Bard without Wanderer's Minuet

Is it at all viable to play Bard without Wanderer's Minuet?

I'm 54 now and it just doesn't feel right to me. I didn't level this class to play a caster, and a subpar one at that.

I feel like they kinda killed Bard's niche here.

Bard lays down the business at level 60. I don't know where people are getting this idea that they are subpar from. Yes they could get a few QoL fixes, but they are definitely in no need of a buff or anything.

What Ephier said. Removing the cast time made a huge difference. A lot of those bards complaining right after launch weren't using it right. On when standing still off when you need to move. It's not complicated.

Damage-wise WM Bard is in a good spot in my opinion, that being said they did kill the jobs 2-3 year core playstyle. If you enjoy playing it as a non-casting mobile class you're in for a disappointment. You can choose not to use WM, but at that point you're losing so much potential that you're almost wasting a slot.

Despite what everyone else says the bard is hands down still the most played job in the game. People play what is strong and bards are still indeed strong. Over 500 bards on balmung alone and the next job that even closely touching it is the ninja at 380. If a job was not powerful it would not be popular.

Dungeon queues are already overflowing with machinist and bards. They need to seperate where only one bard or machinist can be in any 4 man dungeon. They maybe powerful but still it slows down dungeon runs when you lose 600 possible dps.

You either have to get used to it or choose another class if you want to raid in a serious group, non WM BRD's do less DPS than healers, its basically a waste of a slot.

But if you don't really care about playing optimally and are in a casual group of people who don't mind the low dps then you should be fine.

Yeah, I don't have any issue adapting to it. I know how to time movements at the end of casts and between GCDs.

It just doesn't feel fun to me like this. It's not the class I enjoyed for the first 50 levels and throughout all of ARR.

It also feels really clunky with all the off GCD skills bard has. It really sucks seeing bloodletters proc while you're in the middle of a cast.

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Originally Posted by Tharius

It also feels really clunky with all the off GCD skills bard has. It really sucks seeing bloodletters proc while you're in the middle of a cast.

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This is at present one of the biggest issues on why I argue against WM on Bard.

Before they changed WM i dindt use it for the Ravana EX Fight.
Cause i was running way to much to make it worth.
But with the Change you can turn it on in Burst Phases etc..

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Originally Posted by Tharius

Is it at all viable to play Bard without Wanderer's Minuet?

I'm 54 now and it just doesn't feel right to me. I didn't level this class to play a caster, and a subpar one at that.

I feel like they kinda killed Bard's niche here.

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Short Answer : No. You'll need to use it optimally if you want to pull reasonable numbers to justify a dps slot.

Viable? Yeah. Efficient? mmm... nope. Learn how to play with WM, you'll deal more damage but you will loss some mobility, it seems like a nice tradeoff.

Actually there is no trade off or middle ground for this, they effectively destroyed the playstyle of bard, its either use WM or pretty much don't expect to go any further with the content cause you will be kicked from group as Ive seen, THANKS SE for effectively making the bard play the way you guys want it to, there were other solutions that could have been made for this, even with the latest fix you nerfed our SW attack with less potentency and buffed WM as the tradeoff to basically say "HEY you guys play bard the way we want you to, nevermind how it was for the past 2 years....you want to keep going in the content with this class then you switch to a caster roll or GTFO...", yup Im quite annoyed..

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Originally Posted by SovereignAegis

This is at present one of the biggest issues on why I argue against WM on Bard.

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Ah, thought I would see you here, seeing as though you love to add to the salt pile of the BRD issue; started some of your own threads, messaged in basically all of them, etc. even thought you are a lv 32 BRD so therefore have no right to discuss issues people may have on WM. Do everyone a favour, stop trying to be a keyboard warrior, change your signature to something more appropriate, and think before messaging in forums about a class you have no mastery over. Not everyone thinks WM is a bad thing, learn to accept that and move on.

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None of us wanted to play BOW MAGE. We wanted to play a BARD

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Yeah, actually go and play bard then. kthxbai

Something I'd like to point out here: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...=1#post3128466

Knowing when to change stances...is basically them saying they aren't expecting you to be in WM at ALL times (more so now that there is no cast time), but instead when you feel you need it. There a time when you don't need to move at all? (Say Ravana Prelude to Liberation, or in Garuda EX where you are mainly staying in one place when you actually are hitting her.) WM a go! Need to dodge alot of stuff? Switch it off and keep DPSing.

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Originally Posted by Jaibamon

Viable? Yeah. Efficient? mmm... nope. Learn how to play with WM, you'll deal more damage but you will loss some mobility, it seems like a nice tradeoff.

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Thing is not many people understand the concept of tradeoffs. I mean, every damn job in this game has one. They were given a tool to have their damage increased and they can toggle on and off WM.

It's a blessing.

The cast times are so damn short. >.>

Caster? Are you kidding me? You just stand still to have increased damage. You could still deal damage while moving. Don't you understand how lucky you guys are?

Learn to stance dance or you know, just beg yoshi-p to take off WM and let bards deal with their lack of damage.

No boost for you.

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Originally Posted by Jaibamon

Viable? Yeah. Efficient? mmm... nope. Learn how to play with WM, you'll deal more damage but you will loss some mobility, it seems like a nice tradeoff.

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Thing is not many people understand the concept of tradeoffs. I mean, every damn job in this game has one. They were given a tool to have their damage increased and they can toggle on and off WM.

It's a blessing.

Dungeons, Aoe fights - use it please.
Fights like Ravana EM, Alex 4? Not worth it.

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Originally Posted by Reneo

Thing is not many people understand the concept of tradeoffs. I mean, every damn job in this game has one. They were given a tool to have their damage increased and they can toggle on and off WM.

It's a blessing.

The cast times are so damn short. >.>

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But none of the other classes had such a tradeoff come at such ahigh price. We sacrifice everything we know of the class and start new.

Mobilty? I seen more BRD fail to get out of the way. MASSIVE tunnel vision. Also don't get why peeps move so much over nothing.

3.0's cast time? Let's forget about all the songs you'd have to use mid-fight that also weakens you. At least you wouldn't be stuck in it for 15 secs like 3.01. Thanks guys, enjoy something that's even less forgiving especially if you stink at timing. :|

Damage? Here's a thing to think about. Everyone who does higher DPS than BRDs all must stop what they're doing to navigate the AoE storms. Sure almost all of us have a weak instant range options but guess who's always on top? Not BRDs.

Obsessed with never ending streams of GCD attacks? We all would love to do that, but we can't. Trash doesn't count, and you got songs. What exactly did you expect? And this song instead of powering you down, powers you up.

I'm with some of the peeps going on about how a lot of the complaints about 3.0's WM was mostly from BRDs who never used it correctly.

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Originally Posted by mb52139

But none of the other classes had such a tradeoff come at such ahigh price. We sacrifice everything we know of the class and start new.

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I'm sure you're exaggerating too much.

Our DPS is fine with WM... It's just the playstyle I hate.

If you're good, you experience almost no downside. If you get good at toggling the skill, and knowing when, and when not to use it, you experience almost no loss of mobility.

The only people who are going to really suffer over this, are the people who chose brd because they wanted to be lazy.

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Originally Posted by Tharius

Is it at all viable to play Bard without Wanderer's Minuet?

I'm 54 now and it just doesn't feel right to me. I didn't level this class to play a caster, and a subpar one at that.

I feel like they kinda killed Bard's niche here.

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Wanna run around for some reason? no problem turn minuet off. When you feel like you have ran around enough, turn it back on.

If you want to be a good bard you need to think situational about positioning before casting WM something like what BLM do right now

If you want freedom in movement dont use WM if you can find the right spot to stand still go on WM to do more damage but also with reduced cast time if i am right

I am talking from a observational point since i have not a fully lvled bard but from what i have heard and stuff this seems to be the thing