Anyone else feel like the INSANELY BIG ANCIENT EGYPSHUN LAZORZ sort of lack impact?

This is an insanely minor gripe but I'd like to know if anyone else feels the same way.

Xande's Aura Cannon and Cloud of Dankness' giant particle beam thing (the one where she appears and reappears elsewhere) just don't feel like they have a lot of impact. Sure, they hurt you and in the case of the latter it puts a debuff on you but... Idk, there's just something about them that makes me go "meh, this could've been a bit better".

I think it might be the duration of the attack, actually. There's some build up to it and then it's over in less than a second when it's fired. Melee LB3, Final Heaven feels pretty satisfying to do since the BIG SATELLITE LAZ0R lasts just long enough for you to think "yeah, we fried that guy." (or "well, that didn't do jack shit to the boss :]" in some cases).

On the other hand, Akh Morn, used by a certain dreadwyrm, has impact due to the relentless succession of attacks. The duration of the attack itself is short, but it's the quick succession of them that does it in that case. Now, I haven't actually experienced them but I've seen videos of it and can only imagine how pressured the tanks (!) could feel, being blasted again and again and again.

Are we talking about Qarn HM? The super fast beam attack he does that gives you a stack of zombie?

Oh wait. You're talking about CT. Yeah, it's been stated that it's supposed to be casual/easy content already.

Xande I agree with. His beam is easy to shake off. CoD on the other hand... I always /slap emote her when I was sure I was out of her invisible AoE impact zone. I think it tags you with vulnerability up as well.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Najara

Are we talking about Qarn HM? The super fast beam attack he does that gives you a stack of zombie?

Oh wait. You're talking about CT. Yeah, it's been stated that it's supposed to be casual/easy content already.

Xande I agree with. His beam is easy to shake off. CoD on the other hand... I always /slap emote her when I was sure I was out of her invisible AoE impact zone. I think it tags you with vulnerability up as well.

---

I'm not sure you're getting what I'm saying. I'm not talking about the damage the laser does. This also has nothing to do with whether content is "casual" or "hardcore". This has to do with how impactful the attack feels.

Hmm. I guess you're talking about the fact that the LAZOR! only lasts about a second after the cast?

I can see why you'd say it lacks impact.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ashkendor

Hmm. I guess you're talking about the fact that the LAZOR! only lasts about a second after the cast?

I can see why you'd say it lacks impact.

---

Pretty much.

For anyone who's played Xrd, this is kind of what I mean:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?featur...0GnhmjQ7A#t=63

Damage aside, it lasts more than half a second, providing some of that OOMPH!

Sometimes I feel like WoD lazer should one shot people, but then I notice half the raid eats it and decide that's a really bad idea. lol

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Najara

Well what more do you want from these attacks? They blow you back, give you a debuff, and inflict critical damage. How much more impactful does something need to be? Lol.

---

I mentioned before that this doesn't have much to do with the damage (though it hitting for a lot would help somewhat). It's more of a duration thing; a matter of making the laser attack last longer (maybe even damage people if you keep staying in it).

How it feels is entirely subjective. They feel like they hurt a lot to me, and obviously your standard is different. The visual of a gigantic laser hitting me is adequate. The fact you need further bangs and whistles makes me think you undervalue the power of lasers in their simplicity. You just want bells and whistles and I base that off this quote.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Hazama999

On the other hand, Akh Morn, used by a certain dreadwyrm, has impact due to the relentless succession of attacks. The duration of the attack itself is short, but it's the quick succession of them that does it in that case.

---

Here it's not even about the laser. You just like how it's followed up with some flashy attacks for a flashy SEQUENCE of attacks not a flashy single attack. So ultimately your complaint isn't even about the lasers. You want more intense sequences of attacks.
Let me tell you think though. Using the toughest fight in the game as a baseline for other content is generally a bad idea. Akh Morn is specifically trying to murder the crap out fo the tank with that sequence. If used in other content it would mean a lot of dead tanks because it was simply too much going out at once for more casual content. So yes, this discussion does at least in part relate to casual or hardcore content. Long damaging sequential attack patterns are going to be in tougher content and not in easier content.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tiggy

How it feels is entirely subjective.

---

No kidding!

Akh Morn is terrifying because it does 20k initial and 10k successive hits to me (unmitigated...it tickles when using proper mitigation). I don't even really *see* the attack because I'm focused on watching our heals and bahamut play ping pong with our HP.

CoD's laser is worse to me, since it can be hard to get out of the attack if she appears in the wrong spot, and gives a vulnerability up stack (which, if gained at the wrong time or as MT, means death if the heals aren't at their best)

I think it's mostly the impatch on the player that makes it feel weak, if the ray pushed you away it would feel stronger, kinda like the AoE Xande does that push you away.

Quote:

---

How it feels is entirely subjective. They feel like they hurt a lot to me, and obviously your standard is different. The visual of a gigantic laser hitting me is adequate. The fact you need further bangs and whistles makes me think you undervalue the power of lasers in their simplicity. You just want bells and whistles.

---

Well this is where we disagree. I feel that the gigantic laser hitting me for all of 0.5 seconds is a rather flaccid feeling, push-back, debuff, and all. I don't need "further bands and whistles", I just want the "bangs and whistles" that are already present to last a bit longer.

Why is using the toughest fight a bad idea? You're making it seem as though I want to graft Akh Morn into casual content, unchanged, just as it is in T13. God, no. My reason for mentioning Akh Morn is to offer another way in which a laser may feel impactful not by its duration but rather by how many times it's used in succession given its impressive animation. This is still very much about the laser. The laser animation is big, each attack lasts less than a second, and it's repetitive. If it were just a tiny pew pew pew laser in succession it would not make as much of an impact. The "intent" of the attack doesn't matter. Every attack done by any boss/mob ultimately has the "intent" of murdering you, whether it's in one shot or in five.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Hazama999

Why is using the toughest fight a bad idea? You're making it seem as though I want to graft Akh Morn into casual content, unchanged, just as it is in T13. God, no. My reason for mentioning Akh Morn is to offer another way in which a laser may feel impactful not by its duration but rather by how many times it's used in succession given its impressive animation. This is still very much about the laser. The laser animation is big, each attack lasts less than a second, and it's repetitive. If it were just a tiny pew pew pew laser in succession it would not make as much of an impact.

---

Tiggy's not saying that using the toughest fight is a bad idea. They're just saying that you're comparing apples and oranges. CoD's laser is a one-time big attack. It also adds a debuff before calling it a day. The attack you're referring to as being super cool is a rapid succession of attacks. It's not the same thing. It's not that it isn't cool. It's just that you can't compare the two. You would have to compare it to something like Raffy's laser (from T6) to bring up the argument of which was more impactful.

Obviously a rapid animation is gonna feel like it's beating down on you. It's gonna feel more impactful just as a given.

My two cents? Nael's rapid succession of attacks does create an impact on me but I can't compare it to a giant single attack of a laser. I think for me, I would feel it had more of an impact if Angra Mainyu didn't constantly laser you in the first boss fight. I'd feel it would be different for me if she were the only one to use the giant laser thing in WoD...but alas, she isn't. Repetition of a known graphical move will automatically start to lessen the impact cause we see it all the time.

However, all that being said, when I see a whole party just eat a CoD laser to the face, I just wince. While the animation doesn't leave an impression, the damage sure does.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ophie-Mio

Tiggy's not saying that using the toughest fight is a bad idea. They're just saying that you're comparing apples and oranges. CoD's laser is a one-time big attack. It also adds a debuff before calling it a day. The attack you're referring to as being super cool is a rapid succession of attacks. It's not the same thing. It's not that it isn't cool. It's just that you can't compare the two. You would have to compare it to something like Raffy's laser (from T6) to bring up the argument of which was more impactful.

---

Ophie's got what I was getting at.

I know what he wants! He want's either a bigger build up before the laser fires, like a charging sequence, or even better make the animation start small then scale it up to grand size. things that up the sense of inertia and weight to it all. Just a simple animation queue that lets you know this is a BIG ATTACK and not something similar to flicking the switch of a big flashlight on and off. Would you say that's right OP?

Why could you not compare the two? They both share a characteristic: that of being a giant laser. They only differ in how they're used (which is why I mentioned Akh Morn). What I'm trying to get at is that you could use the same attack in a variety of effective ways so as to cause the feeling of impact. A rapid succession of attacks by itself may or may not make you feel like it's impact you depending on the animation that's used (maybe damage as well). Just as well, you could do the same attack ONCE but have it last longer for added impact.

And yes, Daranion, that would help.

Hazama, I think I have video evidence of the exact animation buildup you're talking about. Let me edit it in in just a second

Edit:Here we go. A nice little example of laser buildup for anyone who doesnt quite "get" what you're asking for starring Mazinger Z of super robot fame!

Second game: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tloSO6olREQ
Notice how after the laser hits, he cranks up the intensity for an even bigger "meatier" hit.

Third Game: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WLofR9GQzSU#t=98
Notice the again, increased ferocity once the attack starts. It's just a laser but it has build up, it has WEIGHT!

What would have been a lot cooler for CoD's LAZOR is if she started firing it, then for maybe six to eight seconds moves around the edge one direction or another, so people on the leading edge are forced to move. Bonus points if the wake left a burning floor with a minor DoT effect if someone behind the path runs onto it.