Now that it is "old content", could we get a nerf on Titan EX? (lag woes)

The increased drop rate on the ponies is cool and all, and I also like the quest for the Kirin mount, but as of now I cannot, for the life of me, get through Titan Extreme. I know the mechanics, the patterns, everything I need. I've tried both in DF and in pre-made parties, but the issue is still the same: the response from my connection is too slow, and eventually a plume or landslide will get me.

I can have all the best reflexes in the world (and again, a videogame shouldn't even require that much constrain, not everyone is an air pilot), but if my connection is too slow to move my character, I will still get stuck.

So please, now that its rewards are not game-breaking or super powerful, could we have some tweaks on the EX primals, so that I can have a day without getting flamed on by my party because of my lag (apparently, lag issues do not exist. It's all excuses.)?

Sincerely, from a very stressed Italian player with her server on the other side of the world.

EDIT: Okay, I think the point of everyone's opinions has been pretty much made. I appreciate those who showed sympathy, as much as those who gave helpful advice. I feel happy for those who have no latency issue and can have this fight proceed smoothly even from Europe. However, I do not enjoy insults and non-constructive criticize as much as I do not enjoy receiving them in Duty, so I think I will stop looking at this thread as I fear it's going to turn into a nest of venomous comebacks that I'd rather be not a part of. If people have been hurt by my suggest again I apologize as much as I did in a previous post.

I hope everyone has a good day, and I hope that I will not make so many players upset at me in future content.

Plot twist. TC really does just suck at dodging.

lol, Everything Titan is laggy. I think SE would have to redo ALL the Titans fights to help laggy players pass them. I have lag issues with Levi Ex, but I'm not going to ask for it to be nerfed at this point. Titan may always be laggy ,I dont think its going to change.....

You on PC, PS 3 or PS 4???

when I passed Titan Ex, it took me basically 500+ log into Titan Ex to pass it, I had to learn the fight by heart and anticipate by 1/2 sec (which is what my lag was) anything which means I had to move before anything was even showing on my screen/bar or I would die each time. Back then when people like me were saying we were lagging bad, we were met with hate and insults. I dont think they will nerf it as you ask although I wished it was the case, I would suggest that you learn that fight by heart, after a while it becomes a second nature though and with a good group you will pass it without too much problems. I know is silly but not much else to do.

Good luck with your request and sincerely hope somethign will be done

Mei

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Originally Posted by FranSeara

lol, Everything Titan is laggy. I think SE would have to redo ALL the Titans fights to help laggy players pass them. I have lag issues with Levi Ex, but I'm going to ask for it to be nerfed at this point. Titan may always be laggy ,I dont think its going to change.....

You on PC, PS 3 or PS 4???

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PC^^; I've done all HMs and also Garuda EX (and Levi/Moogle story mode), and can't say I've ever had the same issues I've had on Titan. Hell, Twintania was a piece of cake in comparison.

While I also don't like fighting systems that test your connection as much as if not more than skill... there is one practical solution that's been mentioned.

Titan's rotation is fixed. (Most fights in the game are like this, actually). It's possible to anticipate and start moving before Weights or Landslide come out. I do this even though my connection is good enough not to require it--it comes naturally with enough practice. There are guides that break down his exact rotation, but even just a good friend on teamspeak can tell you what's coming next. Also, your side-profile thing says you're maining BLM... if that's accurate, don't forget about sprint. For us mages, it's free.

Also I see you're on Balmung... I'm running with my static over the next few days but this weekend I could try to help you clear titan EX, maybe get a few friends to help too.

Anyways, good luck!

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Originally Posted by Risvertasashi

Titan's rotation is fixed. (Most fights in the game are like this, actually). It's possible to anticipate and start moving before Weights or Landslide come out.

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It works with plumes, but good luck on landslide with that. There's a decent chance that your preemptive dodging puts you over the edge.

The way I always handled landslide with lag was to get in the middle of him, so it's 2 steps to dodge whatever direction it goes.

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Originally Posted by Risvertasashi

It's possible to anticipate and start moving before Weights or Landslide come out. Also, your side-profile thing says you're maining BLM... if that's accurate, don't forget about sprint. For us mages, it's free.

Also I see you're on Balmung... I'm running with my static over the next few days but this weekend I could try to help you clear titan EX, maybe get a few friends to help too.

Anyways, good luck!

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Thanks for the offer, maybe I'll look you up! I'm main BLM yes, but I've given up on trying this as BLM since I couldn't cast anything. I'm now trying this as NIN, see if the movement speed helps me. And yes, moving forward ahead helps, but the thing is, it's the connection that handles the character's position. If I move away from the AoE that is to come but my connection thinks my character is still there, I'll still get hit. It's why I keep dying.

It's one of the most mechanically simple endgame fights, so it would be difficult to nerf without completely redesigning it into a different kind of challenge that is about complicated mechanics instead of reactionary dodging. If they just slowed it way down or made the attacks weak enough that you don't need to move, then you wouldn't be doing anything. I play from europe and there is rarely ever enough latency to make dodging a challenge, so I suspect people who view Titan as more difficult than other battles are using a computer with low framerate. Try reducing the graphics settings to give yourself a more consistent and faster refresh rate so you can see when it's time to move before it's too late.

I've somewhat recently done a Titan EX where a DPS died before the heart phase by falling off, and another fell off after heart phase and we still managed to beat it.

It's unfortunate that you can't dodge it, but there's not really anything they can do to nerf it even more then it already is from the much better gear and the echo buff that's available without completely redesigning the fight and turning it into something else entirely.

You could also tank it. You don't need AS much reaction timing if you're tanking it, as 1/2 the time you're not even dodging landslides.

Another solution to landslides at least is what someone else said, and stay inside his hitbox, just far enough in to where a plume won't hit the tank. Then if he turns around, you don't have a lot of space to move to get behind him and the landslides won't hit you.

It's really hard to nerf this fight the way you want. Everything comes at set tumes; you need to figure out when you need to move to compensate for your lag. Everyone has to do it; some people are just better at compensating than others. It's also really good practice for blackfire in t12...

Besides, solo tank and solo heal titan exs are fun; I actually have to work when tanking...

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Originally Posted by PArcher

It's really hard to nerf this fight the way you want.

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I didn't really specific "how" I want them to nerf. Personally I was thinking just to make the AoE attacks 1 second slower to cast.

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Originally Posted by Bluevann

I didn't really specific "how" I want them to nerf. Personally I was thinking just to make the AoE attacks 1 second slower to cast.

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Even that will change the fight drastically. If they were cerberus's tail slap cast time, I'll agree, but titans attacks are I feel the "standard" cast time. The fact that it's so exact in when they're cast means anticipation and pre dodging is extremely easy.

Edit: also, my Internet is pretty bad (no one knows how I can play anything online). And I cleared the fight on ps3 many times, so I do know the lag. You have to adapt to it

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Originally Posted by PArcher

Even that will change the fight drastically. If they were cerberus's tail slap cast time, I'll agree, but titans attacks are I feel the "standard" cast time. The fact that it's so exact in when they're cast means anticipation and pre dodging is extremely easy.

Edit: also, my Internet is pretty bad (no one knows how I can play anything online). And I cleared the fight on ps3 many times, so I do know the lag. You have to adapt to it

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You're right, I need to adapt and I still am trying to (as much as I do not think a game should be built around having to lose a fight 50 times before it can be won); I suppose I would be more encouraged if I didn't get all the negative reactions from my team mates every time it happens (or happens to someone else). Of course it's impossible to change the community, so perhaps I wondered if the solution would be to adjust the content so that there'll be less insults flying on a regular basis?

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Originally Posted by Lethallin

I've somewhat recently done a Titan EX where a DPS died before the heart phase by falling off, and another fell off after heart phase and we still managed to beat it.

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Actually that was the same experience for me last time I saw a success. Essentially cleared with only 2 DPS, so there is some room for error. But that only works when other people are strong enough to compensate and break the gaols in time. It will keep getting easier to compensate for more mistakes unless an item level sync is introduced.

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Originally Posted by PArcher

Besides, solo tank and solo heal titan exs are fun; I actually have to work when tanking...

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We did a 4man titan ex over the weekend, it was super fun!

Got it with 10% echo but this weekend we're gonna try again without the echo. We would have done it with 5% echo but our tank ate a landslide.....and he didn't even touch the adds. I tanked one, DRG tanked other, and WHM Cure 3 FTW!

While connection lag is one source of problems for people, there's one thing people should keep in mind if they play on TV (HD or UHD)... Input lag.
I was looking at a nice UHD TV the other day... And was considering buying it... Until I learned that the input lag on it was as high as 120ms.
Input lag in this case being the time between the TV receives a frame and the TV actually displays the frame.

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Originally Posted by Bluevann

You're right, I need to adapt and I still am trying to (as much as I do not think a game should be built around having to lose a fight 50 times before it can be won); I suppose I would be more encouraged if I didn't get all the negative reactions from my team mates every time it happens (or happens to someone else). Of course it's impossible to change the community, so perhaps I wondered if the solution would be to adjust the content so that there'll be less insults flying on a regular basis?

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You bring up good issues. As a matter of principle, yes, I do not think fights should depend so much on latency, and the community problems you mention...

It's not fair to hold those with laggy connections to the much higher standard of having to anticipate everything a half second or so earlier, where 1 mistake=death... but as a pragmatic matter, it's the way to get the fight done. Now for hurling insults... How is your FC? A good FC (or even LSs!) will be a lot more civil than DF groups. The hard part can just be finding those people. If you're not in an FC or don't have particular ties to your current one... I recommend trying to find one that focuses on helping people.

This is a little bit tricky as many will claim to do this, but far fewer actually act on it. Still, it really changes the game experience; I think it's a worthwhile search.

Download and use Pingzapper or WTfast, both of these will remove the latency issues your having. I have friends who play from new zealand, Australia and other countries, before using them they had tons of issues, now with these programs, they dodge like the rest of us.

If these don't work for you, i have some bad news, you simply can not dodge

Just tried it yesterday for the very first time!

500+ Ping with WTFast! WOOO~♪

My advice, dont try it with a 2MB downstream connection while someone is watching netflix :¬|

Well, right now I've fixed my dodging issues by going as NIN (Fleet of Foot). Now it's all about finding a party that has no latency issues as I do.

Still, I hope that SE, if not address this, will at least not make this mistake again and do more content that requires uber connections.

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Originally Posted by Arkenne

Just tried it yesterday for the very first time!

500+ Ping with WTFast! WOOO~♪

My advice, dont try it with a 2MB downstream connection while someone is watching netflix :¬|

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I hope you realize that the lower the ping, the better it is, right? Having 500+ ping is so depressingly bad it would be like the game was being DDOS'd.

There is no reason to DO Titan Ex anymore except for fun, and it is FUN right now because it is so unforgiving.

And this is coming from someone who routinely has connection issues. Don't kill the fun. :/

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Originally Posted by Mandze

There is no reason to DO Titan Ex anymore except for fun, and it is FUN right now because it is so unforgiving.

And this is coming from someone who routinely has connection issues. Don't kill the fun. :/

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People still do it for the achievement, materials, pony, and equipment.

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Originally Posted by SekhmetM

I hope you realize that the lower the ping, the better it is, right? Having 500+ ping is so depressingly bad it would be like the game was being DDOS'd.

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Yes I know, learned my lesson, not doing that again =-=;;

if you ever see a person asking a healer for a Res, in that one you could find me asking the healer to just ignore me...

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Originally Posted by Mandze

There is no reason to DO Titan Ex anymore except for fun, and it is FUN right now because it is so unforgiving.

And this is coming from someone who routinely has connection issues. Don't kill the fun. :/

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I don't know, I don't have particular fun at being insulted and emoted slaps or disgust because I didn't exit a plume in time...

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Originally Posted by Nekodar

While connection lag is one source of problems for people, there's one thing people should keep in mind if they play on TV (HD or UHD)... Input lag.
I was looking at a nice UHD TV the other day... And was considering buying it... Until I learned that the input lag on it was as high as 120ms.
Input lag in this case being the time between the TV receives a frame and the TV actually displays the frame.

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A THOUSAND times this. Everyone goes on and on about the laggy servers, connections, etc. etc. With many of the newer TV's, input lag is a surprising culprit. I went from a terribad 80ms Panny to 23ms Sony and my first reaction (I kid you not) was "did they nerf Titan EX"? I had been beating it consistently before, but now it was like my character had a rocket pack on. Obviously not moving faster, but in and out of plumes and LS's with so much ease.

I was getting worried, I hadn't seen a plz nerf thread in a while. And for titan ex none the less!

I'm not the only one to mention this but the fight is scripted, that means you should know what's coming. If you're a blm you can put sprint on your hotbar, pop sprint for plumes and landslides. I hope this helps. No more nerfs, it's not necessary.

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Originally Posted by Bluevann

I don't know, I don't have particular fun at being insulted and emoted slaps or disgust because I didn't exit a plume in time...

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Gamers and MMO gamers in particular, as a whole... yes, the communities aren't exactly the pride of humanity. As I read more of your posts, I recommend, before anything else, that you find a good group of people to FFXIV with.

If you want a better community as a whole... honestly I wouldn't know what to suggest besides joining an RL club. For whatever reason we might speculate, gaming communities just bring out the worst in a lot of people.

So because you're experiencing lag, you want an already easy fight nerfed? Lol

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Originally Posted by Niasha

So because you're experiencing lag, you want an already easy fight nerfed? Lol

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It's not because I am experiencing lag that I want a fight nerfed. It's because I am sad of upsetting people. I always try my very best to be polite and never make anyone angry in any situation, and I guess I just feel powerless before this. I cannot do anything more than this to try not make my party members upset.

I experience the same lag. On my screen, I can run out of a plume, be out of the plume, be ahead of the guy behind me running out of the plume, the guy behind me still in the plume, and yet I get hit and the one behind me still in the plume (on my screen) doesn't. So I don't even bother trying Titan Extreme.

And it seems like there are some AOEs that are just unavoidable for me.

Coil 1 Turn 1. First boss, tanking the adds in the back of the room. First orb spawn, does AOE, dodge easy. But, ALWAYS, ALWAYS the SECOND one that the FIRST orb does, it does a VERY fast pulse and there is no avoiding it. The first AOE, the third, fourth, the AOEs from the Second orb, or if a Third ever does spawn, all avoidable. Just the first orb, second AOE, it does like a strobe light pulse instead of ground AOE, cast bar, etc.

Same thing with Brayflox. Before the second boss, those 4 mobs right outside. The one lizard that does a circle AOE centered on it (jump attack?) does the strobe light pulse things. ALL other mobs, ALL other AOEs in that entire dungeon do not do that. Just that one mob, that one attack.

So why is it for me only very specific mobs and very specific attacks (and like Turn 1, ONLY the second AOE, not the first, or third +) I have either lag in getting out, or the AOE is just a strobe light pulse with zero chance of getting out of?

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Originally Posted by Mykll

So why is it for me only very specific mobs and very specific attacks (and like Turn 1, ONLY the second AOE, not the first, or third +) I have either lag in getting out, or the AOE is just a strobe light pulse with zero chance of getting out of?

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I don't run Brayflox NM very often, or remember any type of lizard mob in HM version before the 2nd boss....

But that AOE you are talking about in Turn 1 from the ADS is unavoidable for everyone, not just you. It is supposed to be silenced, but if you only have one person who is willing to silence in your party, that move is cast a second time before a Bard's Blunt Arrow is off GCD again so a single Bard would only be able to ever silence every other AOE. PLD, NIN and SCH fairy Selene are all capable of silencing this move, but not all of them will. NIN might be in the wrong poison, PLD animation lock is pretty awful for Spirits, and Selene AI only recently got fixed for her to handle this on her own.

You could just ask for a carry one person dying isn't a big deal.

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Originally Posted by RayneBoemir

You could just ask for a carry one person dying isn't a big deal.

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On my particular case, I am just not supportive of merc system, but that's me. Even so, I think content that is discriminating on people's machines/connection (see hunts for PS3) should be reviewed.

sounds like less an issue of being too hard and more an issue of italy's internet being crummy, should be fine when they finally move the datacenters to europe though for heavensward

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Originally Posted by JayCommon

I don't run Brayflox NM very often, or remember any type of lizard mob in HM version before the 2nd boss....

But that AOE you are talking about in Turn 1 from the ADS is unavoidable for everyone, not just you. It is supposed to be silenced, but if you only have one person who is willing to silence in your party, that move is cast a second time before a Bard's Blunt Arrow is off GCD again so a single Bard would only be able to ever silence every other AOE. PLD, NIN and SCH fairy Selene are all capable of silencing this move, but not all of them will. NIN might be in the wrong poison, PLD animation lock is pretty awful for Spirits, and Selene AI only recently got fixed for her to handle this on her own.

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I was speaking of NM. That big room where most parties hug left wall and clear, and there are those alcoves whatever, 2 of them, with treasure chest. Right before you enter the lizard boss, where when it is almost dead the last name dragon jumps down on you. There is the lizard guy, I think a frog, and a pugil or two something like that, right before that boss.

I am not talking about the AOE from ADS. I am talking about the AOEs from the adds that spawn in the back of the room (the entrance exactly, whether people call that the front or back of the room....) where usually the second tank hangs back solely to keep those "little ADS" guys busy. First one spawns, does his little AOE, dodge easy. Second time the first one that spawns does it, strobe light. Third AOE, it is a normal dodgeable one. As are all the ones of the second little orb that spawn, and the third if ADS is still alive.

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Originally Posted by Mykll

I am not talking about the AOE from ADS. I am talking about the AOEs from the adds that spawn in the back of the room (the entrance exactly, whether people call that the front or back of the room....) where usually the second tank hangs back solely to keep those "little ADS" guys busy. First one spawns, does his little AOE, dodge easy. Second time the first one that spawns does it, strobe light. Third AOE, it is a normal dodgeable one. As are all the ones of the second little orb that spawn, and the third if ADS is still alive.

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One type of node's AOE is actually nearly undodgable (think its called Dirty Cannons or something...been a long time since Ive even seen any nodes spawn in T1...), with a cast time of less than 1 second. Its supposed to be like that.

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Originally Posted by stephenjd3

Download and use Pingzapper or WTfast, both of these will remove the latency issues your having. I have friends who play from new zealand, Australia and other countries, before using them they had tons of issues, now with these programs, they dodge like the rest of us.

If these don't work for you, i have some bad news, you simply can not dodge

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Battleping for the win. Shaves latency off like no one's business. Using these programs is a must for Oceanic players :/ especially in pvp (still doesn't help in some instances, but we learn to adapt to it). Welcome to our world, whereas before all MMO's Oceanic players were interested in had the servers based in NA and we were at your mercy. Now the tables have turned.

Try this program out. I have friends who complain about the lag of Titan but have refused to use these programs. I love them but stop complaining if you don't want solutions to the problem.

forget titan