So Eos/Selene's healing just sucks now?

http://puu.sh/iUpxX/f27282aee3.png

I understand that Square is trying to balance the fairy healing, but I'm not sure I fully understand why Eos/Selene is healing for around 1.3k when the Scholar is healing for 2.6k with a spell that only has 100 potency more.

I feel as though their heals are just weak right now. And personally, I'd have no trouble healing as a 60 Scholar, so I can't truly complain all that much. However, I feel bad for Eos. Her main spell arsenal involves a healing over time spell, but even with Rouse, it only seems to heal for 600-700 HP.

This is difficult, since I am actually having no issues healing, but my fairy certainly isn't helping out the way they used to.

I think that means they made the fairies extra gear dependent so SCH wouldn't get an easy pass during the early days of lvl 60 content but they will scale with us as we gear up and start to feel more powerful.

It definitely did not scale to the level of the incoming damage or player HP did. It's about 35% stronger than the end of 2.0 - player HP are up like 75%. So fairy healing is comparatively weaker - and the "potency" on Embrace isn't relevant anymore since it's not an apples to apples comparison to our own heals as it used to be. Additionally, it's going to get worse as player HP raise via ilvl at a higher rate than a SCH gear upgrades impact fairy heals.

It's kind of annoying, but I am not sure anything is gonna be done, because at the same time it's pretty impossible to argue that SCH is in a bad place.

Yeah that's my issue. It's not a big problem since the Scholar's healing has certainly gotten better. I just feel as though the fairy should play a larger part. As it stands, I don't think Eos is necessary for anything in Heavensward. Maybe Savage Alexander will change that, but as it stands, with the fairies' healing being nerfed so badly, I cannot see a situation in which Eos' mediocre healing would ever be preferred over Selene's DPS buff and debuff cleansing.

It's bs. This sounds like more dancing around them just not saying "we nerfed the fairies." I just want an honest reply at this point.

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Originally Posted by ckc22

It's bs. This sounds like more dancing around them just not saying "we nerfed the fairies." I just want an honest reply at this point.

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Fairy healing needed to be balanced between Physick healing the same amount as a Cure and Lustrate changing to a potency instead of a percent. If fairy healing was the same as 2.0 it'd be much much harder to balance a class like AST vs. SCH because AST naturally lacks the fairy (though it's not like Noct Sect is balanced vs. SCH right now anyways).

Besides, this is like healing with i70 Darklight Gear was in 2.0, and Embrace is still like 2/3 of my Physick at 55 (AKA more total healing than Cure II/Benefic II when Embrace/Physick are combined).

Fairy healing nerf had to happen if you wanted to keep Physick relevant.

I don't mind it so much. From a balance perspective, there is something amiss when an entity that could cast a spell for free that out healed Regen by a significant amount at level 50; especially since both "tick" in the same three second interval. While this change was unexpected, it doesn't really bother me in the slightest either.

Now, when they do the NEXT level cap increase, they better keep the Fairy relatively inline with this particular curve. I think Embrace being equal or slightly weaker than Regen is a good place to be, but if you make it too weak than the Fairy will be nothing more than a buffing machine.

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Originally Posted by SuzakuCMX

Fairy healing needed to be balanced between Physick healing the same amount as a Cure and Lustrate changing to a potency instead of a percent. If fairy healing was the same as 2.0 it'd be much much harder to balance a class like AST vs. SCH because AST naturally lacks the fairy (though it's not like Noct Sect is balanced vs. SCH right now anyways).

Besides, this is like healing with i70 Darklight Gear was in 2.0, and Embrace is still like 2/3 of my Physick at 55 (AKA more total healing than Cure II/Benefic II when Embrace/Physick are combined).

Fairy healing nerf had to happen if you wanted to keep Physick relevant.

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BS to embrace being 66% of your physick.

Again - if they were up front about it it would be an entirely different thing, first they ninja'd it in and then they gave this non-answer.

Keeping Rouse on cooldown despite the current state of fairy healing helps me to stay on CS for longer periods of time... That's also assuming that dps are good that the fairy is almost exclussively haling the tank.

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Originally Posted by Rubiss

Yeah that's my issue. It's not a big problem since the Scholar's healing has certainly gotten better. I just feel as though the fairy should play a larger part. As it stands, I don't think Eos is necessary for anything in Heavensward. Maybe Savage Alexander will change that, but as it stands, with the fairies' healing being nerfed so badly, I cannot see a situation in which Eos' mediocre healing would ever be preferred over Selene's DPS buff and debuff cleansing.

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It's actually the other way around, with Fey Illumination and Whispering Dawn (with or without the buffed Mind Pot) you can float for quite a while in CS, where as with Selene you can't hope to float anymore unless you have a good PLD with you.

Sch has been king of healer jobs and still is, hearing complaints just is irritating.

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Originally Posted by Krixus

Sch has been king of healer jobs and still is, hearing complaints just is irritating.

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1) Eos on average heals just shy of 50% of Physick. Astrologian needs to burn one of their biggest cooldowns to achieve what we've been doing since 2.0.
2) Our Single-Target healing still trumps WHM, and our "Regen" is still free, and stronger. With Macros we can even toss it anywhere we want, or you can manually cast it I guess. (Going back to AST Bash, they're locked into their one target when using Sysnastry)
3) Our AoE healing has been buffed significantly enough that Double SCH is totally legit. Especially when you take Emergency Tactics into account.

Even when nerfed, I strongly believe that SCH is still the Healer & DPS King. I like playing with WHM still because they let me use Selene. AST need not apply.

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Originally Posted by Krixus

Sch has been king of healer jobs and still is, hearing complaints just is irritating.

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Why else do you think I don't bother posting about SCH 'issues' aside from dissipation being total garbage? :p

They nerfed fairies pretty hard. I am pretty sure that a WHM spamming Regen on players heals about the same.

That being said I think it is fair, we're sitting in a solid position. If the fairies were outputting significnalty stronger heals I would argue that would be a bad thing.

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Originally Posted by Krixus

Sch has been king of healer jobs and still is, hearing complaints just is irritating.

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Ast buffs are incoming, hold onto your "nerfbat". We should be working to buff the weaker healer (ast) and not nerf everything because it isn't suffering like AST is.

Just look at the recent live letter, AST are getting stance-dancing and very likely consideration to mana buffs/shuffle buff.

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Originally Posted by Krixus

Sch has been king of healer jobs and still is, hearing complaints just is irritating.

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Oh look one of those. Inb4 you tell me more about how the way to fix Ast is basically give it full versions of everything that whm and scholar have plus its own unique stuff - like every other ast thread.

There's only one real solution, here: let us equip gear to our fairies.

All they need to do is be open and honest and explain WHAT they did that caused the change. Was it the change to secondary stats (DET)? Is healing linked to a percentage of MND/Weapon Damage/VIT now?

That way we can understand how the future will map out for us. That's all we want, honestly and openness. Unfortunately, SE seems to consider that a weakness much of the time.

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Originally Posted by Wizarus

It's actually the other way around, with Fey Illumination and Whispering Dawn (with or without the buffed Mind Pot) you can float for quite a while in CS, where as with Selene you can't hope to float anymore unless you have a good PLD with you.

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If we're going to talk about using cooldowns, then I would argue that the Scholar being in CS for 21 seconds longer is a smaller boost to overall damage than the 3% Haste Selene gives to the party. So even if you can float for longer in CS with Eos, there is no actual point to doing so.

Anyways, I've read the replies in this thread and I want to stress a few things. I fully understand that Scholars are still great healers. I can and have healed most content in this game and it wasn't too difficult. I could do it with Selene and I am sure I could do it with Eos as well. I am not claiming that Scholars are in a bad position nor that they need a buff to sit level with the others. I know the strengths of the class and I do play the other healers as well. I know that Scholar has no troubles in comparison to the other healers.

What I am trying to get at is I feel as though my fairy is nowhere near as useful as they once were. The Scholar heals for so much more now that the fairy really isn't bringing much beyond their own cooldowns. having 10k+ HP is very common in the current end-game. When my fairy is healing for 10% of that every five seconds to a single person, I am just not seeing how their healing is really helping. Do I rely on my fary to patch up DPS? Not really. I usually toss a physick and leave the minor patching up to them or tell them to do so. My point is that in terms of healing, the fairy is just not doing it and this really impacts Eos. As far as I am concerned, Eos is really only good for giving everyone's healing a 20% boost. Well, except the Scholar, since Lustrate and Indominability is unaffected by it.

I know Scholar's are in a great place. I just wish that the fairy played a larger role in why they're in that place. As it stands, Selene is really the only fairy worth using. But once again, Alexander Savage is coming, so that may change.

I'm not sure how I feel about the new "eat my fairy" mechanic... I'd rather keep my fairy if she had greater potency... :(

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Originally Posted by Rubiss

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Honestly? I think we've been too powerful for too long. I still feel incredibly powerful, and even with the weaker Eos/Selene I feel she still pulls her fair share. (Reminder: even in this nerfed state Selene is still a better version of Synastry that doesn't have a cooldown.) If they want to buff us back up then I won't complain, but I feel that my abilities are "appropriate" right now.

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Originally Posted by Sabeta

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Right now I don't think it's a question of whether or not it's a balanced class (at the very least it fulfills its role as a healer and more). It's more of a question of: how fluid does it feel to play? Dissipation feels like it gives a false choice. 20% healing bonus and 3 aetherflow stacks????. Wow what a great deal!

Well except that you lose more than 20% of your healing power by saccing the fairy and only 3 of your healing abilities are even affected by that increase. It's not like SCH was wanting more emergency healing ability being the best emergency healer in the game already....and right now the extra 3 aetherflow stacks are only needed if you reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeally screw up somewhere.

It's kind of like the debate about Wanderer's Minuet. It's necessary to output enough DPS to warrant your spot in a party, but it also totally changes the way a BRD plays. It could be balanced. Doesn't change the fact that it felt clunky as hell and didn't fit the BRD playstyle.

I cannot see Dissipation as anything remotely close to WM. WM is a poorly implemented skill because the Devs clearly don't playtest things enough. 20% damage increase at the cost of 23% of your damage is so mindblowingly stupid that I have to wonder if the Devs even play the game.

Dissipation is a terrible and weak skill, but it's not what this thread is about. This is a thread about Fairies having weak potencies, not about a near useless ability.

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Originally Posted by Sabeta

I cannot see Dissipation as anything remotely close to WM. WM is a poorly implemented skill because the Devs clearly don't playtest things enough. 20% damage increase at the cost of 23% of your damage is so mindblowingly stupid that I have to wonder if the Devs even play the game.

Dissipation is a terrible and weak skill, but it's not what this thread is about. This is a thread about Fairies having weak potencies, not about a near useless ability.

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Um. It's almost identical. Because your auto attack (embrace) (~40%) is more than the heal potency buff (20%).

The only thing that makes me think as to why fairy heals suck is... Rouse and Fey Illumination. If the increase is additive, then that's +60% healing from Eos' Embrace. Otherwise, it will be +68% which is pretty huge and scales VERY GOOD as gear gets better.

One possible fix is to rework how Rouse interacts with SCH fairies so that when active, it adds a flat potency to Embrace and Whispering Dawn while maintaining the scaling of fairy heals to caster's gear as it did pre-HW and keep Fey Illumination as is.