New loot system, let's vote !

English language is not my main, i'll do my best.

Because RNG in the loot system is too imperfect, here are a few suggestions :

1. Gear token system (only in Coil). You want to gear up, you must show up with the class you want to get gear on. Then, once you clear a floor, you get a special token. You clear 5 times (can be modified, debatable), you can buy the item from that floor. Can't get gear on your alt, since the token is printed by the job you used.

2. Gear token system, but possible to gear up all the alts on your main. I suggest increasing number of runs before you can buy an item.

3. Keep the same actual system, but take out greed option. Also, if all players pass on an item, the coffer closes, reset and open again, to give a new item. All players can try and need it. That way, we make sure 2 players get an item they need.

4. Same actual system, keep greed, but if all pass, new item.

5. Absolutely no change.

Wich suggestion you wish to vote for ?

5. Absolutely no change. Any other way would gear everyone out too fast and claims of "I'm bored!" would ring out everywhere since there would no longer be a reason to raid after 2 months.

4 sounds awesome.

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Originally Posted by Noahlimits

5. Absolutely no change. Any other way would gear everyone out too fast and claims of "I'm bored!" ...

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I don't think you understood clearly some of the suggestions. If you take out the greed option, you must show up with your alts and start from bottom to gear it. OF course, you can argue that it would be too fast to gear up your main... and if a player is interested to ONLY play 1 job, then yea, i agree with you.. but most of the players have few jobs. ALSO, suggestions from 1-4 have variables that is flexible on the time. Take the 2 first suggestions, the toeken system.. i said "run 5 times, but can be MODIFIED... debatable".. so you could make it 20 times before you can buy 1 item. for the whole set...over 100 times. You see ? not at all too fast.. and that is just for 1 job. how can 3 and 4 be too fast ? again, faster for a main, but since you got alts... it would take time.

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Originally Posted by The_Leon

4 sounds awesome.

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I like it as well, but i prefer suggestion 3. Imo, there will always have 1 guy who will greed it and "steal" the item from you. Especially since he knows most of the people will pass... But i guess it would work well in a nice group with nice people.

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Originally Posted by ZaaZaa

I like it as well, but i prefer suggestion 3. Imo, there will always have 1 guy who will greed it and "steal" the item from you. Especially since he knows most of the people will pass... But i guess it would work well in a nice group with nice people.

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I was actually thinking running with a static when I "voted" hence not worrying about that issue. But I see that as a massive problem with pugs

I like 4 a lot.

I also like 1 and 2 but as an addition to the current system. The number of tokens required would need to be high of course so that it essentially ends up a consolation prize of "sorry you've done this so many times and didn't get what you want, go trade in tokens for something you do want" for those unlucky players.

The reason I would favor this is, while I do agree RNG drops suck, there is something really special about seeing an item drop and rolling and winning that a token-only system doesn't provide. Having both would still have that thrill for those lucky moments, while ensuring unlucky players still progress if they keep working hard.

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Originally Posted by Squintina

I like 4 a lot.

I also like 1 and 2 but as an addition to the current system. The number of tokens required would need to be high of course so that it essentially ends up a consolation prize of "sorry you've done this so many times and didn't get what you want, go trade in tokens for something you do want" for those unlucky players.

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Hmm you just inspired me to make a 6th suggestion... an hybrid between 1 or 2 with 3 or 4.. so like, give coffers AND tokens... eventually, you would have enough tokens to buy the item and yes, in that case, make it tokens expensive.

So in a way like Shiva? Except instead of an upgrade for say 30 drops you could buy gear?

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Originally Posted by Squintina

I also like 1 and 2 but as an addition to the current system. The number of tokens required would need to be high of course so that it essentially ends up a consolation prize of "sorry you've done this so many times and didn't get what you want, go trade in tokens for something you do want" for those unlucky players.

The reason I would favor this is, while I do agree RNG drops suck, there is something really special about seeing an item drop and rolling and winning that a token-only system doesn't provide. Having both would still have that thrill for those lucky moments, while ensuring unlucky players still progress if they keep working hard.

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^This.
While I personally would prefer 5 (current system) I know that devs will be changing it, so if it has to change I would much rather have a combination system instead of a pure boring token system.

Will something like 4 have a limit? or will it basically be "hey, John Gooden is the group favorite, everyone pass until the item he want comes from the chest". Or is it just a one time reroll on the item?

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Originally Posted by BlaiseArath

Will something like 4 have a limit? or will it basically be "hey, John Gooden is the group favorite, everyone pass until the item he want comes from the chest". Or is it just a one time reroll on the item?

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I would not actually mind if people agree and keep passing until the say item drops. Could be fun to strategically plan drops in the static. Somone would leave, the replacement would have to wait his turn to get his say item... Just like the old dynamis in FF11 or many other games. The players would gain points when they show up in the event and then higuest pts would get the item, etc.

BUT, realistically, we could go for coffer resetting 2 extra times, so 3 in total.

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Originally Posted by ZaaZaa

I would not actually mind if people agree and keep passing until the say item drops. Could be fun to strategically plan drops in the static. Somone would leave, the replacement would have to wait his turn to get his say item... Just like the old dynamis in FF11 or many other games. The players would gain points when they show up in the event and then higuest pts would get the item, etc.

BUT, realistically, we could go for coffer resetting 2 extra times, so 3 in total.

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I think 2 would be a solid reasoning. The way I see it, Coil is on a weekly lockout, having a chance for a reroll on an item thats entirely useless to your group would, at least in my eyes, not be overly terrible... but I can also see people being pushed into passing so the "senior" members can get what they want first.. or like in XI having a job priority system (which, fuck that)... where its "Oh, we need MNK and DRG items first, they're most important because of the DPS check, so everyone pass until one of those items shows up because WHM and PLD dont need it as much" or something to that extent... if you played XI you understand the "Job priority" system on armor and how much it can go to hell. This kind of system, while I admit offers some positives I can get behind, just opens up such a huge can of worms and frankly I don't want that "FFXIV is a Job!" or grinding/unfun job feel to it like XI had in some parts of endgame. It forces people to play the jobs they don't like, or get screwed out of drops until the golden boys are geared up for (X) reasons, depending on who is the company favorite... so on... so forth.

These problems, Job Priority, etc, Existed in XI only because multiple jobs were on the same piece of armor. in XIV, this problem is solved by sets being job specific (or close to it)... but adding a means to reroll would just open this kind of bias back up, because now it would be possibly, albeit a different method, to prioritize what drops they aim for and who to give them too. This might not be bad for some people, they might like the idea of being able to specifically gear up their DPS first to meet DPS checks on the next turn... it has its positives and I don't deny that.

On a much more personal note, I reeeeeeeeeeeee-heeeeeaaaaallllllllyyyyyyyyy loathe the idea of an Time/Show up honor-"point" systems like in XI... It made everything feel more like a job, "well I gotta show up or I wont be paid!", which is fine in real life, but in a game it just creates undue stress and time tables to follow. Sure it had its positives for some groups, but it also had a slew of negatives. Who would want to join a FCoB static where they were basically screwed out of lotting until so many weeks in, especially in a weekly lock-out event? Desperate or bads, which is what was in 90% of Dynamis linkshells back in XI lol.

Again, I don't think your ideas are bad, I just personally dislike what they would mean for XIV endgame.

Perhaps I simply feel this way because I know how I felt in XI as a THF, i was pretty much last priority for any drops... and frankly, screw that noise again, i'd quit on the spot ._.

Well said Blaise, very well said.

The current system is total garbage and I won't be playing in 3.0 if they don't change it. Literally any option would be better than what we have now.

At this point (10 clears of t10 with over half the drops being duplicates including 6 healer boots and similarly bad luck on the other turns) I'm inclined to want a system that just drops two tokens that can each be traded in for a piece of gear from that turn, but I think that's not the best system from a game design standpoint. At the very least it should be tokens like a "gloves token" "chest token" etc. that can be exchanged for a gear of that slot from that boss.

I think the best system, though, would be the current loot system + re-rolls if everyone passes (up to two re-rolls per boss) + a token that you get if you exit the instance without getting a piece of loot. Turn in X tokens (5-10) for a guaranteed drop from that boss.

As long as there is still the excitement of random drops backed by the guarantee that everyone will get what they need eventually, I'll be happy.

The current loot system is just flawed.

For those that suffered through 1.0's Darklight Speed Run Grind (ugh), the current Coil Loot System feels nearly like that:

If you don't get lucky on the RNG making your desired Job's Gear appear, it might as well be "Dark Matter" (the junk reward in 1.0), because it's the same thing to that individual. :mad:

* Imagine when Dark Knight, Astrologian and Machinist get released! (and later on other jobs (Samurai?, Red Mage, etc.):

Imagine how CROWDED the Loot Pool is going to be on those Chests now with even MORE Job Gear Sets added in! It'll be ridiculous to get specific gear.

While I agree Tokens are rather "boring," it's one way to have *some* incremental progress and lessen all the players suffering from Bad Random Number Generator Luck. Dev Team:

* Please consider a Hybrid System: A chance for Gear to Drop in the Chest *and* Token Drops, so players who get unlucky can at least eventually get *some* of their Drops on trade-in.

During 1st Coil, in all the clears we had, I *never* saw the Tank Gloves drop. Not even once. I finally saw them drop when I was on T8 in Second Coil, which, by then made them completely useless. :rolleyes: I've never gotten my Tank Body from T9 either, despite countless T9 wins (even after Echo Buff).

Random Number Generator with Huge Loot Pools = Fail.

It's funny, while we see some type of Gear drop each week, in some cases it feels like hunting NM Drops in Final Fantasy XI. It might as well be as rare as the Empress Hairpin (early days) or something. :rolleyes:

I'm honestly getting sick to death of this loot system as well. To give just one example - in the last two days, I've beaten T9 11 times (trying to get BLM staff and caster pants). In those 11 runs, I saw (not an exaggeration) 6 swords and 6 tank coats and not one single drop at all for casters. People in my group are gearing multiple jobs out with all that the items they want, and I'm sitting here with nothing.

If this situation had happened back when there was a weekly lock out, that would be 11 weeks with absolutely no reward.

Update: After normal raid last night, we got 4 more wins of T9. The paladin sword dropped twice. That is 8 paladin swords out of a total of 15 runs in the last three days. Sorry, this is not normal.

5. In my opinion, tome gear is your token system. Leave loot drops in high-end raid content alone.

By the time I'm high enough to do this content the expansion may have already be upon us and changes to how things are done may already be here, BUT I got to say I hate random drops and prefer content-specific token systems, with some consumable stuff added to the "purchase list" to still make the tokens useful once fully outfitted.

Usually, I have limited amount of time to play, and when I play I like to feel I made some progress. Nothing sucks more than go into an evening of playing to leave entirely empty handed.

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Originally Posted by Able

5. In my opinion, tome gear is your token system. Leave loot drops in high-end raid content alone.

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Tome gear isn't comparable. Everyone can get tome gear.

I've been clearing FCoB turns since the patch came out and have exactly 1 piece of gear to show for it on my main. It's unacceptably bad. Just a completely horrible system.

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Originally Posted by Best-MNK-NA

Tome gear isn't comparable. Everyone can get tome gear.

I've been clearing FCoB turns since the patch came out and have exactly 1 piece of gear to show for it on my main. It's unacceptably bad. Just a completely horrible system.

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See, that's just never bothered me. It took me about 7 weeks on SCoB to get a single drop and I never cared. I could always get comparable tome gear and eventually upgrade it to be in-line with whatever I wanted from coil. So, to me, it's very comparable. A token system in addition to tome gear seems redundant to me. But, that's just my opinion. I've never been one to care at all about having the latest gear from end-game content just for bragging rights or a slight performance edge. It's about enjoying the content. I'm a cashew.

Now I will agree that if they plan to release more job-specific gear drops, it'll be a problem in the expansion. Loot table will be crowded. It's going to get kind of bad for weapon drops. So, I'm not against a token system in that instance.

Let's keep the vote active guys.. i read a lot commentaries, but where is the vote !!? 1,2,3,4 or 5 ? Or new hybrid suggestions ?

4 doesn't really make sense. How I see it is that the item is physical and was dropped by the creature or found in a chest. How could it change? It just doesn't really work if you think about it that way...

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Originally Posted by ZaaZaa

4. Same actual system, keep greed, but if all pass, new item.

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I never thought about this, but I really REALLY like this idea...

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Originally Posted by VanilleFang

4 doesn't really make sense. How I see it is that the item is physical and was dropped by the creature or found in a chest. How could it change? It just doesn't really work if you think about it that way...

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You are being too literal with this.

No offense but explain gear-sets changing in the blink of an eye, characters carrying hundreds of items on them at all times with no weigh-down...

Lighten up. It's an excellent suggestion.

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Originally Posted by VanilleFang

4 doesn't really make sense. How I see it is that the item is physical and was dropped by the creature or found in a chest. How could it change? It just doesn't really work if you think about it that way...

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A lot of things don't make sense in that game.. How about we start with level sync !? Oh i have i-110 but i am doing a level 20 dungoen and i get hit like a truck !!

So far, suggestion no. 4 seems more popular. I tought 3 was going to be more popular since one can always greed for his alt no. 5... There is often this type of player. Especially with this sysem, such players would be more motivated to greed, since he knows more people will pass or did it already in hope for a new item to pop. So he knows there is less competition to his greed.

He could also wait to see if all passed then greed... BUT, anyway, i guess no. 4 would work very well in a static.

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Originally Posted by ZaaZaa

So far, suggestion no. 4 seems more popular. I tought 3 was going to be more popular since one can always greed for his alt no. 5... There is often this type of player. Especially with this sysem, such players would be more motivated to greed, since he knows more people will pass or did it already in hope for a new item to pop. So he knows there is less competition to his greed.

He could also wait to see if all passed then greed... BUT, anyway, i guess no. 4 would work very well in a static.

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I think you mean suggestion no 6 was the most popular. There are more posts asking for a hybrid system than for #4. (only 2 posts said they liked 4. but I count 4 posts asking for hybrid)