I know I make a bit of threads, however my mind changes a lot each time I play the class. I really do want to help the classes a lot, and I want DRK to be viable in high end raids as well as other things and be more comparable to the other tanks. Right now after playing for awhile, I notice that Dark Arts has a lot of issues and i'm constantly running OOM. Here are some of my new suggestions for DRK.
People will say Dark Arts is a high skill move, but it is too much. I have to literally macro almost every ability to make it work, and it still has problems. No temporary ability should rely on another ability just to make it good besides combo ones, that isn't a good design.
Turning Dark Arts into a life-tap move that provides the same effect as the regular one is also a skillful design, you can't always have dark arts up like before, but it turns into a powerful sustain move.
Darkside:
Remove the Aura, period.
Dark Arts:
Converts 33% of all damage dealt into HP.
Nullifies the damage penalty inflicted by Grit.
Duration: 10.00s
Recast: 10.00s
Add an aura like the Dark Knight was seen in trailers, where his body turned black with black flames, however this effect is only tied to the duration of Dark Arts which you cannot spam.
Dark Dance:
For a short duration, the Dark Knight is protected against area effect abilities that do not directly target them.
Duration: 15.00s
Recast: 60.00s second recast.
No longer requires Dark Arts. Too clunky.
Carve and Spit:
Delivers a threefold attack with the potency of X, restores mana when under the effects of Darkside.
Recast: 30.00s
No longer requires Dark Arts. Too clunky.
Souleater:
Delivers an attack with a potency of 100.
Combo Action: Syphon Strike
Combo Potency: X
Absorbs 50%-100% of damage dealt as HP.
No longer requires Dark Arts. No longer requires grit for health restore.
Blood Weapon:
Increases attack speed by 10% and converts physical damage dealt into MP.
Recast: 40.00s
Duration: 15.00s
Instant Cast time.
Grit penalty removed.
Reprisal:
Delivers an attack with a potency of X.
Additional Effect: Lower's target's damage dealt by 10%.
Duration: 20.00s
Recast: 15.00s
Salted Earth:
No longer can be cast outwards, puts it under your feet instead.
Radius increased to 7y. To make up for this.
Duration: 21.00s
Recast: 45.00s
Effect decreased, no longer a circle. Only creates blight on the ground.
This ability is too clunky to use as a tank.
Shadow Wall:
Reduces damage taken by 30%.
Duration: 10.00s
Recast: 120.00s
Dark Passenger:
Deals unaspected damage with a potency of X to all enemies in a straight line before you.
Additional Effect: Lower's target's damage dealt by 5%.
Duration: 20.00s
Recast: 30.00s
Can only be used with Darkside. No longer requires Dark Arts
Power Slash:
Delivers an attack with a potency of 100.
Combo Action: Spinning Slash
Combo Potency: X
Additional Effect: Increased Enmity.
No longer requires Dark Arts
Dark Mind:
Reduces damage of attacks by 30% for attacks that deal more then 15% of your total life.
Triggers: 3.0
Duration: 30.00s
Recast: 60.00s
No longer requires Dark Arts
Delirium:
Delivers an attack with a potency of 100.
Combo Action: Syphon Strike
Combo Potency: X
Combo Bonus: Increases the targets vulnerability to magic damage by 10%.
Duration: 20.00s
As you can see, I removed the sacrifice stuff. I also changed the way Dark Arts works to be a life-tap buff.
DRK 2.0 Suggestion Revamp: More Ideas
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06-30-2015, 03:25 AMNektulos-TuorDRK 2.0 Suggestion Revamp: More Ideas
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06-30-2015, 02:07 PMVrmillion
Why would you want to change Dark Arts? That's like the only thing that makes Dark Knights cool and interesting right now.
Based on what you said about Dark Arts, namely that you need macros to use it and that you run OOM too much, it just sounds like you're not using it correctly. -
06-30-2015, 02:09 PMGarry
Why are there 3 of these post...
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06-30-2015, 02:31 PMNektulos-TuorIdeas are very different is why.Quote:
Originally Posted by Garry
Who is your 60 DRK? I dislike being told such things constantly by people who don't play. Dark Arts is completely different at 60 then it is at 30-40. You do run OOM a lot, and you need your Darkside.Quote:
Originally Posted by Vrmillion
Not that i'm saying your wrong, or bad. I just don't understand your feedback very well. I experienced ease leveling up the class, but as I got to 60 it gets a lot harder to manage all of that. It ends up not working because you cannot use it all, so there is no point to use a lot of Dark Art abilities. -
06-30-2015, 02:34 PMFaytte
Your suggestion for soul eater is that it hits as hard as royal authority AND gives you back health.
Just checking...
Basically you want to take all the complexity out of the class, while retaining the majority of the damage buffs you have BECAUSE your not meant to have infinite dark arts on.
Oh yeah you gave power slash an extra 40 potency, just cause?
This is the biggest joke of a post I've seen today. -
06-30-2015, 02:36 PMNektulos-TuorI don't see how macroing all your skills is complex. That is what it comes right down to, there isn't much complexity to it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Faytte
/macroicon "Dark Dance"
/ac "Dark Arts"
/ac "Dark Arts"
/pause 0.5
/ac "Dark Dance"
/ac "Dark Dance"
/pause 0.5
/ac "Dark Dance"
Just to make sure it works, not complex at all.
Also, different classes different skills. Paladin temp is currently a lot better. These are just ideas and suggestions to the skills. I don't expect many to get taken. -
06-30-2015, 02:44 PMKitelessWe actually agree for once... I'm pretty shocked.Quote:
Originally Posted by Faytte
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06-30-2015, 02:46 PMVrmillionDRK is my only level 60, and I'm full i180 on it. You don't need to use Dark Arts for every applicable skill. DRK is about managing MP. Not using it all the time, not holding onto it all the time, but a middle ground. You use it when you can afford it, and when you can't, you don't.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nektulos-Tuor
There's a use for every Dark Arts version of skills. Power Slash is for grabbing tons of hate, Souleater is for damage and sustain, Carve and Spit is for high damage, Dark Dance is for mitigation, Dark Mind is for magic mitigation, Dark Passenger is for aoe damage and blind, Abyssal Drain is for aoe sustain. If you aren't using Dark Arts for these specific reasons, you shouldn't be using Dark Arts. Even then, you don't need to spam it repeatedly. You'll live if you pass up on Dark Arts for a combo or two, I promise.
Bottom line: if you're running OOM, then you're doing it wrong. You should never run OOM. -
06-30-2015, 02:50 PMFaytte
Knowing when and how to use it is part of your class. Dumbing it down to a simple mini unleash (something warriors have a HUGE cooldown for) + adding 33% life steal is insane. Secondly macros are not the optimum way to play as anyone is going to tell you--they are never as fast as direct keyboard input (unlike say, WOW or RIFT which have no added macro lag, FFXIV has that built in--check any dozen of forum posts on that).
Almost all of your ideas are horribly OP(as they are presented as a whole, and have no draw backs). Most DRK have to prepare for the mana to dark art + Dark mind, given its a mere 60 second cd. Dark Passenger(OFF GCD/AOE) similary gains a damage buff cause of its IMMENSE mana draw, but you get rid of it, make it 200 potency and take on 1/2 of a storms path, so suddenly with reprisal as a tank you have 2 ogcd attacks to get -15% taken damage, when warriors have to use a full a skill chain for 10?).
Suggestions are horribly op--can't be taken seriously -
06-30-2015, 02:53 PMFaytte^Quote:
Originally Posted by Vrmillion
Basically this. When you add dark arts, DRK get a BETTER version of many powers vs other classes. You get a 400 potency 100% health stealing ability you can spam every 6 seconds, or a 300 potency attack with DOUBLE added increased emnity (so straight up much better than butchers block). The cost here is some of your powers ARNT as good with dark arts, and some are just fine--the skill is knowing when and where to apply the ability.
DRK is not meant for starting players, which is why it requires level 50 in another class, but sadly I think it draws many DPS who do not understand 1) other tank classes 2) tanking and are not prepared for 3) mana management. Why do you think they make darkside drain mana and prevent other classes from giving you mana back? Because THAT is the complexity of the class. -
06-30-2015, 02:55 PMFaytteI'm actually very agreeable. ^_^Quote:
Originally Posted by Kiteless
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06-30-2015, 03:01 PMKitelessAs much as I'll say that DRK has resource management problems, my sentiments are pretty similar. There are times where DRK's MP management skills can crap the bed, but what OP is suggesting is asking for way too much while taking away any actual sophistication that would actually attract tank players from other jobs.Quote:
Originally Posted by Vrmillion
Any changes to DRK should be made with the mindset of preserving a high skill ceiling while also improving overall value. -
06-30-2015, 03:02 PMNektulos-TuorKind of makes you just not want to bring a Bard or MCH instead. However you have a point. They are just ideas and suggestions though, you don't need to take the numbers so seriously. I could put X potency in them. It wouldn't make a difference.Quote:
Originally Posted by Faytte
I don't think devaluing Bards, Machinists is a good mechanic. I don't know why people like it.
There, all of them are damage X now. They are just ideas. -
06-30-2015, 03:09 PMMook_Mook
Too drastic of changes, most concept of dark are fine they just need some more oomph.
With salted earth add a debuff or make dark knight gain mp when standing in the circle.
Plunge its just 200 potency on 30 second cool down, if had a small 5% -10% attack speed debuff that applied to boss mobs might be better might need to increase the recast time
Dark passenger too weak for potency increase potency or decrease mana cost
Delerium add in magic resist down small amount nothing major but reason enough to use it.
unleashed needs to be different from abyssal drain. -
06-30-2015, 03:12 PMVrmillionMost of the problem is that your ideas themselves are flawed. I could go down the list if you really wanted me to, but your ideas eitherQuote:
Originally Posted by Nektulos-Tuor
1) Make the class ezbabymode to play (everything you have to say about Dark Arts changes, Blood Weapon)
2) Make the skill needlessly complicated (Dark Mind)
3) Are changing skills that you claim are clunky but are actually just fine and feel great to use (Salted Earth, and seriously Dark Arts is one of the least clunky skills in the game. It's so easy to use.)
4) Give straight up huge, unnecessary buffs to things that are already really good (Carve and Spit)
There are also a couple of skill changes that just don't make any sense at all, like Dark Passenger. There's no reason for this to be changed on either end. Its effect is currently fine, and your proposed effect is something we don't need. Dark Dance is another one.
The only changes I agree with are Delirium and Reprisal's cooldown, and both of those things I've already seen in other threads, suggested by other people. -
06-30-2015, 03:35 PMKiteless
For what it's worth, I would agree that DRK needs to lose the evasion on Dark Dance and the Blind on Dark Passenger. Damage avoidance effects don't really mesh well with DRK's other abilities at all, what with them being fueled by you actually getting hit. Not to mention Dark Passenger's blind doesn't really effect much of value anyway. OP's suggestion for Dark Dance still is ridiculous on several levels, but what he suggests for Dark Passenger isn't entirely terrible. Granted, I'd also be happy to take a complete removal of blind if it meant a lower MP cost too, if that damage reduction seemed a bit much.