Vote Abandon needs to be adjusted

people who vote "no" to abandon duty should be allowed to stay, just let the yes voters leave and let the others reform the party if they want.

it's so annoying in some long dungeon/raid like CT/ST/WoD when ppl abandon it just because they can't beat the last boss. they want to leave without getting punished but the people who voted no have to redo the whole raid from the beginning. it sucks.

While I would agree with you 90% of the time, I've know situations where a group really SHOULD quit, but one drunk guy really wants to waste everyone's time. I've entered dungeons in progress where none of the bosses were dead, there were only a few minutes remaining (but not so few that replacements were halted) the only guy there was clearly messing around. Three people arrive in dungeon, and that fourth guy just can't keep his act together.

It REALLY sucks after waiting 40 minutes for a dps queue, just to walk into one of those situations. I queue in progress because I want to help, but sometimes there just isn't any way to help but to pull the plug.

It takes a long time to look for a tank or a healer if they have left the party, so even if you were allowed to stay you might end up with bugger all time to complete the duty.

It is annoying sometimes, but waiting in duty for a role can take forever and it also requires people to search for "in progress" too. Not a lot of people search in progress, you can't search for in progress when you are in a party so that is why I personally don't have it checked.

I'm not sure that adjustment is a good idea. It would be annoying to have to wait for half or more of your party to be refilled and I feel for the unlucky people in DF that end up in your instance only to wait around for 20 min before vote abandoning again because the party wont fill.

soo just give everyone a free way out with no penalty? yeaaa that will fix the problem.

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Originally Posted by Chiramu

It takes a long time to look for a tank or a healer if they have left the party, so even if you were allowed to stay you might end up with bugger all time to complete the duty.

It is annoying sometimes, but waiting in duty for a role can take forever and it also requires people to search for "in progress" too. Not a lot of people search in progress, you can't search for in progress when you are in a party so that is why I personally don't have it checked.

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You know what I DON'T understand, is why we still can't change roles in dungeon. If we are waiting for a tank, and I have ilevel 130 warrior gear in my bags, then why do I have to stand there for 15 minutes with a bow in my hands like an idiot?

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Originally Posted by Evangela

people who vote "no" to abandon duty should be allowed to stay, just let the yes voters leave and let the others reform the party if they want.

it's so annoying in some long dungeon/raid like CT/ST/WoD when ppl abandon it just because they can't beat the last boss. they want to leave without getting punished but the people who voted no have to redo the whole raid from the beginning. it sucks.

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So you just want a way out instead of sticking to it without eating the timer.

You do realize that when people leave a dungeon that the remaining members are pretty much screwed, right?

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Originally Posted by Gunspec

You know what I DON'T understand, is why we still can't change roles in dungeon. If we are waiting for a tank, and I have ilevel 130 warrior gear in my bags, then why do I have to stand there for 15 minutes with a bow in my hands like an idiot?

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Because everyone else would abuse it; last minute swapping to ninja the loot, drama over who can stay and who gets booted based on what classes everyone has, etc. In fact, I'd bet no one would be willing to do anything unless people in the party have multiple roles under their belt.

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Originally Posted by MilesSaintboroguh

Because everyone else would abuse it; last minute swapping to ninja the loot, drama over who can stay and who gets booted based on what classes everyone has, etc. In fact, I'd bet no one would be willing to do anything unless people in the party have multiple roles under their belt.

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There are very easy ways to counter that, hell all they would have to do is add the same restrictions to switching classes that they do to booting someone. If in combat, or if there is loot in the pool, you can't switch classes. Boom, problem solved.

As for the multiple classes or boot, the other players in the group would still have to agree to kick the person.

And honestly, it's ridiculous in a game where you can level all classes on one character that they restrict you to one class for ANY content. (Except class/job quests for obvious reasons.)

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Originally Posted by Kiroh

And honestly, it's ridiculous in a game where you can level all classes on one character that they restrict you to one class for ANY content. (Except class/job quests for obvious reasons.)

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Thank 1.0 for that. No, really. Late in 1.# when end game groups ran dungeons they required you be able to switch to specific classes to front-load bosses (there were no locks on switching classes save if you were under aggro) or they would remove you from the party, which then had the same effect as Vote Kick if you were in a dungeon. It forced people into leveling classes they probably didn't want to (I only have 7 classes at 50, one just for getting a retainer to 50) just so they could be 'viable' in endgame.

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Originally Posted by Chiramu

It is annoying sometimes, but waiting in duty for a role can take forever and it also requires people to search for "in progress" too. Not a lot of people search in progress, you can't search for in progress when you are in a party so that is why I personally don't have it checked.

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I always have in progress checked, aside from farming gear, dunno why you wouldn't /shrug

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Originally Posted by Gralna

I always have in progress checked, aside from farming gear, dunno why you wouldn't /shrug

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There is a bit of a reason to not do it, especially as a DPS.

If you end up getting put into a failed/doomed party as a DPS after waiting a while in queue, you pretty much wasted your time waiting and have to go to the back of the line again for nothing. It's a risk that may or may not pay off.

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Originally Posted by Gralna

I always have in progress checked, aside from farming gear, dunno why you wouldn't /shrug

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I never queue in progress for dungeons/trials. Way too much chance of getting stuck in a failgroup. The previous person must have ragequit or been kicked for some reason, so you're rolling the dice on whether it's worth the effort. Plus DF likes to troll you sometimes and stick you in things like a half-empty DD where people have already killed all the mobs for quick XP, then re-queued and quit.

As a DPS, I don't want to waste a half-hour queue on the chance of getting stuck in a failgroup that the previous DPS quit for good reasons. And as a tank I get virtually instant queues anyway so why would I queue in progress, plus the failgroup chance is much higher if the previous tank had enough of them.

The only time I ever queue in progress is when I'm doing WOD and I don't need anything from the first couple of bosses. All the rest of the time in CT there's stuff I still want (even if it's just for glamour) from other bosses.

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Originally Posted by Gunspec

You know what I DON'T understand, is why we still can't change roles in dungeon. If we are waiting for a tank, and I have ilevel 130 warrior gear in my bags, then why do I have to stand there for 15 minutes with a bow in my hands like an idiot?

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to ecourage u next time, not to slack of, and use ur tank more often to help the quques ;) it's actualy smart.

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Originally Posted by JimboTCB

I never queue in progress for dungeons/trials. Way too much chance of getting stuck in a failgroup.

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that's because u dont know how to turn the tides, patience and guidance can help a long way.

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Originally Posted by Gunspec

You know what I DON'T understand, is why we still can't change roles in dungeon. If we are waiting for a tank, and I have ilevel 130 warrior gear in my bags, then why do I have to stand there for 15 minutes with a bow in my hands like an idiot?

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A few times when the tank bailed for some reason or another, Ive left, switched to tank, rejoined in progress and been put in the same party.

But about your idea, I called it ages ago. Where if all roles are filled you cannot change jobs, but if a tank or healer is missing, you can switch to them with a party vote.

This is a big irk of mine as well.

As for the people saying "but then you'd be left with a party with a ton of slots left to fill and that's just a waste of time" -- dude, it's already like that even without vote abandon sometimes, due to peoples' tendency to leave when they see someone else leave. Might not happen so much in CT but sure as hell happens a lot in 4/8 man content.

That would make leaving normally (with its 30 minute penalty) pointless. Call a vote, vote yes, leave, get another party immediately.

This wouldnt work cause then people can just innitiate a vote abandon and be allowed to leave the dungeon without penalty.

The worst is the people who want to be kicked but the rest of the party just wanna carry on with the fight. But when they don't get kicked they refuse to join in and sit afk at spawn. Something seriously needs to be done about these guys

I think vote dismiss should be allowed during battle. I had one time doing Ultima where a healer and tank wanted to do it just the 2 of them. So as soon as it started (after a 45 minute queue as Bard), the healer just let everyone die while the tank fought Ultima alone, with the healer somehow keeping them both alive. After 15 minutes or so Ultima was down to maybe 85% HP with people dropping non stop. I tried to vote dismiss but it would say you can't during battle. When we would complain about what they were doing they both would reply "This is a lesson. Watch and learn." or comment about how we just need to sit back and watch them and learn how to play the game properly. I was so mad because it was 12:30am by now and I wasted so much time so finally had to drop.

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Originally Posted by 416to305

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And watch groups kick people just before the boss dies, no thank you.

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Originally Posted by 416to305

I think vote dismiss should be allowed during battle.

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Originally Posted by Devils_Lawyer

And watch groups kick people just before the boss dies, no thank you.

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Something else that happened a lot in 1.0 because being kicked from a party resulted in something not unlike Vote Kick.

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This wouldnt work cause then people can just innitiate a vote abandon and be allowed to leave the dungeon without penalty.

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I don't think the OP is suggesting that anyone who selects abandon is allowed to leave. It would still need a majority vote to pass.

The only change being suggested is that the people who don't select Yes don't get ejected from their instance.

Eh, maybe with some caveats this could work. If 'vote abandon' goes through then those who declined are then given the option to stay and refill ranks or leave with the majority, perhaps? In a CT raid the ranks refill quickly and more likely than not you'll end up with people who can beat the instance even if you couldn't do it with the members who left. They definitely should not allow a vote abandon to remove players unless the majority voted to leave.

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Originally Posted by MilesSaintboroguh

Because everyone else would abuse it; last minute swapping to ninja the loot, drama over who can stay and who gets booted based on what classes everyone has, etc. In fact, I'd bet no one would be willing to do anything unless people in the party have multiple roles under their belt.

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Yeah, sorry Gunspec, good idea in theory, but the above is exactly how things would play out.

For the reference: I do not believe OP is saying that 110% of the time when you Initiate Vote Abaondon, to kick out ONLY those who initiated it / voted yes.

Rather, I believe they are saying they want the option that if a majority votes yes that those who voted "No" should be allowed to stay. Right now, you are kicked out regardless of your vote depending on what the majority vote on. It kinda sucks when you know you're doing fine and know that some fresh blood would really help out (Basically, allowing those quitters to quit.)