Please give us other options for running dungeons

It's well documented with over ten years of evidence that people do not want to run tanks and healers in the unholy trinity of MMORPGs as much as damage dealers, and trying to buy tanks and healers with the roulette bonuses has had the same results as similar measures in other games. The fact is there will never be enough tanks and healers, so why not provide some other options for running dungeons? Maybe let people raise their retainers as tanks or healers? Or just let us go old school and maybe zerg the place with DPS. Please, anything but thirty minute to an hour queue times.

Or just the idea of having to dungeons inside a duty finder envoirment is so boring this WoW Instance feeling is so lame. It feels closed somehow you cant call your FC or LS friends to run to the dungeon and help you like it was in 1.0. Tanaka had a few smart ideas afterall.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fendred

It's well documented with over ten years of proof that people do not want to run tanks and healers in the unholy trinity of MMORPGs, and trying to buy tanks and healers with the roulette bonuses has had the same results as similar measures in other games. The fact is there will never be enough tanks and healers, so why not provide some other options for running dungeons? Maybe let people raise their retainers as tanks or healers? Or just let us go old school and maybe zerg the place with DPS. Please, anything but thirty minute to an hour queue times.

---

http://s3media.247sports.com/Uploads...87/1187122.gif

Only the lower dungeons have had the 30 min plus consintently on the Aether server for DPS, and the fact that it was consitent even with the lull between major patch and xpac says a good bit about how it was spread at the time actually. As of now with both AST and especially DRK added que times seem to be a bit shorter, and end game DPS has usually been closer to 15-20 minutes prior to HW, a little shorter now.

Only seen a que take over 35 minutes in A.) PvP, and B.) This one really wierd time where a mostly preformed group for WoD I was in had to wait 3 hours...we still aren't sure what happened with that one.

I like running tank.

This expansion has been a major let down. Stuck at 54 as a healer. Running around is pretty bad in the poorly designed maps and by the time I get flying unlocked it's already time to move on to the next area. Poor choice to gate everything, I don't remember Aht Urghan being this difficult to reach, in FFXI you could still level without having to do the story line. Was so excited when the expansion released, now I'm spending most of my time running the Camp Blue Fog Fates because old content is more rewarding (XP wise) than Heavensward gated community and walls to climb over. I really don't have much time to play like I used to but I'm just venting, every day I'm getting closer to just quitting.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

Or just the idea of having to dungeons inside a duty finder envoirment is so boring this WoW Instance feeling is so lame. It feels closed somehow you cant call your FC or LS friends to run to the dungeon and help you like it was in 1.0. Tanaka had a few smart ideas afterall.

---

Tanakas idea of dungeon content in XIV was Leves. Outside of Leves there was nothing to do in dungeons. Oh, and Behest every 30 minutes, if you was lucky enough to be one of the first 15 people who clicked on the NPC within the first 3 sec the moment he popped up (within the first 1 sec if it was during JP primetime).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by VargasVermillion

I like running tank.

---

or healer or DPS.

I suggest OP read this.

http://www.nickyee.com/daedalus/gateway_intro.html

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dualblade

Only the lower dungeons have had the 30 min plus consintently on the Aether server for DPS, and the fact that it was consitent even with the lull between major patch and xpac says a good bit about how it was spread at the time actually. As of now with both AST and especially DRK added que times seem to be a bit shorter, and end game DPS has usually been closer to 15-20 minutes prior to HW, a little shorter now.

Only seen a que take over 35 minutes in A.) PvP, and B.) This one really wierd time where a mostly preformed group for WoD I was in had to wait 3 hours...we still aren't sure what happened with that one.

---

Do not trust the queue times on the duty roulette. They lie. I've waited in queue for 30 minutes while it said wait times were under 5 minutes.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SendohJin

or healer or DPS.

---

It doesn't really matter what people do individually. As a collective, the frequency of tanks is far less than that of damage dealers. Queue times for tanks tend to be a couple of minutes at most, and many times instantaneous. Healers have a similar situation. Damage dealers do not, however.

Wait a second...
Hey op, you CAN do dungeons with 4 dps
But you need friends for that

my DPS queues have been nothing compared to before the expansion..
I mean I really dont mind the hour long queues. I can fish or mine or etc. while I wait. Recently though it's been like. maybe an average of six minutes.

I've always felt this complaint is really lame in a game like FFXIV. Maybe that was because I played a rogue for years in World of Warcraft, and was unable to queue as anything but DPS. Playing FFXIV, I was able to main a bard, while running a white mage in dungeons for fast queues and easy tomes. You can do everything on one character. You can use one class to support the growth of another class. The option is there, unlike in so many other games.

I don't claim the following as fact, but my perspective/thoughts on the topic.

You're never going to go to a happy balance where everyone has instant queues, because people largely like hitting things with big numbers more then they like healing or taking hits. NPCs are always going to be dumb to the point where they would have to dumb the dungeons down to an equal and accommodating level. Let's assume that the second point isn't the case, if they make an efficient NPC, people will be less inclined to play with real players in a so-called multiplayer game save for in content that bars this feature.

About the only place where I can think of this being helpful, is if people stopped running old content/dungeons, but the roulette system handles this well enough in my opinion. I'd disagree with it for current content, it's a multiplayer game, play with people and not robots. You can run a dungeon with all DPS though you aren't likely to get very far in most cases, and I don't imagine there is a big enough outcry of people wanting this to warrant an entire automated dungeon balancing system being implemented to accommodate when a non-standard party enters a dungeon.

My DPS ques have been between 0-12 minutes. Of course there is no que time for my tank as its instant.

The routlette system handles things well.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fenwick

I don't claim the following as fact, but my perspective/thoughts on the topic.

You're never going to go to a happy balance where everyone has instant queues, because people largely like hitting things with big numbers more then they like healing or taking hits. NPCs are always going to be dumb to the point where they would have to dumb the dungeons down to an equal and accommodating level. Let's assume that the second point isn't the case, if they make an efficient NPC, people will be less inclined to play with real players in a so-called multiplayer game save for in content that bars this feature.

---

I'm not so much interested in instant queue times, but rather the developers minimizing them. Wait times need to be reduced to a level where most can reasonably say they do not heavily cut into a player's play time. In my opinion, no one's wait time should be greater than 5 minutes during high time. I agree with the assumption that the number of roulette options are probably starting to divide up the community and adding to the queue times.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Gunspec

I've always felt this complaint is really lame in a game like FFXIV. Maybe that was because I played a rogue for years in World of Warcraft, and was unable to queue as anything but DPS. Playing FFXIV, I was able to main a bard, while running a white mage in dungeons for fast queues and easy tomes. You can do everything on one character. You can use one class to support the growth of another class. The option is there, unlike in so many other games.

---

I'm not sure how that is supposed to be a solution. If anything, that is more evident of the problem. I mean, its a solution in the sense that, yes, you can gear up a damage dealer, but if you can gear up a DD faster by not playing a DD in dungeons, that tends to suggest a serious problem.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fendred

It's well documented with over ten years of evidence that people do not want to run tanks and healers in the unholy trinity of MMORPGs.

---

Huh.....? Not sure if serious or just trolling, or just mad that DPS queue is longer

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Chihaya

Huh.....? Not sure if serious or just trolling, or just mad that DPS queue is longer

---

The problem has been around since Dungeon Finder was introduced to World Of Warcraft in 2009. Not to mention dozens of copy cat games that used the same exact tool. You tell me.

Edit: Also, the entire reason it was added was due to the long wait times people were experiencing, so the DD issue predates auto-grouping tools by many years.

You can alrdy do any dungeon/boss/raid with any class combinations (and any numbers less then full party as of 3.0) by using preformed parties.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fenwick

I don't claim the following as fact, but my perspective/thoughts on the topic.

You're never going to go to a happy balance where everyone has instant queues, because people largely like hitting things with big numbers more then they like healing or taking hits. NPCs are always going to be dumb to the point where they would have to dumb the dungeons down to an equal and accommodating level. Let's assume that the second point isn't the case, if they make an efficient NPC, people will be less inclined to play with real players in a so-called multiplayer game save for in content that bars this feature.

---

It's less about hitting things for big numbers (after all, tanks get to hit things constantly) and far more about lack of responsibility. When you queue as DPS you know you're basically just along for the ride. You try to do your best but you don't need to lead or make decisions or take any flak for making mistakes.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fendred

It's well documented with over ten years of evidence that people do not want to run tanks and healers in the unholy trinity of MMORPGs as much as damage dealers, and trying to buy tanks and healers with the roulette bonuses has had the same results as similar measures in other games. The fact is there will never be enough tanks and healers, so why not provide some other options for running dungeons? Maybe let people raise their retainers as tanks or healers? Or just let us go old school and maybe zerg the place with DPS. Please, anything but thirty minute to an hour queue times.

---

Just go as Warrior. Its tank, its heal, its dps.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fendred

It's well documented with over ten years of evidence that people do not want to run tanks and healers in the unholy trinity of MMORPGs as much as damage dealers.

---

You kidding? Healer for life, here ;p

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fendred

Please, anything but thirty minute to an hour queue times.

---

Pretty much the reason why I dislike playing DPS. That and the 2.5s GCD that makes me fall asleep.

I can understand your concern, but playing with bots is not the answer.