Enmity problems as a PLD.

I am having increasingly difficult times trying to maintain enmity as a Paladin. Especially with people having access to i120 gear, it seems as if I have a very difficult time holding enmity from DPS.

I usually start out a boss pull with something like Fight or Flight -> Shield Lob -> Circle of Scorn -> Fast Blade -> Flash -> Savage Blade -> Flash -> Rage of Halone.

I have no problems maintaining enmity as a WAR, despite using the 1,2,3 enmity combo that they have. Given the fact that a Paladin should be the most "tanky" of all the tank classes, its frustrating to lose enmity on a DPS who is completely blowing up the monster.

My PLD is i113 (same as WAR) and I have the i115 weapon and shield dropped from Shiva EX.

I was thinking getting a better weapon through the relic questline would be better, but thats going to be long road ahead of me given the fact that I just got my atma weapon for it.

And maybe equipping 1 STR ring instead of 2 VIT rings would be better? Idk.

For boss fights (which means single target enmity), you dont need to use Flash, spamming a 1-2-3 Halone combo should be more than enough. You may weave Circle of Scorn and Spirit Within to increase your dps (and your enmity) during the first combo.
Flash is nice when you have multiple targets, it is not that great for a single mob.

Your Ilvl is more than decent, you should not have any problem holding hate unless your dps start the fight before you even shield lob.

yeah, no point using flash for 1 mob

for a single mob, don't use flash unless you have low TP :D

IV had this problem a few times last patch so I just reset my bonus attribute points around a lot in to strength and things are a lot better for the most part for now at lest. Bedsides I only use full fending accessorys unlike some people THATS RIGHT IM TALKING TO YOU TANKS IN CT. maybe if I'm still having problems I'll use 1 and only 1 strength ring.

But I have noticed lately that range dps do seam to be gaining hate a lot.

Well I really only use Flash for large pulls (or dungeon pulls). And the larger the pull I make, the more flashes I make before I start the Fast Blade rotation.

It was just difficult to explain because I only have 1500 characters to do so. My rotation is similar to:

Single Target:
Fight or Flight -> Shield Lob -> Spirit's Within -> Circle of Scorn -> 1,2,3 combo.

Multiple:
Shield Lob -> Flash -> Fast Blade -> Flash -> Flash -> Savage Blade -> Flash -> Rage of Halone, with flashing less as the fight moves on.

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Originally Posted by Remn

for a single mob, don't use flash unless you have low TP :D

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And flashing really doesn't work mid-battle. Its really useful for establishing a high enmity ceiling at the beginning of the pull, but useless if you do it in the middle of the fight.

If you're Losing threat on single mob fights, ensure you are meeting the accuracy cap for whatever it is your doing. In regards to DPS accesories, i throw those on dependant of the situation and what we are doing. Usually go full fending for learning as my raid doesn't really have any dps issues once we become comfortable with a fight

Don't fight or flight before shield lob. Lob -> FoF -> Scorn -> combo

Or something like that. You end up wasting some of it if you're not putting it between GCD. You also want to get two Scorns in under it.
You shouldn't have single-target enmity issues with an i115 weapon and current gear even with full tanking accs. Unless you're missing or the DPS is specifically trying to pull (like BLM doing a buffed double flare right on the pull or something)

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Originally Posted by AyaneKitsune

And flashing really doesn't work mid-battle. Its really useful for establishing a high enmity ceiling at the beginning of the pull, but useless if you do it in the middle of the fight.

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RoH is the highest Enmity ability PLD got. I only use flash in the beginning on AoE pull.
also Flash is great tool to regen your TP if you running low during mid to late fight., happen to me a sometime in T11 and T13 as MT.

I miss those day when BRD use to play TP song T_T. now aday NIN goad can keep DPS TP up for a long while ><, unless ppl die or some1 mess up their rotation..

During AoE pulls I usually flash at least 3 times and circle of scorn the mobs before I begin using my combo if that helps. If DPS is pewpewing only single target while you are doing a large pull they will pull some mobs off of you. Part of DPS job is watching the threat level they generate as well.

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Originally Posted by Coldea

Your Ilvl is more than decent, you should not have any problem holding hate unless your dps start the fight before you even shield lob.

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You mean Bards barding it up.

Hmm...in that ilvl range you really shouldn't be losing too much in terms of aggro.
To start off a boss pull, this is what I do:
FoF -> Shield Lob -> Spirits (weaved) -> Rage of Halone -> CoS (weaved) -> Fast Blade -> Savage Blade -> Rage of Halone
That raw RoH after Spirits Within allows you to get a head start on enmity as your DPS is starting out their rotation (the start of most DPS, if not all, rotation is low in potency, so aggro is generated slowly on the start of their rotation).
And this is without being specced in STR gears/bonus points.
And yes, like others have stated, Flash has very little use in enmity generation on single target. You'll be better off with the RoH combo.
The only times you'll come close to losing enmity or even lose it for a sec is when a current-geared BRD has all of their cooldowns up and they pop them all without Quelling Strikes. They'll easily overtake you in aggro, if that is the case. However, since its a boss fight don't panic and try to voke immediately but throw Cover on the person who pulled ahead in hate (in this scenario, would be the BRD), and take that time to build up a combo'd RoH. Once you have that combo'd RoH, voke the target and immediately use that combo'd RoH.

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Originally Posted by Rbstr

Don't fight or flight before shield lob. Lob -> FoF -> Scorn -> combo

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This is the opener i use aswell due said double scron under FoF buff, there is like 2secs or so left in FoF when scorn comes from cooldown.

Flash isn't that bad to use on single target. If the blind sticks it helps with dmg mitigation and gives you time to Stoneskin or whatever.

I agree that FoF should not be used on your lob, it will waste active time. I use the following and have only rare occasions where I lose threat.

Lob > Flash (as I run through the mob) > FB > FoF > SB > CoS > RoH > FB > SW > SB > RoH > Bash (SWIPE if it's up) > Flash, this allows you to get the most benefit from your 20s of FoF. From here you can just 123 using CoS and SW when they are up, flash when you want, SS etc.

I think what may be happening in your rotation that you posted is that you front load a couple of moves that aren't boosting your enmity -

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Originally Posted by AyaneKitsune

...I usually start out a boss pull with something like Fight or Flight -> Shield Lob -> Circle of Scorn -> Fast Blade -> Flash...

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Most DPS are trying to smash that boss from the get go, with a ramp up of 2 or 3 OGCD (BFB, IR, RS), with this being the case they are generating threat in their opening that you are with yours. By the time you get to your flash, you are just starting to catch up. Make a slight adjustment and you should be ahead in threat.

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Originally Posted by Synestra

This is the opener i use aswell due said double scron under FoF buff, there is like 2secs or so left in FoF when scorn comes from cooldown.

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Though I agree that it's nice to get in two CoS under FoF, but for ST as the OP is concerned with, I don't see the benefit. Sure the DoT is cool but you would be better served to ensure you get more of your threat combo in during the up time of FoF. NOW for larger pulls, yes, FoF before CoS is a good idea. Better AoE generation and a little DPS are always welcome.

Hope my advice helps!