", we all know text does not translate tone very well. But space and attention is also very limited on these forums, so people try to get their point across quickly with the most impact. As a result, everyone comes off as being a little abrasive, blunt, and a little rude. It does get people's attentions and everybody is easy to understand (in that exaggerated-Disney-facial-expression kind of way). In short, it sometimes feels like a forum full of Donald Trumps.

I would suggest to just take everything in stride. There's still some comments that make me go "wow, s/he did not just say that", but I can still see their point and agree/disagree with it. Just remember nobody's actually shouting at you personally and stalking you with a tonberry knife... hopefully.

Also keep in mind the tenet of the silent majority. The majority of players don't make that much noise. Those are the people we see in game who don't really care about the new changes. Then there's the top and lower 5%, who like to make noise one way or the other. And generally, those are the people you hear on the forums. Just keep in mind that you're getting the opinions of a very passionate or dedicated few in these threads and that the majority of opinion is unsure or lies somewhere in the middle.

I don't even come to this forum regularly, i just come over to see updates.

the reddit ffxiv forum is pretty cool, usually lots of cute things over there, fan art/drawings, guides, funny videos on raids etc. etc. , i usually just hang around there.

This sums it all up.

https://youtu.be/IW1gWV0gixI

My only problem is with kids that are deluded enough to think they are better than others......

https://media.giphy.com/media/2GjgvS5vA6y08/giphy.gif

Sorry, I had to. :D

This forum has nothing on toxicity in comparison to some other games.

Maybe we should have a contest on which forum can be the worst.

You might as well rename all forums to be "debate boards" because that's what they become.

I for one think some healthy, even heated, debate is a great thing and brings problems that many don't see bubbling to the surface. Trolls will always be trolls, but the greater part of this forum is actually making legitimate points about one thing or another. I've seen waaaaaay worse communities in other games though. At least there is usually someone that will step up to help if someone needs it.

I never became defensive, I was worried I was making people upset and try to resolve it, truly, if I caused issues I am sorry. classes arguing I meant SMN vs SMN not random classes fighting. I understand where youre coming from but if I caused trouble there is no reason for me to have said anything. I am sorry.

Looking through these forums, you'd think that nearly every DF dungeon run ended with people being kicked, yelled at, or otherwise harassed.

In the 2 years and hundreds of dungeons I've run, I've seen a grand total of two runs that went south due to people being rude, belligerent, or just flat-out incompetent. I've been kicked from a run a grand total of once, and that one was very random (it seemed to be going fine, we had just cleared the second boss, no one had said a word, and I suddenly found myself back in Idyllshire. Odd.).

Granted, I'm a filthy casual who doesn't really do raiding much, so maybe that community is different. But the overwhelming majority of people I've seen have been positive, friendly, and helpful. YMMV.

look I hate what Ive done, honestly I can't handle this. I feel weak and pathetic about this now, how can I delete this thread?
I cant see the delete on my first post.

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Originally Posted by Yunona

look I hate what Ive done, honestly I can't handle this. I feel weak and pathetic about this now, how can I delete this thread?
I cant see the delete on my first post.

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Don't worry about it lol. Fact of the matter is that when heated debate happens behind a keyboard many things get misconstrued. Solid points and arguments can quickly be misunderstood as attacks and we all know how it goes from there.

Relax!

It's all good.

Thank you, I truly meant no harm, I just didn't know how to word it correctly, from every forum I read so far.. people become hostile and rude. I just wanted to make people happy. As I game now I love playing a healer to help people, I truly enjoy it, even when someone is rude I protect them. Currently I've been on leave for pregnancy for work and joined ffxiv for the world of fantasy. I love it, finished Scholar and Summoner relic to zenith today! Working on White mage now. I love this game, and the people I meet I try to friend everyone, even when it seems useless, I love the worlds we connect through, dungeons or not.

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Originally Posted by MilesSaintboroguh

Maybe we should have a contest on which forum can be the worst.

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As far as toxic goes for me nothing was worse then BG, Even the moderators were as toxic and pretty much banned or "warned" you if you simply disagreed with them or argued with one of their favorites/freinds.

There are worse forums out there, but keep in mind when dealing with a community of people, it is inevitable to run into toxic people.

You want less toxic on the forums?
A start would be a couple moderators that actually do their job, and some strict ruling like "one thread per subject"

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Originally Posted by Assirra

You want less toxic on the forums?
A start would be a couple moderators that actually do their job, and some strict ruling like "one thread per subject"

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Not surer they could handle the amount of spam the NA forum gets tho, people make 4-5 topics on one thing a day sometimes... multiple times a day, its why our forum is so bloated compared to others.

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

Not surer they could handle the amount of spam the NA forum gets tho, people make 4-5 topics on one thing a day sometimes... multiple times a day, its why our forum is so bloated compared to others.

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Oh god you just reminded me of all those stupid threads about the grass in 2.0. I'll agree that there are way too many threads of the same kind, and it's due to all the English speaking players. I find it kinda annoying that people complain about not getting replies from the devs right away. They've mentioned before that if they don't have the answers to a question or request, they usually won't reply. I'm sure they're monitoring the forums frequently enough, whether they'll answer or not is different.

Toxicity?
Things in need of a clean up?
Bunch of punks running rampant and being bullies?

I think the solution is obvious ...
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/...xicavenger.jpg

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Originally Posted by Crimen

Oh god you just reminded me of all those stupid threads about the grass in 2.0. I'll agree that there are way too many threads of the same kind, and it's due to all the English speaking players. I find it kinda annoying that people complain about not getting replies from the devs right away. They've mentioned before that if they don't have the answers to a question or request, they usually won't reply. I'm sure they're monitoring the forums frequently enough, whether they'll answer or not is different.

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Excuse but what?
grass?

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Originally Posted by Assirra

Excuse but what?
grass?

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People complaining about the look of the grass when we were first shown videos of the new graphic engine. The main point though being that each person complained with their own thread, instead of all just throwing their opinions in on the same one, because they want theirs to be the first one on the page.

I think the common statement "you think this is toxic? X and Y forum is way worse" is flawed. You're not denying theres a problem your simply saying its worse elsewhere (some would say thats a light confirmation). "You think its violent in in richmond? You should move to X where people die by the thousands everyday" just because its worse somewhere else doesnt mean there isnt a problem. Though some have put together more thorough statements going over the positives of the community, I feel overall many are falling short.

I was raised on a dieing culture where if someone offered you something the only polite responses were "yes please, thank you" or "no thank you". Something like "sure" or "no im good thanks" was rude. This is gone. And I fear for the future youth that gets a majority of their interactions through the internet and forums. Yes we understand they are keyboard warriors who can turn off their basic human decency while shielded behind a monitor. But how long till kids misunderstand it and start treating people face to face the way they were conditions to on the internet?

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Originally Posted by TouchandFeel

Toxicity?

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You sir, have made my day lol. Toxie!